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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:20 pm 
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How the fok would that work for us plebs. They just take it off our fokon pay.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:37 pm 
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Average Joe wrote:
How the fok would that work for us plebs. They just take it off our fokon pay.

The owners would have to be asked and then take the risk .


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:44 pm 
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Corporates won't take the risk.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:52 pm 
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Average Joe wrote:
Corporates won't take the risk.

That's the thing .Most prefer to do the right thing and be honest. You dont want to mess with SARS. We all have experienced some kind of grief from them. In December they almost broke me. It was like they had dried out all the other tits and it was my turn to feel the pain. O suspect they were looking for money to pay their bonuses. And we think to ourselves. WTF. The ANC is so corrupt and we are feeding them


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:04 pm 
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Sards wrote:
Average Joe wrote:
Corporates won't take the risk.

That's the thing .Most prefer to do the right thing and be honest. You dont want to mess with SARS. We all have experienced some kind of grief from them. In December they almost broke me. It was like they had dried out all the other tits and it was my turn to feel the pain. O suspect they were looking for money to pay their bonuses. And we think to ourselves. WTF. The ANC is so corrupt and we are feeding them


You can be thankful you have VAT inputs. They molested me without da vaseline.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:25 pm 
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sorCrer wrote:
Sards wrote:
Average Joe wrote:
Corporates won't take the risk.

That's the thing .Most prefer to do the right thing and be honest. You dont want to mess with SARS. We all have experienced some kind of grief from them. In December they almost broke me. It was like they had dried out all the other tits and it was my turn to feel the pain. O suspect they were looking for money to pay their bonuses. And we think to ourselves. WTF. The ANC is so corrupt and we are feeding them


You can be thankful you have VAT inputs. They molested me without da vaseline.

Ours was penalties from when we first started the business and had fokol clue. Threatened to shut us down if we didn't come up with a big chunk. Now bullets were flying around and we were under heavy air attacks with silly season and that was the last thing we had on our minds. To contest that is. Especially with the threat. They literally had us by the balls. Pricks


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:47 pm 
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Sards wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Sards wrote:
Average Joe wrote:
Corporates won't take the risk.

That's the thing .Most prefer to do the right thing and be honest. You dont want to mess with SARS. We all have experienced some kind of grief from them. In December they almost broke me. It was like they had dried out all the other tits and it was my turn to feel the pain. O suspect they were looking for money to pay their bonuses. And we think to ourselves. WTF. The ANC is so corrupt and we are feeding them


You can be thankful you have VAT inputs. They molested me without da vaseline.

Ours was penalties from when we first started the business and had fokol clue. Threatened to shut us down if we didn't come up with a big chunk. Now bullets were flying around and we were under heavy air attacks with silly season and that was the last thing we had on our minds. To contest that is. Especially with the threat. They literally had us by the balls. Pricks


They can't threaten to shut you down. They will debit the money straight off your account without asking.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:58 pm 
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What would happen if everyone take an unpaid leave day on a specific day. Sure they will feel it.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:00 pm 
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Bloutoria wrote:
What would happen if everyone take an unpaid leave day on a specific day. Sure they will feel it.


The economy would feel it first. In a tax boycott normally you would still pay tax but have it collected by a non-government trusted body. The idea being that the taxes are paid over once the issue is resolved.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 pm 
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The thing with SARS is that as soon as you put up a fight they fukken nail you.
I was due a smallish refund from when I was in Zambia. It took fukken ages for them to pay me R8000. When I complained they smashed me with an audit. I waited 7 months for my refund and got it. But SARA were total wankers about it.
Having said that. Last year I received very nice moolah back. Hassle free.
Let's see what happens this year.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:24 pm 
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sorCrer wrote:
Sards wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Sards wrote:
Average Joe wrote:
Corporates won't take the risk.

That's the thing .Most prefer to do the right thing and be honest. You dont want to mess with SARS. We all have experienced some kind of grief from them. In December they almost broke me. It was like they had dried out all the other tits and it was my turn to feel the pain. O suspect they were looking for money to pay their bonuses. And we think to ourselves. WTF. The ANC is so corrupt and we are feeding them


You can be thankful you have VAT inputs. They molested me without da vaseline.

Ours was penalties from when we first started the business and had fokol clue. Threatened to shut us down if we didn't come up with a big chunk. Now bullets were flying around and we were under heavy air attacks with silly season and that was the last thing we had on our minds. To contest that is. Especially with the threat. They literally had us by the balls. Pricks


They can't threaten to shut you down. They will debit the money straight off your account without asking.

