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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:07 pm 
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Auckman wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Very succinct summary there Dark. :thumbup:

Jacinda is starting to sound a bit vacuous on this online hate speech bollocks. I wonder if international observers will start to notice this and some of the gloss will come off her shining star image.



Why is it bollocks. Do you agree with it?


Of course I don't agree with it. But haters gonna hate. 99.9% of social media is fine but let's legislate to try and force the 0.01% of loons to express their lunatic agenda on a different forum. Yeah that'll change the world. :roll:


nah I reckon it is starting to get invaded by organised hit groups of trolls organised by interest groups/political parties/russians/whoever, all designed to swing public opinion towards a particular point of view. Those anti-1080 loons are just one example. It doesn't take much for the NRA to organise "hit squads" of trolls to troll anti-gun law news articles or politicians deemed to be anti-gun control. That is all part of the political debate, although the FBI deems the russian hit squads as an interference in their election process and I reckon it is edging towards being dodgy.

The real worry is when terrorists use similar tactics. I am not on arabic facebook but I'm pretty sure ISIS has been doing similar hit jobs on arabic social media. Their whole recruitment strategy was online. White supremacists using social media for similar ends is not beyond the realms of possibility either. A unified global approach has to be the starting point.


:thumbup:

I must admit I went online to watch YouTube clips of 911 after visiting the Ground Zero Memorial in New York. I couldn't believe it seemed like about 80% of the clips were conspiracy theorists claiming it was an inside job by the US Govt, the planes were carrying missiles, Tower 7 was detonated separately etc.

So I accept what you're saying.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:09 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:
Is this another of your cunning and devious uses of some whataboutery to back up your Hosking style hatred of the PM and her government?


:lol:

I love Jacinda. The world needs more like her. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:18 pm 
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I agree DD that governments should run efficiently.....however the role of government is to implement and oversee policy that benefits its nations citizens fairly in a way that maximises the tax revenue rsource and loans available......that is its business, not to be confused with commerce and profit making. If NZ was into that, today we would hold many state owned assets bing driven by commercial wings....governance is overseeing policy and its implementation, efficiently as you say.....and fairly for all its citizens.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:19 pm 
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And that is exactly why a government cannot be run like a business.
The objectives of a business and the objectives of a government are entirely different.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 4:34 am 
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We agree to differ........


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 4:41 am 
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This News report recently put me off living in an apartment anytime in the future.........

Wellington apartment owners walking away from insurance

Wellington apartment owners are turning their backs on costly natural disaster insurance, putting at risk millions of dollars worth of city property.
They have decided against the insurance because of rising premiums and others are considering it or substantially reducing their cover.
One body corp chairwoman says it's the "tip of the iceberg".
Dropping insurance could put owners in breach of their mortgages and the Unit Titles Act, which requires that body corporates organise full cover.
It could also make their apartments unsellable, say real estate agents.
The premiums at one small complex have trebled since 2016, as part of a hike from $14,000 in 2011 to $57,000. That has pushed their annual body corp levy to more than $12,000 for each apartment.
The complex, which did not want to be identified, has also spent more than $1 million on earthquake strengthening, meaning each apartment owner had to find over $150,000.
That wiped out retirement savings for some.
"Taking everyone through the process was like going through grieving - denial, anger, the whole works," said its body corporate chairwoman.
"We didn't see that we had any choice because we were firmly told that our apartments were unsellable at a 12 per cent earthquake rating."
Owners voted narrowly against dropping insurance, but the chairwoman believes they will need to take another look at that option.
"It's literally a choice between maintenance and insurance," she said. That includes work on health and safety improvements required by law.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 4:44 am 
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That's an interesting take on what I read a month ago...

insurers are refusing new clients in Wellington.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 4:51 am 
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deadduck wrote:
And that is exactly why a government cannot be run like a business.
The objectives of a business and the objectives of a government are entirely different.

