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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:57 am 
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Nieghorn wrote:
Pat the Ex Mat wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It is VERY good but massively diverges from the book from Season 6.

It doesn't ruin it for me but I don't understand the need to do it.


Season 6??? Are YOU from the future???


Come with me if you want to live! !


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:52 am 
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Sky TV boxset channel just did The Sopranos season 1 on the weekend. Still an utterly brilliant show that holds up perfectly.

I'm hooked again, gonna do the whole lot.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:20 am 
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RuggaBugga wrote:
Sky TV boxset channel just did The Sopranos season 1 on the weekend. Still an utterly brilliant show that holds up perfectly.

I'm hooked again, gonna do the whole lot.


I accidentally downloaded the entire show while downloading what I thought was a linux iso. Must have been a virus. Anyway, have been watching it again for the third time. Quality as always.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:33 am 
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Homeland is about to return with Carrie taking on the Keane administration. I don't know plans for any series beyond this but am not sure how much further they can take things.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:42 am 
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True Blue wrote:
RuggaBugga wrote:
Sky TV boxset channel just did The Sopranos season 1 on the weekend. Still an utterly brilliant show that holds up perfectly.

I'm hooked again, gonna do the whole lot.


I accidentally downloaded the entire show while downloading what I thought was a linux iso. Must have been a virus. Anyway, have been watching it again for the third time. Quality as always.


I've only watched it through once. I've caught random episodes in between but quite surprised how much I missed the first time through.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:09 am 
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RuggaBugga wrote:
True Blue wrote:
RuggaBugga wrote:
Sky TV boxset channel just did The Sopranos season 1 on the weekend. Still an utterly brilliant show that holds up perfectly.

I'm hooked again, gonna do the whole lot.


I accidentally downloaded the entire show while downloading what I thought was a linux iso. Must have been a virus. Anyway, have been watching it again for the third time. Quality as always.


I've only watched it through once. I've caught random episodes in between but quite surprised how much I missed the first time through.


It’s the best. Still unmatched by anything else.

If it’s on HBO I’ll always end up watching, the repeat viewing value is better than any other show because the mix of comedy, mafioso shenanigans and just simple human observation is so sharp. I remember getting impatient around season 4 during its original run but watching those and later episodes now is a pleasure


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:16 am 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:13 am 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:27 am 
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Nieghorn wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


Didn't read that one but a lot of the critics seriously missed the point about re-sleeving and claimed it was a whitewashing, despite the original actor getting plenty of screentime.... :roll:


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:34 am 
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Nieghorn wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


Po faced nonsense. I can't stand people who anoint themselves moral guardians of a certain sub-culture, and then have a whinge when someone else touching on it doesn't do it the 'justice' it deserves.

It's had some weird reviews all round. My favourites have been the whinge that even though it is a direct adaptation of a book whereby an asian fella is sleeved into a white fella, the show all of a sudden is guilty of whitewashing. I've also seen a fair bit of whinging about the amount of smoking going on. :?

This show is one of the most egregious cases (in amongst a fair few recently) where the critics have got it very wrong. Just look at the difference in scoring between the fans and the critics:

Metacritic: Critics = 65% / Fans = 82%
Rotten Tommies: Critics = 62% / Fans = 92%
IMDB also has it at 8.5/10

Average at best if you listen to the critics...but that's a solid hit according to the fans.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:46 am 
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Ugh... the prevalence of that kind of talk genuinely makes me worried - at times - that I'm becoming a bigoted old man. And I certainly don't side with the dickbags who cry bloody murder seeing a woman do something badass in Star Wars (my beef with Rose was not giving her and Finn something worthwhile to do). Is it too much to ask that everything not be a hot-button social issue?

I get that it's probably mostly about getting clicks ... but it's also influential on people who don't bother forming their own opinion / hunting down various viewpoints.

It seems to be one of those damned if you do / don't scenarios, though, where you'll get a whitewashing claim on one hand, and a 'white people have no right to write non-white characters' claim on the other. Good thing the story I'm working on features no humans at all. :)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:47 pm 
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It's a cyberpunk story, based on a series of cyberpunk books. Nobody has been under the impression that cyberpunk is biting social commentary since the 90s ended. But it is cool as fudge, it makes good use of its central conceits and realises them effectively, and the cast, despite being populated generally with unknowns, do an excellent job. Poe the AI is a particular delight, and Kinnaman does a great job making what is basically a semi-repressed psychopath into an actually interesting protagonist.

