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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:52 pm 
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In the late 90's when I had just left university I remember arguing with guys who were in their 40s who, that the internet was going to be big, and online shopping via amazon etc would affect physical shops they were unconvinced and said the internet would not be big.

However I really do not get this, paying a lot of money for clothes that do not exist, and just virtually render on to you in photos, I can understand how a few people may think it is a good idea, but cannot see it becoming mainstream, which probably means I am one of those mid 40 year olds that were so out of touch..


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49794403


Quote:
The £7,500 dress that does not exist
By Cody Godwin
Technology of Business reporter, San Francisco
15 November 2019

Mary Ren in the digital dress bought by her husband
Earlier this year Richard Ma, the chief executive of San Francisco-based security company Quantstamp, spent $9,500 (£7,500) on a dress for his wife.
That is a lot of money for a dress, particularly when it does not exist, at least not in a physical form.
Instead it was a digital dress, designed by fashion house The Fabricant, rendered on to an image of Richard's wife, Mary Ren, which can then be used on social media.
"It's definitely very expensive, but it's also like an investment," Mr Ma says.
He explains that he and his wife don't usually buy expensive clothing, but he wanted this piece because he thinks it has long-term value.
"In 10 years time everybody will be 'wearing' digital fashion. It's a unique memento. It's a sign of the times."
Ms Ren has shared the image on her personal Facebook page, and via WeChat, but opted not to post it on a more public platform.

Another fashion house designing for the digital space is Carlings. The Scandinavian company released a digital street wear collection, starting at around £9 ($11), last October.
It "sold out" within a month.

"It sounds kinda stupid to say we 'sold out', which is theoretically impossible when you work with a digital collection because you can create as many as you want," explains Ronny Mikalsen, Carlings' brand director.
"We had set a limit on the amount of products we were going to produce to make it a bit more special.
Being digital-only allows designers to create items that can push boundaries of extravagance or possibilities.
"You wouldn't buy a white t-shirt digitally, right? Because it makes no sense showing it off. So it has to be something that you really either want to show off, or an item that you wouldn't dare to buy physically, or you couldn't afford to buy physically."


Carlings can take risks with a digital only collection
Carlings' digital collection was produced as part of a marketing campaign for their real, physical products. But the firm thinks the concept has potential - a second line of digital garments is planned for late 2019.
The Fabricant releases new, free digital clothes on its website every month, but consumers need the skills, and software, to blend the items with their own pictures.
This also means the company has to find another way to make money until digital fashion becomes more popular.

More Technology of Business
Is China gaining an edge in artificial intelligence?
How streaming could kill the games console
Would you drive a hydrogen-powered car?
On the inside of a hacking catastrophe
Why passwords don't work and what will replace them

"We make our money by servicing fashion brands and retailers with their marketing needs, selling tools, and creating content that uses that aesthetic language of digital fashion," says The Fabricant founder Kerry Murphy.
It is not entirely clear who is buying the digital garments from Carlings, or downloading clothes from The Fabricant.
Mr Mikalsen says Carlings has sold between 200-250 digital pieces, but a search to find them on Instagram only resulted in four people who independently purchased from the collection and had no involvement with the company.
However, some of the those clothes might have only been shared privately.

Some people want the perfect outfit for a particular location
Amber Jae Slooten, a co-founder and designer at The Fabricant, concedes it is mainly industry professionals, who use the CLO 3D software, that are downloading their clothes.
"But it's also just people are very curious to see what the files look like. People just want to own the thing, especially since that one dress sold for $9,500."
Marshal Cohen, chief retail analyst at market research company NPD Group, calls the emergence of digital fashion an "amazing phenomenon", but is yet to be convinced about its long-term impact.
"Do I believe it's going to be something huge and stay forever? No."
He says the technology works for people who want the perfect image. "If you don't like what you're wearing, but you love where you are, you now have the ability to transition your wardrobe, and digitally enhance the photograph to make it look like you're wearing the latest and greatest."

