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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:43 pm 
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Meereen Five-O. Daario’s efforts to enforce the Queen’s peace in Slavers’ Bay. Bonus point after they break up a Sons of the Harpy ring when the Dothraki lieutenant says “book em, Daario.”


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:46 pm 
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DOB wrote:
“book em, Daario.”


:lol:


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:52 pm 
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Turbogoat wrote:
The Bachelor: Craster's Keep


:lol:


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 3:37 pm 
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For all its faults, I have never made a secret of why I like the show:
1 The story in general
2 The violence
3 The supernatural bits
4 The tits.
:thumbup:


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 4:00 pm 
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Dancing with the Starks
It ain't half hot mum...live from Kings Landing
Red(undant) Dwarf....starring Tyrion Lannister from next week.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 8:29 pm 
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Edinburgh01 wrote:
Whilst there are some grounds for some suspension of belief, as discussed previously, I do not understand why people are so disconcerted by the dragons change of fortune.

The dragons change of fortune is dramatic but not totally unbelievable in the context of the series. It would have been if they used the same tactics against Kings Landing as had not worked earlier, but they did not.

With the Night King gone, they thought the dragons were unstoppable. Which makes the fleet they are guarding next door to invulnerable. Anyone attacking the fleet would get torched by the dragons before they get close enough to do any damage. So why would the fleet bother with scouts etc since they believe they are safe come what may? It almost makes more sense for them to make themselves appear open to attack to draw enemies onto them for the dragons to roast.

Whilst it may be a stretch that Dany does not notice a fleet lying in ambush, she is also complacent. She is cruising along with the dragons at fleet pace, not as alert as she should be, then one of her dragons gets hit from ambush. Yes, it may have been an improbably lucky shot, but the general concept of hitting a relatively slow moving dragon from ambush with a weapon Dany (and the fleet) did not know exist is not daft.

Dany panics. She goes into full frontal attack mode, realises that will not work then breaks off. Grief stricken by the loss of one of her children, paniced by this new weapon, she does not think through new tactics on the hoof. Dany losing it and not thinking clearly when under attack and faced by a new threat is not exactly a stretch.

By the time Kings Landing is attacked, they have had time to think through how they counteract the ballistas. So Drogon comes in vertical out of the sun and uses height and speed to counter the ballistas. Once he has broken the first line of ballistas a weakness in the fields of fire has been created that he (and Dany) can use to attack the others before they get angles on him. And of course he is in full attack mode flying at speed and making evasive manoeuvres.

A bit too neat and tidy for reality, but we are scarcely talking reality here.

And while we are at it, sacking a city and slaughtering the population 'pour encourage les autres' was a common tactic in times gone by. Particularly enjoyed by the Mongols, on whom the Dothraki appear loosely based.

Cromwell was a dab hand at it as well.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:01 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Edinburgh01 wrote:
Whilst there are some grounds for some suspension of belief, as discussed previously, I do not understand why people are so disconcerted by the dragons change of fortune.

The dragons change of fortune is dramatic but not totally unbelievable in the context of the series. It would have been if they used the same tactics against Kings Landing as had not worked earlier, but they did not.

With the Night King gone, they thought the dragons were unstoppable. Which makes the fleet they are guarding next door to invulnerable. Anyone attacking the fleet would get torched by the dragons before they get close enough to do any damage. So why would the fleet bother with scouts etc since they believe they are safe come what may? It almost makes more sense for them to make themselves appear open to attack to draw enemies onto them for the dragons to roast.

Whilst it may be a stretch that Dany does not notice a fleet lying in ambush, she is also complacent. She is cruising along with the dragons at fleet pace, not as alert as she should be, then one of her dragons gets hit from ambush. Yes, it may have been an improbably lucky shot, but the general concept of hitting a relatively slow moving dragon from ambush with a weapon Dany (and the fleet) did not know exist is not daft.

Dany panics. She goes into full frontal attack mode, realises that will not work then breaks off. Grief stricken by the loss of one of her children, paniced by this new weapon, she does not think through new tactics on the hoof. Dany losing it and not thinking clearly when under attack and faced by a new threat is not exactly a stretch.

By the time Kings Landing is attacked, they have had time to think through how they counteract the ballistas. So Drogon comes in vertical out of the sun and uses height and speed to counter the ballistas. Once he has broken the first line of ballistas a weakness in the fields of fire has been created that he (and Dany) can use to attack the others before they get angles on him. And of course he is in full attack mode flying at speed and making evasive manoeuvres.

