Page 51 of 55

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:33 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
Ironically, I think it was bitcoins rise to $20,000 that was it’s deathnell. That made it, ironically, worthless for its purpose, it was too unstable to be used as a transactional currency. It’s narrative was as that it was that. And I know one person who actually used bitcoin as a currency. He would change the appropriate number of euros into bitcoin and use that to buy a gram of coke on silkroad (or its successors). He used bitcoin exactly as it is suppose to be used, as a transactional currency, and didn’t hold it for more than a few minutes.

The problem with bitcoin is you can’t hold it for more than a few minutes if you intend to use it as a transactional currency. You don’t know what it will be worth in a day or a weeks time. +7%, +50%, - 10%...

The only reason to hold it is speculation. No different than tulip bulbs in the 17th century. It has no base worth, beyond what someone else will pay you for it.

As far as oher crypto-currency, I thought Etherium had a chance, but that is looking unlikely. The rest are mostly just the inventions of snake oil salesmen who have discovered a sucker niche.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:07 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
Although I think bitcoin and all crypto currencies will eventually be worth less than tulips, the technology will continue. My prediction would be that one of the companies behind one of the crypto currencies, I’ve no idea which one, will srurvive the currency going to zero, and will instead become a major listed company based on their expertise in blockchain technology.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:31 pm
by sorCrer
Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:36 pm
by Anonymous 1
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:42 pm
by bimboman
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.

Maybe not, but the desperation from some quarters to de bunk it's total history is funny.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:44 pm
by sorCrer
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:46 pm
by bimboman
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.

It will only happen when the three or four largest powers allow it to happen. You get that right ?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:47 pm
by sorCrer
https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourd ... oin-again/

Refer link to Wall Street Journal.

Hardly dead?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:48 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.
I think its first price was about 3 cents. It’s up over 100 thousand fold since then. But I’m not sure what the point is?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:51 pm
by sorCrer
bimboman wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.

Maybe not, but the desperation from some quarters to de bunk it's total history is funny.

https://www.press.uchicago.edu/ucp/book ... 14939.html

Anne Goldgar
Professor of early modern European history, King's College London.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:51 pm
by bimboman
sorCrer wrote:https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourd ... oin-again/

Refer link to Wall Street Journal.

Hardly dead?

Nothing days replacing the petrodollar like Dunoon doughnuts.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:51 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.
When you say buying into it, do you mean using it as a currency or speculating on it. It’s probably both.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:52 pm
by sorCrer
bimboman wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.

It will only happen when the three or four largest powers allow it to happen. You get that right ?
I think you completely under estimate the power of government over society.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:54 pm
by sorCrer
FairWeather_Aussie wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.
When you say buying into it, do you mean using it as a currency or speculating on it. It’s probably both.
Buying into the concept of cryptocurrency or a derivative.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:55 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
The ones using it as a currency will be holding it for a couple of minutes. The ones speculating will need to find someone to buy it a higher price. Who would they be?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:57 pm
by Anonymous 1
sorCrer wrote:https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourd ... oin-again/

Refer link to Wall Street Journal.

Hardly dead?
I'm of the opinion it's here to stay. I just think that it's value continues to plummet you will keep saying how much more it's worth now than it was way back when. Just as you have been doing for the best part of a year.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:01 pm
by bimboman
sorCrer wrote:
bimboman wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:Tulip fever never happened the way you may think it did.
And Bitcoin at around 10c to a dollar will be a winner
BTC at its current price is 10x what it was when we first started talking about it on here. A 'cryptocurrency' or derivative will replace hard currency. Despite the negativity around BTC for example, more and more of the younger generation are buying into it.

It will only happen when the three or four largest powers allow it to happen. You get that right ?
I think you completely under estimate the power of government over society.

I think that's my argument !

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:07 pm
by sorCrer
Anonymous. wrote:
sorCrer wrote:https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourd ... oin-again/

Refer link to Wall Street Journal.

