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Whether you can or can't actually vote IRL, In, or Out
In 61%  61%  [ 235 ]
Out 39%  39%  [ 152 ]
Total votes : 387
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:25 pm 
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SamShark wrote:
AND-y wrote:
We're obviously gonna get an in vote, might be closer than expected, and the world will see us as a bunch of entitled whiners. Again.


Perhaps so, but I wish I had more insight into what other countries think about the EU.

Does everyone else apart from the UK think it's perfect?

Do pothers think it's not great, but they are happy to put up with it?

Or do others want change, in which case why do we see this as the UK demanding change and others having accepted a little bit to keep us quiet.


The EU poll this stuff twice annually. It's called Eurobarometer: http://ec.europa.eu/public_opinion/arch ... b83_en.htm


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:25 pm 
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SaintK wrote:
SamShark wrote:
Old bastards want out, the younger generation want to stay - 18-29s the biggest stayers, 60+ the most likely "out" group

This "Old Bastard" most definitely wants to stay in :thumbup:



So does this old bastard from the other side of the spectrum.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:35 pm 
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Tim. wrote:
SamShark wrote:
AND-y wrote:
We're obviously gonna get an in vote, might be closer than expected, and the world will see us as a bunch of entitled whiners. Again.


Perhaps so, but I wish I had more insight into what other countries think about the EU.

Does everyone else apart from the UK think it's perfect?

Do pothers think it's not great, but they are happy to put up with it?

Or do others want change, in which case why do we see this as the UK demanding change and others having accepted a little bit to keep us quiet.


The EU poll this stuff twice annually. It's called Eurobarometer: http://ec.europa.eu/public_opinion/arch ... b83_en.htm


Interesting, cheers. Will try to read it properly at some stage but for now this chart from it is interesting.

On average 41% of people are positive about it, 38% dont care either way and 19% feel total negativity. A few countries have a similar level of disdain to the UK

This was back last autumn

Image


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:43 pm 
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I just noticed that the UK would need to give the EU 2 years notice of leaving.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:43 pm 
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SamShark wrote:
Tim. wrote:
SamShark wrote:
AND-y wrote:
We're obviously gonna get an in vote, might be closer than expected, and the world will see us as a bunch of entitled whiners. Again.


Perhaps so, but I wish I had more insight into what other countries think about the EU.

Does everyone else apart from the UK think it's perfect?

Do pothers think it's not great, but they are happy to put up with it?

Or do others want change, in which case why do we see this as the UK demanding change and others having accepted a little bit to keep us quiet.


The EU poll this stuff twice annually. It's called Eurobarometer: http://ec.europa.eu/public_opinion/arch ... b83_en.htm


Interesting, cheers. Will try to read it properly at some stage but for now this chart from it is interesting.

On average 41% of people are positive about it, 38% dont care either way and 19% feel total negativity. A few countries have a similar level of disdain to the UK

This was back last autumn


Yes those countries are by and large skint or currently flooded with immigrants. The UK's attitude to Europe is quite bizarre.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:45 pm 
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Tim. wrote:
SamShark wrote:
Tim. wrote:
SamShark wrote:
AND-y wrote:
We're obviously gonna get an in vote, might be closer than expected, and the world will see us as a bunch of entitled whiners. Again.


Perhaps so, but I wish I had more insight into what other countries think about the EU.

Does everyone else apart from the UK think it's perfect?

Do pothers think it's not great, but they are happy to put up with it?

Or do others want change, in which case why do we see this as the UK demanding change and others having accepted a little bit to keep us quiet.


The EU poll this stuff twice annually. It's called Eurobarometer: http://ec.europa.eu/public_opinion/arch ... b83_en.htm


Interesting, cheers. Will try to read it properly at some stage but for now this chart from it is interesting.

On average 41% of people are positive about it, 38% dont care either way and 19% feel total negativity. A few countries have a similar level of disdain to the UK

This was back last autumn


Yes those countries are by and large skint or currently flooded with immigrants. The UK's attitude to Europe is quite bizarre.