A bit too neat and tidy for reality, but we are scarcely talking reality here.

And while we are at it, sacking a city and slaughtering the population 'pour encourage les autres' was a common tactic in times gone by. Particularly enjoyed by the Mongols, on whom the Dothraki appear loosely based.

Cromwell was a dab hand at it as well.

Only you, cammy.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:11 pm 
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happyhooker wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
Edinburgh01 wrote:
Whilst there are some grounds for some suspension of belief, as discussed previously, I do not understand why people are so disconcerted by the dragons change of fortune.

The dragons change of fortune is dramatic but not totally unbelievable in the context of the series. It would have been if they used the same tactics against Kings Landing as had not worked earlier, but they did not.

With the Night King gone, they thought the dragons were unstoppable. Which makes the fleet they are guarding next door to invulnerable. Anyone attacking the fleet would get torched by the dragons before they get close enough to do any damage. So why would the fleet bother with scouts etc since they believe they are safe come what may? It almost makes more sense for them to make themselves appear open to attack to draw enemies onto them for the dragons to roast.

Whilst it may be a stretch that Dany does not notice a fleet lying in ambush, she is also complacent. She is cruising along with the dragons at fleet pace, not as alert as she should be, then one of her dragons gets hit from ambush. Yes, it may have been an improbably lucky shot, but the general concept of hitting a relatively slow moving dragon from ambush with a weapon Dany (and the fleet) did not know exist is not daft.

Dany panics. She goes into full frontal attack mode, realises that will not work then breaks off. Grief stricken by the loss of one of her children, paniced by this new weapon, she does not think through new tactics on the hoof. Dany losing it and not thinking clearly when under attack and faced by a new threat is not exactly a stretch.

By the time Kings Landing is attacked, they have had time to think through how they counteract the ballistas. So Drogon comes in vertical out of the sun and uses height and speed to counter the ballistas. Once he has broken the first line of ballistas a weakness in the fields of fire has been created that he (and Dany) can use to attack the others before they get angles on him. And of course he is in full attack mode flying at speed and making evasive manoeuvres.

A bit too neat and tidy for reality, but we are scarcely talking reality here.

And while we are at it, sacking a city and slaughtering the population 'pour encourage les autres' was a common tactic in times gone by. Particularly enjoyed by the Mongols, on whom the Dothraki appear loosely based.

Cromwell was a dab hand at it as well.

Only you, cammy.

It's not just the Mongols who put towns/cities to blaze and killed all the inhabitants, even after they'd surrendered.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:13 pm 
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Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:18 pm 
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Speaking of the obsessed......

Quote:
More than 30,000 upset ‘Game of Thrones’ fans sign petition to remake Season 8

Game of Thrones fans have been especially vocal over the last several weeks as the final season of the show heads towards its conclusion.
Fan outrage turned white hot after the penultimate episode last Sunday, when Daenerys incinerated King’s Landing — along with children and other innocent people — with her dragon, showcasing her descent into madness. Many viewers and followers of the series’ mythology, along with several TV critics, said that the character’s behaviour was massively out of step with her storyline.

Now, someone named “Dylan D.” has started up a petition on Change.org to get the entire season remade “with competent writers.”

“[Game of Thrones writers] David Benioff and D.B. Weiss have proven themselves to be woefully incompetent writers when they have no source material (i.e. the books) to fall back on,” reads the petition objective.

“This series deserves a final season that makes sense. Subvert my expectations and make it happen, HBO!”


https://globalnews.ca/news/5280447/game ... s8JpgksTmw


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:23 pm 
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earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:25 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:26 pm 
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Watched E5 last night and was a bit underwhelmed. It’s certainly cinematic and gripping, but the writers have abandoned what made this series great, rather than an enjoyable diversion.

GoT isn’t about big battles. They are fun, but up until now have been rare, and sometimes even fought off-screen. GoT is about the machinations, the plotting, the positioning and the interaction of the characters. You can see it in the opening credits - all the little moving parts inside all of the cities. All of the main characters have been on amazing personal journeys, and it is those journeys that have been so compelling. But telling those stories takes time. Between series 1-6, it generally took 3-4 episodes minimum for even minor plot lines to pay off. Some (Dany in Slavers’ Bay, Jon at the Wall, etc) took multiple series. That’s what made them so satisfying.

