Planet Rugby Forum

England scrum half rumours

Joe Simpson going to Harlequins
Ben Vellacott lined up as his replacement at Wasps

openclashXX wrote:England scrum half rumours

Joe Simpson going to Harlequins
Ben Vellacott lined up as his replacement at Wasps

Pah. He's no Dave Lewis.

Sauce?

openclashXX wrote:England scrum half rumours

Joe Simpson going to Harlequins
Ben Vellacott lined up as his replacement at Wasps

There were rumblings about him looking for an out last season as he's slumped to being (justifiably) second choice. Dai was fairly curt, simply stating that Joe was contracted until the end of this season when asked about it iirc.

Vellacott would be a decent addition in his stead. Would wonder what that means for Hampson who's looked pretty good in the limited opportunities he's had.

Would be a very strange choice for Quins. Barely younger than Care, Nowhere near as good, but presumably still looking for a decent wedge.

RodneyRegis wrote:Would be a very strange choice for Quins. Barely younger than Care, Nowhere near as good, but presumably still looking for a decent wedge.

You've already mentioned him, but it can't hurt to re-iterate: Dave Lewis.

Even an off form Simpson would be an upgrade there. He might be willing to take a cut just to get more game time than he's been enjoying for Wasps of late.

Yes - hopefully the new broom will despatch of Lewis ASAP.

would still rather get a young, quality SH in - although maybe they are backing Callum Waters.

I’d like to see Waters get a chance before we look at anyone else.

The Simpson rumour is also linked to whether Care re-signs or not. I can’t see him not doing so unless he misses out on the World Cup squad and lands a big contract in France.

There was also a rumour of Simpson to Ealing I believe?

Yeah - that was a while ago though.

I used to be a fan of Simpson but he’s really not stepped-up to compete with Robson as I thought he might. If anything, the less good parts of his game have become more obvious now that less game time means that there are less ‘highlight reel’ moments to counter them.

Yeah he's not great these days.

RodneyRegis wrote:Yes - hopefully the new broom will despatch of Lewis ASAP.

would still rather get a young, quality SH in - although maybe they are backing Callum Waters.

I think Mulchrone is in the box seat as regular back up and replacement for Care. I got confused when the prem 7s was on and thought Waters had had some good games for wins the season before last, but it was Mulchrone. He's a decent player.

I can't imagine Glos will want to get rid of Vellacotte, but then again they let Robson go in the past so you never know. I'd much prefer we hang onto him than Braley (or Heinz for that matter). Much higher potential IMO.

Scrum half performance of the week was Uren off the bench for Bristol. His kicking and control won the game

Matt O'Connor has been sacked from the tigers, woohoo!

Nabberuk wrote:Matt O'Connor has been sacked from the tigers, woohoo!

Damn, I was hoping they'd hang on to him for a few more months.

beafheart wrote:I can't imagine Glos will want to get rid of Vellacotte, but then again they let Robson go in the past so you never know. I'd much prefer we hang onto him than Braley (or Heinz for that matter). Much higher potential IMO.

Scrum half performance of the week was Uren off the bench for Bristol. His kicking and control won the game

They play Heinz for every minute they can usually, club captain. It's a tough person to be behind, especially when splitting time between him and Braley anyway.

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport. Loz had a hand in both tries, going well?

I thought it was a good performance from him. Breaking tackles and not getting much wrong.

Will Skelton was the news though - is a different man and player.

Agreed on Lozowski. Definitely the catalyst for most of their better breaks.

Skelton was almost unrecognisable.

One observation I do have is that Sarries don’t appear to trust Tolofua. Yes it was a tight game, but they retained Jamie George for over 70mins. He’s not going to be able to manage that all season, which underlined how much they’ll miss Brits.

Jamie scored a wonder try and came pretty close to another 65 minutes in, the dude has a great engine, Skelton had a monster game, we saw the results in his first spell but obviously no one down under followed up on his progress, I suspect that's why he came back. Ben Earl also had a great game.

Lewington looks like a Ashton Mk2 in terms of his support lines which is promising but i'm a little worried about how many players we'll have left standing come April, we lost 3 yesterday.

Watched the Quins game. Holy shit, our intensity was something else. Long may it continue.

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport. Loz had a hand in both tries, going well?

I thought it was a good performance from him. Breaking tackles and not getting much wrong.

Will Skelton was the news though - is a different man and player.

Agreed on Lozowski. Definitely the catalyst for most of their better breaks.

Skelton was almost unrecognisable.