The digital fashion collections have been inspired by the outfits in games like Fortnite
Players of computer games have long been willing to spend money on outfits, or skins, for their in-game characters. That partly inspired The Fabricant to work in the digital space.
"The only reason we made the collection the way we did - inspired from Fortnite - was because of the whole link between buying skins and buying digital clothing," Mr Mikalsen says.
"When it comes to technology and the way people are living their lives, we have to be aware of that the world is changing."
Designers working on skins for games face extra challenges - they have to make sure it fits the story and the character.
Once the outfit is designed, which can take one try or 70, the hardest part starts according to in-games cosmetics consultant Janelle Jimenez.
The skins have to work in the game - a medium that, unlike digital fashion, often involves movements such as walking, fighting or dancing.
"For a game like League of Legends, you have to do 3D, there's sound effects, there's animations, all of these things have to come together to make the character feel like they're sort of expressing a different fantasy of themselves.
"It's less like changing clothes and more like seeing an actor playing a different role."

Buyers of digital fashion don't have to worry about taking something back if it doesn't fit
The influence of games and shifts in customer tastes gives some in the fashion industry confidence that digital clothes, in some capacity, will have long-term impact.
"Digital fashion will become an important part of every fashion business' future business model," says head of the Fashion Innovation Agency at the London College of Fashion, Matthew Drinkwater.
"It's not going to replace everything, but it will be an important part of that


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:56 pm 
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OK Boomer


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:57 pm 
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My 21 year old niece will be all over this. :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:57 pm 
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It’s just a reinvention of the Emperor’s new threads :lol: :lol:

A fool and his money...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:58 pm 
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I’m so out of touch , there is no way I’m reading all that without some boobs or stockings or a car chase to look at, or maybe a gif of parkour going wrong and the guy groins hinself on a railing


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:01 pm 
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Probably will catch on given my teenage daughter and friends just stand around posing for photos at any party they are at, its all about the photos apparently.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:07 pm 
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BokJock wrote:
OK Boomer
- Gen X actually..


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:08 pm 
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Lorthern Nights wrote:
Probably will catch on given my teenage daughter and friends just stand around posing for photos at any party they are at, its all about the photos apparently.


I am sure it will catch on (still do not get it), virtual holidays next where you get pictures on you on holiday at amazing locations..


Last edited by msp. on Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:09 pm 
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msp. wrote:
In the late 90's when I had just left university I remember arguing with guys who were in their 40s who, that the internet was going to be big, and online shopping via amazon etc would affect physical shops they were unconvinced and said the internet would not be big.

However I really do not get this, paying a lot of money for clothes that do not exist, and just virtually render on to you in photos, I can understand how a few people may think it is a good idea, but cannot see it becoming mainstream, which probably means I am one of those mid 40 year olds that were so out of touch..


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49794403


Spoiler: show
Quote:
The £7,500 dress that does not exist
By Cody Godwin
Technology of Business reporter, San Francisco
15 November 2019

Mary Ren in the digital dress bought by her husband
Earlier this year Richard Ma, the chief executive of San Francisco-based security company Quantstamp, spent $9,500 (£7,500) on a dress for his wife.
That is a lot of money for a dress, particularly when it does not exist, at least not in a physical form.
Instead it was a digital dress, designed by fashion house The Fabricant, rendered on to an image of Richard's wife, Mary Ren, which can then be used on social media.
"It's definitely very expensive, but it's also like an investment," Mr Ma says.
He explains that he and his wife don't usually buy expensive clothing, but he wanted this piece because he thinks it has long-term value.
"In 10 years time everybody will be 'wearing' digital fashion. It's a unique memento. It's a sign of the times."
Ms Ren has shared the image on her personal Facebook page, and via WeChat, but opted not to post it on a more public platform.

Another fashion house designing for the digital space is Carlings. The Scandinavian company released a digital street wear collection, starting at around £9 ($11), last October.
It "sold out" within a month.