Series 8 (and, to a lesser extent, 7) has suffered from the writers trying to tie up things far too quickly. Plot threads have been resolved within a single episode. Characters effectively teleport to where they need to be without any need to travel. Ravens carry information at broadband speeds. And characters like Tyrion and Jon (Tyrion especially as he was the most intelligent character on the show) have made a series of bafflingly bad decisions in order to bring the story to where it needed to be. This isn’t at all the GoT style, and it jars.

I’d be OK about Danaerys descending into madness if it had been detailed over half a dozen episodes. Instead, they had her look sulky for an episode or two and then turn full psycho. Yes, she has done some pretty dark stuff at times from the beginning, but for her to suddenly flip in mid-battle just doesn’t feel right. The conclusion of Arya’s story is so out of character it was just bizarre. This is a girl driven entirely by vengeance since the end of series 1 - and within a few steps of her goal, she has a lecture from The Hound and decides not to bother? If they wanted to have her renounce violence, they needed to tell that story properly and earn the audience’s belief.

Basically Series 8 has been epic and I’ve enjoyed it, but it isn’t really GoT.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:26 pm 
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earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.

They weren't the only ones slaying all around them in KL.

Lots of them were wearing Westeros armour.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:42 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.

They weren't the only ones slaying all around them in KL.

Lots of them were wearing Westeros armour.


I expect you noticed the resemblance between them and the New Model Army.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:44 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

:lol: :lol: :lol:














:roll:


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:46 pm 
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Where did all these unsullied come from

Image

Cersei?
Image


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:07 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.

They weren't the only ones slaying all around them in KL.

Lots of them were wearing Westeros armour.

Oh, just fûck off elsewhere, there's a good lad.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:11 pm 
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Boobs not Moobs wrote:
Where did all these unsullied come from

Image

Cersei?
Image


Unsullied have regen powers.

That does look like Cersei which makes no sense.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:18 pm 
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Actually now that I think about it, that's probably from the episode last showed. Looks like Cersei in the map room just before Jamie came in.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:25 pm 
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it's 2 people, jon and davos walking through the rubble

Spoiler: show
Image


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:26 pm 
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Is that snow or ash?


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:27 pm 
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Not too worried about all the unsullied in the preview. Did you think you saw a census of all the unsullied in the last two episodes?


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:27 pm 
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Looks like ash.

Davos and Snow hopefully plotting to kill that mad cow.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:33 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.

They weren't the only ones slaying all around them in KL.

Lots of them were wearing Westeros armour.

And that armour reminded you of Cromwell how?

You are obsessed, it's actually dangerous and you should seek help.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:36 pm 
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True Blue wrote:
Looks like ash.

Davos and Snow hopefully plotting to kill that mad cow.

Why? It's a jungle out there you can't blame the dragon for being a dragon.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:40 pm 
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earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:
Only fúcking Camroc could try and spin a GoT thread into an anti-British thread.

For a self confessed anglophile he really does hate British stuff.

#Not obsessed.

As opposed to an anti-Mongol thread ?

Do you even watch GoT.

The Dothraki are based on the Mongols.

They weren't the only ones slaying all around them in KL.

Lots of them were wearing Westeros armour.

And that armour reminded you of Cromwell how?

You are obsessed, it's actually dangerous and you should seek help.


It's hardly just limited to the Mongols. The sacking if cities happened untold times throughout history. The Romans once did it to one of their own cities FFS, and it happened a few times in WWII (Nanking, East Germany for example)


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:41 pm 
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True Blue wrote:
Boobs not Moobs wrote:
Where did all these unsullied come from

Image

Cersei?
Image


Unsullied have regen powers.

That does look like Cersei which makes no sense.

Apparently that's about 2k unsullied and 500 Dothraki which isn't too bad... Unless we insist that episode 3 actually existed.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:44 pm 
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2k of 10k left and 500 of 80k? Doesn't seem implausible. Looking at that picture, it all seems to add up anyway.
Bloody hell there can't be too many people left at all at this stage.

Maybe a whole Dornish fleet will arrive next week and finish them all off :o


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:48 pm 
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True Blue wrote:
Boobs not Moobs wrote:
Where did all these unsullied come from

Image

Cersei?
Image


Unsullied have regen powers.

That does look like Cersei which makes no sense.



Y'all need your eyesight tested... that's Davos.

