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Re: Viva Maduro!

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:47 am
by Blackrock Bullet
free_safety wrote:
julian wrote:
Glaston wrote:John McDonnell on Venezuela “I don’t think it was a socialist country”

So now we know why its a failed regime.
Of course it is not a socialist country, not even in the european sense of it. There has never been a socialist country in LATAM, none in the very pure sense of it.

Most of the time people tend to confuse populist leftist latinamerican dictatorships with mild center left european socialist. Two different animals.

Venezuela is the first case, a very very rich country that has been governed for the past decade by some mad thieves, they have been doing socialism in benefit of their own pockets.

:thumbup: :thumbup:
Venezuela's problems are due to Zimbabwe type mismanagement NOT socialism
Please, we had a decade of the Left holding up Venezuala as all that was right with the world. They need to take their medicine on this one.

Re: Viva Maduro!

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:07 am
by malky
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
free_safety wrote:
julian wrote:
Glaston wrote:John McDonnell on Venezuela “I don’t think it was a socialist country”

So now we know why its a failed regime.
Of course it is not a socialist country, not even in the european sense of it. There has never been a socialist country in LATAM, none in the very pure sense of it.

Most of the time people tend to confuse populist leftist latinamerican dictatorships with mild center left european socialist. Two different animals.

Venezuela is the first case, a very very rich country that has been governed for the past decade by some mad thieves, they have been doing socialism in benefit of their own pockets.

:thumbup: :thumbup:
Venezuela's problems are due to Zimbabwe type mismanagement NOT socialism
Please, we had a decade of the Left holding up Venezuala as all that was right with the world. They need to take their medicine on this one.
You are so right - every time a left wing 'utopia' fails there is a different excuse - why the fudge do people, particularly the younger generation, fall for it?

Re: Viva Maduro!

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:12 am
by Caley_Red
Bullettyme wrote:
free_safety wrote:
julian wrote:
Glaston wrote:John McDonnell on Venezuela “I don’t think it was a socialist country”

So now we know why its a failed regime.
Of course it is not a socialist country, not even in the european sense of it. There has never been a socialist country in LATAM, none in the very pure sense of it.

Most of the time people tend to confuse populist leftist latinamerican dictatorships with mild center left european socialist. Two different animals.

Venezuela is the first case, a very very rich country that has been governed for the past decade by some mad thieves, they have been doing socialism in benefit of their own pockets.

:thumbup: :thumbup:
Venezuela's problems are due to Zimbabwe type mismanagement NOT socialism
Be careful with that talk, it makes some people very mad.
It should because it's patently not true.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:09 am
by Mullet 2
Time for a bit of the Ronald Reagan doctrine

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:11 am
by eldanielfire
Mullet 2 wrote:Time for a bit of the Ronald Reagan doctrine

You can't resist showing your Thatcherism.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:13 am
by Mullet 2
eldanielfire wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:Time for a bit of the Ronald Reagan doctrine

You can't resist showing your Thatcherism.

Are they the same person in your head?

Hold on, I'm talking logic with a Brexit cheerleading Socialist

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:18 am
by bessantj
Bullettyme wrote:So today will be a big day in Venezuela. Big marches in support of the leader of the national assembly, Juan Guaido, who is arguing he is the legitimate leader and Maduro is an usurper. Theres been some mutinies from the military in the lead up, so let's hope that soldiers refuse to fire on protestors if ordered to. Mike Pence, to be fair to the man, spoke well in support of the marchers (although he, and the US, are complete hypocrites).

My girlfriends family plan on attending a march, she's fairly worried. Hopefully there's no violence.
Hope everyone is safe mate.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:22 am
by eldanielfire
Mullet 2 wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:Time for a bit of the Ronald Reagan doctrine

You can't resist showing your Thatcherism.

Are they the same person in your head?

Hold on, I'm talking logic with a Brexit cheerleading Socialist

I'm neither a brexit cheerleader nor a socialist.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:25 am
by Toulon's Not Toulouse
First bit of the military leaving Maduro:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPY1FFa ... e=youtu.be

But in far worse news for Maduro... He lost his verified status on Facebook and Instagram! :shock:
https://twitter.com/AndrewsAbreu/status ... 3845424128

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:26 am
by Bullettyme
bessantj wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:So today will be a big day in Venezuela. Big marches in support of the leader of the national assembly, Juan Guaido, who is arguing he is the legitimate leader and Maduro is an usurper. Theres been some mutinies from the military in the lead up, so let's hope that soldiers refuse to fire on protestors if ordered to. Mike Pence, to be fair to the man, spoke well in support of the marchers (although he, and the US, are complete hypocrites).