"It sounds kinda stupid to say we 'sold out', which is theoretically impossible when you work with a digital collection because you can create as many as you want," explains Ronny Mikalsen, Carlings' brand director.
"We had set a limit on the amount of products we were going to produce to make it a bit more special.
Being digital-only allows designers to create items that can push boundaries of extravagance or possibilities.
"You wouldn't buy a white t-shirt digitally, right? Because it makes no sense showing it off. So it has to be something that you really either want to show off, or an item that you wouldn't dare to buy physically, or you couldn't afford to buy physically."


Carlings can take risks with a digital only collection
Carlings' digital collection was produced as part of a marketing campaign for their real, physical products. But the firm thinks the concept has potential - a second line of digital garments is planned for late 2019.
The Fabricant releases new, free digital clothes on its website every month, but consumers need the skills, and software, to blend the items with their own pictures.
This also means the company has to find another way to make money until digital fashion becomes more popular.

More Technology of Business
Is China gaining an edge in artificial intelligence?
How streaming could kill the games console
Would you drive a hydrogen-powered car?
On the inside of a hacking catastrophe
Why passwords don't work and what will replace them

"We make our money by servicing fashion brands and retailers with their marketing needs, selling tools, and creating content that uses that aesthetic language of digital fashion," says The Fabricant founder Kerry Murphy.
It is not entirely clear who is buying the digital garments from Carlings, or downloading clothes from The Fabricant.
Mr Mikalsen says Carlings has sold between 200-250 digital pieces, but a search to find them on Instagram only resulted in four people who independently purchased from the collection and had no involvement with the company.
However, some of the those clothes might have only been shared privately.

Some people want the perfect outfit for a particular location
Amber Jae Slooten, a co-founder and designer at The Fabricant, concedes it is mainly industry professionals, who use the CLO 3D software, that are downloading their clothes.
"But it's also just people are very curious to see what the files look like. People just want to own the thing, especially since that one dress sold for $9,500."
Marshal Cohen, chief retail analyst at market research company NPD Group, calls the emergence of digital fashion an "amazing phenomenon", but is yet to be convinced about its long-term impact.
"Do I believe it's going to be something huge and stay forever? No."
He says the technology works for people who want the perfect image. "If you don't like what you're wearing, but you love where you are, you now have the ability to transition your wardrobe, and digitally enhance the photograph to make it look like you're wearing the latest and greatest."

The digital fashion collections have been inspired by the outfits in games like Fortnite
Players of computer games have long been willing to spend money on outfits, or skins, for their in-game characters. That partly inspired The Fabricant to work in the digital space.
"The only reason we made the collection the way we did - inspired from Fortnite - was because of the whole link between buying skins and buying digital clothing," Mr Mikalsen says.
"When it comes to technology and the way people are living their lives, we have to be aware of that the world is changing."
Designers working on skins for games face extra challenges - they have to make sure it fits the story and the character.
Once the outfit is designed, which can take one try or 70, the hardest part starts according to in-games cosmetics consultant Janelle Jimenez.
The skins have to work in the game - a medium that, unlike digital fashion, often involves movements such as walking, fighting or dancing.
"For a game like League of Legends, you have to do 3D, there's sound effects, there's animations, all of these things have to come together to make the character feel like they're sort of expressing a different fantasy of themselves.
"It's less like changing clothes and more like seeing an actor playing a different role."

Buyers of digital fashion don't have to worry about taking something back if it doesn't fit
The influence of games and shifts in customer tastes gives some in the fashion industry confidence that digital clothes, in some capacity, will have long-term impact.
"Digital fashion will become an important part of every fashion business' future business model," says head of the Fashion Innovation Agency at the London College of Fashion, Matthew Drinkwater.
"It's not going to replace everything, but it will be an important part of that


Jesus. Fools and their money...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:09 pm 
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Sometimes I have moments where I think Seneca might be right and that Western society has reached the point of decadence that precipitates a fall of Rome style collapse. This is definitely one of those.

£7,500 is insane for a dress you can actually wear, let alone one that's digital only.

There are dozens if not hundreds of charities that could do with the Lion's share of that cash if you've really got nothing better to do with it*.



