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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:29 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
How many buildings in Ireland have that dangerous cladding


Do you mean the specific one used or external insulation in general?
Few few multistorey buildigns have had cladding put on them, it's primarily been domestic dwellings that have undergone external insulation and rendering in the last few years. Even then, not a huge amount of them.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:40 pm 
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Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:54 pm 
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There's a number on here want us to live in shoe boxes in multi storey apartment blocks. I would hate that even ignoring the safety issue.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:08 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
There's a number on here want us to live in shoe boxes in multi storey apartment blocks. I would hate that even ignoring the safety issue.


In terms of safety: dry line the apartments to insulate them instead of using external cladding. It's the better option if building from scratch once ventilation is done properly.


Last edited by Leinsterman on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:08 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
There's a number on here want us to live in shoe boxes in multi storey apartment blocks. I would hate that even ignoring the safety issue.


No-one's forcing you to do live somewhere like that.

Also, I don't think any on here are proposing 24 storey council flat towers when they talk about higher rise residential buildings for Dublin.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:09 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
There's a number on here want us to live in shoe boxes in multi storey apartment blocks. I would hate that even ignoring the safety issue.


Have a parachute and a big window and you'll be grand.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:39 pm 
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regardless of what's causing the property bubble (or large property price increase's for risk of offending anyone) how do the experts see it playing out ? not so much interested in it being caused by a supply shortage (or vulture funds hoarding development property) and not due to banks throwing money at people like last time but anyone any idea what the end game looks like ....and when ? cheers, genuinely curious non expert.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:48 pm 
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ticketlessinseattle wrote:
regardless of what's causing the property bubble (or large property price increase's for risk of offending anyone) how do the experts see it playing out ? not so much interested in it being caused by a supply shortage (or vulture funds hoarding development property) and not due to banks throwing money at people like last time but anyone any idea what the end game looks like ....and when ? cheers, genuinely curious non expert.



No idea but my 5yo has told me she's going to live at home forever and take the house when I die so it looks like she's already plotted her own long-term strategy to cope with the housing shortage.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:53 pm 
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Not an expert but my two cents.

Low interest rates are the primary factor.

Combined with that is that in Ireland you now have large deposit requirements which is causing people to stay in their first buy (perhaps negative equity) and not move on thus not freeing up starter houses. This keeps first time buyers renting. This causes demand for rentals to increase which pushes up the return on rental units which leads to housing as an investment opportunity (driven by low yields from banks caused by low interest rates).

Now because the first time buyers dont have the deposit to start off with and cant save because of avocado and coffee or something... property that does come online goes to those with deep pockets looking for a return on their capital - which there is thanks to all those people without deposits renting.

Old people never move ever and die in their 75 bed homes all alone because.... no inheritance tax.

Answer is just to build more fkin homes. When this will happen? Who knows. Endgame? We all die.


Last edited by nardol on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:55 pm 
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I can probably believe that. There's been a few places I've seen in the 600-800k range which seem awful nice for that price bracket but some of the dumps going for 400-500k. :uhoh:


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:03 pm 
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nardol wrote:
Combined with that is that in Ireland you now have large deposit requirements which is causing people to stay in their first buy (perhaps negative equity) and not move on thus not freeing up starter houses.


It's possible to get an exception to the 20% deposits though.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:04 pm 
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Leinsterman wrote:
nardol wrote:
Combined with that is that in Ireland you now have large deposit requirements which is causing people to stay in their first buy (perhaps negative equity) and not move on thus not freeing up starter houses.


It's possible to get an exception to the 20% deposits though.


Yeah but as its the exception to the rule it doesn't really factor in to trends on a macro level.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:10 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


They retrofit that onto an existing concrete structure. The detail is very different for a new structure and doesn't create the same cavity between wall and panel which caused such mayhem. I doubt this has been applied to many buildings in Ireland as a refurbishment but I haven't been around Dublin in a while.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:11 pm 
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Rumham wrote:
Duff Paddy wrote:
Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


They retrofit that onto an existing concrete structure. The detail is very different for a new structure and doesn't create the same cavity between wall and panel which caused such mayhem. I doubt this has been applied to many buildings in Ireland as a refurbishment but I haven't been around Dublin in a while.


Only buildings in ireland worth doing this to were the ballymun flats and the communists tower along the liffey

... they do have shite hanging down off it these days


Last edited by nardol on Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:11 pm 
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Rumham wrote:
Duff Paddy wrote:
Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


They retrofit that onto an existing concrete structure. The detail is very different for a new structure and doesn't create the same cavity between wall and panel which caused such mayhem. I doubt this has been applied to many buildings in Ireland as a refurbishment but I haven't been around Dublin in a while.


We have knocked the majority of the concrete dumps rather than retrofitted them.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:15 pm 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Rumham wrote:
Duff Paddy wrote:
Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


They retrofit that onto an existing concrete structure. The detail is very different for a new structure and doesn't create the same cavity between wall and panel which caused such mayhem. I doubt this has been applied to many buildings in Ireland as a refurbishment but I haven't been around Dublin in a while.