I was also talking about Holland, Belgium, France, Italy - they are also in the 20%s of people who thought the EU was wholly negative


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:46 pm 
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SamShark wrote:
I just noticed that the UK would need to give the EU 2 years notice of leaving.


That is a maximum not minimum. Negotiations and setting the exit date will not exceed 2 years.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:52 pm 
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Quote:
Here’s how to argue with a Brexiter – and win
Timothy Garton Ash

A new battle of Britain has begun. On its outcome will depend the fate of two unions: the United Kingdom and the European Union. If the English vote to leave the EU, the Scots will vote to leave the UK. There will then be no Britain. Meanwhile, the shock of Brexit to a continent already staggering under many crises could spell the beginning of the end of the European Union.

So if you care about Britain or Europe, and even more if you care about Britain and Europe, please join this good fight. The final negotiation in Brussels was bruising, and certainly not the kick-off anyone would want, but there is still everything to play for.

Continental Europeans often assume that England is, in its heart of oak, incorrigibly hostile to Europe. This is not true. For decades now, the best pollsters have found that on the EU there is a large undecided middle which can go either way. That was the case in the run-up to the 1975 referendum, which saw a large swing from out to in, and it’s true today: 42% of those who tell ComRes they will vote in or out also say they could still change their minds.

I know, from many hostile online comments, that the Guardian has some fiercely Eurosceptic followers, but I’m now mainly addressing the majority of our readers, whether British or not, who want Britain to stay in the EU. It’s a peculiarity of this referendum that Commonwealth citizens may vote in it, whereas French, Italians and Germans who have lived here for many years, and are much more directly affected, may not. But whether or not you have a vote, you still have a voice. Raise it, please, in the pub, in the office or in the friend’s living room.

Here are just a few of the arguments you could make. First of all, the details of the deal are not the crucial issue. Months ago, when David Cameron revealed his renegotiation agenda, it was already clear that this was not going to be a fundamental redefinition of Britain’s relationship with the EU. Nor would we suddenly find ourselves in “a reformed Europe”.

On this, Eurosceptics are right: Cameron’s demands were less than he pumped them up to be, and inevitably, given that 27 other European countries had to be satisfied, what he achieved is even more modest. But it would be madness to let a decision about the economic and political future of Britain for decades ahead hinge on the detail of an “emergency brake” on in-work benefits for migrants.

Brexit is riskier than Bremain. This is incontestable. We know what it’s like being a member of the EU. We don’t know what it would be like outside.

The negotiation of Brexit would be long and bloody. Nigel Lawson blithely suggests that it would be easy: we just repeal the 1972 European Communities Act and with one bound John Bull is free.

Our continental partners would give us generous access to the single market through a free trade agreement “that they need far more than we do”. In your dreams. Read the careful analysis by the longtime legal chief of the EU, Jean-Claude Piris, to see what a nightmare of legal unravelling it would be. Talk to continental politicians. What we just saw in Brussels was the most that they are prepared to do to keep us in. They would do us no favours if we were leaving.

Many of our European partners privately envy us the position of being outside the Schengen area and the ill-designed eurozone, but in all the parts that we want to be in. The Brussels deal shows that our European partners have accepted that for the foreseeable future Britain wishes to stop at roughly its current stage of integration. If there is a “best of both worlds”, it is this – and not Brexit.

It is cold outside. The more you look at Norway or Switzerland, the less attractive their position appears, and a clear majority of business and union leaders don’t want to take this gamble. The EU has used the attraction of its single market of 500 million consumers to secure favourable free-trade deals with much of the world. It defies logic to think that Britain would get better deals on its own. Michael B Froman, the United States trade representative, said last year that no free trade agreement would exist with Britain if it left the EU, and the US would have no interest in negotiating one.

Being in the EU helps keep us safe from terrorism and international crime. Don’t listen to me, listen to the Conservative home secretary, Theresa May. This is why she has kept Britain in the most important European networks for police and judicial cooperation, and will argue for Britain to stay in the EU.

