Planet Rugby Forum

Biffer29 wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:

Biffer29 wrote:Looking forward to this. But then I was looking forward to Cardiff.

Long time lurker finally getting round to posting.

Welcome. (Sorry, I mean ‘fudge off noob’ )

Ta. Now I’ve been told to fudge off I can go and wind up some tattie shaggers.

It’s a rite of passage right enough.

Doc Rob wrote:FFS, the requirements for a new avatar on the bored are ridiculous. Half an hour of messing around in Paint later...

Worth it though - it'll be nice not getting you and OTOTM mixed up any more.

charltom wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:FFS, the requirements for a new avatar on the bored are ridiculous. Half an hour of messing around in Paint later...

Worth it though - it'll be nice not getting you and OTOTM mixed up any more.

I reckon Smutley still had the same pic until last week too!

Sorry guys, that was my fault just then. Thought I’d try watching live again. Turned on the TV - Scotland attacking in Ireland 22. Ireland interception try within 30 secs. Turned it off again. I am cursed.

Jonny Gray was good. Kinghorn looks more than at home at this level. Russell had a good game.

Huw Jones was pish. Which was inevitable considering the levels he's played at.

Genuinely don't see where this away win will come. Paris next year?

Just as McGeechan said, the last pass.

If Scotland keep creating those chances, their away win will come sooner rather than later.

I like haggis wrote:Jonny Gray was good. Kinghorn looks more than at home at this level. Russell had a good game.

Huw Jones was pish. Which was inevitable considering the levels he's played at.

Genuinely don't see where this away win will come. Paris next year?

Let’s start with Rome!

Win that and it’s 3 wins for us which is a pass for toonie in his first 6n

I like haggis wrote:Jonny Gray was good. Kinghorn looks more than at home at this level. Russell had a good game.

Huw Jones was pish. Which was inevitable considering the levels he's played at.

Genuinely don't see where this away win will come. Paris next year?

Rome next time out, I hope. That aside, Paris looks our best bet. TBH though, it’s uncommon for any 6N side to win consistently away from home, hence Slams are uncommon. If we can at least maintain a winning record at home for a few years, I’ll be happier than I have been in ages.

Doc Rob wrote:

I like haggis wrote:Jonny Gray was good. Kinghorn looks more than at home at this level. Russell had a good game.

Huw Jones was pish. Which was inevitable considering the levels he's played at.

Genuinely don't see where this away win will come. Paris next year?

Rome next time out, I hope. That aside, Paris looks our best bet. TBH though, it’s uncommon for any 6N side to win consistently away from home, hence Slams are uncommon. If we can at least maintain a winning record at home for a few years, I’ll be happier than I have been in ages.

Yeah it's an overblown narrative and we won't win a GrandSlam anytime soon but it's the really annoying to hear about it all the time.

Italy are pish. We should spank them as everyone else does these days.

Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

I like haggis wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:

I like haggis wrote:Jonny Gray was good. Kinghorn looks more than at home at this level. Russell had a good game.

Huw Jones was pish. Which was inevitable considering the levels he's played at.

Genuinely don't see where this away win will come. Paris next year?

Rome next time out, I hope. That aside, Paris looks our best bet. TBH though, it’s uncommon for any 6N side to win consistently away from home, hence Slams are uncommon. If we can at least maintain a winning record at home for a few years, I’ll be happier than I have been in ages.

Yeah it's an overblown narrative and we won't win a GrandSlam anytime soon but it's the really annoying to hear about it all the time.

Italy are pish. We should spank them as everyone else does these days.

Hopefully so. I’m comfortable being a mid-table side just now. It makes a nice change.

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

Final comment a bit harsh. You have to start somewhere, and we haven’t lost a 6N game at home for two years. No, we haven’t made the breakthrough to title contenders, but it was never likely we would this year at least.

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

It’s been a good tournament, beating France and England is no mean feat. I don’t think England will win in Paris, Ireland needed a last minute drop goal to beat them there

Lorthern Nights wrote:

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

It’s been a good tournament, beating France and England is no mean feat. I don’t think England will win in Paris, Ireland needed a last minute drop goal to beat them there

Winning your home games are a good tournament so far but a loss to Italy would be a bad tournament. The Wales game sours it somewhat.

Agree Kinghorn must start - he's the real deal. Didn't look like his first start - pleasingly looked dangerous on the wing and his finish was excellent.

Wouldn't play Marfo though, there's more than a case for blessed with low expectations. Reid keeping the scrum up is all we need for now until Dell is back.

Rugby2023 wrote:Just as McGeechan said, the last pass.

If Scotland keep creating those chances, their away win will come sooner rather than later.

Exactly. Three good try scoring chances blown and one dumb intercept.

