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Whether you can or can't actually vote IRL, In, or Out
In 60%  60%  [ 248 ]
Out 40%  40%  [ 167 ]
Total votes : 415
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 6:29 pm 
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Yer Man wrote:
ScarfaceClaw wrote:
Something is up tomorrow. Work has just gone on a full lockdown with expectation of early morning announcement from the FCA. Expectation that the markets will go crazy. Something something Brexit is all we can put our fingers on at the moment.

Publishing the practical implications of "No Deal"?


Maybe copying JLR & others & forcing people to take time off around Brexit day ?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 6:44 pm 
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fishfoodie wrote:
May is probably trying to pitch this, as period when the mysterious, 'technical means', are invented to track all cross-border commerce, so there's no need for a hard border, & there's no need to trigger the backstop. The problem is that the EU aren't mugs, & they won't want to let the UK out of the SM/CU, unless there's complete agreement that means are available to avoid that hard border.

Key point. Backstop end date = Free UK. Definitely not what EU has in mind.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:00 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
fishfoodie wrote:
May is probably trying to pitch this, as period when the mysterious, 'technical means', are invented to track all cross-border commerce, so there's no need for a hard border, & there's no need to trigger the backstop. The problem is that the EU aren't mugs, & they won't want to let the UK out of the SM/CU, unless there's complete agreement that means are available to avoid that hard border.

Key point. Backstop end date = Free UK. Definitely not what EU has in mind.

its not really a backstop if it has an end date is it?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:03 pm 
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Yer Man wrote:
ScarfaceClaw wrote:
Something is up tomorrow. Work has just gone on a full lockdown with expectation of early morning announcement from the FCA. Expectation that the markets will go crazy. Something something Brexit is all we can put our fingers on at the moment.

Publishing the practical implications of "No Deal"?

That’s what the business folk are hinting at. Brexit no deal and this is how fooked you’re all going to be.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:04 pm 
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ScarfaceClaw wrote:
Yer Man wrote:
ScarfaceClaw wrote:
Something is up tomorrow. Work has just gone on a full lockdown with expectation of early morning announcement from the FCA. Expectation that the markets will go crazy. Something something Brexit is all we can put our fingers on at the moment.

Publishing the practical implications of "No Deal"?

That’s what the business folk are hinting at. Brexit no deal and this is how fooked you’re all going to be.


Obviously Project Fear, and Bimbo will be along in a minute to call them liars.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:42 pm 
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pigaaaa wrote:
Rugby2023 wrote:
fishfoodie wrote:
May is probably trying to pitch this, as period when the mysterious, 'technical means', are invented to track all cross-border commerce, so there's no need for a hard border, & there's no need to trigger the backstop. The problem is that the EU aren't mugs, & they won't want to let the UK out of the SM/CU, unless there's complete agreement that means are available to avoid that hard border.

Key point. Backstop end date = Free UK. Definitely not what EU has in mind.

its not really a backstop if it has an end date is it?

Theoretically, the backstop is supposed to give time to do an FTA so that the backstop won't be needed. So if December 2021 is the end date, giving the EU & UK time to do an FTA, no backstop is needed beyond that point.

If no FTA is concluded in that time, the UK would leave, but has undertaken not to put up a hard border regardless (I believe the latter part is in law).

What the EU is pushing for here is a backstop with an open-ended (i.e. perpetual) Customs Union meaning the EU never has to conclude an FTA and the UK never has the freedom to diverge and seal deals with other nations.

The only way out of it would be to give up part of the UK, or agree a subservient FTA with no freedom to do deals with other countries (and whatever other bells on they might add) or rejoin the EU.

It is, in essence, a trap. I should add, it's one that May-Robbins have knowingly and willingly walked into, and are now facing pushback.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:49 pm 
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Yer Man wrote:
ScarfaceClaw wrote:
Something is up tomorrow. Work has just gone on a full lockdown with expectation of early morning announcement from the FCA. Expectation that the markets will go crazy. Something something Brexit is all we can put our fingers on at the moment.

Publishing the practical implications of "No Deal"?



The FCA ?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:53 pm 
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Is what you are saying that this isn't the easiest deal in history, there aren't only upsides and that we don't hold all the cards?

Now it's; we can't get a deal, there will be lots of downsides and the EU are actually in control of this.

We've played an incredibly difficult situation exceptionally badly at every turn.

