Chat Forum
It is currently Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:51 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1825 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 ... 46  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:00 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
bimboman wrote:
Sorry inshouldmhave said "cut that for the Grenville towers" , then I wouldn't have to read about unrelated issues in Nottingham,


Yeah right. Put it this way. K&C were expecting a lot more money to spend on their properties. However as soon as the Conservative government came in they cut the money councils were to receive. So clearly each project had less to spend on it. Including Grenfell Tower.

Unrelated Nottingham issue :lol:

Quote:
The arms-length management organisation (Nottingham version of KCTMO)said the cuts would mean “major changes” to its Secure Warm Modern programme for homes in the city.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:02 pm 
Online

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 42217
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Sorry inshouldmhave said "cut that for the Grenville towers" , then I wouldn't have to read about unrelated issues in Nottingham,


Yeah right. Put it this way. K&C were expecting a lot more money to spend on their properties. However as soon as the Conservative government came in they cut the money councils were to receive. So clearly each project had less to spend on it. Including Grenfell Tower.

Unrelated Nottingham issue :lol:

Quote:
The arms-length management organisation (Nottingham version of KCTMO)said the cuts would mean “major changes” to its Secure Warm Modern programme for homes in the city.



Looks like those cuts were 2009 under labour if related to the decent homes scheme. You and silver today for the win.?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
bimboman wrote:
Sorry inshouldmhave said "cut that for the Grenville towers" , then I wouldn't have to read about unrelated issues in Nottingham,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8287824.stm

Labour removed 150 mill in 2009.


The £150m from the entire budget they put into new homes instead. Getting back to Nottingham again that is one council and they were down £46m alone in 2011. That money wasn't going into new houses either


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:09 pm 
Online

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 42217
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Sorry inshouldmhave said "cut that for the Grenville towers" , then I wouldn't have to read about unrelated issues in Nottingham,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8287824.stm

Labour removed 150 mill in 2009.


The £150m from the entire budget they put into new homes instead. Getting back to Nottingham again that is one council and they were down £46m alone in 2011. That money wasn't going into new houses either



You know this ? Budgets run for future years. Probably removed by Labour.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Sorry inshouldmhave said "cut that for the Grenville towers" , then I wouldn't have to read about unrelated issues in Nottingham,


Yeah right. Put it this way. K&C were expecting a lot more money to spend on their properties. However as soon as the Conservative government came in they cut the money councils were to receive. So clearly each project had less to spend on it. Including Grenfell Tower.

Unrelated Nottingham issue :lol:

Quote:
The arms-length management organisation (Nottingham version of KCTMO)said the cuts would mean “major changes” to its Secure Warm Modern programme for homes in the city.



Looks like those cuts were 2009 under labour if related to the decent homes scheme. You and silver today for the win.?


That is pretty scummy bimbo. Trying to blame a scummy coalition move on Labour. Haringey council lost £50m to their budget
Quote:
The Decent Homes programme was set up by the Labour government. The coalition has said it is cutting the budget, impacting on councils across London.
Haringey Council said as a result of this the focus would now be on windows, doors, roofs and crucial health and safety works, such as rewiring.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14080660


Not forgetting another coalition move

Quote:
The affordable housing grant was cut by 60 per cent. Housing Associations were told to introduce the so-called "Affordable Rent" at up to 80 per cent of market rent, and make up the shortfall in funding to build new homes with borrowing


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 27527
Location: Chickenrunning...
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.


Are we sure they used these flammable panels to save money? Was there a more expensive, fire-proof panel rejected by the contractor on cost grounds?
Was this change of panel decision communicated to the housing association?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:29 pm 
Online

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 42217
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 13038
TheDocForgotHisLogon wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
4 year old video from France. Cladding with the same core :( :(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yQLIlIetDM

:shock: That goes from a flicker on the second floor or whatever to all 20 stories in one minute.


Nah, the film is stopped at 24sec and 1'15


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
Sandstorm wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.


