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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:28 am 
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..... not quite gooooonnnnneeeeee.

But it’s only a matter of time.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:38 am 
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... as it is for all of us


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:53 am 
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Any news story that prompted this?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:26 pm 
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Seehofer is a bit of a problem for her


Last edited by Mick Mannock on Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:28 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
Any news story that prompted this?


CSU CDU clash, CSU strongly disagrees with the immigration policy of the chancellor. Some CDU MoP look like willing to join CSU rebellion. If Merkel changes her policy along CSU line she will lose SPD support, if she stands on her position we'll see if CSU are ready to withdraw their support.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:58 pm 
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It seems to be electioneering for the Bavarian elections in October. As the big picture was known before the coalition was created it looks like a bit of grandstanding before the summer break of the Bundestag.
When it comes back after the summer there may be another bit of grandstanding for a few weeks, then it may blow over.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:46 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
Any news story that prompted this?


There was a report on Reuters this morning that CSU had ended alliance with CDU that caused the Euro to dump. This turned out to be false.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 5:33 pm 
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CSU just lost their majority in Bavaria.

Support continues to ebb away for Angela’s coalition.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:03 pm 
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She should be appointed ambassador to Somalia.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:12 pm 
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You must be so excited. Like early Christmas.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:27 pm 
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to be fair the Germans have had decades of stability, sensible pragmatism from broadly centrist politicians powered by a rock-solid economy

it's time the domestic chaos we've been experiencing reaches them too


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:28 pm 
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Biggest losers SPD, biggest winner AFD.

Not exactly comforting.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:59 pm 
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Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:11 pm 
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Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.

I had read some analysis that Merkel could be a beneficiary.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:23 pm 
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Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.



So the right wing CSU vote went to the left wing greens and the left wing SPD vote went to the AFD?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:17 pm 
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Gorbachev of the EU getting ousted in a coup? Great :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:35 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.



So the right wing CSU vote went to the left wing greens and the left wing SPD vote went to the AFD?

I don't know about the UK, but in Ireland the greens tend to be nice middle class people, who attract votes from other nice middle class people. And, before you hit Dr. Google, we've had greens in government in Ireland.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:25 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.



So the right wing CSU vote went to the left wing greens and the left wing SPD vote went to the AFD?

I don't know about the UK, but in Ireland the greens tend to be nice middle class people, who attract votes from other nice middle class people. And, before you hit Dr. Google, we've had greens in government in Ireland.



That'll be German middle class have rebelled ....


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:01 am 
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bimboman wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.



So the right wing CSU vote went to the left wing greens and the left wing SPD vote went to the AFD?


portion of the CSU right went AfD and a portion of the centrist CSU vote went to the Greens as they can't bring themselves to vote SPD.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:45 am 
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maxbox wrote:
Gorbachev of the EU getting ousted in a coup? Great :thumbup:

no


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:51 am 
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camroc1 wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Biggest winner is the Greens. I reckon the biggest loser is Seehofer. Trying to out-right the far-right is a mug's game and will only turn centrist voters off. The collapse of the CSU vote is as much a result of CSU voters flocking to the Greens as much as those flocking to AfD.

I expect Seehofer's resignation before Christmas. Merkel survives shaken but not stirred for now but her party must surely be thinking about succession for the next election. A nice orderly efficient German transition to the post-Merkel era is on the cards but not sure who yet.



So the right wing CSU vote went to the left wing greens and the left wing SPD vote went to the AFD?

I don't know about the UK, but in Ireland the greens tend to be nice middle class people, who attract votes from other nice middle class people. And, before you hit Dr. Google, we've had greens in government in Ireland.


Greens in the UK is a weird mix. They used to be nice middle class people who were a bit into homeopathetic medicine and stuff and they still are, but recent years a hard left has infiltrated them politically that has caused a split (much like Labour but they aren't in power so it doesn't matter).


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:34 pm 
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she gets her preferred successor in, so likely to stay as chancellor for a while

Quote:
Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer, a staunchly Catholic conservative career politician, has been elected as the successor to Angela Merkel as leader of Germany’s Christian Democrats.

Kramp-Karrenbauer won by just 25 votes following a nail-biting second round run-off against her main opponent, the multi-millionaire businessman Friedrich Merz.

Wiping away tears, Kramp-Karrenbauer said she would accept the post, and thanked the party for its support and trust in her, insisting she would give new impetus to the party as it seeks to claw back the millions of voters it has lost to rightwing populists and the Greens in recent years.

