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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:46 pm 
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POC's comments in the build up were spot on. England want to play wide-wide so don't number up at the breakdown. The opposition have had a couple of seasons to work this out and now they are just piling in at the breakdown and England are refusing to adjust. We defended really well today but that counts for the square root of fudge all when you can't build a score.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:47 pm 
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I still think playing Ford and Farrell together hampers both of them.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:47 pm 
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Daly did terrificly well for a player with no recent game-time but that push?? I think England scored a try then although the French cameras didn't show it.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:47 pm 
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nardol wrote:
I think Eddie thinks he is coaching a league side

His strategy is to have as little as needed in the ruck and then to overlap all the time.

That works if you have a big pack who are fast. England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:48 pm 
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maverickmak wrote:
I still think playing Ford and Farrell together hampers both of them.

We might have to make a choice now yes.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:49 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Daly did terrificly well for a player with no recent game-time but that push?? I think England scored a try then although the French cameras didn't show it.

He pushed him because he couldn't avoid him. It was a block which the rather timid touch judge bought.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:50 pm 
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What happened to England's scrum and maul? Eddie Jones has not sorted this at all.

The attack: England have stopped being able to create chances. This happened in the AIs, when they capitalised on mistakes rather then creating chances. Now in championship matches they are being exposed.

The breakdown. We all know the issues. But it's not just an Openside and backrow balance. The tight 5 is incapable of basting off opponents on our ball. In fact frequently England players stand there watching the context and realise they have to get involved. hence the turnovers we conceed.

Nobody runs onto the ball. It's all static. It's all shit slow ball.

The line-up. The subs showed how vastly superior they were as carriers. Haskell was good, Sinklar was dynamite, LCD was dynamic.

The Grassroots. Why do England consistently produce players without the full array of skills and physicality. Almost every key player has a fault.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:50 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:50 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
Robshaw and Haskell gave away 9 points today in penalties

If they're the answer then we're asking the wrong question


Robshaw gave away three points for a penalty where even POC said he couldn't do anything about it and won several turnovers.

Haskell had a big impact with his carrying and clearing. It's no surprise that we actually looked threatening once the subs came on and actually hit rucks hard.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:51 pm 
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Maverick and Wendigo you're both three stages too far into the "dealing with getting bummed at the breakdown" survival guide

Quote:

1. The ref on the day
2. The reffing in the Premiership
3. Anyone in the tight five who had a bad game
4. Anyone in the backline who had a bad game
5. The Premiership for picking too many foreign 7s
6. The Premiership for not picking any 7s at all
7. Our age-grade sides for not producing any 7s
8. Tom Rees for retiring so early


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:51 pm 
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Gospel wrote:
Rugby2023 wrote:
Daly did terrificly well for a player with no recent game-time but that push?? I think England scored a try then although the French cameras didn't show it.

He pushed him because he couldn't avoid him. It was a block which the rather timid touch judge bought.

The penalty should have gone to us, it was a deliberate block


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:52 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:
Robshaw and Haskell gave away 9 points today in penalties

If they're the answer then we're asking the wrong question


Robshaw gave away three points for a penalty where even POC said he couldn't do anything about it and won several turnovers.

Haskell had a big impact with his carrying and clearing. It's no surprise that we actually looked threatening once the subs came on and actually hit rucks hard.

+1

England looked better with them at 6 & 7. As crap as the first 60 minutes were, the last 20 gives me some hope.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:52 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:
Robshaw and Haskell gave away 9 points today in penalties

If they're the answer then we're asking the wrong question


Robshaw gave away three points for a penalty where even POC said he couldn't do anything about it and won several turnovers.

Haskell had a big impact with his carrying and clearing. It's no surprise that we actually looked threatening once the subs came on and actually hit rucks hard.


Robshaw gave away an offside penalty and a breakdown penalty - both were kicked for points

Haskell gave away a breakdown penalty - kicked for points

That's 9 points in a game we lost by 6


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:53 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
Maverick and Wendigo you're both three stages too far into the "dealing with getting bummed at the breakdown" survival guide

Quote:

1. The ref on the day
2. The reffing in the Premiership
3. Anyone in the tight five who had a bad game
4. Anyone in the backline who had a bad game
5. The Premiership for picking too many foreign 7s
6. The Premiership for not picking any 7s at all
7. Our age-grade sides for not producing any 7s
8. Tom Rees for retiring so early

:lol: :lol: :thumbup: thanks for that open. Cheered me up.


Last edited by Wendigo7 on Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:53 pm 
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Watson: not really a full back


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:54 pm 
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Somehow I think the f**king penalty try and yellow card from Watson was more telling than back rows giving away penalties trying to do their job


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:55 pm 
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Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?

Yes. Look at the size of Wales, Ireland and Frances packs.

I don’t think I’m saying much saying even though the stats say otherwise, they look a lot fuller, bigger and more physical than us.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:55 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
Somehow I think the f**king penalty try and yellow card from Watson was more telling than back rows giving away penalties trying to do their job


Being shit at their jobs


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:55 pm 
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Anything to deflect away from Saint Robshaw it seems


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:56 pm 
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Seen the replay of the end there, before we knocked on?