Are we sure they used these flammable panels to save money? Was there a more expensive, fire-proof panel rejected by the contractor on cost grounds?
Was this change of panel decision communicated to the housing association?

The residents complained about the work that was being done on Grenfell Tower. I think it wasn't about the cladding but about all sorts of things from the quality of material to the quality of the work itself. Both things that obviously suffer when you cut costs.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:52 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER


Whether they had to reduce costs or not is kind of irrelevant as they still spent £8.6m on the tower block and did nothing to deal with the many safety issues. That was a decision they made regardless of funding. The safety issues should have been dealt with as the priority.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
theo wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER


Whether they had to reduce costs or not is kind of irrelevant as they still spent £8.6m on the tower block and did nothing to deal with the many safety issues. That was a decision they made regardless of funding. The safety issues should have been dealt with as the priority.

You are right they didn't do their job and although new kitchens and bathrooms were very important (most flat probably still had originals kitchens from 1974) having a single staircase upgrading the fire performance there should have been a major priority, but it's not fair to say they did nothing. If they had not clad the building in a flammable blanket replacing all the residents front doors with self closing fire doors would probably have been enough to contain a fire as has proved to be the case many times in the past.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
theo wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER


Whether they had to reduce costs or not is kind of irrelevant as they still spent £8.6m on the tower block and did nothing to deal with the many safety issues. That was a decision they made regardless of funding. The safety issues should have been dealt with as the priority.

I'd still like to see a breakdown of the £11.5m salary bill shown in their accounts.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
theo wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER


Whether they had to reduce costs or not is kind of irrelevant as they still spent £8.6m on the tower block and did nothing to deal with the many safety issues. That was a decision they made regardless of funding. The safety issues should have been dealt with as the priority.

I'd still like to see a breakdown of the £11.5m salary bill shown in their accounts.

That's a lot of people....


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:08 pm 
Online

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 42217
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER



Stop being silly, it's more about the ludicrous conflations back to central funding and that being directly to blame for the tragedy.

None of this denegrates the losses or suffering. But they'll have been decisions made that we learn from.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
theo wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
I'd still like to see a breakdown of the £11.5m salary bill shown in their accounts.

That's a lot of people....

OK. Got it.

y/e 31st March 16
- average no of employees = 218
- total staff costs (incl pension) = £11.5m
- average of £53k per person.......
- £1.3m on agency staff = 10%

Staff split
> 79 in housing
> 88 in technical services whatever TF that is because it seems they contract repair work out to............ Kensington And Chelsea TMO Repairs Direct Limited (nothing like open tender eh?)
> 51 in support services

Looks pretty much like the usual clusterf**k of greed and wastage that is the public sector playing at being the private sector.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
theo wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
I'd still like to see a breakdown of the £11.5m salary bill shown in their accounts.

That's a lot of people....

OK. Got it.

y/e 31st March 16
- average no of employees = 218
- total staff costs (incl pension) = £11.5m
- average of £53k per person.......
- £1.3m on agency staff = 10%

Staff split
> 79 in housing
> 88 in technical services whatever TF that is because it seems they contract repair work out to............ Kensington And Chelsea TMO Repairs Direct Limited (nothing like open tender eh?)
> 51 in support services

Looks pretty much like the usual clusterf**k of greed and wastage that is the public sector playing at being the private sector.


Yea, that looks questionable. I bet this model is replicated across the country. So much waste.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 2755
Anonymous. wrote:
Yeah right. Put it this way. K&C were expecting a lot more money to spend on their properties. However as soon as the Conservative government came in they cut the money councils were to receive. So clearly each project had less to spend on it. Including Grenfell Tower.
I appreciate that the Grenfell refurb was a couple of years back but if K&C genuinely felt strapped, you'd have thought they'd increase council tax by the the max 5% this year. They haven't, they've gone for around 2%. Looks like they feel their finances aren't too bad.
And seems to be a third less that the average for England,
Quote:
Local authority, Band D 2017-2018
Kensington & Chelsea 1,078
England excluding parishes 1,563


Last edited by dantedelew on Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:09 pm
Posts: 920
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER



Stop being silly, it's more about the ludicrous conflations back to central funding and that being directly to blame for the tragedy.