Edit:

Akkerman wrote:
it's 2 people, jon and davos walking through the rubble

Spoiler: show
Image


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:59 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
It's not just the Mongols who put towns/cities to blaze and killed all the inhabitants, even after they'd surrendered.

I'm afraid you're misinformed Cam.
Mongols treated cities that surrendered early (and stayed surrendered) quite well.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:06 pm 
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I haven't seen tits for years

GOT gone to shit


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:18 pm 
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Doc Rob wrote:
Watched E5 last night and was a bit underwhelmed. It’s certainly cinematic and gripping, but the writers have abandoned what made this series great, rather than an enjoyable diversion.

GoT isn’t about big battles. They are fun, but up until now have been rare, and sometimes even fought off-screen. GoT is about the machinations, the plotting, the positioning and the interaction of the characters. You can see it in the opening credits - all the little moving parts inside all of the cities. All of the main characters have been on amazing personal journeys, and it is those journeys that have been so compelling. But telling those stories takes time. Between series 1-6, it generally took 3-4 episodes minimum for even minor plot lines to pay off. Some (Dany in Slavers’ Bay, Jon at the Wall, etc) took multiple series. That’s what made them so satisfying.

Series 8 (and, to a lesser extent, 7) has suffered from the writers trying to tie up things far too quickly. Plot threads have been resolved within a single episode. Characters effectively teleport to where they need to be without any need to travel. Ravens carry information at broadband speeds. And characters like Tyrion and Jon (Tyrion especially as he was the most intelligent character on the show) have made a series of bafflingly bad decisions in order to bring the story to where it needed to be. This isn’t at all the GoT style, and it jars.

I’d be OK about Danaerys descending into madness if it had been detailed over half a dozen episodes. Instead, they had her look sulky for an episode or two and then turn full psycho. Yes, she has done some pretty dark stuff at times from the beginning, but for her to suddenly flip in mid-battle just doesn’t feel right. The conclusion of Arya’s story is so out of character it was just bizarre. This is a girl driven entirely by vengeance since the end of series 1 - and within a few steps of her goal, she has a lecture from The Hound and decides not to bother? If they wanted to have her renounce violence, they needed to tell that story properly and earn the audience’s belief.

Basically Series 8 has been epic and I’ve enjoyed it, but it isn’t really GoT.


I don’t think she flipped mid battle, she indicated to Grey Worm to “wait for her signal” as Tyrion discussed the surrender bells. I took that to mean her signal to unleash hell, which they both did in a pre-planned attack.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:25 pm 
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naki wrote:
Doc Rob wrote:
Watched E5 last night and was a bit underwhelmed. It’s certainly cinematic and gripping, but the writers have abandoned what made this series great, rather than an enjoyable diversion.

GoT isn’t about big battles. They are fun, but up until now have been rare, and sometimes even fought off-screen. GoT is about the machinations, the plotting, the positioning and the interaction of the characters. You can see it in the opening credits - all the little moving parts inside all of the cities. All of the main characters have been on amazing personal journeys, and it is those journeys that have been so compelling. But telling those stories takes time. Between series 1-6, it generally took 3-4 episodes minimum for even minor plot lines to pay off. Some (Dany in Slavers’ Bay, Jon at the Wall, etc) took multiple series. That’s what made them so satisfying.

Series 8 (and, to a lesser extent, 7) has suffered from the writers trying to tie up things far too quickly. Plot threads have been resolved within a single episode. Characters effectively teleport to where they need to be without any need to travel. Ravens carry information at broadband speeds. And characters like Tyrion and Jon (Tyrion especially as he was the most intelligent character on the show) have made a series of bafflingly bad decisions in order to bring the story to where it needed to be. This isn’t at all the GoT style, and it jars.

I’d be OK about Danaerys descending into madness if it had been detailed over half a dozen episodes. Instead, they had her look sulky for an episode or two and then turn full psycho. Yes, she has done some pretty dark stuff at times from the beginning, but for her to suddenly flip in mid-battle just doesn’t feel right. The conclusion of Arya’s story is so out of character it was just bizarre. This is a girl driven entirely by vengeance since the end of series 1 - and within a few steps of her goal, she has a lecture from The Hound and decides not to bother? If they wanted to have her renounce violence, they needed to tell that story properly and earn the audience’s belief.

Basically Series 8 has been epic and I’ve enjoyed it, but it isn’t really GoT.