One observation I do have is that Sarries don’t appear to trust Tolofua. Yes it was a tight game, but they retained Jamie George for over 70mins. He’s not going to be able to manage that all season, which underlined how much they’ll miss Brits.

There is Woolstencroft and Spurling that might take some of the workload.

Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

@neilfissler
Jim Mallinder and Dorian West at Leicester Tigers Premiership Shield game tonight #justsaying

Margin_Walker wrote:

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

@neilfissler
Jim Mallinder and Dorian West at Leicester Tigers Premiership Shield game tonight #justsaying

It's against saints...

Nabberuk wrote:

Margin_Walker wrote:

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

@neilfissler
Jim Mallinder and Dorian West at Leicester Tigers Premiership Shield game tonight #justsaying

It's against saints...

Don't ruin it...

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport. Loz had a hand in both tries, going well?

I thought it was a good performance from him. Breaking tackles and not getting much wrong.

Will Skelton was the news though - is a different man and player.

Agreed on Lozowski. Definitely the catalyst for most of their better breaks.

Skelton was almost unrecognisable.

One observation I do have is that Sarries don’t appear to trust Tolofua. Yes it was a tight game, but they retained Jamie George for over 70mins. He’s not going to be able to manage that all season, which underlined how much they’ll miss Brits.

There is Woolstencroft and Spurling that might take some of the workload.

Sure. I know there are other hookers in their squad but none of them can hold a candle to Brits. Tolofua is decent from the bits I’ve seen of him but I do wonder whether a club like Sarries that wants to be competing for every bit of silverware possible almost needs two first choice hookers (which is pretty what George and Brits were IMO) rather than an obvious first choice and adequate back up.

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport. Loz had a hand in both tries, going well?

I thought it was a good performance from him. Breaking tackles and not getting much wrong.

Will Skelton was the news though - is a different man and player.

Agreed on Lozowski. Definitely the catalyst for most of their better breaks.

Skelton was almost unrecognisable.

One observation I do have is that Sarries don’t appear to trust Tolofua. Yes it was a tight game, but they retained Jamie George for over 70mins. He’s not going to be able to manage that all season, which underlined how much they’ll miss Brits.

There is Woolstencroft and Spurling that might take some of the workload.

Sure. I know there are other hookers in their squad but none of them can hold a candle to Brits. Tolofua is decent from the bits I’ve seen of him but I do wonder whether a club like Sarries that wants to be competing for every bit of silverware possible almost needs two first choice hookers (which is pretty what George and Brits were IMO) rather than an obvious first choice and adequate back up.

Kvesic looks to have beefed up and yet added some agility - a far cry from the ponderous player we saw getting run over in the last few seasons. Long may it continue. Failed to steal much ball but was always there and always slowing it down.

At one point he carried directly into a set Fitzgerald and I expect him to get dumped, instead he went over the top of him.

Anyone know how Charlie Matthews got on for Wasps?

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Dunnikin Diver wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport. Loz had a hand in both tries, going well?

I thought it was a good performance from him. Breaking tackles and not getting much wrong.

Will Skelton was the news though - is a different man and player.

Agreed on Lozowski. Definitely the catalyst for most of their better breaks.

Skelton was almost unrecognisable.

One observation I do have is that Sarries don’t appear to trust Tolofua. Yes it was a tight game, but they retained Jamie George for over 70mins. He’s not going to be able to manage that all season, which underlined how much they’ll miss Brits.

There is Woolstencroft and Spurling that might take some of the workload.

Sure. I know there are other hookers in their squad but none of them can hold a candle to Brits. Tolofua is decent from the bits I’ve seen of him but I do wonder whether a club like Sarries that wants to be competing for every bit of silverware possible almost needs two first choice hookers (which is pretty what George and Brits were IMO) rather than an obvious first choice and adequate back up.

Tolofua is decent in the loose, but his line out throwing is very suspect.

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

It's not an over-poulated field of contenders imo, but good to see the back of MOC in any event.

Johnno is an interesting idea, but don't think he would be right or interested. I'd be OK with having a look Lancaster but don't think he would go for it. Murphy? Would be popular in many quarters but don't know if he's ready.

One I would like to see in the frame is Alex Sanderson, but I believe he has a new contract at Sarries and is probably DoR Designate there, in effect.

Shaun Edwards should jump ship

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport.

http://smashtv.ddns.net/pay.php

allegedly.