We have knocked the majority of the concrete dumps rather than retrofitted them.


The UK will most likely be looking to do the same. It is going to cost an absolute fortune.

Once they change their building code, which will inevitably happen, they will have hundreds of inhabitable social housing tower blocks if they have been tarted up like this already. The untouched ones will have to be left as they are.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:17 pm 
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Rumham wrote:

The UK will most likely be looking to do the same. It is going to cost an absolute fortune.

Once they change their building code, which will inevitably happen, they will have hundreds of inhabitable social housing tower blocks if they have been tarted up like this already. The untouched ones will have to be left as they are.


But they will have the 350 million a week they no longer need to pay the EU to pay for it


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:20 pm 
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Leinsterman wrote:
nardol wrote:
Combined with that is that in Ireland you now have large deposit requirements which is causing people to stay in their first buy (perhaps negative equity) and not move on thus not freeing up starter houses.


It's possible to get an exception to the 20% deposits though.


Sunday Business Post saying that the Central Bank relaxing this rule is one of the issues causing the bubbl.....price increase


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:22 pm 
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sewa wrote:
Rumham wrote:

The UK will most likely be looking to do the same. It is going to cost an absolute fortune.

Once they change their building code, which will inevitably happen, they will have hundreds of inhabitable social housing tower blocks if they have been tarted up like this already. The untouched ones will have to be left as they are.


But they will have the 350 million a week they no longer need to pay the EU to pay for it


That's already earmarked for the NHS.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:11 pm 
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I see constant shite on FB from Early Retirement.ie.

The same crew who were involved in the CHC scam?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:12 am 
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Going back for a mo' to the Limerick/Cork/MidWest thing touched on a few pages back - one aspect to Varadkar's cabinet which 100% concerns me as a resident of the Mid-West is that there is no voice at the cabinet table for it.

Now in a properly functioning normal run of things, this would not matter one whit.

But every dog in the street knows damn well that it's critical.

It's also potentially risky from Leo; leaves the area vulnerable come election time. But as those employment blackspot stats dropped recently highlight, there remain major problems in Limerick especially and I'd hate to think the recent progress made on the jobs & investment front will be looked back on in time as merely an upward blip in temporary defiance of a steady overall decline due to the 'usual' Irish political bullshit stakes.

The singular best thing that happened in terms of inward investment in the last 30 years in the MidWest was them putting a bullet into SFADCO and bringing the region back under the direct remit of the IDA. I think there are worrying signs that the Shannon Group or whatever they're calling themselves nowadays, are every bit as inept as they were during the bulk of my growing-up years however.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:02 am 
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Vote for some talented TDs then.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:32 am 
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ticketlessinseattle wrote:
Leinsterman wrote:
nardol wrote:
Combined with that is that in Ireland you now have large deposit requirements which is causing people to stay in their first buy (perhaps negative equity) and not move on thus not freeing up starter houses.


It's possible to get an exception to the 20% deposits though.


Sunday Business Post saying that the Central Bank relaxing this rule is one of the issues causing the bubbl.....price increase


another article in that left wing tabloid the Sunday Business Post saying that vulture funds hoarding the land, not developing it and waiting until the price goes up further is a big contributory factor - the government wont do anything about it, didnt seek assurances when they flogged the land that it would be developed as its in their interest for property prices to go up. Any thoughts on how big a factor this would be ? when will it peak, when will they jump in start developing so prices return to something sane ?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:34 am 
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Just slap in a vacant site tax now and Bob's your uncle.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:57 am 
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Malcom Gladwell's second series of podcasts just started and he had an interesting one on LA and the lack of taxes Golf clubs pay for their land. It's an interesting listen on another countries land decisions http://revisionisthistory.com/about


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:20 am 
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The GAA sex abuse case in the midlands has been rumbling for a long time. Allegations are about 5 years old but one of the parties skipped the country, another is dead.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:39 am 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
The GAA sex abuse case in the midlands has been rumbling for a long time. Allegations are about 5 years old but one of the parties skipped the country, another is dead.


What's the story there? Underage coaches allegedly abusing kids in the club?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:49 am 
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Nolanator wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:
The GAA sex abuse case in the midlands has been rumbling for a long time. Allegations are about 5 years old but one of the parties skipped the country, another is dead.


What's the story there? Underage coaches allegedly abusing kids in the club?


Nope, lads who were employed by GAA on a FAS type scheme abusing lads. Lots pf photographic evidence seemingly.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:49 am 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
Vote for some talented TDs then.


A more than fair point.

Breen, Carey, Neville & O'Donovan. Nobody from North Tipp.