My girlfriends family plan on attending a march, she's fairly worried. Hopefully there's no violence.
Hope everyone is safe mate.
Cheers, all good. The missus was very stressed out all day seeing videos and photos from her family as the march in her city but it appears most marches went off without the violence of 2017. People seem to be mobilised and hopeful again.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:29 am
by Mullet 2
You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:38 am
by bessantj
Bullettyme wrote:
bessantj wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:So today will be a big day in Venezuela. Big marches in support of the leader of the national assembly, Juan Guaido, who is arguing he is the legitimate leader and Maduro is an usurper. Theres been some mutinies from the military in the lead up, so let's hope that soldiers refuse to fire on protestors if ordered to. Mike Pence, to be fair to the man, spoke well in support of the marchers (although he, and the US, are complete hypocrites).

My girlfriends family plan on attending a march, she's fairly worried. Hopefully there's no violence.
Hope everyone is safe mate.
Cheers, all good. The missus was very stressed out all day seeing videos and photos from her family as the march in her city but it appears most marches went off without the violence of 2017. People seem to be mobilised and hopeful again.
Well that's a piece of great news :thumbup:

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:45 am
by eldanielfire
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
I agree with that. You're still a lover of Thatcherism.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:10 pm
by eldanielfire

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:16 pm
by bimboman
eldanielfire wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
I agree with that. You're still a lover of Thatcherism.

Thatcherism was great.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:52 pm
by Hellraiser
malky wrote:Seems to me as if a country goes down the old socialist dreamland horseshit route several people here wet themselves.

These same tw*ts never have to suffer the consequences of socialism - when will these clowns ever learn

+1

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:55 pm
by eldanielfire
bimboman wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
I agree with that. You're still a lover of Thatcherism.

Thatcherism was great.
It wasn't. She did some things right and some things badly wrong. You only have to see how polarising she was to see how many people hated her because of her actions.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:56 pm
by Hellraiser
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism

Nutshell

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:06 pm
by Lorthern Nights
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
Probably your best post :thumbup:

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:14 pm
by Mullet 2
I have had 1000s of good posts.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:40 pm
by bimboman
eldanielfire wrote:
bimboman wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
I agree with that. You're still a lover of Thatcherism.

Thatcherism was great.
It wasn't. She did some things right and some things badly wrong. You only have to see how polarising she was to see how many people hated her because of her actions.

Facts hurt their feelings, she created modern Britain.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:41 pm
by bimboman
Lorthern Nights wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:You're right, Corbyn is more of a full blown pinko then a Socialist.

Anyway here is pattern.

Lefty comes to power - European Left Cheers
Announces massive poverty relief programme - European Left Cheers
Nationalises key industry - European Left Cheers
Thumbs his nose at the United States - European Left Cheers
Economic Activity Declines - European Left Dismisses
Inflation Rises - European Left Dismisses
Wages fall - European Left Dismisses
Poverty increases - European Left Dismisses
Elections are rigged - European Left Disputes
Protesters are killed - European Left Dismisses
Country f**ked and Left now a Dictator - - European Left Claims it was never Socialism
Probably your best post :thumbup:
It's spot on as well.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:45 pm
by julian
In my opinion put all latin american countries in the same basket is a mistake, there are enormous differences among them (educational, historical, etc.).

Having said so I don't clearly see now a way out of the current situation for Venezuela (most of the important opinionist don't also).

Venezuela has two presidents now apparently, one -Guaidó- who is the president of the legislative body backed by the US and what you can consider the center righ -mild- of latam (Brazil, Arg, Chile, etc.), and Maduro who still retain the military power and was backed yesterday by Russia, China, Mexico (!!!!) and other small latam countries. EU remains neutral at the time (I assume they have other problems with a rebel country that wants to leave).

Maduro is still in charge. Guaidó does not have more power than the hundred of thousands that rallied yesterday.

And Maduro power relies 100 % on the military that the opinion believes is backing him due to their strong involvement in non legal trafficking activies allowed by Maduro.

I truly hope this does not escalate into some kind of civil war as the way out is not easy to see right now.

Trump said yesterday that all the options are over the table, but we know at this point that his comments are simple bravados (unless he wants to divert attention from his failure with the gov shutdown+the wall).

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:51 pm
by Toulon's Not Toulouse
julian wrote:In my opinion put all latin american countries in the same basket is a mistake, there are enormous differences among them (educational, historical, etc.).

Having said so I don't clearly see now a way out of the current situation for Venezuela (most of the important opinionist don't also).

Venezuela has two presidents now apparently, one -Guaidó- who is the president of the legislative body backed by the US and what you can consider the center righ -mild- of latam (Brazil, Arg, Chile, etc.), and Maduro who still retain the military power and was backed yesterday by Russia, China, Mexico (!!!!) and other small latam countries. EU remains neutral at the time (I assume they have other problems with a rebel country that wants to leave).