Tony Blair's Therapist wrote:

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Because I'm poor, I don't have BT Sport.

http://smashtv.ddns.net/pay.php

allegedly.

nuffsaid wrote:

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

It's not an over-poulated field of contenders imo, but good to see the back of MOC in any event.

Johnno is an interesting idea, but don't think he would be right or interested. I'd be OK with having a look Lancaster but don't think he would go for it. Murphy? Would be popular in many quarters but don't know if he's ready.

One I would like to see in the frame is Alex Sanderson, but I believe he has a new contract at Sarries and is probably DoR Designate there, in effect.

I think that the board of management should take a long, hard look at themselves. Since Cockers was sacked, their recruitment has been very poor. All well and good being a "Tigers man" but a fresh pair of eyes or two from elsewhere would probably help a great deal.

Billy Burns would play for Ireland if the chance came ... https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/45406437

SaintK wrote:

nuffsaid wrote:

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

It's not an over-poulated field of contenders imo, but good to see the back of MOC in any event.

Johnno is an interesting idea, but don't think he would be right or interested. I'd be OK with having a look Lancaster but don't think he would go for it. Murphy? Would be popular in many quarters but don't know if he's ready.

One I would like to see in the frame is Alex Sanderson, but I believe he has a new contract at Sarries and is probably DoR Designate there, in effect.

I think that the board of management should take a long, hard look at themselves. Since Cockers was sacked, their recruitment has been very poor. All well and good being a "Tigers man" but a fresh pair of eyes or two from elsewhere would probably help a great deal.

Wonder how much cash they’d have to throw at Deano to get him to go back

Nieghorn wrote:Billy Burns would play for Ireland if the chance came ... https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/45406437

That’s not new news. They mentioned he was Irish qualified when he signed for Ulster.

He’ll be first choice at Ulster so if he does well, he’s only an injury or two away from being selected.

I saw something written the other day on RugbyPass where they did a deep dive on the outputs of the academies of the 14 major clubs in England, and they concluded that Leicester was the biggest exporter of young players to other clubs

Thinking about it there haven't really been any world beaters that Leicester have lost (Twelvetrees, Purdy, Thacker etc) but it's a big contrast to Exeter and Sarries who are constantly bringing through good players and relying heavily on them to plug the gaps during international windows

Probably more a symptom than a cause but still something to fix

Joost wrote:

SaintK wrote:

nuffsaid wrote:

Nabberuk wrote:Replacement for O'Connor?

Johnno?
Lancaster?
Murphy?

It's not an over-poulated field of contenders imo, but good to see the back of MOC in any event.

Johnno is an interesting idea, but don't think he would be right or interested. I'd be OK with having a look Lancaster but don't think he would go for it. Murphy? Would be popular in many quarters but don't know if he's ready.

One I would like to see in the frame is Alex Sanderson, but I believe he has a new contract at Sarries and is probably DoR Designate there, in effect.

I think that the board of management should take a long, hard look at themselves. Since Cockers was sacked, their recruitment has been very poor. All well and good being a "Tigers man" but a fresh pair of eyes or two from elsewhere would probably help a great deal.

Wonder how much cash they’d have to throw at Deano to get him to go back

I think Deano would want to bring Walder and Wells with him (which would be a nightmare for Falcons) but something inside him must want to return to Tigers?

Btw, I agree with SaintK that it sometimes needs fresh vision and ideas.

fatcat wrote:Anyone know how Charlie Matthews got on for Wasps?

He got 13 minutes, during which time I can't really remember him doing anything of note be it good or bad. Exceeded expectations really.

openclashXX wrote:I saw something written the other day on RugbyPass where they did a deep dive on the outputs of the academies of the 14 major clubs in England, and they concluded that Leicester was the biggest exporter of young players to other clubs

Thinking about it there haven't really been any world beaters that Leicester have lost (Twelvetrees, Purdy, Thacker etc) but it's a big contrast to Exeter and Sarries who are constantly bringing through good players and relying heavily on them to plug the gaps during international windows

Probably more a symptom than a cause but still something to fix

Yes and no. The likes of Twelvetrees and Purdy would improve their squad but probably wouldn’t be first choice which is the whole reason they left in the first instance.

Any club is treading a fairly fine line with players who are good enough to be in the 23 but possibly not good enough to be an automatic first choice. I’d argue those are the hardest kind to keep.

Dunno if this has been covered but this is what I heard re O'Connor

Probably should have been done in May. Some chat that he was 2 weeks late back for pre season. Not sure why, but he didn't communicate it to the club. Think the performance at Exeter and his comments afterwards were the final nail in the coffin.