I don’t think she flipped mid battle, she indicated to Grey Worm to “wait for her signal” as Tyrion discussed the surrender bells. I took that to mean her signal to unleash hell, which they both did in a pre-planned attack.


Dany started to look paranoid (clumsy, but for want of a better word) at Winterfell when she got the hairy eyeball from Sansa and everyone surrounded Jon with love and adulation. From there she began to fall apart. Jon's betrayal and rejection compounded the grief of losing Missandei and the dragons.

I agree the series has been rushed and they've lost the intrigue of the books, months have been compressed into one episode.... subtleties have been dispensed with.

I'm still enjoying it, bigly.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:30 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:
naki wrote:
Doc Rob wrote:
Watched E5 last night and was a bit underwhelmed. It’s certainly cinematic and gripping, but the writers have abandoned what made this series great, rather than an enjoyable diversion.

GoT isn’t about big battles. They are fun, but up until now have been rare, and sometimes even fought off-screen. GoT is about the machinations, the plotting, the positioning and the interaction of the characters. You can see it in the opening credits - all the little moving parts inside all of the cities. All of the main characters have been on amazing personal journeys, and it is those journeys that have been so compelling. But telling those stories takes time. Between series 1-6, it generally took 3-4 episodes minimum for even minor plot lines to pay off. Some (Dany in Slavers’ Bay, Jon at the Wall, etc) took multiple series. That’s what made them so satisfying.

Series 8 (and, to a lesser extent, 7) has suffered from the writers trying to tie up things far too quickly. Plot threads have been resolved within a single episode. Characters effectively teleport to where they need to be without any need to travel. Ravens carry information at broadband speeds. And characters like Tyrion and Jon (Tyrion especially as he was the most intelligent character on the show) have made a series of bafflingly bad decisions in order to bring the story to where it needed to be. This isn’t at all the GoT style, and it jars.

I’d be OK about Danaerys descending into madness if it had been detailed over half a dozen episodes. Instead, they had her look sulky for an episode or two and then turn full psycho. Yes, she has done some pretty dark stuff at times from the beginning, but for her to suddenly flip in mid-battle just doesn’t feel right. The conclusion of Arya’s story is so out of character it was just bizarre. This is a girl driven entirely by vengeance since the end of series 1 - and within a few steps of her goal, she has a lecture from The Hound and decides not to bother? If they wanted to have her renounce violence, they needed to tell that story properly and earn the audience’s belief.

Basically Series 8 has been epic and I’ve enjoyed it, but it isn’t really GoT.


I don’t think she flipped mid battle, she indicated to Grey Worm to “wait for her signal” as Tyrion discussed the surrender bells. I took that to mean her signal to unleash hell, which they both did in a pre-planned attack.


Dany started to look paranoid (clumsy, but for want of a better word) at Winterfell when she got the hairy eyeball from Sansa and everyone surrounded Jon with love and adulation. From there she began to fall apart. Jon's betrayal and rejection compounded the grief of losing Missandei and the dragons.

I agree the series has been rushed and they've lost the intrigue of the books, months have been compressed into one episode.... subtleties have been dispensed with.

I'm still enjoying it, bigly.


Bashing the showrunners online has become a free for all and now seems to be less about valid objections to the dumbing-down of certain aspects of the script and more just non-specific outrage.

The most common complaint about the last episode seems to be that it “doesn’t make sense” whereas I watched it thinking it was the perfectly logical outcome in Martin’s GOT universe, however hamfisted some of the build up to it was


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:33 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:

Dany started to look paranoid (clumsy, but for want of a better word) at Winterfell when she got the hairy eyeball from Sansa and everyone surrounded Jon with love and adulation. From there she began to fall apart. Jon's betrayal and rejection compounded the grief of losing Missandei and the dragons.

I agree the series has been rushed and they've lost the intrigue of the books, months have been compressed into one episode.... subtleties have been dispensed with.

I'm still enjoying it, bigly.



Yeah, they've got all the pieces in place to establish her motivation for going mental, she's lost two dragons and shitloads of troops, two of her trusted advisors are dead, one betrayed her and another considered it, Jon's rejected her...it's just they haven't really shown enough of how this has affected her.

Ditto Arya who's been established as a vengeful badass for 7 seasons but just turns around when the Hound gives her a talk.

Or Jaime just going all in back to Cersei.