By 2021 when the "trap" comes in, the country will be very clearly remain.

Calling it democracy at this stage is laughable.

We should have the British Bulldog balls to sack it all off and - like someone who has disgraced themselves at the work Xmas do - be apologetic and wait for everyone to hopefully forget.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:02 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
pigaaaa wrote:
Rugby2023 wrote:
fishfoodie wrote:
May is probably trying to pitch this, as period when the mysterious, 'technical means', are invented to track all cross-border commerce, so there's no need for a hard border, & there's no need to trigger the backstop. The problem is that the EU aren't mugs, & they won't want to let the UK out of the SM/CU, unless there's complete agreement that means are available to avoid that hard border.

Key point. Backstop end date = Free UK. Definitely not what EU has in mind.

its not really a backstop if it has an end date is it?

Theoretically, the backstop is supposed to give time to do an FTA so that the backstop won't be needed. So if December 2021 is the end date, giving the EU & UK time to do an FTA, no backstop is needed beyond that point.

If no FTA is concluded in that time, the UK would leave, but has undertaken not to put up a hard border regardless (I believe the latter part is in law).

What the EU is pushing for here is a backstop with an open-ended (i.e. perpetual) Customs Union meaning the EU never has to conclude an FTA and the UK never has the freedom to diverge and seal deals with other nations.

The only way out of it would be to give up part of the UK, or agree a subservient FTA with no freedom to do deals with other countries (and whatever other bells on they might add) or rejoin the EU.

It is, in essence, a trap. I should add, it's one that May-Robbins have knowingly and willingly walked into, and are now facing pushback.


Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:10 pm 
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This talk of a time limited backstop is bloody lunacy, I don't know how they can view it as in any way addressing the border problem unless it runs until unification.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:14 pm 
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Quote:
It is, in essence, a trap. I should add, it's one that May-Robbins have knowingly and willingly walked into, and are now facing pushback.


This.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:15 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Theoretically, the backstop is supposed to give time to do an FTA so that the backstop won't be needed. So if December 2021 is the end date, giving the EU & UK time to do an FTA, no backstop is needed beyond that point.


The EU isn't trying to keep GB in the CU indefinitely; it's trying to stop you leaving a transition period without doing anything to fix the status of the border; that's why they want a conditional exit, not one with a fixed date.

Rugby2023 wrote:
If no FTA is concluded in that time, the UK would leave, but has undertaken not to put up a hard border regardless (I believe the latter part is in law).


and you also passed an amendment that prevents different customs regimes in NI; & the Government gave themselves the Henry VIII powers that mean they could revoke any of these without troubling the MPs with the inconvenience of a vote; so why would the EU trust them ?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:16 pm 
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unseenwork wrote:
This talk of a time limited backstop is bloody lunacy, I don't know how they can view it as in any way addressing the border problem unless it runs until unification.



Disgusting.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:22 pm 
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Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


Last edited by Rugby2023 on Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:25 pm 
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Yet another Tory MP with Bimboesque levels of understanding of the GFA.

https://twitter.com/lord_mchaggis/statu ... 4158803968


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:27 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


If everyone is so confident that you're going to be hyper-competitive outside the EU; why are the Politicians expending so much energy to get an agreement; why don't you just fuck off & leave ?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:33 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


None of this is news. Greece were also under the gun when they talked about leaving a few years ago. EU is like the Yakuza, you never leave alive.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:33 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Yet another Tory MP with Bimboesque levels of understanding of the GFA.

https://twitter.com/lord_mchaggis/statu ... 4158803968



If "bad" times in Ireland means you can't be lectured on the subject, we should all be bowing to Foster then.

The Tory did make an excellent point about context in your little border and the minute amount of goods that apparently require watch towers.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:33 pm 
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fishfoodie wrote:
If everyone is so confident that you're going to be hyper-competitive outside the EU; why are the Politicians expending so much energy to get an agreement; why don't you just fuck off & leave ?

Most politicians campaigned and voted remain, including the PM & Chancellor and majority of Cabinet, the HoC is 75% remain. By in large, the political class don't want to leave. Not sure anyone is necessarily confident but the stakes are high.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:38 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.

Link to katya adler article please.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:39 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
Yet another Tory MP with Bimboesque levels of understanding of the GFA.

https://twitter.com/lord_mchaggis/statu ... 4158803968



If "bad" times in Ireland means you can't be lectured on the subject, we should all be bowing to Foster then.