It’s also vital to national security. Our highest-ranking soldier, Field Marshal Lord Bramall – no starry-eyed Europhile – warns that if we left, “a broken and demoralised Europe just across the Channel” would imperil our security. If we stay, we can be one of the leaders of a European foreign policy that addresses the root causes of problems such as Middle East refugee flows. Vladimir Putin and Marine Le Pen want us to leave. Barack Obama, Angela Merkel and all our traditional friends, in Europe, North America and the Commonwealth, want us to stay. Need I say more?

Brexit would be disastrous for Ireland. The former Irish prime minister John Bruton says it would “undo much of the work of the peace process and create huge questions over borders and labour market access”. There are more than 380,000 Irish citizens living in Britain, who do have a vote in this referendum, and millions of Brits (including me) with Irish ancestry. If you care about Ireland, vote to remain.

Scotland would leave the UK. If you care about that, vote to remain.

The EU can be changed. While the reforms Cameron has secured are modest, there’s a swelling chorus of voices in countries like Germany saying not just “We must do this, reluctantly, to keep Britain in”, but “We really do need to reform the EU”. If Britain remains, the reform lobby is strong; if it leaves, much weaker.

Most of these arguments are from prudence, not visionary optimism – and none the worse for that. Eurosceptics will decry them as “scaremongering”. Well, I suppose you might call it scaremongering if someone asks you not to jump off the deck of an ocean liner, without a lifebelt, in a force nine storm. Actually, it’s common sense.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 5:55 pm 
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Glaston wrote:
Nobleman wrote:
In
The Conservatives (75% of MPs)


Guido has it as 30% of tory MP's in
40% as out and rest undecided


There are only going to be 80-90 pro Brexit Conservative MPs. The Eurosceptics were hoping for 150+.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:13 pm 
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SamShark wrote:
Quote:
Here’s how to argue with a Brexiter – and win
Timothy Garton Ash

A new battle of Britain has begun. On its outcome will depend the fate of two unions: the United Kingdom and the European Union. If the English vote to leave the EU, the Scots will vote to leave the UK. There will then be no Britain. Meanwhile, the shock of Brexit to a continent already staggering under many crises could spell the beginning of the end of the European Union.

So if you care about Britain or Europe, and even more if you care about Britain and Europe, please join this good fight. The final negotiation in Brussels was bruising, and certainly not the kick-off anyone would want, but there is still everything to play for.

Continental Europeans often assume that England is, in its heart of oak, incorrigibly hostile to Europe. This is not true. For decades now, the best pollsters have found that on the EU there is a large undecided middle which can go either way. That was the case in the run-up to the 1975 referendum, which saw a large swing from out to in, and it’s true today: 42% of those who tell ComRes they will vote in or out also say they could still change their minds.

I know, from many hostile online comments, that the Guardian has some fiercely Eurosceptic followers, but I’m now mainly addressing the majority of our readers, whether British or not, who want Britain to stay in the EU. It’s a peculiarity of this referendum that Commonwealth citizens may vote in it, whereas French, Italians and Germans who have lived here for many years, and are much more directly affected, may not. But whether or not you have a vote, you still have a voice. Raise it, please, in the pub, in the office or in the friend’s living room.

Here are just a few of the arguments you could make. First of all, the details of the deal are not the crucial issue. Months ago, when David Cameron revealed his renegotiation agenda, it was already clear that this was not going to be a fundamental redefinition of Britain’s relationship with the EU. Nor would we suddenly find ourselves in “a reformed Europe”.

On this, Eurosceptics are right: Cameron’s demands were less than he pumped them up to be, and inevitably, given that 27 other European countries had to be satisfied, what he achieved is even more modest. But it would be madness to let a decision about the economic and political future of Britain for decades ahead hinge on the detail of an “emergency brake” on in-work benefits for migrants.

Brexit is riskier than Bremain. This is incontestable. We know what it’s like being a member of the EU. We don’t know what it would be like outside.

The negotiation of Brexit would be long and bloody. Nigel Lawson blithely suggests that it would be easy: we just repeal the 1972 European Communities Act and with one bound John Bull is free.