None of this denegrates the losses or suffering. But they'll have been decisions made that we learn from.


Agreed. This ill informed political name calling over budget is unedifying and distasteful.

Silver has copped a lot of flack on this thread, but he didn't stoop to these depths.

This is what happens when an example is so badly set by someone in a position of responsibility like corbyn, who entered into the political name calling guessing game on the very day of the disaster. Sadly, his followers do just that.

It's frankly disgusting.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
dantedelew wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Yeah right. Put it this way. K&C were expecting a lot more money to spend on their properties. However as soon as the Conservative government came in they cut the money councils were to receive. So clearly each project had less to spend on it. Including Grenfell Tower.
I appreciate that the Grenfell refurb was a couple of years back but if K&C genuinely felt strapped, you'd have thought they'd increase council tax by the the max 5% this year. They haven't, they've gone for around 2%. Looks like they feel their fnnaices aren't too bad.


It's a Tory council. Providing fewer services and cutting costs is part of their mantra. Increasing council tax to replace money that was taken by a Tory government is not something they were likely to do. Any plans to do so would make headlines.


Quote:
Surrey council abandons plan to raise council tax by 15%
7th of Feb


Quote:
Theresa May accused of doing 'sweetheart deal' with Tory Surrey council to stop embarrassing tax rise
8th of Feb

At Prime Minister’s Questions on Wednesday Jeremy Corbyn produced leaked texts apparently from the flagship Tory council’s leader to a central government civil servant which suggested a “memorandum of understanding” had been reached to find a “solution”.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 68831.html


Last edited by Anonymous. on Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


In fairness some of them may not have been on the Committee/Board when the decisions on the Grenfell refurb were taken.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
theo wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


In fairness some of them may not have been on the Committee/Board when the decisions on the Grenfell refurb were taken.

:lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:37 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
theo wrote:
In fairness some of them may not have been on the Committee/Board when the decisions on the Grenfell refurb were taken.

These are the acting ones and that decision was quite recent. Anyway, as "in office" board members, I think it's not unreasonable to expect them to know what key projects their business has been involved in recently. Grenfell was their flagship.

More info:

During the year £6.5m of the £10m total investment completed the refurbishment of Grenfell Tower .....although the project was delayed because two sub-contractors went into liquidation. The project has been delivered within budget.

Setting aside the usual procurement f**k ups in failing sub-contractors (how do you fail in an overheated property market....?), getting within budget despite 2 subbies crashing and running past schedule bears some scrutiny too.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:40 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
armchair pundit wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
bimboman wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Anyway my original point was KCTMO had a lot less money to "play with" than they would have originally anticipated so it's not that surprising that attempts were made to cut corners here and there.



Did they ? You have little proof of this.

Yes bimbo you are quite right. I have no proof whatsover that with £10s of millions cut off their budget they took measures to reduce costs.

Bimbo is a WINNER



Stop being silly, it's more about the ludicrous conflations back to central funding and that being directly to blame for the tragedy.

None of this denegrates the losses or suffering. But they'll have been decisions made that we learn from.


Agreed. This ill informed political name calling over budget is unedifying and distasteful.

Silver has copped a lot of flack on this thread, but he didn't stoop to these depths.

This is what happens when an example is so badly set by someone in a position of responsibility like corbyn, who entered into the political name calling guessing game on the very day of the disaster. Sadly, his followers do just that.

It's frankly disgusting.

I said you can't blame them for cutting corners when their budget was cut. It was cut by £10's of millions I might add. That's political name calling :(


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
I'm guessing we all hope they get to the bottom of this and lessons that had already been learned from previous fires are acted upon so this sort of thing does not happen again.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 9183
Location: Bucks
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?