Hardly dead?
I'm of the opinion it's here to stay. I just think that it's value continues to plummet you will keep saying how much more it's worth now than it was way back when. Just as you have been doing for the best part of a year.
I've been posting positively about cryptocurrencies on here since 2014. It clearly isn't worth more now then it was a year ago but it has born the brunt of a continuous onslaught from more established financial thinking (understandably) and survived thus far.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:09 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
Sorcerer,

What do you think is the value of bitcoin, other than what you believe someone will pay you more for it? Tulips are beautiful, they look great when tryin to spice up your apartment without being too unmanly about it but I fail to see what cryptocurrencies have overtulips. I mean I can’t even hold them. Some of the logo’s are nice, but not quite as nice as a lovely red and yellow arrangement of tulips.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:20 pm
by sorCrer
FairWeather_Aussie wrote:Sorcerer,

What do you think is the value of bitcoin, other than what you believe someone will pay you more for it? Tulips are beautiful, they look great when tryin to spice up your apartment without being too unmanly about it but I fail to see what cryptocurrencies have overtulips. I mean I can’t even hold them. Some of the logo’s are nice, but not quite as nice as a lovely red and yellow arrangement of tulips.
There are many things that you can't physically hold today that have value.

E.g

The Dragon Lore style of AWP is the most expensive CS:GO skin ever sold – in January 2018 it was sold for $61,052.63. Of course, it wasn’t a usual Dragon Lore, but a souvenir one with a unique set of stickers: PGL, G2 Esports, Cloud9, and Tyler “Skadoodle” Latham, who was MVP at the Boston Major 2018 and played for Cloud9, the winner of the tournament. This skin is one of a kind, there are no more of its type.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/skins.cash ... skins/amp/

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:45 pm
by FairWeather_Aussie
sorCrer wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote:Sorcerer,

What do you think is the value of bitcoin, other than what you believe someone will pay you more for it? Tulips are beautiful, they look great when tryin to spice up your apartment without being too unmanly about it but I fail to see what cryptocurrencies have overtulips. I mean I can’t even hold them. Some of the logo’s are nice, but not quite as nice as a lovely red and yellow arrangement of tulips.
There are many things that you can't physically hold today that have value.

E.g

The Dragon Lore style of AWP is the most expensive CS:GO skin ever sold – in January 2018 it was sold for $61,052.63. Of course, it wasn’t a usual Dragon Lore, but a souvenir one with a unique set of stickers: PGL, G2 Esports, Cloud9, and Tyler “Skadoodle” Latham, who was MVP at the Boston Major 2018 and played for Cloud9, the winner of the tournament. This skin is one of a kind, there are no more of its type.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/skins.cash ... skins/amp/
Well played. That made me laugh.

But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 10:48 pm
by Rumham
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:09 am
by sorCrer
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:19 am
by FairWeather_Aussie
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?
How is it a store of value?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:21 am
by FairWeather_Aussie
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?
Shouldn’t you say a speculation you think someone will pay more for in the future?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:24 am
by bimboman
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?

It's not performing as a store of value.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:40 am
by Rumham
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?
There are many, many services offering this.

But the issue is I value actual currency over this fad. So there is no store of value whatsoever.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:06 am
by UncleFB
Rumham wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?
There are many, many services offering this.

But the issue is I value actual currency over this fad. So there is no store of value whatsoever.
Hasn't it only been the arrival of the Lightning Network that has allowed real time transactions?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:29 am
by Anonymous 1
bimboman wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?

It's not performing as a store of value.
If you consider a sieve to be a store of water then you consider Bitcoin to be a store of value.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:59 am
by sewa
Burning your cash has a value, its limited and short lived. Like bitcoin

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:10 am
by sorCrer
Of course it currently isn't a store of value due to heavy speculation allied to early adoption. This may change in future.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:14 am
by sorCrer
Rumham wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Rumham wrote:
FairWeather_Aussie wrote: But as a serious question, I would like to understand what or where bitcoin holders believe its value value comes from?
Other than buying illicit goods online, wtf do you need to use it for?
Real time, borderless transactions/store of value?
There are many, many services offering this.