The Tory did make an excellent point about context in your little border and the minute amount of goods that apparently require watch towers.

Excellent point :lol:


Last edited by Gavin Duffy on Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:39 pm 
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I'm not sure it quite works as an argument as the best way to let Britain become "hyper competitive" would be to see a no deal, where shit bags like the ERG are salivating over slashing regulations, environmental standards, workers rights, corp tax and the like.

It would fudge 95% of people of course, but that's not their concern.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:03 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


This is moronic and captures the problem with brexiteers and their punishment line. It starts off with the false premise that if the EU 'likes' the UK and wants to be fair it will do a deal that allows it all the benefits of EU membership and none of the responsibilities and restrictions enabling it to undercut the EU in international negotiations. Such an arrangement would suit any member.

Then you suggest that the EU won't do it because they are terrified and need to punish the UK. No, they won't do that because it would be moronic and they are not terrified, they realise brexit will hurt the EU but they can't quite believe that idiots in the UK refuse to realise it will hurt them more and they are holding on in the hope that the politicians come to their sense, take responsibility for leading the country and make the hard decisions that enable a deal to be done.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:12 pm 
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Sandstorm wrote:
Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


None of this is news. Greece were also under the gun when they talked about leaving a few years ago. EU is like the Yakuza, you never leave alive.

They considered ditching the euro. There was never any serious talk of Greece leaving the EU. The Greeks aren't this stupid.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:16 pm 
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There is no such category as "ex EU member".

You are either a member, or a third country. And if you are a third country the EU will do deals with you to protect its own interests strictly.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:16 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
pigaaaa wrote:
Rugby2023 wrote:
fishfoodie wrote:
May is probably trying to pitch this, as period when the mysterious, 'technical means', are invented to track all cross-border commerce, so there's no need for a hard border, & there's no need to trigger the backstop. The problem is that the EU aren't mugs, & they won't want to let the UK out of the SM/CU, unless there's complete agreement that means are available to avoid that hard border.

Key point. Backstop end date = Free UK. Definitely not what EU has in mind.

its not really a backstop if it has an end date is it?

Theoretically, the backstop is supposed to give time to do an FTA so that the backstop won't be needed. So if December 2021 is the end date, giving the EU & UK time to do an FTA, no backstop is needed beyond that point.

If no FTA is concluded in that time, the UK would leave, but has undertaken not to put up a hard border regardless (I believe the latter part is in law).

What the EU is pushing for here is a backstop with an open-ended (i.e. perpetual) Customs Union meaning the EU never has to conclude an FTA and the UK never has the freedom to diverge and seal deals with other nations.

The only way out of it would be to give up part of the UK, or agree a subservient FTA with no freedom to do deals with other countries (and whatever other bells on they might add) or rejoin the EU.

It is, in essence, a trap. I should add, it's one that May-Robbins have knowingly and willingly walked into, and are now facing pushback.


The point of the backstop is to ensure the isn't a hard border. If you can come up with a solution to leave the SM/CU without forcing that to happen, the backstop would end. Bimboman says its easy. Whats the problem.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:21 pm 
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May is a remainer. If Boris was in charge we'd have UltraCanada+++ by now


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:22 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


Why the hell would anyone be so stupid to ever think the EU would give the UK everything it wants?
Of course the EU wants to gain advantage over the UK, you're a third country now. Or is it only OK if its the UK is trying to do it?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:23 pm 
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Rugby2023 wrote:
Lenny wrote:
Of course you’re right. It’s not like it’s possible that this could actually be something that Ireland sees as vital to its national interest, in both a historical and economic context. The value to us of a time limited backstop is negligible as Britain, having gotten what it wants from the withdrawal agreement, will simply walk away and leave Ireland to deal with its mess. Ffs you couldn’t even stand over the initial agreement for a day without seeking to water it down to nothing. Why the fcuk would anyone trust your half arsed undertakings.

It's not about Ireland, and never was. They're willing pawns playing a high-wire game because if it goes wrong and the UK does walk away then Ireland takes the biggest hit. This is about the EU caging the UK to prevent competition on the EU's doorstep, the bigger picture.

Katya Adler, BBC Europe Editor:
Quote:
“Let’s imagine a scenario where the EU says, ‘UK we love you, you know we love you and you know that we don’t want you to leave and you know that we want to keep you really close, so let’s do a really advantageous free trade deal and let’s add some financial services into that.