5 on 2 (maybe 3) overlap. Ball got recycled instead and knocked on in the tackle.

Image


Last edited by ThePretender on Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:57 pm 
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There we go. POC just said England aren’t a big physical team.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:57 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?

Yes. Look at the size of Wales, Ireland and Frances packs.

I don’t think I’m saying much saying even though the stats say otherwise, they look a lot fuller, bigger and more physical than us.

Our pack was considerably bigger than France. We had three locks and Nathan Hughes.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:58 pm 
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Pack rating:

Mako 5/10
George 3/10
Cole -3/10
Launch 4/10
Maro 5/10
Lawes 1/10
Robshaw 4/10
Hughes 4/10


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:58 pm 
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Flankers in giving away penalties shock.

Anyway, for Ireland

Marler, Mako looks done in
Hartley if fit, else George gets a second chance
Sinckler
Launchbury
Itoje
Robshaw
Simmons
Hask

fudge knows
Ford

May
Farrell
JJ, Te'o is just not a Test 13
Daly
Watson, I suppose

Pick whoever on the bench, as long as Cole is gone.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:58 pm 
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englishchief wrote:
Anything to deflect away from Saint Robshaw it seems


Indeed

If there is any accountability at all for performances then Robshaw is a goner


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?

Yes. Look at the size of Wales, Ireland and Frances packs.

I don’t think I’m saying much saying even though the stats say otherwise, they look a lot fuller, bigger and more physical than us.

Our pack was considerably bigger than France. We had three locks and Nathan Hughes.

Are any of them physical though?

Nope.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?

Yes. Look at the size of Wales, Ireland and Frances packs.

I don’t think I’m saying much saying even though the stats say otherwise, they look a lot fuller, bigger and more physical than us.


I disagree. Losing Hughes did not help. England could field a bigger pack, sure but it is not small.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Hey if you guys think the penalties those two gave away were the problem then have at it, I think it was pretty clear where the real problems were (including the same problem from last week, which includes Robshaw) but given the years long hissy fit from some posters I'm not surprised this is being used as an excuse to fight old wars.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:59 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
nardol wrote:
I think Eddie thinks he is coaching a league side

His strategy is to have as little as needed in the ruck and then to overlap all the time.

That works if you have a big pack who are fast. England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.



England aren't a small team, hey have missed weight in he backrow, that's all.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:59 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
englishchief wrote:
Anything to deflect away from Saint Robshaw it seems


Indeed

If there is any accountability at all for performances then Robshaw is a goner

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:00 pm 
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The Man Without Fear wrote:
Flankers in giving away penalties shock.


:lol:

Is this an actual excuse for a game where we gave away 16 penalties


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:00 pm 
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maverickmak wrote:
I still think playing Ford and Farrell together hampers both of them.


It doesn't matter who plays 10/12 if a) you don't get clean ball and keep getting turned over b) the SH is crap

The problem isn't with the backs.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:01 pm 
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englishchief wrote:
Anything to deflect away from Saint Robshaw it seems

Far be it for me to defend a filthy quim but for large swathes of the game it seemed that Robshaw was the only England player making any positive interventions.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm 
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Keith wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Keith wrote:
To me is clear that we only have one world class player - Elliott Daly



Stop being silly.

Name the others. If you mention Farrell.... :?



Launchbury , Itoji, Farrell, George was a winner in a Lions shirt. So knob off.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm 
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ovalball wrote:
maverickmak wrote:
I still think playing Ford and Farrell together hampers both of them.


It doesn't matter who plays 10/12 if a) you don't get clean ball and keep getting turned over b) the SH is crap

The problem isn't with the backs.

Solid analysis. Care made Wigglesworth look good, and that takes some doing.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm 
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So how do you fix it then?

If it’s the forwards who goes... and I mean a full drop?

Are we sure even moving Robshaw to 6 with a 7 coming in and Cole being dropped is enough?


Last edited by Wendigo7 on Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
The Man Without Fear wrote:
Flankers in giving away penalties shock.


:lol:

Is this an actual excuse for a game where we gave away 16 penalties


Of which the flankers conceded 4 :lol:

Most of them were for holding on.

You are all over the shop, as ever.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:02 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
englishchief wrote:
Anything to deflect away from Saint Robshaw it seems


Indeed

If there is any accountability at all for performances then
At 7, sure. But it's ludicrous to watch that game and say he deserves to be dropped.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:03 pm 
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I think LCD and Simmonds can certainly come out of the game with their heads held high.

I think Farrell needs to be dropped (he's such a f**king robot, standing still and lobbing the ball on and making shit tackles in defence), Slade to go to 13 and Te'o to 12.

Mark Wilson in at 6 (even Jack Willis ffs), Hask at 7.

Maunder or Robson at 9, Wiggy and Care shouldn't even be near the squad. Vellacott instead of either of those 2 as well.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:03 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
Gospel wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
England are a physically small team, we need to fight for anything we get.

Small? :?

Yes. Look at the size of Wales, Ireland and Frances packs.

I don’t think I’m saying much saying even though the stats say otherwise, they look a lot fuller, bigger and more physical than us.



France pack of course , we out weighed the Welsh and Scots pack.


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