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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 10:07 am 
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Agree about the shit the councillors get. One local lady is nothing but helpful but 5minutes on Facebook and you’d think she was a mass murderer. The abuse she gets is unreal.

I see there’s an AONTU lad running in north Wicklow as well - got kicked out of FG or FF due to his pro life stand and ended up with them.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 10:17 am 
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Are Aontu not just the FF of Devs time ?


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:49 pm 
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So we have record employment of 2.3m (it dropped below 1.9m in 2011), our unemployment rate has been revised down to 4.6% with the Long Term Unemployed down to 1.7%.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/eco ... -1.3899416

And still the Lefties moan.

God help us all should they ever get a sniff of power.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:51 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
So we have record employment of 2.3m (it dropped below 1.9m in 2011), our unemployment rate has been revised down to 4.6% with the Long Term Unemployed down to 1.7%.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/eco ... -1.3899416

And still the Lefties moan.

God help us all should they ever get a sniff of power.

Just this morning we had a PBP loon on the radio saying that capitalism has failed, it’s had 100 years and it has been a great failure and as a result we have terrible problems like the homelessness crisis


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:53 pm 
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Has our rate dropped below Australia now?

We have been waiting 12 years for this day :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:57 pm 
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Boxcar Ira wrote:
Has our rate dropped below Australia now?

We have been waiting 12 years for this day :thumbup:

Way below, they're at 5.2%.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:58 pm 
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A happy day for Irish boredies


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 12:59 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
So we have record employment of 2.3m (it dropped below 1.9m in 2011), our unemployment rate has been revised down to 4.6% with the Long Term Unemployed down to 1.7%.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/eco ... -1.3899416

And still the Lefties moan.

God help us all should they ever get a sniff of power.

Just this morning we had a PBP loon on the radio saying that capitalism has failed, it’s had 100 years and it has been a great failure and as a result we have terrible problems like the homelessness crisis

And did the interviewer challenge their witterings ?


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:00 pm 
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No longer will our nation be taunted by a fat kiwi living in a redneck mining town in Australia


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:01 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
No longer will our nation be taunted by a fat kiwi living in a redneck mining town in Australia


Not for another 6 years at least


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:09 pm 
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What's wrong with the Co Living model? It's not designed for families, it's for single people starting off. To me it sounds like a great idea, especially since the FG government got rid of bedsits.

Practically everyone I know lived in a bedsit at some stage or other. We were never going to make them our homes but they were a first rung on the ladder when we moved to Dublin.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:14 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
What's wrong with the Co Living model? It's not designed for families, it's for single people starting off. To me it sounds like a great idea, especially since the FG government got rid of bedsits.

Practically everyone I know lived in a bedsit at some stage or other. We were never going to make them our homes but they were a first rung on the ladder when we moved to Dublin.

You don't understand, the Government should give everyone as a right a 3/4 bed semi D with a large back garden in the location of their choice as a forever home.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:15 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:
What's wrong with the Co Living model? It's not designed for families, it's for single people starting off. To me it sounds like a great idea, especially since the FG government got rid of bedsits.

Practically everyone I know lived in a bedsit at some stage or other. We were never going to make them our homes but they were a first rung on the ladder when we moved to Dublin.

You don't understand, the Government should give everyone as a right a 3/4 bed semi D with a large back garden in the location of their choice as a forever home.

Sure you're not conflating two different issues there? :roll:


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:17 pm 
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Student accommodation in most of europe is based on this model. There are legal minimums to rooms per facility (max 5 rooms per kitchen / toilet etc). The model have this in Ireland?


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:25 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
No longer will our nation be taunted by a fat kiwi living in a redneck mining town in Australia


I think we should remind him


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:26 pm 
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Nolanator wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:
What's wrong with the Co Living model? It's not designed for families, it's for single people starting off. To me it sounds like a great idea, especially since the FG government got rid of bedsits.

Practically everyone I know lived in a bedsit at some stage or other. We were never going to make them our homes but they were a first rung on the ladder when we moved to Dublin.