*Yes, all discretionary spending could be put to better use with a charity, but buying yourself a book or a regular, £30 hoodie or whatever that's non-essential isn't quite the same scale of egregious waste.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:18 pm 
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sockwithaticket wrote:
Sometimes I have moments where I think Seneca might be right and that Western society has reached the point of decadence that precipitates a fall of Rome style collapse. This is definitely one of those.

£7,500 is insane for a dress you can actually wear, let alone one that's digital only.

There are dozens if not hundreds of charities that could do with the Lion's share of that cash if you've really got nothing better to do with it*.



*Yes, all discretionary spending could be put to better use with a charity, but buying yourself a book or a regular, £30 hoodie or whatever that's non-essential isn't quite the same scale of egregious waste.


At least in physical form, it has taken a tailor many hours on skilled work to make (in theory) and expensive materials...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:18 pm 
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It will never catch on.

Sent from my Commodore 64.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:20 pm 
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sockwithaticket wrote:
Sometimes I have moments where I think Seneca might be right and that Western society has reached the point of decadence that precipitates a fall of Rome style collapse. This is definitely one of those.

£7,500 is insane for a dress you can actually wear, let alone one that's digital only.

There are dozens if not hundreds of charities that could do with the Lion's share of that cash if you've really got nothing better to do with it*.



*Yes, all discretionary spending could be put to better use with a charity, but buying yourself a book or a regular, £30 hoodie or whatever that's non-essential isn't quite the same scale of egregious waste.


Actually if you try to disregard the price, this digital dress is the opposite of waste!

No cotton/silk was grown in water-hungry fields 6k away, then spun in a factory, put onto a ship and sailed around the world and then designed & sewn in another factory before being trucked to a designer boutique with 100 000 watt lights and 3 latte machines. Rich tart gets in her Merc (with driver) and picks it up before driving home/to the shoe shop. Then getting dressed up on Saturday night, heading out in the Merc to the charity ball.....you get the picture.

Or it's designed in a couple of days on a Mac and emailed to the rich bird to post on her Bookface account.


Grrrr..MSP


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:25 pm 
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Could be a useful way of selling real clothes on line - give buyers the opportunity to see just how they would look in items that are on offer - how mix/matching etc., would work to create outfits.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:26 pm 
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I'm not sure it's just about fools and their money in the case mentioned - it's almost certainly due in part to massive egos and a certain lack of perspective that being loaded brings. For some reason I'm reminded of the Silicon Valley top brass who pay a starting price of $150,000 for a corporate head shot that may take photographer Kevin Abosch just few minutes.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:31 pm 
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Sandstorm wrote:
My 21 year old niece will be all over this. :lol:


Come on old chap, you know the rules!


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:33 pm 
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I'm old and out of touch. In my playing days that meant a foot over the line.

Nothing to fear MSP. Enjoy your age and experience.

I'm being plagued by certain individuals to go across the ruddy Atlantic again. Just so they can log up their sea miles.

Experience has taught me not to succomb. It's incredibly boring, especially with a crew who are as interesting as tadpoles.

I'm now quite a decent drummer. In the same vein, I've been asked to join a couple of local bands.

The answer is no.

Take up cookery! I've dusted the shelves to find Beck, Bertholla and Child

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mastering ... ch_Cooking

Not sure where you are but Oundle is not far away. It would be fun.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:34 pm 
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Market Square Hero wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:
My 21 year old niece will be all over this. :lol:


Come on old chap, you know the rules!

He's sensible enough to ignore them!


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:09 pm 
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Sandstorm wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:
Sometimes I have moments where I think Seneca might be right and that Western society has reached the point of decadence that precipitates a fall of Rome style collapse. This is definitely one of those.

£7,500 is insane for a dress you can actually wear, let alone one that's digital only.

There are dozens if not hundreds of charities that could do with the Lion's share of that cash if you've really got nothing better to do with it*.



*Yes, all discretionary spending could be put to better use with a charity, but buying yourself a book or a regular, £30 hoodie or whatever that's non-essential isn't quite the same scale of egregious waste.


Actually if you try to disregard the price, this digital dress is the opposite of waste!