And as far as the whitewashing comment goes, the show is one of the most diverse I can remember coming across in a long time. Missing the wood for the trees


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:48 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
Is it too much to ask that everything not be a hot-button social issue?


I would have thought that getting older made it easier to ignore the opinions of those you disagree with, not harder


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:50 pm 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Nieghorn wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


Po faced nonsense. I can't stand people who anoint themselves moral guardians of a certain sub-culture, and then have a whinge when someone else touching on it doesn't do it the 'justice' it deserves.

It's had some weird reviews all round. My favourites have been the whinge that even though it is a direct adaptation of a book whereby an asian fella is sleeved into a white fella, the show all of a sudden is guilty of whitewashing. I've also seen a fair bit of whinging about the amount of smoking going on. :?

This show is one of the most egregious cases (in amongst a fair few recently) where the critics have got it very wrong. Just look at the difference in scoring between the fans and the critics:

Metacritic: Critics = 65% / Fans = 82%
Rotten Tommies: Critics = 62% / Fans = 92%
IMDB also has it at 8.5/10

Average at best if you listen to the critics...but that's a solid hit according to the fans.


You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:53 pm 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Nieghorn wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


Po faced nonsense. I can't stand people who anoint themselves moral guardians of a certain sub-culture, and then have a whinge when someone else touching on it doesn't do it the 'justice' it deserves.

It's had some weird reviews all round. My favourites have been the whinge that even though it is a direct adaptation of a book whereby an asian fella is sleeved into a white fella, the show all of a sudden is guilty of whitewashing. I've also seen a fair bit of whinging about the amount of smoking going on. :?

This show is one of the most egregious cases (in amongst a fair few recently) where the critics have got it very wrong. Just look at the difference in scoring between the fans and the critics:

Metacritic: Critics = 65% / Fans = 82%
Rotten Tommies: Critics = 62% / Fans = 92%
IMDB also has it at 8.5/10

Average at best if you listen to the critics...but that's a solid hit according to the fans.


You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


As a hardened scifi reader and watcher, it's excellent. Critics can forkoff.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:58 pm 
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sorCrer wrote:
As a hardened scifi reader and watcher, it's excellent. Critics can forkoff.


Exactly my own position :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:25 pm 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


Eh, that's exactly what they are supposed to do...or at least, be a bellwether for whatever medium they are being critical of.

With regards to TV, their job is to inform the public (of which most don't have the time themselves to watch every single thing out there, and so therefore need guidance)...essentially letting you know what TV show you should waste your limited time on.

The only metric by which you can judge a critic is how well their reviews match up to the opinions of those that want a review of a particular subject. Obviously, if they consistently deviate from what the majority think, then their opinions will no longer be sought, and ultimately they won't be paid to be a critic anymore.

P.S. It's important to note that the term 'majority' in this case represents a group of people that care about a certain media, i.e. there may be only a dozen or so people who care about, for instance, an obscure poet, and there may be one critic of said poet...and if the critic constantly disagrees with the majority of that dozen, then he ain't going to be a recognised critic for very long.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:23 am 
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The funniest (Actually funny and not just given a comedy genre tag like shows on HBO, Showcase etc) show on TV right now is SUPERIOR DONUTS, its on season 2 now, if you haven't seen it, start form season 1, there isn't and episode yet that i haven't laughed at..


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:36 am 
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Regarding the whitewashing, it's a significant plot point that he's originally of Asian decent and is sleeved in a Caucasian body.
For the second book he's in a black sleeve and his team are mostly Maori. In the third book he's in an Asian sleeve again.

Plus, the main cast of the series/first book are extremely diverse. Way to miss the point in an attempt to be outraged by anything.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:55 am 
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The first episode of the new Shetland series was excellent.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:06 am 
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Nolanator wrote:
Regarding the whitewashing, it's a significant plot point that he's originally of Asian decent and is sleeved in a Caucasian body.
For the second book he's in a black sleeve and his team are mostly Maori. In the third book he's in an Asian sleeve again.