You don't understand, the Government should give everyone as a right a 3/4 bed semi D with a large back garden in the location of their choice as a forever home.

Sure you're not conflating two different issues there? :roll:


the only conflation going on is amongst the perennially malcontent lefties in Ireland, who have somehow concluded that co-living is a trojan horse thats designed to force Irish families back into tenements

Co-living is a well established model in many countries, designed to accommodate mobile workers, landing FDI teams, young people starting out etc etc. Its only for a certain cohort of short term occupiers, yet its received in Dublin by the permanently outraged, as some sort of concentration camp.

The reaction to co-working by the likes of Una Mullaly, absolutely and perfectly captures whats wrong with Ireland today .... namely that its choc-full of moany pricks who think the taxpayer owes them a living that said taxpayer can hardly even afford for himself/herself


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:33 pm 
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The Ben Gilroy election video is class.

https://twitter.com/electionlit/status/1130396544824467456


Last edited by paddyor on Tue May 21, 2019 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:34 pm 
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a bunch of lads renting a house while students is the exact same as this type of living.... only difference is you can individually rent a room. It allows the socially exiled to also find a spot to live.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:34 pm 
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https://twitter.com/ownohmanny/status/1130727720663552001


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:36 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
No longer will our nation be taunted by a fat kiwi living in a redneck mining town in Australia


:lol: Come out Ali....you know who you are.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:39 pm 
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You mean they stopped giving out about Israel long enough to vote.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:54 pm 
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Boxcar Ira wrote:
A happy day for Irish boredies


Get an AC call out thread going


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:56 pm 
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https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/c ... 32076.html


60k because she is apparently never learned to use a swing as a child ... these are the ones who are supposed to reform the insurance bollox.... no wonder reform is not forthcoming


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 1:59 pm 
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nardol wrote:
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/dublin-td-maria-bailey-who-fell-off-swing-wasnt-holding-on-properly-hotel-claims-38132076.html


60k because she is apparently never learned to use a swing as a child ... these are the ones who are supposed to reform the insurance bollox.... no wonder reform is not forthcoming

I'd imagine she wasn't pre-loaded with 3 or 4 Gs&Ts before using the swing as a child.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 2:03 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
nardol wrote:
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/dublin-td-maria-bailey-who-fell-off-swing-wasnt-holding-on-properly-hotel-claims-38132076.html


60k because she is apparently never learned to use a swing as a child ... these are the ones who are supposed to reform the insurance bollox.... no wonder reform is not forthcoming

I'd imagine she wasn't pre-loaded with 3 or 4 Gs&Ts before using the swing as a child.

Ah the Healy ray defence ... it wasnt my fault i knocked those people over judge, I had a few drinks on


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 4:39 pm 
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Also, new home completions at 4,275 up 23.2% in Q1 over 2018, with over 60% of these in the Greater Dublin Area.

https://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublicatio ... onsq12019/

Should that rate of increase continue there will be about 22,200 new home completions this year over the 18,072 completions in 2018, which itself was 25% more than the 2017 figure.

The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 4:49 pm 
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nardol wrote:
Student accommodation in most of europe is based on this model. There are legal minimums to rooms per facility (max 5 rooms per kitchen / toilet etc). The model have this in Ireland?


Yes, but it costs 9K a year.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:01 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:02 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Also, new home completions at 4,275 up 23.2% in Q1 over 2018, with over 60% of these in the Greater Dublin Area.

https://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublicatio ... onsq12019/

Should that rate of increase continue there will be about 22,200 new home completions this year over the 18,072 completions in 2018, which itself was 25% more than the 2017 figure.

The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


yep

any media commentator, homelessness 'advocate', economist, politician or party, that tells you that the Government should be doing more to increase supply above this yoy 25% rate, is a dangerous simpleton and needs to be called out as such.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:07 pm 
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CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.


