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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:02 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
Gauss wrote:
RTÉ did a vox pop on the nurses this morning and couldn’t find one person against them funnily enough :lol:


Yes quite amazing that RTSiptu are massively biased towards the nurses. This strike is a f**king disgrace


....people calling into rte in the morning, now there's a demographic ; unfortunately they get to vote


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:08 am 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
we should bring in legislation that forces newly qualified and expensively trained nurses (or any PS workers), who electively turn down a job in Ireland to take higher pay in UAE or elsewhere, to immediately begin paying back a portion of the cost of their taxpayer funded education.

This should be a stipulation of their entry into a nursing/teaching/whatever degree programme.

With this kind of terms and conditions in place, the argument that the Irish domiciled nurses are worse off, would fall away immediately.

Otherwise Irish taxpayers are funding a system that incentivises the public sector beneficiaries of our tax-funded subsidised education model, to continually agitate for more money ..... on the sole basis that the grass is always greener somewhere else.

That is no way to run the public sector.

If PS nurses don't like their situation (that they signed up to with eyes wide open), then join an agency or leave the country ...... just don't pretend that the ones who stay in situ are being somehow deceived or treated in bad faith.

I and lots of others in Ireland could get better paid if we went to a competitor abroad ...... but expecting my employer to do anything about that in pay terms, would be delusional.


The nurses going abroad thing is the biggest red herring.

Nurses go abroad for cash yes, but so do loads of other professionals, so what? Nurses also go abroad because many of them are 22 coming out of college with a qualification that is immediately usable overseas. Why wouldn't you?

In comparison; accountants spend another 3 plus years before being able to call themselves an accountant.
Finance workers need to pass CFAs (or accounting exams) to have good credibility which will take a year or so.
Solicitors spend similar.
Barristers longer (and not as usable).
Architects spend years qualifying.
IT/Software development and Engineering take a few years of earning your stripes.

Nurses meanwhile are ready to go. Teachers are similar - but the big difference is that their qualification is often very restricted.


This is incorrect re teachers who do their teacher training as a post-graduate qualification. ie most secondary teachers.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:45 pm 
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Leinster in London wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
we should bring in legislation that forces newly qualified and expensively trained nurses (or any PS workers), who electively turn down a job in Ireland to take higher pay in UAE or elsewhere, to immediately begin paying back a portion of the cost of their taxpayer funded education.

This should be a stipulation of their entry into a nursing/teaching/whatever degree programme.

With this kind of terms and conditions in place, the argument that the Irish domiciled nurses are worse off, would fall away immediately.

Otherwise Irish taxpayers are funding a system that incentivises the public sector beneficiaries of our tax-funded subsidised education model, to continually agitate for more money ..... on the sole basis that the grass is always greener somewhere else.

That is no way to run the public sector.

If PS nurses don't like their situation (that they signed up to with eyes wide open), then join an agency or leave the country ...... just don't pretend that the ones who stay in situ are being somehow deceived or treated in bad faith.

I and lots of others in Ireland could get better paid if we went to a competitor abroad ...... but expecting my employer to do anything about that in pay terms, would be delusional.


The nurses going abroad thing is the biggest red herring.

Nurses go abroad for cash yes, but so do loads of other professionals, so what? Nurses also go abroad because many of them are 22 coming out of college with a qualification that is immediately usable overseas. Why wouldn't you?

In comparison; accountants spend another 3 plus years before being able to call themselves an accountant.
Finance workers need to pass CFAs (or accounting exams) to have good credibility which will take a year or so.
Solicitors spend similar.
Barristers longer (and not as usable).
Architects spend years qualifying.
IT/Software development and Engineering take a few years of earning your stripes.

Nurses meanwhile are ready to go. Teachers are similar - but the big difference is that their qualification is often very restricted.


This is incorrect re teachers who do their teacher training as a post-graduate qualification. ie most secondary teachers.


Not really. 3 years of Arts and two years post grad.

Yes there are longer routes, but you can be out teaching with your Dip 5 years after leaving school and it used to be 4.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:48 pm 
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Is the nurses pension all that good, I am hearing not good.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:53 pm 
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lorcanoworms wrote:
Is the nurses pension all that good, I am hearing not good.