“We should harness the boost this competition has given us, and use it to propel the party’s success,” she said.

Dubbed a mini-Merkel - a title she is determined to discard - Kramp-Karrenbauer was not officially endorsed by the chancellor, but was clearly her favourite, having been propelled by her to the position of the party’s general secretary in February.

But in a veiled sign of her support earlier in the day, Merkel made a point of praising Kramp-Karrenbauer for her contribution to the CDU’s electoral success during a valedictory speech to the party on Friday morning.

The result is seen as making it more likely that Merkel will be able to see out her fourth term until 2021. She has expressed her determination to stay on as chancellor for the remaining three years of her term in office and 56% of Germans support her decision to do so, polls show.


Earlier in the day Merkel fought back tears after CDU delegates gave her a 10-minute standing ovation after she delivered an emotional speech marking the end of her leadership, which she said had been both “challenging” and “a joy”.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:40 pm 
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Continuity some of us Frenchies can only dream of....


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:26 pm 
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Shirely, If 1,000,000 plus votes majority in Britain is enough to warrant calls for another election. a 25 vote majority shouldn`t even be considered. :twisted:


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:34 pm 
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Continuity fckup.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:12 am 
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Goooooooooone!

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/07/67471671 ... rman-polit


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:27 am 
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Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 6:11 am 
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Under her chancellorship Germans have elected neo-Nazis to their parliament.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:08 am 
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she did it so that she will never have to meet trump again.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:22 am 
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This akk figure will be Germany's Macron.

Merkel is a staggeringly enigmatic figure. She's probably been a disaster for Germany, but no one can be sure, and to what end is baffling.

I was in bonn a few weeks ago and was talking to an ex high level West German civil servant now in his 80s. It was a long conversation and he was an impeccably Liberal post war fellow. I asked him about some of the decisions Merkel had made regarding immigration etc and he was silent a long time. And then just said he didn't know.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:27 pm 
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Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:31 pm 
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zt1903 wrote:
..... not quite gooooonnnnneeeeee.

But it’s only a matter of time.

This didn’t age well.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:32 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.

It wasn’t. It was just recovering. But hey Will Greenwood was a 13.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 1:49 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
zt1903 wrote:
..... not quite gooooonnnnneeeeee.

But it’s only a matter of time.

This didn’t age well.



What ? She's gone from CDU and the government is a zombie.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:08 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.

It wasn’t. It was just recovering. But hey Will Greenwood was a 13.



Recovering from what? The 2 years of growth the preceded her and Germany's status of europe's biggest economy?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:51 pm 
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BTW, I think this is a good and balanced piece of Merkel on the BBC:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/id ... ela_merkel


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:24 pm 
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Adenauer, Kohl, and Merkel.

Crazy to think a country in 70 years can have three elected leaders from one party that each went more than a decade consecutively.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:49 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
paddyor wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.

It wasn’t. It was just recovering. But hey Will Greenwood was a 13.



Recovering from what? The 2 years of growth the preceded her and Germany's status of europe's biggest economy?

No, just stop. You’re over reaching to say her tenure had no upside.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:59 am 
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paddyor wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
paddyor wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.

It wasn’t. It was just recovering. But hey Will Greenwood was a 13.



Recovering from what? The 2 years of growth the preceded her and Germany's status of europe's biggest economy?

No, just stop. You’re over reaching to say her tenure had no upside.


I said no such thing.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:05 am 
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paddyor wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Zico wrote:
Sad day for European politics when she does go. She's been a stabilising influence through some rough times. You don't have to look far to see the kind mess that can be created by weak reactionary leadership.



She's managed to get buy by doing not much with the continents bets economy in a Eurozone that is set-up to support the economy. It's quite easy to not need to do anything but insist on carry on. On the other hand, when she has been called to actually help, all she's done is screw Greece, destabilise her own parliament by directly encouraging the growth of neo-nazi's due to a impulsive reaction to illegal migrants rather then sort it out properly, which in turn also got lots of women raped on a New Years eve.

The German economy was strong before Merkel and will be strong after without a German leader doing to much but keeping things going forward. I think she'll quickly be forgotten as she didn't really do anything.

It wasn’t. It was just recovering. But hey Will Greenwood was a 13.


Only the case because Schroeder put through the Hartz reforms where the benefits predominantly came to fruition during Merkel's term: German unit labor costs fell relative to most of Europe which, accompanied by the subsidy Germany receives from being in the Euro, caused a new export boom.

Merkel has been a disaster and results say as much electorally.


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