It's not just the odd person who lived on tins of beans. We all did. No one got married and moved into a fully finished house with furniture just out of the wrapping. We had hand me down furniture and gradually changed it. We had friends who lived with us and paid rent to help with the mortgage. That was the way it was. The other factor that people don't mention is that interest rates were 6% plus (I know someone who fixed at 12% for 3 years) so this notion that the cost of housing was cheap is just that.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:09 pm 
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CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.

Increase in supply is the answer, and the best way to do that is to build higher in the places people want to live (say 8-9 floors instead of 4 - 5). If you really want " affordable" housing, not only must we build higher, but also change the building regs. The dual aspect, and number of apts per lift, for example, are seriously out of whack with the building regs in say, Vienna, which is always brought up as an example of where affordable units are built. We have thousands of single storey cottages between the canals. If we want "affordable" housing we need to finance DCC (or other statutory authority) to compulsorily purchase them and prepare outline planning scemes before selling on. We are not serious about planning in this country. It is used as a tool to stymie development instead of encouraging and controlling it.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:18 pm 
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Liathroidigloine wrote:
CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.


It's not just the odd person who lived on tins of beans. We all did. No one got married and moved into a fully finished house with furniture just out of the wrapping. We had hand me down furniture and gradually changed it. We had friends who lived with us and paid rent to help with the mortgage. That was the way it was. The other factor that people don't mention is that interest rates were 6% plus (I know someone who fixed at 12% for 3 years) so this notion that the cost of housing was cheap is just that.


You miss my point that for a lot of people that was a means to an end. In the current situation it is the ends, if they could even get the cheap mortgages that would need to flood the market.

camroc1 wrote:
CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.

Increase in supply is the answer, and the best way to do that is to build higher in the places people want to live (say 8-9 floors instead of 4 - 5). If you really want " affordable" housing, not only must we build higher, but also change the building regs. The dual aspect, and number of apts per lift, for example, are seriously out of whack with the building regs in say, Vienna, which is always brought up as an example of where affordable units are built. We have thousands of single storey cottages between the canals. If we want "affordable" housing we need to finance DCC (or other statutory authority) to compulsorily purchase them and prepare outline planning scemes before selling on. We are not serious about planning in this country. It is used as a tool to stymie development instead of encouraging and controlling it.


Yeah. Absolutely. In Cork a lot of people are excited about the docklands project, despite it sitting around going nowhere for an age. When I left college it was my old uni President who took it on, being promised €1b to go at it. A decade later it's still going nowhere, while the likes of Apple bring ever more people in and the housing situation is forcing other people away.

One battle area I see here is cycling routes. The people already in the city want them. The people on the outskirts don't. If you're going to build upwards within the city then they need to be in place or it'll cause problems. But right now they're the argument rather than the fact that they're a precursor to what needs to happen immediately next, the medium rise accommodation that'll see them get used.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:26 pm 
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The real issue is that pretty much everybody has to live in Dublin if they want a job.

That's the big change. My parents had friends who were able to buy gaffs pretty much out of college down the country.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:26 pm 
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You talk about sacrifices all you like it’s all window dressing, the bottom line is the average income to house price ratio that is now completely out of whack compared to our parents generation. But it’s a worldwide problem not unique to Ireland


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:28 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
You talk about sacrifices all you like it’s all window dressing, the bottom line is the average income to house price ratio that is now completely out of whack compared to our parents generation. But it’s a worldwide problem not unique to Ireland


Talk to a QS about the cost of building and you'll see the problem, alright. It's unaffordably expensive for average people.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:32 pm 
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CarrotGawks wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:
CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.


It's not just the odd person who lived on tins of beans. We all did. No one got married and moved into a fully finished house with furniture just out of the wrapping. We had hand me down furniture and gradually changed it. We had friends who lived with us and paid rent to help with the mortgage. That was the way it was. The other factor that people don't mention is that interest rates were 6% plus (I know someone who fixed at 12% for 3 years) so this notion that the cost of housing was cheap is just that.