They also claimed to be understaffed and badly paid


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:53 pm 
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Colm McCarthy absolute breath of fresh air on newstalk last night.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:55 pm 
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What's rare is wonderful.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:58 pm 
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lorcanoworms wrote:
Is the nurses pension all that good, I am hearing not good.


So a nurse retiring on say €50K after 40 years (say 60/61) gets a pension of 40/80ths (or 50% equal to €25,000) in addition they will get a Tax Free Lump sum of 120/80ths (€75,000).

To get an annuity of €25,000 a year you'd need a pension fund in the private sector of at least €1M. Even taking out the Contributory pension you'd still have to have a fund of around €500K excluding the TFLS. Not many people earning €50K a year will get within an asses roar of that.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:59 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
lorcanoworms wrote:
Is the nurses pension all that good, I am hearing not good.


So a nurse retiring on say €50K after 40 years (say 60/61) gets a pension of 40/80ths (or 50% equal to €25,000) in addition they will get a Tax Free Lump sum of 120/80ths (€75,000).

To get an annuity of €25,000 a year you'd need a pension fund in the private sector of at least €1M. Even taking out the Contributory pension you'd still have to have a fund of around €500K excluding the TFLS. Not many people earning €50K a year will get within an asses roar of that.

I must have a chat with the ladies who were giving out.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:02 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
lorcanoworms wrote:
Is the nurses pension all that good, I am hearing not good.


So a nurse retiring on say €50K after 40 years (say 60/61) gets a pension of 40/80ths (or 50% equal to €25,000) in addition they will get a Tax Free Lump sum of 120/80ths (€75,000).

To get an annuity of €25,000 a year you'd need a pension fund in the private sector of at least €1M. Even taking out the Contributory pension you'd still have to have a fund of around €500K excluding the TFLS. Not many people earning €50K a year will get within an asses roar of that.



The issue is not that they will be comfortable in old age the issue is that they have the neck to put on the poor mouth and the media let them.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:17 pm 
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Going by my own experience ward nurses are not exactly dedicated,lack a vocation.
The nurses say in the Beacon are very kind and caring.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:29 pm 
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So a more accurate smear test has been delayed because of the free, unnecessary (from a medical pov), repeat smear test debacle last year.

Good going all round. :?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:50 pm 
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https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/cou ... 12872.html

Nobody likes to see a family home repossessed but there are not many countries where you could live rent free in a 1 million euro house for 8 years.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:26 pm 
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CM11 wrote:
So a more accurate smear test has been delayed because of the free, unnecessary (from a medical pov), repeat smear test debacle last year.

Good going all round. :?

And it's all the governments fault, and nothing to do with the false hysteria orchestrated by a group of mendacious politicians and their media lapdogs.

Nosiree, nothing at all.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:33 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/highprofile-restaurateur-ronan-ryan-and-former-miss-ireland-and-tv-star-pamela-flood-face-losing-1millionplus-home-37812872.html

Nobody likes to see a family home repossessed but there are not many countries where you could live rent free in a 1 million euro house for 8 years.

Would be nice if folks were able to make the connection between cases like that and the high variable rates that people who are paying their mortgages have to pay.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:14 pm 
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Nah fester, its all the greedy banks fault.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:27 pm 
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Take a break.

Hey Redders, best Lab last year: https://www.champdogs.co.uk/dog/65463

Now, back to the PS bashing...

Carry on.


Last edited by gokwe on Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:27 pm 
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Bit of a chicken and egg here. Banks currently aren't being very greedy but this situation is a result of them being greedy in the 00s. Now that has to be balanced by the buyers being equally greedy.

Unfortunately that doesn't help those who had nothing to do with the problem other than being a very good lesson in never borrowing to the hilt on your main residence.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:38 pm 
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Nah. If you're comparing high interest rates in Ireland with low ones in Europe that's purely as a result of mortgages not actually being a form of secured lending in Ireland while it is in Europe.

You don't pay your mortgage in Holland, you are out within 6 months. The bank also gets to chase you to your grave if there is no positive value left after repossessing your former property.

Result? 10 year fixed mortgage NL 1.6% IE 3% variable


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:40 pm 
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gokwe wrote:
Take a break.