I’m slightly worried there is something we agree on. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 7:15 am 
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UncleFB wrote:
deadduck wrote:
And that is exactly why a government cannot be run like a business.
The objectives of a business and the objectives of a government are entirely different.

I’m slightly worried there is something we agree on. ;)


I reckon he's forgotten to add the word 'not' in there somewhere, or somebody has hacked his log in.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 8:18 am 
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booji boy wrote:
Jacinda is starting to sound a bit vacuous on this online hate speech bollocks. I wonder if international observers will start to notice this and some of the gloss will come off her shining star image.



https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-23/ ... h/11038584

Image

Quote:
The image of New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern embracing a Muslim woman after the Christchurch mosque attacks resonated around the world.

Ms Ardern was praised for her strong and empathetic response to the massacre that shocked the world last month.

Now the image is set to be immortalised in one of Australia's famous silo murals, but this time in the inner northern suburbs of Melbourne.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 9:00 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Jacinda is starting to sound a bit vacuous on this online hate speech bollocks. I wonder if international observers will start to notice this and some of the gloss will come off her shining star image.



https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-23/ ... h/11038584

Image

Quote:
The image of New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern embracing a Muslim woman after the Christchurch mosque attacks resonated around the world.

Ms Ardern was praised for her strong and empathetic response to the massacre that shocked the world last month.

Now the image is set to be immortalised in one of Australia's famous silo murals, but this time in the inner northern suburbs of Melbourne.


An article from the 23rd April?

Old news mate. In case you didn't realise, because you appear to be on permanent holiday, it's the 16th May. ;)

Having said that she does appear to have pulled off 'The Christchurch Call' successfully and come out of it with credit so fair play. :thumbup:


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 9:19 am 
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Tehui wrote:
UncleFB wrote:
deadduck wrote:
And that is exactly why a government cannot be run like a business.
The objectives of a business and the objectives of a government are entirely different.

I’m slightly worried there is something we agree on. ;)


I reckon he's forgotten to add the word 'not' in there somewhere, or somebody has hacked his log in.


I agree too! :shock: :shock:

Has someone hacked your account and UncleFB? :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 9:44 am 
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booji boy wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
Auckman wrote:
deadduck wrote:

There's an irony here that in the 2017 election Labour used Facebook extensively to proliferate anti-National memes with their "Backing the Kiwi Meme" campaign. It's probably naive to think that they don't also have social media teams who organise "hit squads" of people to flood comments sections in an effort to frame the narrative their way. Perhaps not to the same extent as the NRA but I bet it does happen.


I am willing to bet all the parties try and do that. National are probably the kings of that kind of stuff, simply because they have more money to spend. They had something like $4 million in donations in the last election; Labour $1.4 million from memory. However, America is probably where this kind of thing is at its absolute height.



There are enough news articles around to suggest the practise is widespread. There's no irony in Labour having used it. It would be naive to suggest any party isn't.

it also has very little bearing on deciding on a need to act after a terrorist incident that deliberately used social media live streaming as an integral aspect of the terror act.


Where was 'The Raqqa Call' when Jihadi John was beheading western hostages on YouTube?


National was in charge - they were busy building roads and cycle tracks.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 10:05 am 
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Actually it was about that time National "got some guts" and sent troops to Iraq, as part of an international effort to eradicate ISIL from the region.


It was Labour and the Greens in opposition who were happy to sit back and wring their hands doing f*ck all


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 8:12 pm 
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Maybe I'm making false assumptions, but are the people who protest against NZ sending troops to areas of international conflict, the same people who complain the loudest when human atrocities occur overseas and refugees then need a safe place to live?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 9:32 pm 
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booji boy wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Jacinda is starting to sound a bit vacuous on this online hate speech bollocks. I wonder if international observers will start to notice this and some of the gloss will come off her shining star image.



https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-23/ ... h/11038584

Image

Quote:
The image of New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern embracing a Muslim woman after the Christchurch mosque attacks resonated around the world.