Even with the intercept the match could just as easily have finished 28-29

We held our own today and the score line flattered Ireland. It’ll come.

Just had a random thought that we now have a Jones, a Taylor and a Bennett in our backs. If we can just find a Williams then we’ll basically be Wales.

Doc Rob wrote:

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

Final comment a bit harsh. You have to start somewhere, and we haven’t lost a 6N game at home for two years. No, we haven’t made the breakthrough to title contenders, but it was never likely we would this year at least.

I don't think it is.

We haven't played out best for a full game once. Yes it is good to win at home but it's not unfair to be ultimately dissapointed with the overall performance this year.

We were embarrassed by Wales and today showed decent spells were but ultimately lacking in the very basics at times and lost by 20 points. We're the only team other than Italy to give up 2 4try bonus points thus far.

Big D wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

Final comment a bit harsh. You have to start somewhere, and we haven’t lost a 6N game at home for two years. No, we haven’t made the breakthrough to title contenders, but it was never likely we would this year at least.

I don't think it is.

We haven't played out best for a full game once. Yes it is good to win at home but it's not unfair to be ultimately dissapointed with the overall performance this year.

We were embarrassed by Wales and today showed decent spells were but ultimately lacking in the very basics at times and lost by 20 points. We're the only team other than Italy to give up 2 4try bonus points thus far.

Wales gave up a 4 try by to Ireland and our performance against England was as complete as we are going to get.

Lorthern Nights wrote:

Big D wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:

Big D wrote:Not that it impacted the game I wonder what the logic is in doing the captains run at MF rather than the away ground then travelling late afternoon/evening before the game. Feels unnecessary.

On to the game, few good performances but a few poor ones. There was a real lack of impetuous in attack at times in the second half.

Bhatti or Marfo must start next week. And I'd be tempted play Kinghorn every game where form permits.

Overall we are headed to another 6N that has flattered to deceive.

Final comment a bit harsh. You have to start somewhere, and we haven’t lost a 6N game at home for two years. No, we haven’t made the breakthrough to title contenders, but it was never likely we would this year at least.

I don't think it is.

We haven't played out best for a full game once. Yes it is good to win at home but it's not unfair to be ultimately dissapointed with the overall performance this year.

We were embarrassed by Wales and today showed decent spells were but ultimately lacking in the very basics at times and lost by 20 points. We're the only team other than Italy to give up 2 4try bonus points thus far.

Wales gave up a 4 try by to Ireland and our performance against England was as complete as we are going to get.

And they haven't to anyone else. I'm talking 6N as a whole where we've leaked 2.

We were not at our absolute peak v England despite playing well it wasn't a complete performance. And there is nothing wrong with that either.

I don't see how it's unfair or harsh to be disappointed at the overall.championship performance.

Think you are being too harsh.

Cardiff was the low point as we never turned up. Today was the final pass and what could have been, Ireland were never under pressure in the second half so we will never know if we hadn’t thrown such shit passes earlier on.

I don’t think we could have done much more than the England game tbh, I don’t think you are being realistic on what we can honestly achieve

Lorthern Nights wrote:Think you are being too harsh.

Cardiff was the low point as we never turned up. Today was the final pass and what could have been, Ireland were never under pressure in the second half so we will never know if we hadn’t thrown such shit passes earlier on.

I don’t think we could have done much more than the England game tbh, I don’t think you are being realistic on what we can honestly achieve

So especially given know what we now do that England are pretty average, if we were starting the 6N again 4 wins were never achievable? It feels.like a missed opportunity.

In terms of performance v England we didn't really get into our attacking game in the second half and out line out was pretty average despite the stats saying we only lost 2 or 3. It is in our capabilities of at least coming away with a 4th try in that 2nd half.

Edit: I'm not suggesting it wasn't a good performance v England.

Geech had a sharp blazer in the studio. That's about as sharp as my analysis gets.

Steamin Beamin wrote:Geech had a sharp blazer in the studio. That's about as sharp as my analysis gets.

Agreed.

I just think it is brilliant of Toony to tell the guys to miss the last pass deliberately every time, apart from one of the ones to King Blairhorn for his first try. Now Ireland won't prepare quite so seriously for our match next autumn...

Big week ahead for Edinburgh. A win v Munster would be a massive step towards top 3. I wonder if we'll see Fagerson bench for Scotland and Nel allowed to play for Edinburgh?

It is probably a reason why Marfo won't be picked too.

Lads has Ryan Wilson got much of a history of head knocks? Just watching the match back now and he got sparked out from a very innocuous incident. It's not clear if he hit his head on anything other than Kearney's chest and there's no whiplash. Worrying for him.

7s lost to NZ and S.A. the blitzbokke game was a poor performance.

Play Russia after midnight.

