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EverReady wrote:At last a balanced articlezzzz wrote:Why we need to get out. This is bonkers stuff.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/201 ... g_share_tw
iarmhiman wrote:EverReady wrote:At last a balanced articlezzzz wrote:Why we need to get out. This is bonkers stuff.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/201 ... g_share_tw
You have access to the content of this abortion of a newspaper?EverReady wrote:At last a balanced articlezzzz wrote:Why we need to get out. This is bonkers stuff.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/201 ... g_share_tw
but meanwhile, why is forecast growth against actual falls in growth, a cause for such gleeful triumphalism? Little things...Rinkals wrote:The point (which you are attempting to subvert) is that predictions of the effect of leaving the EU cannot be assessed with any accuracy until that actually happens.bimboman wrote:Rinkals wrote:When you actually leave?Santa wrote:Another embarrassingly positive forecast
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/201 ... -upgraded/
When oh when will Brexit actually turn out bad!?!
The predictions didn't stay post leaving they made lots of immediate predictions, none of which have been close.
Rinkals wrote:The point (which you are attempting to subvert) is that predictions of the effect of leaving the EU cannot be assessed with any accuracy until that actually happens.bimboman wrote:Rinkals wrote:When you actually leave?Santa wrote:Another embarrassingly positive forecast
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/201 ... -upgraded/
When oh when will Brexit actually turn out bad!?!
The predictions didn't stay post leaving they made lots of immediate predictions, none of which have been close.
EverReady wrote:The Telegraph loves to channel a bit of Der Ewige Jude when shiteing on about the EU. It is full of parasitic, remorseless, shape shifting monsters trying to destroy the pure and innocent GB. The only people who buy into it most definitely have NPD or narcissistic personality disorder. Literally every symptom is there between the pages or can be glimpsed here on PR. It is fascinating to see one out of a controlled environment and it is why I log on most days.iarmhiman wrote:EverReady wrote:At last a balanced articlezzzz wrote:Why we need to get out. This is bonkers stuff.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/201 ... g_share_tw
What are Brussels going to do about Poland and Hungary? They're getting out of control and are backing each other up avoiding the discipline.La soule wrote:Thank you for your concerns Bimbo.
We will deal with this should it become an issue.
It warms my heart to find you and the Daily Telegraph being so worried about what might happen to the EU
It is a pity to lose such a close and carrying partner.
Unsure what mechanism is available to deal with this considering they both have a veto.iarmhiman wrote:What are Brussels going to do about Poland and Hungary? They're getting out of control and are backing each other up avoiding the discipline.La soule wrote:Thank you for your concerns Bimbo.
We will deal with this should it become an issue.
It warms my heart to find you and the Daily Telegraph being so worried about what might happen to the EU
It is a pity to lose such a close and carrying partner.
La soule wrote:Should never have gone east to please the Brits in the first place.
He's not wrong there.Chips wrote:La soule wrote:Should never have gone east to please the Brits in the first place.
Of course you can, you just did.iarmhiman wrote:He's not wrong there.Chips wrote:La soule wrote:Should never have gone east to please the Brits in the first place.
The French and Germans initially wanted to keep the EEC as small as possible. It was Britain who wanted all the eastern members to join...obviously to weaken it. Now it's the British who want less Eastern European migrants after they were the ones pushing for their admission into the EEC/EU.
You couldn't make it up
iarmhiman wrote:He's not wrong there.Chips wrote:La soule wrote:Should never have gone east to please the Brits in the first place.
The French and Germans initially wanted to keep the EEC as small as possible. It was Britain who wanted all the eastern members to join...obviously to weaken it. Now it's the British who want less Eastern European migrants after they were the ones pushing for their admission into the EEC/EU.
You couldn't make it up
You do know ever closer union was on the agenda since 1957 Treaty of Rome. You lot joined in 1973 already knowing that.Chips wrote:iarmhiman wrote:He's not wrong there.Chips wrote:La soule wrote:Should never have gone east to please the Brits in the first place.
The French and Germans initially wanted to keep the EEC as small as possible. It was Britain who wanted all the eastern members to join...obviously to weaken it. Now it's the British who want less Eastern European migrants after they were the ones pushing for their admission into the EEC/EU.
You couldn't make it up
A big EEC - very good idea.
A big EU - not a very good idea.
I think I can see where things went tits up.
Got any proof to back that statement up?You do know ever closer union was on the agenda since 1957 Treaty of Rome. You lot joined in 1973 already knowing that
You got links for that ? The European Union wasn't created in 1957.You do know ever closer union was on the agenda since 1957 Treaty of Rome. You lot joined in 1973 already knowing that.
This could easily be a growing problem for the UK, and anyone can see it's the vote that got us into this messChips wrote:
A big EU - not a very good idea.
I think I can see where things went tits up.
There are many articles online about this.100MileDad wrote:Got any proof to back that statement up?You do know ever closer union was on the agenda since 1957 Treaty of Rome. You lot joined in 1973 already knowing that
Treaty of Rome
The 1957 Treaty Establishing the European Community contained the objective of “ever closer union” in the following words in the Preamble. In English this is: “Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe …..”.