Ms Ardern was praised for her strong and empathetic response to the massacre that shocked the world last month.

Now the image is set to be immortalised in one of Australia's famous silo murals, but this time in the inner northern suburbs of Melbourne.


An article from the 23rd April?

Old news mate. In case you didn't realise, because you appear to be on permanent holiday, it's the 16th May. ;)

Having said that she does appear to have pulled off 'The Christchurch Call' successfully and come out of it with credit so fair play. :thumbup:


She's been brilliant in the Aftermath of the Christchurch incident. I can't imagine a better response or think of any other leader or potential leader who might have done better.

But her government in general is turning out to be a bit of a disappointment. Many of their core election policies are just not being delivered on or achieving what what it was hoped they would. Kiwibuild, Free fees etc. It was always a concern to many that their policies, while aspirational and well intentioned, didn't appear to backed by a sound process.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 10:31 pm 
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Saw Pete Hellyer the Aussie comedian being interviewed last night. He was saying how he had tweeted about Jacinda recently and had finished it by saying something along the lines of "you should hold her tight New Zealand".

When he woke up the next morning he'd received a one word reply from Clarke Gayford - "Done!"


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 3:14 am 
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Tehui wrote:
Maybe I'm making false assumptions, but are the people who protest against NZ sending troops to areas of international conflict, the same people who complain the loudest when human atrocities occur overseas and refugees then need a safe place to live?


I think for some people it depends where the troops are sent and why.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 3:16 am 
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Is this really the type of person we would ever want running programs in prison?

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national ... id=UP97DHP


Corrections staff told to be vigilant of 'escalated tension' after Tamaki prison revolt comments
Jamie Ensor 1 hour ago
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Private funeral for Pua underway
a man standing in a parking lot: Tamaki has made several controversial comments recently.© Video - Newshub; Image - Newshub / File. Tamaki has made several controversial comments recently.
Department of Corrections staff were advised to be vigilant of escalated tension after controversial comments by Destiny Church leader Brian Tamaki threatened revolts in prisons.

In April, a war of words broke out between Tamaki and Government Ministers, including Corrections Minister Kelvin Davis and Finance Minister Grant Robertson.

Tamaki said he wanted Government funding to introduce his Man Up programme into prisons, but Davis stated Tamaki had failed to follow proper application procedures.

Davis was also unsure of the authenticity of claims by Tamaki about the success of the programme, which claims to help men with a record of violent offending and addiction by rehabilitating them to re-enter society after prison.

Click to expand
Among several tweets Tamaki posted about the funding not going ahead, he wrote that "we will plan thru Private Visits to inmates in every Prison to bring ManUp in nd cause inmate revolts in evey prison (sic)".

The self-professed bishop has since said the tweet wasn't serious, but Newshub has learnt that following the comments, Department of Corrections staff were advised to remain vigilant of threats.

"Key regional staff were advised to speak with prisons and remain vigilant for any signs of escalated tension," a Corrections spokesperson confirmed to Newshub.

The Corrections spokesperson said key national and regional staff meet daily, both in person and by video conference, to discuss "emerging issues".

It was during one of these meetings that "the comments made were raised verbally".

Operational staff involved include the department's deputy national commissioner, the chief custodial officer and the national operations manager.

The regional staff advised include senior advisers to each of the department's four regional commissioners.

a person posing for the camera© Provided by MediaWorks NZ Limited
The department wouldn't go further into detail "relating to a threat, or our response," but said it took "all threats to the safety and security of our sites seriously".

It also has a plan to deal with a range of risks, including:

A comprehensive approval process for prison visitors
Daily assessment and reporting of tension in every prison unit
The ability to monitor prisoners' phone calls, mail and incoming property
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has condemned the comments and supported Davis' in noting that Man Up had not properly sought funding.