Hey Redders, best Lab last year: https://www.champdogs.co.uk/dog/65463

Now, back to the PS bashing...

Carry on.


:lol: Never was a dog's name more apt. That yoke could do damage coming off the back of a scrum.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:01 am 
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CM11 wrote:
Bit of a chicken and egg here. Banks currently aren't being very greedy but this situation is a result of them being greedy in the 00s. Now that has to be balanced by the buyers being equally greedy.

Unfortunately that doesn't help those who had nothing to do with the problem other than being a very good lesson in never borrowing to the hilt on your main residence.

Ah with these kind of people it was never going to work.

The real problem is that nobody wanted to repossess back in the day. People like this were left in situ for years.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:11 am 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Bit of a chicken and egg here. Banks currently aren't being very greedy but this situation is a result of them being greedy in the 00s. Now that has to be balanced by the buyers being equally greedy.

Unfortunately that doesn't help those who had nothing to do with the problem other than being a very good lesson in never borrowing to the hilt on your main residence.

Ah with these kind of people it was never going to work.

The real problem is that nobody wanted to repossess back in the day. People like this were left in situ for years.


Have pals living near us and they've gone from living in a wonderful spot, in a cracking supportive friendly community within the larger small town community, to still living in a lovely spot, but with that sense of close community spirit busted wide open.

Two of their neighbours in an enclave of about 15 homes went down a similar path described in the article. One is believed to be 'genuine' couldn't pay; the other what's be termed a strategic defaulter. Thing is, in small town Ireland - and that describes ALL of Ireland IMHO - it's hard to know what's genuine and what's bullshit. All sorts of angles are being played by all sorts. Both families remain in their homes, years after the shit hit. One making payments as best they can, the other doing SFA; yet living a lifestyle which would suggest they could do a lot more.

The jealousies and anger it has brought to the surface has to be seen to be believed.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:14 am 
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https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-sty ... -1.3792457

The comments on facebag

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You could fit a lot of nurses on that land


:lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:16 am 
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redderneck wrote:
anonymous_joe wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Bit of a chicken and egg here. Banks currently aren't being very greedy but this situation is a result of them being greedy in the 00s. Now that has to be balanced by the buyers being equally greedy.

Unfortunately that doesn't help those who had nothing to do with the problem other than being a very good lesson in never borrowing to the hilt on your main residence.

Ah with these kind of people it was never going to work.

The real problem is that nobody wanted to repossess back in the day. People like this were left in situ for years.


Have pals living near us and they've gone from living in a wonderful spot, in a cracking supportive friendly community within the larger small town community, to still living in a lovely spot, but with that sense of close community spirit busted wide open.

Two of their neighbours in an enclave of about 15 homes went down a similar path described in the article. One is believed to be 'genuine' couldn't pay; the other what's be termed a strategic defaulter. Thing is, in small town Ireland - and that describes ALL of Ireland IMHO - it's hard to know what's genuine and what's bullshit. All sorts of angles are being played by all sorts. Both families remain in their homes, years after the shit hit. One making payments as best they can, the other doing SFA; yet living a lifestyle which would suggest they could do a lot more.

The jealousies and anger it has brought to the surface has to be seen to be believed.

Yeah, it's not so bad in work, as you can just do your job and ignore all their bollocks.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:29 am 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Bit of a chicken and egg here. Banks currently aren't being very greedy but this situation is a result of them being greedy in the 00s. Now that has to be balanced by the buyers being equally greedy.

Unfortunately that doesn't help those who had nothing to do with the problem other than being a very good lesson in never borrowing to the hilt on your main residence.

Ah with these kind of people it was never going to work.

The real problem is that nobody wanted to repossess back in the day. People like this were left in situ for years.


Yep the family income collapses and I know a couple of people in this exact situation. However this couple haven’t paid a cent in 8 years. Most couples made a genuine effort - at least went down to interest only. These guys typical get to stay in the house and maintain their middle class lifestyle. The kids in fee paying schools, two decent cars etc - all the trappings of solid middle class life. The school fees are usually in arrears too. It’s amazing how you can get away with it really - fairly unique to Ireland and not necessarily a bad thing as it protects the children. The poor sap working in Spar ends up paying for it though.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:38 am 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/highprofile-restaurateur-ronan-ryan-and-former-miss-ireland-and-tv-star-pamela-flood-face-losing-1millionplus-home-37812872.html

Nobody likes to see a family home repossessed but there are not many countries where you could live rent free in a 1 million euro house for 8 years.