It's the same thing. I am sure the bastards have a link in to when you get a Retirement annuity payout. A small one my mother had taken out for me matured. It was heartbreaking to see the money come in and disappear the next day. Next thing they were looking at our company.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:26 am 
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http://politicsweb.co.za/documents/we-believe-race-is-a-proxy-for-disadvantage--mmusi

Constantly flipping off your base. Bold move.
Mmusi the pussy is the Theresa May of SA politics.
Will the DA merge into the ANC, NNP style after they face plant in May?


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:21 pm 
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Killface wrote:
http://politicsweb.co.za/documents/we-believe-race-is-a-proxy-for-disadvantage--mmusi

Constantly flipping off your base. Bold move.
Mmusi the pussy is the Theresa May of SA politics.
Will the DA merge into the ANC, NNP style after they face plant in May?


Care to elaborate on you position? Flipping of his election base?


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:34 pm 
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hey saffas - when will BEE end ? never ?
or is there in theory some date in the future when blacks will no longer be oppressed and suffering by the Evil Honky ?

apartheid was in for what, 40 years, so surely BEE is halfway through by now ?


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:55 pm 
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backrow wrote:
hey saffas - when will BEE end ? never ?
or is there in theory some date in the future when blacks will no longer be oppressed and suffering by the Evil Honky ?

apartheid was in for what, 40 years, so surely BEE is halfway through by now ?


I guess when our Gini coefficient evens out.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:17 pm 
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DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:
http://politicsweb.co.za/documents/we-believe-race-is-a-proxy-for-disadvantage--mmusi

Constantly flipping off your base. Bold move.
Mmusi the pussy is the Theresa May of SA politics.
Will the DA merge into the ANC, NNP style after they face plant in May?


Care to elaborate on you position? Flipping of his election base?


That’s what he thinks. The reality is that the base won’t flip, it will disperse.
He has fully committed to ANC lite + SJW rhetoric chasing black voters.
You can’t beat the ANC (and EFF) at making fanciful promises so that’s a bad gambit.
What you can see in comments sections and even on this thread is that those who were once fooled by PFP/DP/DA promises of “a South Africa for all South Africans” are leaving the sinking DA in droves now that Mmusi has given the game away. Minority votes have always been taken for granted and they will foot the bill for social programs that discriminate against them in perpetuity. When will “redress policies” end? x(

Took them long enough, but then again it’s not like the smaller parties have their acts together and the DA have always been better at shitting on those smaller than being an effective opposition party. In a proportional representation system no valid votes for parties that make it into parliament are wasted, regardless of what the DA radio ads claim every election season...
They’ve been shit in opposition and it’s time for someone with policies that actually oppose the ANC to take over leadership of the opposition coalition (which will hopefully be more ideologically diverse this time round).


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:22 pm 
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DraadkarD wrote:
backrow wrote:
hey saffas - when will BEE end ? never ?
or is there in theory some date in the future when blacks will no longer be oppressed and suffering by the Evil Honky ?

apartheid was in for what, 40 years, so surely BEE is halfway through by now ?


I guess when our Gini coefficient evens out.


https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/south- ... I.POV.GINI

lolz, Blacks & BEE are pushing it toward 100, not zero
not a huge amount of change though tbf


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:42 pm 
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DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:
http://politicsweb.co.za/documents/we-believe-race-is-a-proxy-for-disadvantage--mmusi

Constantly flipping off your base. Bold move.
Mmusi the pussy is the Theresa May of SA politics.
Will the DA merge into the ANC, NNP style after they face plant in May?


Care to elaborate on you position? Flipping of his election base?

The point is that the DA has a choice: either stay as a minority party looking after the narrow interests of the whites, or look to appeal to other sections of the population.

BEE is an incentive to try to broaden access to economic power for the black majority. It's not perfect and should probably be reformed, but it's in nobody's interests to continue to have the perception that the whites still run the country.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:40 pm 
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backrow wrote:
hey saffas - when will BEE end ? never ?
or is there in theory some date in the future when blacks will no longer be oppressed and suffering by the Evil Honky ?

apartheid was in for what, 40 years, so surely BEE is halfway through by now ?