Maduro is still in charge. Guaidó does not have more power than the hundred of thousands that rallied yesterday.

And Maduro power relies 100 % on the military that the opinion believes is backing him due to their strong involvement in non legal trafficking activies allowed by Maduro.

I truly hope this does not escalate into some kind of civil war as the way out is not easy to see right now.

Trump said yesterday that all the options are over the table, but we know at this point that his comments are simple bravados (unless he wants to divert attention from his failure with the gov shutdown+the wall).
Mexico isn't surprising, it was part of López Obrador's manifesto to return to the Estrada Doctrine (non-interventionism on foreign matters). It's not so much supporting the regime as letting self-determination take its course either way. Pretty sure they'll accept whoever comes out of the current conflict.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:52 pm
by Mullet 2
The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:06 pm
by julian
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
To reach that you need to take Maduro out.

And Maduro is right now backed by Russia and China . A couple of months ago Russia sent some nuclear capable jets. This is a chess game played in the backyard of the world by the two superpowers.

A cold war reminiscence.
Image

https://www.popularmechanics.com/milita ... exercises/

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:08 pm
by Bullettyme
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:11 pm
by Toulon's Not Toulouse
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.
It is. The world would better place if leaders stopped their shenanigans for a minute and just put Bimbo in charge of Brexit, Silver for Climate change and, well, Mullet for Venezuela now, I guess.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:22 pm
by Mullet 2
Russia and China don't matter a Monkey Fúck.

Whatever about Obama's cowardice and Trump's compliance in Ukraine this is very clearly in the US sphere of influence.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:26 pm
by Mullet 2
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.

Yeah more Socialism is the answer.

You people are shameless and hilarious at the same.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:39 pm
by Mullet 2
c69 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:Russia and China don't matter a Monkey Fúck.

Whatever about Obama's cowardice and Trump's compliance in Ukraine this is very clearly in the US sphere of influence.
Ah the Monroe Doctrine.

Bingo baby

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:42 pm
by paddyor
Mullet 2 wrote:Russia and China don't matter a Monkey Fúck.

Whatever about Obama's cowardice and Trump's compliance in Ukraine this is very clearly in the US sphere of influence.
Yeah and the army defections mean he's just a black hole fore their money. He's fucked up too badly already.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:43 pm
by Bullettyme
Mullet 2 wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.

Yeah more Socialism is the answer.

You people are shameless and hilarious at the same.

:yawn:

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:47 pm
by Puma
RichieRich89 wrote:It all sounds pretty terrible.

Surely time for another US-led "liberation" of another oil-rich country?
As long as the US keeps buying oil from Venezuela at market prices, they won't intervene. And Venezuela won't stop selling them since they're their only paying customer at the moment.

Both Russia and China are getting Venezuelan oil as a repay from previous loans, so no current cash income for the country fro those operations...

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:51 pm
by Mullet 2
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.

Yeah more Socialism is the answer.

You people are shameless and hilarious at the same.

:yawn:

Yeah sweet response

Your boy and his corrupt and thankfully dead mentor has turned the richest country in SA into a shithole inside 10 years.

Great political philosophy though. :lol:

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:54 pm
by Bullettyme
Alright Irish Bimboman.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:54 pm
by Nolanator
Mullet 2 wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:The way out is simple.

Put a centre right leader in charge who will immediately invite back US investment and aid. He can then start the process of rebuilding the country and attracting back the diaspora.
They had centre right people in charge for years. It lead to people voting in Chavez. It also lead to them developing the Dutch disease.

Note that I agree there should be change but it's not that black and white.

Yeah more Socialism is the answer.

You people are shameless and hilarious at the same.
it's not that black and white

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:54 pm
by Mullet 2
Puma wrote:
RichieRich89 wrote:It all sounds pretty terrible.

Surely time for another US-led "liberation" of another oil-rich country?
As long as the US keeps buying oil from Venezuela at market prices, they won't intervene. And Venezuela won't stop selling them since they're their only paying customer at the moment.

Both Russia and China are getting Venezuelan oil as a repay from previous loans, so no current cash income for the country fro those operations...
Of course they'll intervene.

If they get their boy into the Presidential Palace the oil is hardly going to dry up.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:55 pm
by bimboman
Every Britisher should take careful note of the current Labour leaderships views on Chavez and the policies of his governemnt and realise the ghost of Xmas future is closer than you think.

Re: When Socialists Go Bad - Venezuela

Posted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:58 pm
by Mullet 2
That's under Lefty fúcking classic.

When they take charge it's always black and white. Rich landowners and big Business keeping the working man down etc

After they have turned the place into a fúcking bomb site all of sudden it's complicated and the solutions aren't black and white.