Well, predictably enough there is a thread saying Huw Jones isn’t all that because he wasn’t brilliant today. On the plus side, though, quite a lot of the swarm were realtively complimentary, and nobody has yet suggested that last week was purely down to England being crap. This represents progress.

Scotland are improving. That team is light and day compared to a few years back. The problem is, everyone else is improving as well rather than obligingly waiting for us to catch up. In his post match Schmidt said that was a one score game whatever the scoreboard said. That is not entirely true as the reason Ireland are where they are, and Scotland are not, is they do not mess up chances like we did.

Progress is slow, but it is being made. It looks like the raw material is there, it is just not (yet) binding into a winning team.

While I am very disappointed with the result and pissed with the errors, I think today was always going to be a big ask against an in form Ireland chasing the championship at home.

This game and the defeat will help us improve in the long run. Realistically, we're not quite there yet but I'm encouraged that we will be soon. Thought Watson was all class, and very pleased with Kinghorn, that guy looks perfectly at home at this level, so yay for us. On the other hand, didn't think much of Gilchrist, and both Horne/Jones had a poor game, just didn't quite work for either of them today's Barnes did his best to piss me off but let us not cast too much ire in his direction, as it wasn't his fault we lost.

Oh and really can't wait for the Tom English "Scotland are sh*t, sure aren't Ireland great" bbc Scotland article in the coming days. Double yay.

Got sparked out before the game so could only watch through one eye and a hazey ringing head, but...

I thought we weren't terribly far away. Hands sticking on those final passes and a competent line-out and we're ahead or less than 5 down at the break.

Irish very good, needed to be all on to contend with tand we weren't. Still room to grow for a few of our boys, but equally they've got some good players/youth to come in to better their team. Next year home and world cup will be very interesting.

Gilchrist very poor today, dumb penalties again doesn't make up for work around the pitch. We need a solution to that line-out, if the problem is McInally same thing, we're losing too much in the set-piece. Obviously need Brown or other fit. Horne struggled as he simply got read too easily, bur still waiting on players to be fit.

Troll wrote:Got sparked out before the game so could only watch through one eye and a hazey ringing head, but...

I thought we weren't terribly far away. Hands sticking on those final passes and a competent line-out and we're ahead or less than 5 down at the break.

Irish very good, needed to be all on to contend with tand we weren't. Still room to grow for a few of our boys, but equally they've got some good players/youth to come in to better their team. Next year home and world cup will be very interesting.

Gilchrist very poor today, dumb penalties again doesn't make up for work around the pitch. We need a solution to that line-out, if the problem is McInally same thing, we're losing too much in the set-piece. Obviously need Brown or other fit. Horne struggled as he simply got read too easily, bur still waiting on players to be fit.

Gilchrist was poor today and that's 2 games in a row we've seen silly pens given away by him.

There were a few things wrong with the line out. Rambos darts were off but also we called a fair few line outs to the man marked by Toner which lead to competition in the air. That unit needs a bit of work and either Gray or Toolis brought in with the other on the bench.

7s team lost v Russia too.

Once again we were the victim of a petty, point making penalty in this game (Bhatti tackling beyond the ruck), much the same as the ones in the England and Wales matches. All for offences that have been utterly ignored for every other minute of every game in the competition. This one didn't have much of an impact but it did kill our momentum just after the try, however the others were very punishing. It still seems to me that some of the refs consider us the easy beats and are more willing to sting us like this rather than the opposition.

dargotronV.1 wrote:While I am very disappointed with the result and pissed with the errors, I think today was always going to be a big ask against an in form Ireland chasing the championship at home.

This game and the defeat will help us improve in the long run. Realistically, we're not quite there yet but I'm encouraged that we will be soon. Thought Watson was all class, and very pleased with Kinghorn, that guy looks perfectly at home at this level, so yay for us. On the other hand, didn't think much of Gilchrist, and both Horne/Jones had a poor game, just didn't quite work for either of them today's Barnes did his best to piss me off but let us not cast too much ire in his direction, as it wasn't his fault we lost.

It’s only a few years since Ireland did us 40-0 at home in pursuit of the title. We’re definitely in a different place now.

As I have been amusing myself reading old posts on this thread, I can report that we have been saying that we are getting there for at least 5-6 years. There is some tangible evidence now, but we need to address the deficiencies, starting with our defence. This used to be one of our main strengths, but now seems to be fairly porous.

BlackMac wrote:Once again we were the victim of a petty, point making penalty in this game (Bhatti tackling beyond the ruck), much the same as the ones in the England and Wales matches. All for offences that have been utterly ignored for every other minute of every game in the competition. This one didn't have much of an impact but it did kill our momentum just after the try, however the others were very punishing. It still seems to me that some of the refs consider us the easy beats and are more willing to sting us like this rather than the opposition.