None of those are necessarily against their characters, there just hasn't been enough effort to satisfactorily get to those decisions by the characters.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:33 pm 
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Yeah couldn't agree more. It's obvious now that they should have went for 10 episode seasons, and were definitely missing the subtlety of earlier seasons.

That said, the final season was always going to be Big. At a certain point years of manuevering has to come to a head.

Regardless of the above, it's still really enjoyable, 8/10 TV that is making a concerted effort to wrap up a plethora of complicated storylines. I'm going to watch it again once the finale is done.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:34 pm 
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naki wrote:

Bashing the showrunners online has become a free for all and now seems to be less about valid objections to the dumbing-down of certain aspects of the script and more just non-specific outrage.

The most common complaint about the last episode seems to be that it “doesn’t make sense” whereas I watched it thinking it was the perfectly logical outcome in Martin’s GOT universe, however hamfisted some of the build up to it was


Yup. I guess the outrage is symptomatic of attachment to a hero figure as a result of crushing alienation and loneliness in the personal lives of the wailers, hence the destructive nature of the realisation that after all this time, Dany's just as f**ked up as everyone else. We should pity them... before burning them. With fire.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:36 pm 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
It's not just the Mongols who put towns/cities to blaze and killed all the inhabitants, even after they'd surrendered.

I'm afraid you're misinformed Cam.
Mongols treated cities that surrendered early (and stayed surrendered) quite well.


Is that when ghenghis had his red tent policy? They had three days to surrender, on the third day he puts up the red tent then the city is f**ked. He did this so word would spread, surrender early and it would go ok for you, waste his time resisting and you were f**ked, it makes more sense than just slaughtering everyone even when they surrender promptly because then cities would be forced to resist no matter what, then you get bogged down in siege after siege. You need a stick and a carrot. Often though they were extremely harsh on cities that surrendered then suddenly rebelled forcing the army to come back.

Another misconception is that they often overwhelmingly outnumbered their opponents which is often not the case, often they where the ones who were outnumbered, they where one of the most mobile armies and self sufficient ones, their speed often caught people off guard making them think they where facing a larger army or armies than they thought. The word Horde comes from the mongol word Ordo, which meant an army of 10,000 men.


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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:39 pm 
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naki wrote:
Doc Rob wrote:
Watched E5 last night and was a bit underwhelmed. It’s certainly cinematic and gripping, but the writers have abandoned what made this series great, rather than an enjoyable diversion.

GoT isn’t about big battles. They are fun, but up until now have been rare, and sometimes even fought off-screen. GoT is about the machinations, the plotting, the positioning and the interaction of the characters. You can see it in the opening credits - all the little moving parts inside all of the cities. All of the main characters have been on amazing personal journeys, and it is those journeys that have been so compelling. But telling those stories takes time. Between series 1-6, it generally took 3-4 episodes minimum for even minor plot lines to pay off. Some (Dany in Slavers’ Bay, Jon at the Wall, etc) took multiple series. That’s what made them so satisfying.

Series 8 (and, to a lesser extent, 7) has suffered from the writers trying to tie up things far too quickly. Plot threads have been resolved within a single episode. Characters effectively teleport to where they need to be without any need to travel. Ravens carry information at broadband speeds. And characters like Tyrion and Jon (Tyrion especially as he was the most intelligent character on the show) have made a series of bafflingly bad decisions in order to bring the story to where it needed to be. This isn’t at all the GoT style, and it jars.

I’d be OK about Danaerys descending into madness if it had been detailed over half a dozen episodes. Instead, they had her look sulky for an episode or two and then turn full psycho. Yes, she has done some pretty dark stuff at times from the beginning, but for her to suddenly flip in mid-battle just doesn’t feel right. The conclusion of Arya’s story is so out of character it was just bizarre. This is a girl driven entirely by vengeance since the end of series 1 - and within a few steps of her goal, she has a lecture from The Hound and decides not to bother? If they wanted to have her renounce violence, they needed to tell that story properly and earn the audience’s belief.

Basically Series 8 has been epic and I’ve enjoyed it, but it isn’t really GoT.


I don’t think she flipped mid battle, she indicated to Grey Worm to “wait for her signal” as Tyrion discussed the surrender bells. I took that to mean her signal to unleash hell, which they both did in a pre-planned attack.


Good point I saw that grey worm seemed to be waiting for some sort of signal from her when the bells went and once she attacked he followed suit, and looked back at jon when jon tried to stop everyone with a look of, I follow my queen not you.


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