That’s a lot of rent saved, compared to anybody renting a comparable property.
(For mortgage repayments, probably a lot more. )

Say a very conservative €3000 a month X 12 X 8 = €288,000.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:49 am 
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What it also does is disguise the fact that the new gig which Mr/Mrs/Ms entrepreneur has started up in the meantime, to replace the old one, may not be viable in terms of providing a 'proper' income.

Explains to some extent the serial entrepreneur nature of many in the food/entertainment/experiential game specifically. Of more interest to me is where their next bankroll comes from.

Again and again.

Shell games far too often. Ones often requiring those who should know better, being complicit.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:02 am 
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Celebrities rarely earn much money.

When you're younger you don't really ever think about it, but as I've gotten older, I've often wondered how celebrities make a living. It turns out a great many don't.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:17 am 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
Celebrities rarely earn much money.

When you're younger you don't really ever think about it, but as I've gotten older, I've often wondered how celebrities make a living. It turns out a great many don't.


Certainly not in Ireland. I did accounts for a lot of B and c list celebs back in the noughties. The income would be so erratic. Minted for a couple of months then whoring around for the next gig when it all runs out.

But the expense account is where they thrive. Clothes and "entertainment" as a business expense


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:44 am 
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Boxcar Ira wrote:
anonymous_joe wrote:
Celebrities rarely earn much money.

When you're younger you don't really ever think about it, but as I've gotten older, I've often wondered how celebrities make a living. It turns out a great many don't.


Certainly not in Ireland. I did accounts for a lot of B and c list celebs back in the noughties. The income would be so erratic. Minted for a couple of months then whoring around for the next gig when it all runs out.

But the expense account is where they thrive. Clothes and "entertainment" as a business expense

It's a surprisingly grim life for them. Which I find vaguely amusing.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:58 am 
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Surprisingly. It's extreme highs and extreme lows


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:01 pm 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
Celebrities rarely earn much money.

When you're younger you don't really ever think about it, but as I've gotten older, I've often wondered how celebrities make a living. It turns out a great many don't.


Hence shilling loads of shit on social media.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:06 pm 
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https://www.independent.ie/business/world/eu-crackdown-dealt-possible-blow-as-ruling-against-belgian-tax-break-for-global-giants-thrown-out-37816081.html

Looks like ''good news'' for Ireland on the 13Bn Apple tax ruling


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:26 pm 
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Also they go whoring around from company to company to be a brand ambassador, I.e. can I have a free car, holiday, clothes etc. You’d be surprised at some of the absolute hasbeens who get away with this


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:32 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
Also they go whoring around from company to company to be a brand ambassador, I.e. can I have a free car, holiday, clothes etc. You’d be surprised at some of the absolute hasbeens who get away with this

I knew an undergrad in Belfast who plays with the Irish international hockey team. He was saying that once he just contacted Skins out of the blue asking if he could have some free kit. He was probably looking to score a few hundred quid's worth of stuff.
They wanted to know his total number of social media followers across all platforms to see if they'd go with it. Can well imagine someone with a reasonable profile looking for cars, holidays, etc.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:32 pm 
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sewa wrote:



Quote:
The Commission wrongly considered that the Belgian system relating to the excess profit of multinational companies constituted an aid scheme," it said.


Boom vestager enjoy retirement you complete spoofer


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:45 pm 
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Between the Commissions proposals for a "Digital Tax", and now Vestagers competence "state aid" creep, being stymied, it seems that this Commissions attempt to take EU control of tax from the sovereign is now dead.

The new Commission won't touch tax issues with a bargepole.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:54 pm 
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When is the Irish case?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:56 pm 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
When is the Irish case?

No idea.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:57 pm 
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Wasn't sure if we should have put this on the Brexit thread, few of the usual numpty pigdogs have made big predictions on that


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