No cotton/silk was grown in water-hungry fields 6k away, then spun in a factory, put onto a ship and sailed around the world and then designed & sewn in another factory before being trucked to a designer boutique with 100 000 watt lights and 3 latte machines. Rich tart gets in her Merc (with driver) and picks it up before driving home/to the shoe shop. Then getting dressed up on Saturday night, heading out in the Merc to the charity ball.....you get the picture.

Or it's designed in a couple of days on a Mac and emailed to the rich bird to post on her Bookface account.


Grrrr..MSP


True, but donating that money to charity would also lead to none of that happening and we'd be a little closer to more effective cancer treatments or preserving wild jaguar populations.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:37 pm 
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I'm big into virtual clothing - really helps to get more traffic to my Instagram profile.

Bought a beautiful cashmere jumper for one photo recently for only a couple of hundred quid - absolute bargain :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:45 pm 
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Nothing to see here folks. Supply and demand. Nobody died in the struggle over these scarce resources.

Move along.

Now, Quantstamp trading at 11 cents a share, vs all time high of 87 cents a share in early 2018, might want to rethink the PR attached. Hey ho. Still up from their all time low at arse end of Sept, of c.9 cents a share so let's focus on that staggering 22%+, that's a PLUS people, growth number. No room for negative Nellies on the old bitcoin rollercoaster. Long game etc.

His backers might want to give him a gentle prod with a baseball bat.

Virtually, naturally.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:46 pm 
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You wouldn't download a jacket...


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 4:05 pm 
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ZappaMan wrote:
I'm big into virtual clothing - really helps to get more traffic to my Instagram profile.

Bought a beautiful cashmere jumper for one photo recently for only a couple of hundred quid - absolute bargain :thumbup:


I've doubled the clicks on my Nazi Gold Fanbois LinkedIn profile by having my suited and booted profile pic digitally altered to double breasted with a touch more shoulder pad.

Going B&W should see anotger surge.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 4:08 pm 
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In the late 90's, I was already selling goods online with e-commerce.

I'm not really sure where your confusion comes in. This is the norm. Kids are spending fortunes on armor, add ons and weapons in Fortnite let alone what everyone else is doing.

THis is exactly why cryptocurrencies will be successful.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:21 am 
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JM2K6 wrote:
You wouldn't download a jacket...

You’ll catch your death going out in that.


I can see paying someone to digitally design a garment, and then paying a tailor to make it. In the same way that people pay an architect to design a house, and then a contractor to build it. Is this just cutting out, not so much the middleman, as the end manufacturer? If they ever actually do make the dress, it then becomes a fragile garment, that can only get torn, or get wine spilt on it, or get caught in the wheel of your sports car and decapitate you Isadora Duncan style. Dangerous things, clothes. In the digital world, this $7,500 dress will always be pristine and will never break your neck, even if it does break the bank.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:23 am 
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It’s a fad like those people who paid good money for a piece of paper saying they own a piece of the moon.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:21 am 
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msp. wrote:
In the late 90's when I had just left university I remember arguing with guys who were in their 40s who, that the internet was going to be big, and online shopping via amazon etc would affect physical shops they were unconvinced and said the internet would not be big.

However I really do not get this, paying a lot of money for clothes that do not exist, and just virtually render on to you in photos, I can understand how a few people may think it is a good idea, but cannot see it becoming mainstream, which probably means I am one of those mid 40 year olds that were so out of touch..

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49794403

Quote:
The £7,500 dress that does not exist
By Cody Godwin

Don't be caught up in the specifics. This is about commerce, not new tech or new social mores. Look at it through that lens and you'll see scammers / flimflammers on the one side and mug punters on the other.

Next step is to recall that the interaction between fools and their money has long been well understood.

There: fear not that you are out of touch.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:26 am 
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msp. wrote:
BokJock wrote:
OK Boomer
- Gen X actually..



Still count as one of Greta's dreams and childhood stealers.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:34 am 
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Anyone want to buy a bridge ?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:54 am 
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globus wrote:
I'm old and out of touch. In my playing days that meant a foot over the line.

Nothing to fear MSP. Enjoy your age and experience.