Our continental partners would give us generous access to the single market through a free trade agreement “that they need far more than we do”. In your dreams. Read the careful analysis by the longtime legal chief of the EU, Jean-Claude Piris, to see what a nightmare of legal unravelling it would be. Talk to continental politicians. What we just saw in Brussels was the most that they are prepared to do to keep us in. They would do us no favours if we were leaving.

Many of our European partners privately envy us the position of being outside the Schengen area and the ill-designed eurozone, but in all the parts that we want to be in. The Brussels deal shows that our European partners have accepted that for the foreseeable future Britain wishes to stop at roughly its current stage of integration. If there is a “best of both worlds”, it is this – and not Brexit.

It is cold outside. The more you look at Norway or Switzerland, the less attractive their position appears, and a clear majority of business and union leaders don’t want to take this gamble. The EU has used the attraction of its single market of 500 million consumers to secure favourable free-trade deals with much of the world. It defies logic to think that Britain would get better deals on its own. Michael B Froman, the United States trade representative, said last year that no free trade agreement would exist with Britain if it left the EU, and the US would have no interest in negotiating one.

Being in the EU helps keep us safe from terrorism and international crime. Don’t listen to me, listen to the Conservative home secretary, Theresa May. This is why she has kept Britain in the most important European networks for police and judicial cooperation, and will argue for Britain to stay in the EU.

It’s also vital to national security. Our highest-ranking soldier, Field Marshal Lord Bramall – no starry-eyed Europhile – warns that if we left, “a broken and demoralised Europe just across the Channel” would imperil our security. If we stay, we can be one of the leaders of a European foreign policy that addresses the root causes of problems such as Middle East refugee flows. Vladimir Putin and Marine Le Pen want us to leave. Barack Obama, Angela Merkel and all our traditional friends, in Europe, North America and the Commonwealth, want us to stay. Need I say more?

Brexit would be disastrous for Ireland. The former Irish prime minister John Bruton says it would “undo much of the work of the peace process and create huge questions over borders and labour market access”. There are more than 380,000 Irish citizens living in Britain, who do have a vote in this referendum, and millions of Brits (including me) with Irish ancestry. If you care about Ireland, vote to remain.

Scotland would leave the UK. If you care about that, vote to remain.

The EU can be changed. While the reforms Cameron has secured are modest, there’s a swelling chorus of voices in countries like Germany saying not just “We must do this, reluctantly, to keep Britain in”, but “We really do need to reform the EU”. If Britain remains, the reform lobby is strong; if it leaves, much weaker.

Most of these arguments are from prudence, not visionary optimism – and none the worse for that. Eurosceptics will decry them as “scaremongering”. Well, I suppose you might call it scaremongering if someone asks you not to jump off the deck of an ocean liner, without a lifebelt, in a force nine storm. Actually, it’s common sense.


It's a depressing column this, because it's very accurate. Britain is snookered and Cameron knows it - it has to stay in for a myriad of internal and external reasons. But it no longer benefits Britain itself to be shackled to this corpse, run by a lunatic country.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:14 pm 
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Actually in the case of Brexit, and Ireland takes in eastern european migrants like it has been doing, would the UK reintroduce border controls between Ireland and Northern Ireland? That would be nasty and could kick off more trouble. It's scaremongering if we know the UK government wouldn't actually do that, but what if they felt it was necessary to stop migrants entering the UK illegally?


Last edited by iarmhiman on Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:15 pm 
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iarmhiman wrote:
Actually in the case of Brexit, and Ireland takes in eastern european refugees like it has been doing, would the UK reintroduce border controls between Ireland and Northern Ireland? That would be nasty and could kick off more trouble. It's scaremongering if we know the UK government wouldn't actually do that, but what if they felt it was necessary to stop migrants entering the UK illegally?


Where are these refugees coming from in Eastern Europe?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:17 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
iarmhiman wrote:
Actually in the case of Brexit, and Ireland takes in eastern european refugees like it has been doing, would the UK reintroduce border controls between Ireland and Northern Ireland? That would be nasty and could kick off more trouble. It's scaremongering if we know the UK government wouldn't actually do that, but what if they felt it was necessary to stop migrants entering the UK illegally?


Where are these refugees coming from in Eastern Europe?