"They repeatedly criticise the Government for not putting them into prisons, but then do nothing to formally make an attempt to put anything to Corrections and enter into prisons," said Ardern.

"I do think it's irresponsible to incite violence in the prison system because you're not getting your way."

Tamaki has been outspoken against the Government, in April taking aim over the decision to push through gun reforms in the wake of the March 15 terror attack in Christchurch.

He also criticised Ardern for her decision to allow the broadcast of the Islamic call to prayer during a ceremony after the attack, claiming New Zealand's "national identity is at stake".

The Man Up programme claims to have more than 300 groups operating in every main city and town in New Zealand, as well as groups running internationally in Australia and Cambodia.

Tamaki says the programme has a success rate for non-reoffending of 72 percent.

Tamaki has a massive number of supporters. In December last year, around 2000 of his followers marched on Parliament. He told the crowd the Government was ignoring him "after all my efforts".

He also headed to Waitangi in February with a large contingent of followers.

Brian Tamaki et al. in uniform© Provided by MediaWorks NZ Limited
Earlier this month, Tamaki said that Man Up didn't need Government funding, and it would continue being funded by Man Up organisations as it had been for a while.

"It's not about the money, we don't need to be funded. If that is the case, it doesn't need to be funded because we have been doing it for five years on our funding, paying for it ourselves."

Tamaki and Destiny Church have been approached for comment.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 5:44 am 
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Can you stop being a lazy bugger and edit the crap links out of your C&Ps so that the post is readable? Cheers

In another point, it is great to see that John Key's inability to tell the truth has followed him to ANZ Bank and infected their board and Head Orifice.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/112033 ... BrM3iHSljQ


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 6:01 am 
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John Key left politics a while ago.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 6:08 am 
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Wilderbeast wrote:
John Key left politics a while ago.



He can check out anytime he likes but he can never leave.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 6:45 am 
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Enzedder wrote:
Can you stop being a lazy bugger and edit the crap links out of your C&Ps so that the post is readable? Cheers

In another point, it is great to see that John Key's inability to tell the truth has followed him to ANZ Bank and infected their board and Head Orifice.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/112033 ... BrM3iHSljQ

Short version.
Reserve Bank : "We don't like your method of calculation. Please use our model."
ANZ : "Oh, ok. Sorry about that.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:25 am 
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Seems like it started in 2014 anyway.

At that time Key had nothing to do with ANZ's board. He only joined in October 2017.

I wonder if Enz is one of those paid Labour shills and agitators we were talking about earlier.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:38 am 
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Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:43 am 
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Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in NZ. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


Sorry, it doesn't work that way and no amount of protest will change that. An ex PM heading the board of a business being censured for conduct is political news. This thread consistently sees references dredged up from years ago... relevance isn't a matter of personal preference.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:47 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in NZ. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


Sorry, it doesn't work that way and no amount of protest will change that. An ex PM heading the board of a business being censured for conduct is political news. This thread consistently sees references dredged up from years ago... relevance isn't a matter of personal preference.

Fake news.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:51 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in NZ. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


Sorry, it doesn't work that way and no amount of protest will change that. An ex PM heading the board of a business being censured for conduct is political news. This thread consistently sees references dredged up from years ago... relevance isn't a matter of personal preference.


I disagree. He’s not in politics. He has no interest to be in politics in the future. The censure was not a political one. The only link is Key, which I guess is fair enough in terms of idle discussion but nothing more than that. Certainly not something try and score points over.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 7:55 am 
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Enzedder wrote:
Can you stop being a lazy bugger and edit the crap links out of your C&Ps so that the post is readable? Cheers

In another point, it is great to see that John Key's inability to tell the truth has followed him to ANZ Bank and infected their board and Head Orifice.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/112033 ... BrM3iHSljQ


Wow -what a storm in teacup

Seems your inability to let go is the issue here


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:05 am 
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Wilderbeast wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in NZ. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


Sorry, it doesn't work that way and no amount of protest will change that. An ex PM heading the board of a business being censured for conduct is political news. This thread consistently sees references dredged up from years ago... relevance isn't a matter of personal preference.