But the issue is I value actual currency over this fad. So there is no store of value whatsoever.
There are? I presume they use a trusted 3rd party?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:23 am
by kiwinoz
Just transferred LTC from US to my personal account. Instant. If I tried to move the equivalent in $ would take 1 to 2 days to show up in my account. Better still no third party ie a bank was needed or involved.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:23 am
by sewa
kiwinoz wrote:Just transferred LTC from US to my personal account. Instant. If I tried to move the equivalent in $ would take 1 to 2 days to show up in my account. Better still no third party ie a bank was needed or involved.
If you are the sort of person who can't budget well enough that you need this sort of urgent liquidity then maybe you aren't the financial expert we need

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:45 am
by sorCrer
sewa wrote:
kiwinoz wrote:Just transferred LTC from US to my personal account. Instant. If I tried to move the equivalent in $ would take 1 to 2 days to show up in my account. Better still no third party ie a bank was needed or involved.
If you are the sort of person who can't budget well enough that you need this sort of urgent liquidity then maybe you aren't the financial expert we need
You're taking the piss a bit now, yes? :lol:

Here, this makes pleasant viewing for a change:

https://coin360.com/

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 10:53 am
by sewa
sorCrer wrote:
sewa wrote:
kiwinoz wrote:Just transferred LTC from US to my personal account. Instant. If I tried to move the equivalent in $ would take 1 to 2 days to show up in my account. Better still no third party ie a bank was needed or involved.
If you are the sort of person who can't budget well enough that you need this sort of urgent liquidity then maybe you aren't the financial expert we need
You're taking the piss a bit now, yes? :lol:

Here, this makes pleasant viewing for a change:

https://coin360.com/
Nope, given I am an adult who can manage my finances why would I consider this a major perk? I actually keep my savings in a 30 day notice account. A bit of financial discipline is no big deal

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:00 am
by sorCrer
sewa wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
sewa wrote:
kiwinoz wrote:Just transferred LTC from US to my personal account. Instant. If I tried to move the equivalent in $ would take 1 to 2 days to show up in my account. Better still no third party ie a bank was needed or involved.
If you are the sort of person who can't budget well enough that you need this sort of urgent liquidity then maybe you aren't the financial expert we need
You're taking the piss a bit now, yes? :lol:

Here, this makes pleasant viewing for a change:

https://coin360.com/
Nope, given I am an adult who can manage my finances why would I consider this a major perk? I actually keep my savings in a 30 day notice account. A bit of financial discipline is no big deal
I'm glad you're an adult interacting with other adults on here. OOI, what are the terms of access to the notice account? Instant withdrawal?

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:06 am
by sewa
I have to inform the bank 30 days in advance if I want to remove funds. It's a great way to save, removes the temptation for impulse buying. It used to also attract higher rates of interest (sadly these are about 0%)

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:12 am
by sorCrer
sewa wrote:I have to inform the bank 30 days in advance if I want to remove funds. It's a great way to save, removes the temptation for impulse buying. It used to also attract higher rates of interest (sadly these are about 0%)
Thats nice. However, I fail to see how this mitigates needing cash in the immediate future for an emergency or other pressing expense? Transferring money between international bank accounts in South Africa is not a simple task and is costly.

Re: €100 of Bitcoin in 2010 = €70m today

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 11:25 am
by sewa
sorCrer wrote:
sewa wrote:I have to inform the bank 30 days in advance if I want to remove funds. It's a great way to save, removes the temptation for impulse buying. It used to also attract higher rates of interest (sadly these are about 0%)
Thats nice. However, I fail to see how this mitigates needing cash in the immediate future for an emergency or other pressing expense? Transferring money between international bank accounts in South Africa is not a simple task and is costly.
Well that's my core savings. I run a balance on my cash card each month and keep my credit card clear just in case. I can imagine its different in other countries ok