It won't end. It's a good distraction from rampant corruption and nepotism that inflicts almost every country in Africa.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:29 pm 
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Killface wrote:

When will “redress policies” end? x(


Look, I am feel that it's unfair to use race as a criteria for employment policy, however, South Africa is different. Apartheid had a significant impact on socio-economic circumstances of especially black families in the country. Do you think it is fair to start on a blank slate and just say: "okay guys we are all equal now, so no excuses for being prosperous"?

The thing that enraged me the most is that the ANC government has wasted billions in corruption and wasteful expenditure, and tend to blame economic issues on a staunch Capitalist like me. However, if the DA says that it supports policy to see that we can ensure that equality is reach, I don't see how anyone can have a problem. The true injustice will be if racial BEE policies are imposed in a society where there is no racism in company employment, and I can ensure you that there are still a lot of white owned companies that employ lesser qualified whites in place of a better qualified "BEE" candidate. End that, and you end BEE policy.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:34 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
The point is that the DA has a choice: either stay as a minority party looking after the narrow interests of the whites, or look to appeal to other sections of the population.



I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:43 pm 
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DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:

When will “redress policies” end? x(


Look, I am feel that it's unfair to use race as a criteria for employment policy, however, South Africa is different. Apartheid had a significant impact on socio-economic circumstances of especially black families in the country. Do you think it is fair to start on a blank slate and just say: "okay guys we are all equal now, so no excuses for being prosperous"?

The thing that enraged me the most is that the ANC government has wasted billions in corruption and wasteful expenditure, and tend to blame economic issues on a staunch Capitalist like me. However, if the DA says that it supports policy to see that we can ensure that equality is reach, I don't see how anyone can have a problem. The true injustice will be if racial BEE policies are imposed in a society where there is no racism in company employment, and I can ensure you that there are still a lot of white owned companies that employ lesser qualified whites in place of a better qualified "BEE" candidate. End that, and you end BEE policy.


You reckon companies can get away with employing whites...please explain how so that when the next inspection takes place I can justify it.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:09 pm 
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Sards wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:

When will “redress policies” end? x(


Look, I am feel that it's unfair to use race as a criteria for employment policy, however, South Africa is different. Apartheid had a significant impact on socio-economic circumstances of especially black families in the country. Do you think it is fair to start on a blank slate and just say: "okay guys we are all equal now, so no excuses for being prosperous"?

The thing that enraged me the most is that the ANC government has wasted billions in corruption and wasteful expenditure, and tend to blame economic issues on a staunch Capitalist like me. However, if the DA says that it supports policy to see that we can ensure that equality is reach, I don't see how anyone can have a problem. The true injustice will be if racial BEE policies are imposed in a society where there is no racism in company employment, and I can ensure you that there are still a lot of white owned companies that employ lesser qualified whites in place of a better qualified "BEE" candidate. End that, and you end BEE policy.


You reckon companies can get away with employing whites...please explain how so that when the next inspection takes place I can justify it.

Sards, it's not compulsory to be BEE compliant.

I do work with a few companies which are white owned and largely staffed by white management and supervisors.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:08 pm 
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DraadkarD wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
The point is that the DA has a choice: either stay as a minority party looking after the narrow interests of the whites, or look to appeal to other sections of the population.



I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.


I'm saying that they need to appeal to beyond their base if they want to challenge the ANC.

Maimane is doing the right thing.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:40 am 
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What a lot of companies is struggling with imo: It's tough enough to be profitable. Being profitable with a workforce that is not as efficient as possible is looking for trouble.

People in general aren't as hard working as a few years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:46 am 
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Sards wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:

When will “redress policies” end? x(


Look, I am feel that it's unfair to use race as a criteria for employment policy, however, South Africa is different. Apartheid had a significant impact on socio-economic circumstances of especially black families in the country. Do you think it is fair to start on a blank slate and just say: "okay guys we are all equal now, so no excuses for being prosperous"?

The thing that enraged me the most is that the ANC government has wasted billions in corruption and wasteful expenditure, and tend to blame economic issues on a staunch Capitalist like me. However, if the DA says that it supports policy to see that we can ensure that equality is reach, I don't see how anyone can have a problem. The true injustice will be if racial BEE policies are imposed in a society where there is no racism in company employment, and I can ensure you that there are still a lot of white owned companies that employ lesser qualified whites in place of a better qualified "BEE" candidate. End that, and you end BEE policy.


You reckon companies can get away with employing whites...please explain how so that when the next inspection takes place I can justify it.