Article 2 of the Treaty also promoted the ‘spirit’ of closer union in its description of the aims of the Community, ending with “closer relations between the States belonging to it”.
Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
It's also a meaningless phrase, and yet it gets used all the time, and maybe 99% of the time it's used with a bad understanding of the context in which the phrase was used.iarmhiman wrote:
You do know ever closer union was on the agenda since 1957 Treaty of Rome. You lot joined in 1973 already knowing that.
It was always the intention of mainland Europe to proceed with this. The reason I think Britain joined in 1973 was to ensure it couldn't happen. Now that they are leaving, it's going to happen.100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
iarmhiman wrote:It was always the intention of mainland Europe to proceed with this. The reason I think Britain joined in 1973 was to ensure it couldn't happen. Now that they are leaving, it's going to happen.100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
"Mainland Europe"? Don't you mean people with vested interests in business and wanting to make sure Germany didn't kick the shit out of France for a third time?iarmhiman wrote:It was always the intention of mainland Europe to proceed with this. The reason I think Britain joined in 1973 was to ensure it couldn't happen. Now that they are leaving, it's going to happen.100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
The UK didn't actually hold a public vote on joining in 1973 unlike Ireland and Norway.shereblue wrote:Returning to facts rather than "predictions", when the UK voted to join the EU in 1973, there was a repeat performance in 1975. There is nothing to actually stop there being another referendum on the subject of withdrawal. Remember the fixed term parliaments? It's up to Parliament to decide.
Gospel wrote:The UK didn't actually hold a public vote on joining in 1973 unlike Ireland and Norway.shereblue wrote:Returning to facts rather than "predictions", when the UK voted to join the EU in 1973, there was a repeat performance in 1975. There is nothing to actually stop there being another referendum on the subject of withdrawal. Remember the fixed term parliaments? It's up to Parliament to decide.
Actually the original concept of the European Coal & Steel community was the Americans idea. They were stuck in a war on the Korean Peninsula and hadn't the soldiers required to defend western Europe from potential Soviet aggression. The European Coal & Steel Community was so Germany and France pooled their resources. After that the concept grew to a customs union, and then ever closer union .100MileDad wrote:"Mainland Europe"? Don't you mean people with vested interests in business and wanting to make sure Germany didn't kick the shit out of France for a third time?iarmhiman wrote:It was always the intention of mainland Europe to proceed with this. The reason I think Britain joined in 1973 was to ensure it couldn't happen. Now that they are leaving, it's going to happen.100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
It was actually the yanks who put a lot of pressure on after the fall of the Soviet Union. There were a lot of WWII allies that had been left to rot under communist rule that deserved better lives. It's been poorly managed especially from a British perspective but then successive governments wanted to steal a march on France and Germany with a boost in GDP from immigration.iarmhiman wrote:It was Britain who wanted all the eastern members to join...obviously to weaken it.
Read my post about someone having to stop Germany kicking the shit out of you again. The fact that they are using you financially and are still kicking the shit out of you is either here nor there.La soule wrote:Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
La soule wrote:Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
Well had it been done after WW1 instead of humiliating Germany there wouldn't have been the resentment or poverty in Germany that lead to WW2 and the greatest atrocity of all time the holocaust100MileDad wrote:Read my post about someone having to stop Germany kicking the shit out of you again. The fact that they are using you financially and are still kicking the shit out of you is either here nor there.La soule wrote:Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
iarmhiman wrote:Well had it been done after WW1 instead of humiliating Germany there wouldn't have been the resentment or poverty in Germany that lead to WW2 and the greatest atrocity of all time the holocaust100MileDad wrote:Read my post about someone having to stop Germany kicking the shit out of you again. The fact that they are using you financially and are still kicking the shit out of you is either here nor there.La soule wrote:Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
O' level history is great.Well had it been done after WW1 instead of humiliating Germany there wouldn't have been the resentment or poverty in Germany that lead to WW2 and the greatest atrocity of all time the holocaust
Bit of a strawman there Daccy.100MileDad wrote:iarmhiman wrote:Well had it been done after WW1 instead of humiliating Germany there wouldn't have been the resentment or poverty in Germany that lead to WW2 and the greatest atrocity of all time the holocaust100MileDad wrote:Read my post about someone having to stop Germany kicking the shit out of you again. The fact that they are using you financially and are still kicking the shit out of you is either here nor there.La soule wrote:
Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?
Feck me mate, there's being pro-EU and there's being pro-EU. In your mind the reason there was a holocaust was because their wasn't an EU?
They somehow still come across as more trustworthy than the brits somehow.100MileDad wrote:Read my post about someone having to stop Germany kicking the shit out of you again. The fact that they are using you financially and are still kicking the shit out of you is either here nor there.La soule wrote:Like what exactly?? Having more BBQs together for example?100MileDad wrote:Yeah, you can read that several ways.“Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe ….
In what way?The EU isn't perfect but never has it been so good to live in Europe. Listen you made your bed and have to live with it.
I'll be waving at you from the fast lane in the airport
Which is why you're their bitch, which is why you've always been their bitch and the only time you're not their bitch is when we're helping you.They somehow still come across as more trustworthy than the brits somehow.