I'm being plagued by certain individuals to go across the ruddy Atlantic again. Just so they can log up their sea miles.

Experience has taught me not to succomb. It's incredibly boring, especially with a crew who are as interesting as tadpoles.

I'm now quite a decent drummer. In the same vein, I've been asked to join a couple of local bands.

The answer is no.

Take up cookery! I've dusted the shelves to find Beck, Bertholla and Child

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mastering ... ch_Cooking

Not sure where you are but Oundle is not far away. It would be fun.


just take in the majesty of it all...


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 3:03 am 
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It is not just about virtual clothing either. In China there are online businesses making huge amounts of money creating fake holiday pictures, and pictures with all kinds of expensive food, etc that people use on their social media pages to make it look like they travel the world and have a wild party life. /so if you are very good in your photoshop skills you could make a lucrative living creating these fake lifes for people through photos.
It has apparently gotten so bad that the big online portals like Taobao, etc have now banned selling these services on their platforms


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 4:44 am 
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When new businesses start up like this one, so many more are generated on the back of them.......virtual dry cleaners, virtual fabric providers, virtual seamstresses, virtual lawyers protecting virtual businesses and virtual patents........crikey.....I'd always heard that there were going to be jobs soon that no-one had heard of.....I'm becoming less cynical.......


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:00 am 
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terangi48 wrote:
When new businesses start up like this one, so many more are generated on the back of them.......virtual dry cleaners, virtual fabric providers, virtual seamstresses, virtual lawyers protecting virtual businesses and virtual patents........crikey.....I'd always heard that there were going to be jobs soon that no-one had heard of.....I'm becoming less cynical.......

Word is the vendor is already working on virtual moths to eat the clothes and thus ensure a continuing market


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:17 am 
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:lol: :lol: :lol:........wonder what a virtual moth hole would look like.....


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:03 am 
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terangi48 wrote:
When new businesses start up like this one, so many more are generated on the back of them.......virtual dry cleaners, virtual fabric providers, virtual seamstresses, virtual lawyers protecting virtual businesses and virtual patents........crikey.....I'd always heard that there were going to be jobs soon that no-one had heard of.....I'm becoming less cynical.......



Been around for yonks. https://secondlife.com/


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:12 am 
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Ready Player One actually scares me...


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:35 am 
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kiwigreg369 wrote:
Ready Player One actually scares me...


Really enjoyed that book - not seen the film yet though


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:15 pm 
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bok_viking wrote:
It is not just about virtual clothing either. In China there are online businesses making huge amounts of money creating fake holiday pictures, and pictures with all kinds of expensive food, etc that people use on their social media pages to make it look like they travel the world and have a wild party life. /so if you are very good in your photoshop skills you could make a lucrative living creating these fake lifes for people through photos.
It has apparently gotten so bad that the big online portals like Taobao, etc have now banned selling these services on their platforms

Anyone interested in this? I could hook you up for half price. Here is a sample of my work that I used on my vleisbroek status from my digital holiday in Bora-Bora.

Image

Please tell your 21 year old nieces as well. I haven't done any dress designs but I'm sure I'll manage given the right price.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:09 pm 
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Taranaki Snapper wrote:
globus wrote:
I'm old and out of touch. In my playing days that meant a foot over the line.

Nothing to fear MSP. Enjoy your age and experience.

I'm being plagued by certain individuals to go across the ruddy Atlantic again. Just so they can log up their sea miles.

Experience has taught me not to succomb. It's incredibly boring, especially with a crew who are as interesting as tadpoles.

I'm now quite a decent drummer. In the same vein, I've been asked to join a couple of local bands.

The answer is no.

Take up cookery! I've dusted the shelves to find Beck, Bertholla and Child

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mastering ... ch_Cooking

Not sure where you are but Oundle is not far away. It would be fun.


just take in the majesty of it all...


Just a bit of etiquette. When you meet Her Majesty you may say "Your Majesty". After that you can call her "Ma'am".

There are other "rules" but I intend giving a drip drip approach to this as some may be drips.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:17 pm 
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This picture of sunflowers is worth more than 80 million dollars

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