“‘And we’ll give you everything you want. But you’re also free to make arrangements with anybody else you like where you may change your prices and become much more competitive than us’ .

“That’s what they don’t want. They want to keep the UK close, but they want to keep the UK close and locked in.

“They are terrified about us becoming this super competitive country just right close to them and sucking in business that they would then lose out on.


“So, absolutely, they are very worried about that.


Moreover, if the UK succeeds outside the EU, then what is the point of the EU? The UK must be seen to lose.


More shite about a super competitive country off the coast of Europe!!! :lol: Would you fcuk right off. This vision of Britain as New Singapore is so delusional that it defies belief. Singapore started with am extremely low standard of living and a hugely competitive cost base, and with effectively a single party state and a President for Life who suspended all civil rights. You on the other hand have a high standard of living and a high cost base, with fairly poor productivity. And you have this damned pesky thing called democracy, or at least a very crude version of it, so no government will get the space or time to implement policy over the lengthy timespan required to make the huge changes that a transformation into New Singapore requires, even if such a transformation was possible for a mature economy. And have you looked at the bunch of morons masquerading as your political masters recently?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:44 pm 
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Lenny wrote:
And have you looked at the bunch of morons masquerading as your political masters recently?


and there you neatly summed up; the source of the Brexit Referendum, the source of enough votes for Leave to win; the reason why negotiations were doomed to failure; & why the reason the UK is fucked for the next decade at least.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:45 pm 
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Looks like Mrs May is going to be asked to "put up or shut up" tomorrow; ie agree the backstop or prepare for no deal.

http://va.newsrepublic.net/a/6612868747348673029


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:54 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Looks like Mrs May is going to be asked to "put up or shut up" tomorrow; ie agree the backstop or prepare for no deal.

http://va.newsrepublic.net/a/6612868747348673029


Not exactly surprising. There's been rumblings that a lot of the EU members were fed up spending so much time on Brexit; when there is other business to work on, (eg Italys fantasy Budget), & it's been increasingly obvious that May can't negotiate meaningfully anyway; as the DUP have her by the throat.

No Deal is now 99.9%. Batten down the hatches.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:56 pm 
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Yeah saying it here on the telly now. Have a German politican, Andrew Mitchell MP and Neil Richmond a FG senator on Prime Time and tomorrow is it. Well until the next day is anyway


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:56 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
There is no such category as "ex EU member".

You are either a member, or a third country. And if you are a third country the EU will do deals with you to protect its own interests strictly.



Ex EU member will exist in 6 months time you absolute throbber.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:05 pm 
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camroc1 wrote:
Looks like Mrs May is going to be asked to "put up or shut up" tomorrow; ie agree the backstop or prepare for no deal.

http://va.newsrepublic.net/a/6612868747348673029



Superb, her agreement is irrelevant, it won't pass through parliament.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:08 pm 
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Easiest deal ever.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:11 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
Looks like Mrs May is going to be asked to "put up or shut up" tomorrow; ie agree the backstop or prepare for no deal.

http://va.newsrepublic.net/a/6612868747348673029



Superb, her agreement is irrelevant, it won't pass through parliament.


That’s your problem, sort yourselves out - if you send somebody over to make a deal there’s no point in saying that they don’t have the authority to see it through. It’s pathetic and embarrassing for the UK. Either she resigns or she calls a second referendum


Last edited by Duff Paddy on Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:11 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
camroc1 wrote:
There is no such category as "ex EU member".

You are either a member, or a third country. And if you are a third country the EU will do deals with you to protect its own interests strictly.



Ex EU member will exist in 6 months time you absolute throbber.

A very lonely subset of Third Country status, but still wholly Third country for all that.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:12 pm 
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fishfoodie wrote:
Lenny wrote:
And have you looked at the bunch of morons masquerading as your political masters recently?


and there you neatly summed up; the source of the Brexit Referendum, the source of enough votes for Leave to win; the reason why negotiations were doomed to failure; & why the reason the UK is fucked for the next decade at least.


I wish I believed it was just moronic, because then the penny might finally drop.

Just remember, there are people of influence who want/prefer chaos. The bigger the fracture, the greater the disruption, the more they can implement their ideology.

Not to say that this hasn't all been facilitated by plenty of idiocy.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:14 pm 
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Anytime I feel bad about myself, I remember bimbo exists. We could replace the samaritans just by putting a spotlight on him.


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