Sards, I'm just talking out of certain cases I observed in Bloemfontien and Pretoria. People see BEE just as a target, and not as way to diversify the workforce and actually getting new fresh expertise in. Admin department are usually the slowest to transform in certain companies.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:00 am 
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DraadkarD wrote:
Sards wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
Killface wrote:

When will “redress policies” end? x(


Look, I am feel that it's unfair to use race as a criteria for employment policy, however, South Africa is different. Apartheid had a significant impact on socio-economic circumstances of especially black families in the country. Do you think it is fair to start on a blank slate and just say: "okay guys we are all equal now, so no excuses for being prosperous"?

The thing that enraged me the most is that the ANC government has wasted billions in corruption and wasteful expenditure, and tend to blame economic issues on a staunch Capitalist like me. However, if the DA says that it supports policy to see that we can ensure that equality is reach, I don't see how anyone can have a problem. The true injustice will be if racial BEE policies are imposed in a society where there is no racism in company employment, and I can ensure you that there are still a lot of white owned companies that employ lesser qualified whites in place of a better qualified "BEE" candidate. End that, and you end BEE policy.


You reckon companies can get away with employing whites...please explain how so that when the next inspection takes place I can justify it.


Sards, I'm just talking out of certain cases I observed in Bloemfontien and Pretoria. People see BEE just as a target, and not as way to diversify the workforce and actually getting new fresh expertise in. Admin department are usually the slowest to transform in certain companies.

We are very strictly monitored.
We have yearly visits to determine demographics and nationalities of our workers as well as skills assesment visits where they look at the job descriptions . We are BEE compliant and have to be in order for our agents to be able to tender on projects. White staff are definitely in a huge minority...

I do think that manufacturing is looked at in a different fashion. Our workers are definitely a lot better paid that other industries. They also get contributions from the company towards a Provident fund as well as 5 weeks leave if there service is over 5 years. As well as a guaranteed bonus at year end and yearly increases.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:03 am 
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handyman wrote:
What a lot of companies is struggling with imo: It's tough enough to be profitable. Being profitable with a workforce that is not as efficient as possible is looking for trouble.

People in general aren't as hard working as a few years ago.


Ok. We've changed direction again.

I'll agree that encouraging the hiring of black people (or 'previously disadvantaged' , if you like) will mean that you are not necessarily hiring the best people for the job. Particularly twenty years ago when access to the white education structures were illegal.

I'm not sure where you get the figures for the generalisation about people not working as hard as a few years ago; I don't see that. But I suppose most of the people I come into contact with through work are white.

Anyway, bottom line is that BEE is mostly a shambles and has been poorly implemented, but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.

And, in my personal experience, most whites are savvy enough to keep making a living.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:05 am 
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Rinkals wrote:

Anyway, bottom line is that BEE is mostly a shambles and has been poorly implemented, but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.

.


What what what...are you fu cked in the head.......

Why should one demographic be punished for having a dominant nature....dude you need to rethink your attitude.

Surely what you mean to say is that the free ( in terms of the recipients but not in terms of the taxpayers ) education should address the issue in its natural course.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:08 am 
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DraadkarD wrote:
I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.

Freestate has always had a lot of vote splitting between FF+ and DA. In a national election the ANC always wins, so voting for an opposition party is purely a choice based on principles. The DA are now running on a BEE ticket, something that is a failure. When nearly the entire DA was built on opposing BEE, which is the position that made it the official opposition.

The DA are going to get hammered this election. If you quite like BEE and racial discrimination against minorities, you can pick other parties that do it better. If you don't like that, you're at a minimum going to be thinking about not voting for them. The DA position doesn't make sense, if they don't sort themselves out soon the ANC will be the least of their worries.

The most interesting thing about this election is if and how much the DA lose. Maybe the second most interesting thing is how much and if the EFF and FF+ gain.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:10 am 
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ox wagon wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.

Freestate has always had a lot of vote splitting between FF+ and DA. In a national election the ANC always wins, so voting for an opposition party is purely a choice based on principles. The DA are now running on a BEE ticket, something that is a failure. When nearly the entire DA was built on opposing BEE, which is the position that made it the official opposition.

The DA are going to get hammered this election. If you quite like BEE and racial discrimination against minorities, you can pick other parties that do it better. If you don't like that, you're at a minimum going to be thinking about not voting for them. The DA position doesn't make sense, if they don't sort themselves out soon the ANC will be the least of their worries.