Edited. I'm all over the place today with this dreadful hangover.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:19 pm 
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iarmhiman wrote:
Actually in the case of Brexit, and Ireland takes in eastern european migrants like it has been doing, would the UK reintroduce border controls between Ireland and Northern Ireland? That would be nasty and could kick off more trouble. It's scaremongering if we know the UK government wouldn't actually do that, but what if they felt it was necessary to stop migrants entering the UK illegally?


They wouldn't simply. There have never been border control controls between Ireland and the UK.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:21 pm 
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Tim. wrote:
iarmhiman wrote:
Actually in the case of Brexit, and Ireland takes in eastern european migrants like it has been doing, would the UK reintroduce border controls between Ireland and Northern Ireland? That would be nasty and could kick off more trouble. It's scaremongering if we know the UK government wouldn't actually do that, but what if they felt it was necessary to stop migrants entering the UK illegally?


They wouldn't simply. There have never been border control controls between Ireland and the UK.


There were up until the 90s for obvious reasons but what if the British government felt they were necessary for keeping their borders secure?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:23 pm 
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Leaving the EU makes zero sense for Northern Ireland.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:25 pm 
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As a point of reference, the amount child benefit paid to children living abroad in the rest of the EU is 25 million quid. Ie fudge all , a rounding error, an irrelevant amount. Jeez it's depressing.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:32 pm 
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unseenwork wrote:
Leaving the EU makes zero sense for Northern Ireland.


Why are the DUP voting to leave?

Interested to hear Willie Faloon's views on this. Would NI farmers stop getting their grants in the event of a Brexit?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:34 pm 
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UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:35 pm 
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terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

It's not confirmed.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:36 pm 
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if you are into democracy and accountability its has to be out

how could anybody vote to stay in without being able to name the top table eu leaders, who pass so many laws that effect them, its totally bizarre

nothing will change if we leave the 'european project'. will countries cut their nose off to spite their face i doubt it, we will still share trade, intelligence on terrorism, criminal activity, it benefits nobody to stop.

this vote is probably the most important vote i will ever have, if any uk government cannot govern the uk without eu interference, then it makes it more important than a general election. our elected ministers are pish, but at least they are ours

hopefully we can get this layer of government cut away, then concentrate on ending the other non-elected gravy train, the house of lords


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:38 pm 
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fisgard792 wrote:
nothing will change if we leave the 'european project'.

Jaysus :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:41 pm 
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fisgard792 wrote:
if you are into democracy and accountability its has to be out

how could anybody vote to stay in without being able to name the top table eu leaders, who pass so many laws that effect them, its totally bizarre

nothing will change if we leave the 'european project'. will countries cut their nose off to spite their face i doubt it, we will still share trade, intelligence on terrorism, criminal activity, it benefits nobody to stop.

this vote is probably the most important vote i will ever have, if any uk government cannot govern the uk without eu interference, then it makes it more important than a general election. our elected ministers are pish, but at least they are ours

hopefully we can get this layer of government cut away, then concentrate on ending the other non-elected gravy train, the house of lords



We will have to sign up to most EU regulation to have any sort of trade with them. If we're not a member we have no input to said regulations. It's a perverse situation but Cameron's potential vetos could give us less European influence than exit.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:47 pm 
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ZappaMan wrote:
fisgard792 wrote:
nothing will change if we leave the 'european project'.

Jaysus :lol:


so what do you think will fundamentally change?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:49 pm 
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fisgard792 wrote:
ZappaMan wrote:
fisgard792 wrote:
nothing will change if we leave the 'european project'.

Jaysus :lol:


so what do you think will fundamentally change?


None of us really know and you don't either. What we know is the UK businesses don't want a Brexit. Businesses don't like uncertainty.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:51 pm 
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iarmhiman wrote:
unseenwork wrote:
Leaving the EU makes zero sense for Northern Ireland.


Why are the DUP voting to leave?

Interested to hear Willie Faloon's views on this. Would NI farmers stop getting their grants in the event of a Brexit?