Plus, the main cast of the series/first book are extremely diverse. Way to miss the point in an attempt to be outraged by anything.


the types who complained about the 'whitewashing' in Altered Carbon are going to have conniptions when they see Black Panther.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:09 am 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


Eh, that's exactly what they are supposed to do...or at least, be a bellwether for whatever medium they are being critical of.

With regards to TV, their job is to inform the public (of which most don't have the time themselves to watch every single thing out there, and so therefore need guidance)...essentially letting you know what TV show you should waste your limited time on.

The only metric by which you can judge a critic is how well their reviews match up to the opinions of those that want a review of a particular subject. Obviously, if they consistently deviate from what the majority think, then their opinions will no longer be sought, and ultimately they won't be paid to be a critic anymore.

P.S. It's important to note that the term 'majority' in this case represents a group of people that care about a certain media, i.e. there may be only a dozen or so people who care about, for instance, an obscure poet, and there may be one critic of said poet...and if the critic constantly disagrees with the majority of that dozen, then he ain't going to be a recognised critic for very long.


All of this is wrong


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:12 am 
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Turbogoat wrote:
Nolanator wrote:
Regarding the whitewashing, it's a significant plot point that he's originally of Asian decent and is sleeved in a Caucasian body.
For the second book he's in a black sleeve and his team are mostly Maori. In the third book he's in an Asian sleeve again.

Plus, the main cast of the series/first book are extremely diverse. Way to miss the point in an attempt to be outraged by anything.


the types who complained about the 'whitewashing' in Altered Carbon are going to have conniptions when they see Black Panther.

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Are they? Why?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:30 am 
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I will admit I paused on Ortega's 1st nude scene.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:27 pm 
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Bindi wrote:
I will admit I paused on Ortega's 1st nude scene.


She's absolutely cracking. :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:37 pm 
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Last Line wrote:
The first episode of the new Shetland series was excellent.

Logged in just to make that point.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:08 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Just popping in to say that Altered Carbon is the bomb. :thumbup:


It's insanely good



Thoughts on this... ?

Quote:
Beneath its “serious grown-up science fiction” trappings of nudity and sexual violence, Altered Carbon is less incisive than the equally heavy-handed young adult series The Hunger Games, which mixed on-the-nose class commentary with genuine futuristic weirdness.


https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/12/1700 ... o-futurism

(Was getting a serious Blade Runner vibe, so I thought I'd see what the critics were saying. And one ep in, I'm really intrigued, so am not going to let the article cloud my judgement. Just interested in the thoughts of those of you who really know the genre.)


Huge huge fan of the books and the show but there's a few things I agree with in there. Mentioned it earlier in the thread but how in heavens name are neo-Nazis with "14" and "88" still a thing in the far future? The timeline is iffy. And yeah the Meths are boring af. Also, did mention that some would complain about "whitewashing" too earlier in the thread. Regular Nostradamus me.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:38 pm 
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2 episodes into The Night Of. Outstanding so far, really enjoying the cinematography.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:18 pm 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


Eh, that's exactly what they are supposed to do...or at least, be a bellwether for whatever medium they are being critical of.

With regards to TV, their job is to inform the public (of which most don't have the time themselves to watch every single thing out there, and so therefore need guidance)...essentially letting you know what TV show you should waste your limited time on.

The only metric by which you can judge a critic is how well their reviews match up to the opinions of those that want a review of a particular subject. Obviously, if they consistently deviate from what the majority think, then their opinions will no longer be sought, and ultimately they won't be paid to be a critic anymore.

P.S. It's important to note that the term 'majority' in this case represents a group of people that care about a certain media, i.e. there may be only a dozen or so people who care about, for instance, an obscure poet, and there may be one critic of said poet...and if the critic constantly disagrees with the majority of that dozen, then he ain't going to be a recognised critic for very long.


All of this is wrong


Show me that famous and well renowned critic who everyone disagrees with, all the time.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:47 pm 
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F.R. Leavis.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:47 am 
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Thought it was funny that I'd just started Altered Carbon the other day and today picked up a free Larry Niven book from the discard rack at my local library with the following on the back...