The most interesting thing about this election is if and how much the DA lose. Maybe the second most interesting thing is how much and if the EFF and FF+ gain.


I have long decided that the DA has completely lost the plot and like very much the way that Cope is becoming a very diversified and sensible party.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:14 am 
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Sards wrote:
ox wagon wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.

Freestate has always had a lot of vote splitting between FF+ and DA. In a national election the ANC always wins, so voting for an opposition party is purely a choice based on principles. The DA are now running on a BEE ticket, something that is a failure. When nearly the entire DA was built on opposing BEE, which is the position that made it the official opposition.

The DA are going to get hammered this election. If you quite like BEE and racial discrimination against minorities, you can pick other parties that do it better. If you don't like that, you're at a minimum going to be thinking about not voting for them. The DA position doesn't make sense, if they don't sort themselves out soon the ANC will be the least of their worries.

The most interesting thing about this election is if and how much the DA lose. Maybe the second most interesting thing is how much and if the EFF and FF+ gain.


I have long decided that the DA has completely lost the plot and like very much the way that Cope is becoming a very diversified and sensible party.

This will be the first election in which I will not be voting for the DA in it's various guises.
Will more than likely vote for COPE.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:15 am 
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Sards wrote:
Rinkals wrote:

Anyway, bottom line is that BEE is mostly a shambles and has been poorly implemented, but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.

.


What what what...are you fu cked in the head.......

Why should one demographic be punished for having a dominant nature....dude you need to rethink your attitude.

Surely what you mean to say is that the free ( in terms of the recipients but not in terms of the taxpayers ) education should address the issue in its natural course.


What on earth are you talking about?

Who mentioned free education? I was alluding to the fact that the white education structures consumed the bulk of resources (certainly per capita) and the black education structures were inferior, and this only in passing to suggest that BEE twenty years ago would have been more of a problem to implement twenty years ago. It has very little to do with my argument.

Surely you can see that it's not beneficial to have the economic power of the country concentrated in white hands?

On free tertiary education, I would like to see Primary and Secondary education improved to the point where tertiary students aren't completely out of their depth first.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:16 am 
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Sards wrote:
I have long decided that the DA has completely lost the plot and like very much the way that Cope is becoming a very diversified and sensible party.

Apart from the fact the leader of Cope was in cabinet when all the BEE policies, cadre deployment, etc were made and put into force in the late 90s and early 00s. The outcome of which we've seen fully decades after.

Lekota is a cunning operator. He knew Cope were almost dead, he also knew the DA were struggling. So he made some speeches opposing the ANC more strongly than the DA. And now he's certain to be returned back to parliament, and continue his ride on the gravy train collecting a salary. If he hadn't of done that, Cope may have gone extinct and his salary along with it.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:21 am 
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Rinkals wrote:
Sards wrote:
Rinkals wrote:

Anyway, bottom line is that BEE is mostly a shambles and has been poorly implemented, but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.

.


What what what...are you fu cked in the head.......

Why should one demographic be punished for having a dominant nature....dude you need to rethink your attitude.

Surely what you mean to say is that the free ( in terms of the recipients but not in terms of the taxpayers ) education should address the issue in its natural course.


What on earth are you talking about?

Who mentioned free education? I was alluding to the fact that the white education structures consumed the bulk of resources (certainly per capita) and the black education structures were inferior, and this only in passing to suggest that BEE twenty years ago would have been more of a problem to implement twenty years ago. It has very little to do with my argument.

Surely you can see that it's not beneficial to have the economic power of the country concentrated in white hands?

On free tertiary education, I would like to see Primary and Secondary education improved to the point where tertiary students aren't completely out of their depth first.


Dude....you need to rethink your logic....What you are saying is that if one demographic has the ability to rise above another demographic to create employment they need to be suppressed and another demographic allowed to take over even though they are not driven or as capable as the more dominant demographic....that is fu cking insanity son.....


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:24 am 
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ox wagon wrote:
Sards wrote:
I have long decided that the DA has completely lost the plot and like very much the way that Cope is becoming a very diversified and sensible party.

Apart from the fact the leader of Cope was in cabinet when all the BEE policies, cadre deployment, etc were made and put into force in the late 90s and early 00s. The outcome of which we've seen fully decades after.