Because it's a nice opportunity for then to drape themselves in union flags whilst shunning a closer relationship with the South, and appeal to the lowest common denominator of their electorate.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:00 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

It's not confirmed.



We would be mad to get out. We have the best of both worlds. The rest is just noise.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:27 pm 
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June 23rd then...


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:38 pm 
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tabascoboy wrote:
June 23rd then...

Let the bullshit begin!


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:42 pm 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

It's not confirmed.


Has all this been written into a treaty, or is it just an agreement between national leaders with no obligation upon their sucessors?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:44 pm 
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AND-y wrote:
tabascoboy wrote:
June 23rd then...

Let the bullshit begin!

Nigel Farage will be knocking one out.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:48 pm 
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terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

Enjoy this ladies, Terry and I in agreement is a once in a lifetime experience.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:00 pm 
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Gove for PM


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:09 pm 
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Sefton wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

Enjoy this ladies, Terry and I in agreement is a once in a lifetime experience.



Sefton, you are rarely correct on anything but, in this case, you appear to be right which is good! Must admit the terrifying sight of Nigel Farage, George Galloway and Ian Duncan Smith leading the charge against us is a worry. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:09 pm 
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cachao wrote:
Wendigo7 wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

It's not confirmed.


Has all this been written into a treaty, or is it just an agreement between national leaders with no obligation upon their sucessors?


From reading those points Terry wrote. The UK never had to agree to those ever. Definitely 3/4 of those were never in place and the UK in or out of the EU will never agree to a superstate.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:11 pm 
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Posts: 37587
terryfinch wrote:
Sefton wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

Enjoy this ladies, Terry and I in agreement is a once in a lifetime experience.



Sefton, you are rarely correct on anything but, in this case, you appear to be right which is good! Must admit the terrifying sight of Nigel Farage, George Galloway and Ian Duncan Smith leading the charge against us is a worry. :lol:


I could have swore a few weeks back you wanted out and those points you mentioned were already existing.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2016 8:14 pm 
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Posts: 5594
iarmhiman wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
Sefton wrote:
terryfinch wrote:
UK has a great deal. We are in the EU and can trade freely but:

- No Schengen
- No Euro
- No 'ever closer union' or a United State of Europe for us
- No disadvantage from being outside the disasterous Eurozone.

We would be mad to get out now.

Enjoy this ladies, Terry and I in agreement is a once in a lifetime experience.



Sefton, you are rarely correct on anything but, in this case, you appear to be right which is good! Must admit the terrifying sight of Nigel Farage, George Galloway and Ian Duncan Smith leading the charge against us is a worry. :lol:




I could have swore a few weeks back you wanted out and those points you mentioned were already existing.



No, never been an 'outer', just think the Euro is a disaster for the poor sods caught up in it.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2016 1:21 am 
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Quote:
Robert Peston ‏@Peston 1h1 hour ago

.@BorisJohnson will back leaving EU, I understand, & as I just said on @itvnews - & we'll know the why and how tmrw night

Shameless careerism and opportunism from the blond one, if true - and further confirmation that he is utterly unfit for high office.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2016 1:35 am 
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MrDominator wrote:
Quote:
Robert Peston ‏@Peston 1h1 hour ago

.@BorisJohnson will back leaving EU, I understand, & as I just said on @itvnews - & we'll know the why and how tmrw night

Shameless careerism and opportunism from the blond one, if true - and further confirmation that he is utterly unfit for high office.

It's entirely characteristic of his political career to date, the man is nothing more than a petty opportunist.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2016 10:08 am 
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Location: South Oxfordshire
unseenwork wrote:
MrDominator wrote:
Quote:
Robert Peston ‏@Peston 1h1 hour ago

.@BorisJohnson will back leaving EU, I understand, & as I just said on @itvnews - & we'll know the why and how tmrw night

Shameless careerism and opportunism from the blond one, if true - and further confirmation that he is utterly unfit for high office.

It's entirely characteristic of his political career to date, the man is nothing more than a petty opportunist.


Agreed - this decision was made by him as soon as Theresa May came out in favour of staying in. This is entire;y about his chances of winning a Tory party leadership election


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