Taking out beyond the ruck has been pinged in a lot of games. Look no further than Mike Brown at Murrayfield. Bhatti was blatant in what he did. Absolutely incredibly stupid. Blame him not Barnes.

The squint feed decision was pretty point making since dropped which is really annoying.

Doc Rob wrote:

dargotronV.1 wrote:While I am very disappointed with the result and pissed with the errors, I think today was always going to be a big ask against an in form Ireland chasing the championship at home.

This game and the defeat will help us improve in the long run. Realistically, we're not quite there yet but I'm encouraged that we will be soon. Thought Watson was all class, and very pleased with Kinghorn, that guy looks perfectly at home at this level, so yay for us. On the other hand, didn't think much of Gilchrist, and both Horne/Jones had a poor game, just didn't quite work for either of them today's Barnes did his best to piss me off but let us not cast too much ire in his direction, as it wasn't his fault we lost.

It’s only a few years since Ireland did us 40-0 at home in pursuit of the title. We’re definitely in a different place now.

As I have been amusing myself reading old posts on this thread, I can report that we have been saying that we are getting there for at least 5-6 years. There is some tangible evidence now, but we need to address the deficiencies, starting with our defence. This used to be one of our main strengths, but now seems to be fairly porous.

As a team we'll be perpetually getting there but never get there.

It is what it is - we're improving of course but Ireland are so well set up and England have infinite resources.

We don't have the set up to challenge. Perhaps never will either.

I like haggis wrote:

Doc Rob wrote:

dargotronV.1 wrote:While I am very disappointed with the result and pissed with the errors, I think today was always going to be a big ask against an in form Ireland chasing the championship at home.

This game and the defeat will help us improve in the long run. Realistically, we're not quite there yet but I'm encouraged that we will be soon. Thought Watson was all class, and very pleased with Kinghorn, that guy looks perfectly at home at this level, so yay for us. On the other hand, didn't think much of Gilchrist, and both Horne/Jones had a poor game, just didn't quite work for either of them today's Barnes did his best to piss me off but let us not cast too much ire in his direction, as it wasn't his fault we lost.

It’s only a few years since Ireland did us 40-0 at home in pursuit of the title. We’re definitely in a different place now.

As I have been amusing myself reading old posts on this thread, I can report that we have been saying that we are getting there for at least 5-6 years. There is some tangible evidence now, but we need to address the deficiencies, starting with our defence. This used to be one of our main strengths, but now seems to be fairly porous.

As a team we'll be perpetually getting there but never get there.

It is what it is - we're improving of course but Ireland are so well set up and England have infinite resources.

We don't have the set up to challenge. Perhaps never will either.

Perhaps. But there is a natural cycle in these things - England, France, Wales and Ireland have all had their turn at being pre-eminent over the last few years. I know that we have fewer resources, but we are building a bit of depth in most positions now, despite the two-pro-team problem. We also have decent coaches in charge at both of those teams for possibly the first time ever.

I would argue that what stops us challenging is 80% mental. 5 years ago (even 3 years in the 6N) we didn't fundamentally believe that we could win 6N games, and so we lost matches from winnable positions - over and over again. I think there was one year recently where we were ahead at the 70-minute mark in every game and lost all of them. We have now progressed to the point that we go into home games believing we will win, but we don't really believe we can win away. We go into away games with exactly the same players and we don't perform to the same standard. That's clearly a mental thing.

We may have been beaten yesterday, but we did at least appear not to be beaten prior to kick-off, and we played some good rugby. As we know, the execution wasn't there, but on another day it may be.

Edinburgh01 wrote:Scotland are improving. That team is light and day compared to a few years back. The problem is, everyone else is improving as well rather than obligingly waiting for us to catch up. In his post match Schmidt said that was a one score game whatever the scoreboard said. That is not entirely true as the reason Ireland are where they are, and Scotland are not, is they do not mess up chances like we did.

Progress is slow, but it is being made. It looks like the raw material is there, it is just not (yet) binding into a winning team.

I’m not sure others improving. If we look at the top 10 sides:

Improving/already good

NZ
Ireland
France, they have bottomed our and are on the way back imho
Scotland

Decline/below long term performance

Italy
England
Australia
South Africa
Argentina

Only one I’m not sure where they are is Wales

France are dreadful. When was the last time they even played well at home? Yesterday was so funny because of how bad France were. Maybe the Ireland game but I didn't watch it. Ireland are a joyless rugby robot these days, can't imagine many who aren't Ireland fans enjoy their style of play. Whereas France drag anything down to their level of abject sh*thousery. Are quite successful with it but wouldn't say they play well. So it wasn't a game I watched.

Wales are good and annoyingly Gatland is a very good coach. Still back us to beat them at home though.

SA can't be so bad forever. When they have their exiled back they'll be fine.