They are a piss-weak squad to be selecting anyone from, for anything tbh. They are the definition of political ballast and if we had any sense, local councils would be and bloody SHOULD BE the limit to their ambitions.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:24 am 
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redderneck wrote:
Going back for a mo' to the Limerick/Cork/MidWest thing touched on a few pages back - one aspect to Varadkar's cabinet which 100% concerns me as a resident of the Mid-West is that there is no voice at the cabinet table for it.

Now in a properly functioning normal run of things, this would not matter one whit.

But every dog in the street knows damn well that it's critical.

It's also potentially risky from Leo; leaves the area vulnerable come election time. But as those employment blackspot stats dropped recently highlight, there remain major problems in Limerick especially and I'd hate to think the recent progress made on the jobs & investment front will be looked back on in time as merely an upward blip in temporary defiance of a steady overall decline due to the 'usual' Irish political bullshit stakes.

The singular best thing that happened in terms of inward investment in the last 30 years in the MidWest was them putting a bullet into SFADCO and bringing the region back under the direct remit of the IDA. I think there are worrying signs that the Shannon Group or whatever they're calling themselves nowadays, are every bit as inept as they were during the bulk of my growing-up years however.


It's clear now how inept Shannon Development really were alright, though they were always likely to get muscled out by the IDA anyhow, bigger fish etc. The problem with the unemployment blackspots is that anyone from those areas who gets a job tends to move away from those areas. Anyone I know from Moyross (for example) who got a degree and job isn't going back there. It would be interesting to see a population analysis of the various blackspots on a region by region basis. It also takes years and years for the investments that have been made in education to pay off. LIT has been a massive driver in reducing unemployment in the Midwest but again, it will probably take over a decade before that really gets seen in these areas.

We badly need a voice at the cabinet though, and it's not clear who that could be.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:43 am 
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Yup. I mean - with the best will in the world - none of those 4 aforementioned SHOULD be sitting at any cabinet table worthy of the name. It should not be an issue, but it is. I would have a bit of time for Niall Collins of FF, but by and large, not for his party. The calibre of public rep in the MidWest doesn't reflect well on the MidWest voters...


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:46 am 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Rumham wrote:
Duff Paddy wrote:
Well it's too early to say, but the suggestion is that the cladding used on this building was the reason it went up so quickly. You'd have to think it was the particular type of cladding as that shouldn't happen.


They retrofit that onto an existing concrete structure. The detail is very different for a new structure and doesn't create the same cavity between wall and panel which caused such mayhem. I doubt this has been applied to many buildings in Ireland as a refurbishment but I haven't been around Dublin in a while.


We have knocked the majority of the concrete dumps rather than retrofitted them.

I'd be more worried about the newer buildings and corners being cut with those.

Millfield Manor in Newbridge was only built in 2006. 6 houses ablaze within 20 minutes.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:48 am 
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redderneck wrote:
Yup. I mean - with the best will in the world - none of those 4 aforementioned SHOULD be sitting at any cabinet table worthy of the name. It should not be an issue, but it is. I would have a bit of time for Niall Collins of FF, but by and large, not for his party. The calibre of public rep in the MidWest doesn't reflect well on the MidWest voters...

If you want exemptions from property tax or help with your planning application, Willie O'Dea is your man but beyond that, Galway and Limerick has a very low quality of representation.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 12:04 pm 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
redderneck wrote:
Yup. I mean - with the best will in the world - none of those 4 aforementioned SHOULD be sitting at any cabinet table worthy of the name. It should not be an issue, but it is. I would have a bit of time for Niall Collins of FF, but by and large, not for his party. The calibre of public rep in the MidWest doesn't reflect well on the MidWest voters...

If you want exemptions from property tax or help with your planning application, Willie O'Dea is your man but beyond that, Galway and Limerick has a very low quality of representation.


Jan O'Sullivan and Noonan were great for the city in the last Government (or second last I guess now), but Noonan is retiring and O'Sullivan might be retiring. I like Keiran O'Donnell and Patrick O'Donovan but I'm not sure either has anything close to a vision. Quinlivan hasn't done anything since being made a TD, but that was to be expected.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:30 am 
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M50 toll gooooone.

Freedom of Dublin to follow. :lol:

http://independent.ie/irish-news/traffi ... 36277.html


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:48 pm 
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Is the story about €1 billion Cork docklands plan something realistic or more akin to the Chinatown in Athlone or the Disneyland in Dublin plans?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:53 pm 
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ID2 wrote:
Is the story about €1 billion Cork docklands plan something realistic or more akin to the Chinatown in Athlone or the Disneyland in Dublin plans?


Something will happen there but it remains to be seen the scale of it. It is prime real estate crying out for somebody to develop it but it is a lot easier said than done to do these things, especially in Cork.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:58 pm 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
Vote for some talented TDs then.


Or stop voting for f**king independents who scream like bitches how bad successive governments are in the realisation that it will get them reelected and they will never have to actually make the tough decision of choosing between funding a local garda station or cut funding in cancer care.

fudge independents


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Last edited by EverReady on Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:08 pm 
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Last edited by redderneck on Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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