Lekota is a cunning operator. He knew Cope were almost dead, he also knew the DA were struggling. So he made some speeches opposing the ANC more strongly than the DA. And now he's certain to be returned back to parliament, and continue his ride on the gravy train collecting a salary. If he hadn't of done that, Cope may have gone extinct and his salary along with it.


He has worked friggin hard and is making all the right noises and his policies are fair for all. He has also gone about installing representatives based on acumen rather than racist policies. I am very impressed with how he has taken a flailing ship and made it attractive to voters. His drive and passion deserves the reward it reaps....the DA is lost .......


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:43 am 
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Here's the problem with BEE. You’re telling everyone that Mr. Ramaphosa or any high earning black persons children is at a disadvantage because of the color of their skin. Try and explain that to little Koosie who lives in a tent with his parents in a white informal settlement in Pretoria North or the Peterson’s who live in a shack in Mamelodi.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:54 am 
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Sards wrote:
ox wagon wrote:
DraadkarD wrote:
I don't see it that way. I know they are loosing Afriform fluffers, but in a conservative city like Bloemfontein, people still will vote DA due to issues like service delivery, red tape and economic development are more important than supporting some transformation policies.

Freestate has always had a lot of vote splitting between FF+ and DA. In a national election the ANC always wins, so voting for an opposition party is purely a choice based on principles. The DA are now running on a BEE ticket, something that is a failure. When nearly the entire DA was built on opposing BEE, which is the position that made it the official opposition.

The DA are going to get hammered this election. If you quite like BEE and racial discrimination against minorities, you can pick other parties that do it better. If you don't like that, you're at a minimum going to be thinking about not voting for them. The DA position doesn't make sense, if they don't sort themselves out soon the ANC will be the least of their worries.

The most interesting thing about this election is if and how much the DA lose. Maybe the second most interesting thing is how much and if the EFF and FF+ gain.


I have long decided that the DA has completely lost the plot and like very much the way that Cope is becoming a very diversified and sensible party.

Yes, Cope have probably done it the right way, originating from the struggle side rather than being derived from what are perceived (by the black population) as part of the Apartheid. (You and I know that the DA are descended from the PFP and Helen Suzman, but the average voter doesn't see it that way, particularly when they have been joined by former Nats, a point that the ANC has not been shy to push).

Ox, I respect your views and I'm aware that you are interested in the political undercurrents, but I feel that the DA has gone as far as it can in terms of appealing to the white electorate. If it needs to expand it's base beyond what it had in 2016, it has to appeal to black voters.

Unfortunately, it has suffered a lot of infighting and the de Lille affair has damaged the party.

Like you, I fear that the DA will lose ground in May, but whether this will be due to the internal struggles on these matters or to their support of BEE will probably never be known.

I hope both of us are wrong and the DA consolidates and improves it's support in May.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:55 am 
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Sards wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Sards wrote:
Rinkals wrote:

Anyway, bottom line is that BEE is mostly a shambles and has been poorly implemented, but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.

.


What what what...are you fu cked in the head.......

Why should one demographic be punished for having a dominant nature....dude you need to rethink your attitude.

Surely what you mean to say is that the free ( in terms of the recipients but not in terms of the taxpayers ) education should address the issue in its natural course.


What on earth are you talking about?

Who mentioned free education? I was alluding to the fact that the white education structures consumed the bulk of resources (certainly per capita) and the black education structures were inferior, and this only in passing to suggest that BEE twenty years ago would have been more of a problem to implement twenty years ago. It has very little to do with my argument.

Surely you can see that it's not beneficial to have the economic power of the country concentrated in white hands?

On free tertiary education, I would like to see Primary and Secondary education improved to the point where tertiary students aren't completely out of their depth first.


Dude....you need to rethink your logic....What you are saying is that if one demographic has the ability to rise above another demographic to create employment they need to be suppressed and another demographic allowed to take over even though they are not driven or as capable as the more dominant demographic....that is fu cking insanity son.....


What?

That's not what I'm saying at all.


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 Post subject: Re: SA Politics thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:57 am 
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Rinkals wrote:
Sards wrote:
Rinkals wrote:

but some measures surely need to be in place to counter the dominance of whites in business.



Dude....you need to rethink your logic....What you are saying is that if one demographic has the ability to rise above another demographic to create employment they need to be suppressed and another demographic allowed to take over even though they are not driven or as capable as the more dominant demographic....that is fu cking insanity son.....


What?

That's not what I'm saying at all.


?


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