I disagree. He’s not in politics. He has no interest to be in politics in the future. The censure was not a political one. The only link is Key, which I guess is fair enough in terms of idle discussion but nothing more than that. Certainly not something try and score points over.

While I don't really give a shit about this, when has this thread ever been strictly current 'politics' in NZ only?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:10 am 
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Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.



if you read the article you would see it was ANZ who found the problem and dobbed themselves in to the Reserve Bank.
What more do you want?
10 lashes in the square?


Last edited by deadduck on Fri May 17, 2019 8:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:14 am 
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deadduck wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.



if you read the article you would see it was ANZ who found the problem on their own and dobbed themselves in to the Reserve Bank.
What more do you want?
10 lashes in the square?


Not quite...

Quote:
According to the Reserve Bank, it "had encouraged" ANZ to review its attestation process - through which bank directors assess whether the bank is complying with the conditions of its regulations. When ANZ conducted the review, it discovered the issue and alerted the Reserve Bank.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:17 am 
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The point is they were alerted to a potential problem, found it was a problem, told the regulatory body, made the necessary changes and copped the appropriate sanction.

Where's the problem?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:19 am 
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deadduck wrote:
The point is they were alerted to a potential problem, found it was a problem, told the regulatory body, made the necessary changes and copped the appropriate sanction.

Where's the problem?


No problem, just another tarnish on the varnish for the supposedly wonderful ex PM.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:22 am 
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Shouldn't be reported because it degrades the reputation of my hero, says the Honorary National Party shill. :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:34 am 
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It does make a nice distraction from discussing what the current government are or aren't achieving I guess.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:35 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
deadduck wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.



if you read the article you would see it was ANZ who found the problem on their own and dobbed themselves in to the Reserve Bank.
What more do you want?
10 lashes in the square?


Not quite...

Quote:
According to the Reserve Bank, it "had encouraged" ANZ to review its attestation process - through which bank directors assess whether the bank is complying with the conditions of its regulations. When ANZ conducted the review, it discovered the issue and alerted the Reserve Bank.

Pretty much how John Key operated.
A problem is identified.
He fixes it.
No drama.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:37 am 
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deadduck wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.



if you read the article you would see it was ANZ who found the problem and dobbed themselves in to the Reserve Bank.
What more do you want?
10 lashes in the square?


Now you're talking.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:44 am 
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BillW wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
deadduck wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in nz. Doesn’t belong in this thread.



if you read the article you would see it was ANZ who found the problem on their own and dobbed themselves in to the Reserve Bank.
What more do you want?
10 lashes in the square?


Not quite...

Quote:
According to the Reserve Bank, it "had encouraged" ANZ to review its attestation process - through which bank directors assess whether the bank is complying with the conditions of its regulations. When ANZ conducted the review, it discovered the issue and alerted the Reserve Bank.

Pretty much how John Key operated.
A problem is identified.
He fixes it.
No drama.

:lol: :lol:

Except that he errrr...

didn't.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:49 am 
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UncleFB wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
Doesn’t matter when it started. Key has been there long enough to see it fixed so rightly bears responsibility.

But this has nothing to do with politics in NZ. Doesn’t belong in this thread.


Sorry, it doesn't work that way and no amount of protest will change that. An ex PM heading the board of a business being censured for conduct is political news. This thread consistently sees references dredged up from years ago... relevance isn't a matter of personal preference.


I disagree. He’s not in politics. He has no interest to be in politics in the future. The censure was not a political one. The only link is Key, which I guess is fair enough in terms of idle discussion but nothing more than that. Certainly not something try and score points over.

While I don't really give a shit about this, when has this thread ever been strictly current 'politics' in NZ only?


You’re right of course. I just get a bit sick of the lefts ongoing obsession with Key.


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