You miss my point that for a lot of people that was a means to an end. In the current situation it is the ends, if they could even get the cheap mortgages that would need to flood the market.

camroc1 wrote:
CarrotGawks wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
The building industry is increasing new home production at about 25% per annum - it's very difficult to increase by more without going back to the silly days of the early noughties when foreign banks, followed by our own darlings, started shovelling money out the door to any Gobshite with a 10 Acre field and a 4x4 as their office.


Isn't that the problem though, that shovelling money out the door would be necessary. Not just to build the houses, but for a large portion of people to ever be able to afford the houses. The cost of living somewhere needs to drop significantly. Not just for people who can't afford to live somewhere but for the greater amount of people who have most of their income dedicated to just housing. (And continuing on from that, the flow of a large part of the economy towards those who own the houses.)

There's plenty of people saying, "In my day I lived on tins of beans so I could afford my first home," and I know they now have multiple investment properties. Living on tins of beans for a while is a sacrifice someone can make when they're looking at the huge upside, a huge increase in wealth in the long run. Living on tins of beans in the short term so you can afford to splash out on the odd M&S tin of beans in the long run isn't one worth making.

Increase in supply is the answer, and the best way to do that is to build higher in the places people want to live (say 8-9 floors instead of 4 - 5). If you really want " affordable" housing, not only must we build higher, but also change the building regs. The dual aspect, and number of apts per lift, for example, are seriously out of whack with the building regs in say, Vienna, which is always brought up as an example of where affordable units are built. We have thousands of single storey cottages between the canals. If we want "affordable" housing we need to finance DCC (or other statutory authority) to compulsorily purchase them and prepare outline planning scemes before selling on. We are not serious about planning in this country. It is used as a tool to stymie development instead of encouraging and controlling it.


Yeah. Absolutely. In Cork a lot of people are excited about the docklands project, despite it sitting around going nowhere for an age. When I left college it was my old uni President who took it on, being promised €1b to go at it. A decade later it's still going nowhere, while the likes of Apple bring ever more people in and the housing situation is forcing other people away.

One battle area I see here is cycling routes. The people already in the city want them. The people on the outskirts don't. If you're going to build upwards within the city then they need to be in place or it'll cause problems. But right now they're the argument rather than the fact that they're a precursor to what needs to happen immediately next, the medium rise accommodation that'll see them get used.

I can recall meeting Cork Co Council engineers and planners for the proposed Treasury development at Horgans Quay/Kent Station back in the early noughties !


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:36 pm 
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Duff Paddy wrote:
You talk about sacrifices all you like it’s all window dressing, the bottom line is the average income to house price ratio that is now completely out of whack compared to our parents generation. But it’s a worldwide problem not unique to Ireland


I'm talking about temporary sacrifices, which isn't what people have now. They're not giving up something now for more in the future. It's giving up everything to have even a hope of even a little bit of what people had in the past.

My whole point is that the people who lived on tins of beans for a few months in the past now have vast investment portfolios. If some people (and not everyone can) were to get a house now it'd be beans forever, with the prospect of M&S beans in the future rather than a bundle of wealth.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:39 pm 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
Duff Paddy wrote:
You talk about sacrifices all you like it’s all window dressing, the bottom line is the average income to house price ratio that is now completely out of whack compared to our parents generation. But it’s a worldwide problem not unique to Ireland


Talk to a QS about the cost of building and you'll see the problem, alright. It's unaffordably expensive for average people.

There are solutions.

Cap windfall gains on change in zoning to resi

Build higher

Reduce government taxation on new builds (ie VAT)

Revise certain aspects of building rega

etc etc.


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:42 pm 
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Realistically cammy the solution is to get away from the house ownership obsession/model to a continental style system of liveable apartments and legislative protection for lifelong rental


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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 5:50 pm 
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anonymous_joe wrote:
The real issue is that pretty much everybody has to live in Dublin if they want a job.

That's the big change. My parents had friends who were able to buy gaffs pretty much out of college down the country.


Wtf? Limerick, Cork and Galway are full of jobs atm. Anyone not working in any of those places is choosing to not work in certain areas. Limerick's unemployment rate is back to where it was in 2007 or so, more or less full employment, except for places with multi-generational entrenched unemployment.


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