"Corbett's mind had not died. He merely slept for two hundred years inside a coffin of liquid hydrogen, waiting for medical science to find him a cure. He waited in vain. The found a new body instead. It came from a criminal whose crime was so terrible that the State had wiped out his personality. But there was a price to pay."

Not the same, but similar. I'm more wowed by the coincidence of finding two similar premises given that I don't watch nor read a lot of sci-fi.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:31 am 
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eugenefraxby wrote:
F.R. Leavis.


:lol:

I think most people read Leavis just for the lulz nowadays.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:34 am 
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assfly wrote:
2 episodes into The Night Of. Outstanding so far, really enjoying the cinematography.

It is very good. Aside from the foot thing. That was dragged on for too long.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:37 am 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


Eh, that's exactly what they are supposed to do...or at least, be a bellwether for whatever medium they are being critical of.

With regards to TV, their job is to inform the public (of which most don't have the time themselves to watch every single thing out there, and so therefore need guidance)...essentially letting you know what TV show you should waste your limited time on.

The only metric by which you can judge a critic is how well their reviews match up to the opinions of those that want a review of a particular subject. Obviously, if they consistently deviate from what the majority think, then their opinions will no longer be sought, and ultimately they won't be paid to be a critic anymore.

P.S. It's important to note that the term 'majority' in this case represents a group of people that care about a certain media, i.e. there may be only a dozen or so people who care about, for instance, an obscure poet, and there may be one critic of said poet...and if the critic constantly disagrees with the majority of that dozen, then he ain't going to be a recognised critic for very long.


All of this is wrong


Show me that famous and well renowned critic who everyone disagrees with, all the time.


The opinions of other people are irrelevant to criticism


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:41 am 
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Finished Altered Carbon. Diverges a lot from the books in the detail in the second half, but definitely enjoyed it.
I hope they do a second season, loads of space alien stuff.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:48 am 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
Jeff the Bear wrote:
Chuckles1188 wrote:
You can't really say that the critics have "got it wrong" just because audiences disagree with them. Critics' job is not to predict what audiences will like


Eh, that's exactly what they are supposed to do...or at least, be a bellwether for whatever medium they are being critical of.

With regards to TV, their job is to inform the public (of which most don't have the time themselves to watch every single thing out there, and so therefore need guidance)...essentially letting you know what TV show you should waste your limited time on.

The only metric by which you can judge a critic is how well their reviews match up to the opinions of those that want a review of a particular subject. Obviously, if they consistently deviate from what the majority think, then their opinions will no longer be sought, and ultimately they won't be paid to be a critic anymore.

P.S. It's important to note that the term 'majority' in this case represents a group of people that care about a certain media, i.e. there may be only a dozen or so people who care about, for instance, an obscure poet, and there may be one critic of said poet...and if the critic constantly disagrees with the majority of that dozen, then he ain't going to be a recognised critic for very long.


All of this is wrong


Show me that famous and well renowned critic who everyone disagrees with, all the time.


The opinions of other people are irrelevant to criticism


In a strict sense, yes.

However, what makes a sucessfull critic in media is being someone that Joe Public (or a segment thereof) can rely upon to give a suggestion as to whether they will enjoy a given film/series/game etc.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:52 am 
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Again, no. Criticism would continue to happen without any level of public engagement. The decision by the public to take an interest in critics' opinions doesn't carry any kind of responsibility to pay attention to them. Critics might choose to orient their work towards a layperson, but that doesn't make it an integral or necessary part of criticism


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:52 am 
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ScarfaceClaw wrote:
It is very good. Aside from the foot thing. That was dragged on for too long.


I've learnt to finish my dinner before watching :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:57 am 
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Altered Carbon was great. Started a bit slow I thought but the second half of the season was A+. Also some awesome tits on Ortega.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:58 am 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
Again, no. Criticism would continue to happen without any level of public engagement. The decision by the public to take an interest in critics' opinions doesn't carry any kind of responsibility to pay attention to them. Critics might choose to orient their work towards a layperson, but that doesn't make it an integral or necessary part of criticism


Sure.

But if a critic wants to be a sucessfull critic, I.E feed their family based on their work, then I suggest being reliable for the layperson is a fairly imprtant characteristic.


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