How does a Board of that size make any decisions at all?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
Anonymous. wrote:
I'm guessing we all hope they get to the bottom of this and lessons that had already been learned from previous fires are acted upon so this sort of thing does not happen again.

One wonders how many councils up and down the UK are scurrying around trying to get their houses in order whilst trying not to attract attention to the fact that they don't have their houses in order?

I've not kept up on the news on this after day 1 so has there been any comment on the possibility of sublets? Especially illegal because if any existed, some people might simply disappear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:06 pm 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 14170
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


I thought they looked after buildings housing almost 10,000 tenants? There's a good chance they would have had quite a lot of building reps/tenants as directors. As any knob knows - director doesn't necessarily equal shareholder or someone who makes any money.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 3788
fatcat wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


I thought they looked after buildings housing almost 10,000 tenants? There's a good chance they would have had quite a lot of building reps/tenants as directors. As any knob knows - director doesn't necessarily equal shareholder or someone who makes any money.


More than half of the board are residents.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 32783
Location: Hut 8
fatcat wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
And these are the people who should be answering questions:

Board of Directors
Ms Fay Edwards BEM - Chair
Mr Tony Annis - Vice Chair
Ms Mary Benjamin
Ms Anne Duru
Mrs Maria Escudero
Mr Kush Kanodia - Vice Chair
Ms Deborah Price
Mr Brendan Tracey
Councillor Maighread Condon-Simmonds
Councillor Judith (Ed. surname missed in records)
Ms Paula Fance
Mr Jeff Zitron
Mr Simon Brissenden
Mr Peter Chapman
Mr Anthony Preiskel

Senior Management
Mr R Black
Mrs B Matthews FCMA
Ms S Jevans MCIH
Ms Y Birch

Turnover is phenomenal. Something like 110 directors and co secs since the company started. Maybe they all got enough to retire early?


I thought they looked after buildings housing almost 10,000 tenants? There's a good chance they would have had quite a lot of building reps/tenants as directors. As any knob knows - director doesn't necessarily equal shareholder or someone who makes any money.

6,900 freehold and 2,500 leasehold (the flats) but don't know the tenant numbers. 10k seems light based on those nos.

On latter point: I can't find whether all the directors are paid.

Anyway, the consequence of this is I'll be confident that the majority of turnover is from tenant directors. Possibly in part due to mobility of tenants. But it does mean
- tenant directors is a sham because they are rarely going to be there long enough to grasp the issues and get involved
- which means the rest of the board gets to do what it likes........ and we've seen where that ends up


Last edited by Torquemada 1420 on Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
I'm guessing we all hope they get to the bottom of this and lessons that had already been learned from previous fires are acted upon so this sort of thing does not happen again.

One wonders how many councils up and down the UK are scurrying around trying to get their houses in order whilst trying not to attract attention to the fact that they don't have their houses in order?

I've not kept up on the news on this after day 1 so has there been any comment on the possibility of sublets? Especially illegal because if any existed, some people might simply disappear.

Subletting is a huge problem. If for whatever reason you move out of a two bedroom flat in one of these blocks you can rent it out for more than the average weekly take home pay.

Former KCTMO employee

Quote:
There was a drive to let homes to the “most deserving”, principally those in work; and a sense that people on benefits were somehow less deserving. Many felt the council, like all councils, should have been building new homes but instead it was obsessed with the problem of subletting. As the casework grew in size and urgency, we were frequently drawn away from it to go out door-knocking, checking residents’ ID and asking intrusive questions about their incomes and home lives.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... wer-blocks


Councils that do not have that kind of cladding will all have already leafleted their tenants and updated their websites with the information. If a council has made no statement then assume the worst


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 38148
As someone who works in the construction industry, I am shocked that this could happen.

Even if the Architect/Project Manager f**ked up on the spec,both Main Contractor and sub contractor would have known what they were putting up wasn't fire rated, and, in my experience, both would have looked for very specifically worded letters of comfort to ensure that their arses were well and truly covered. Even pointing out the fire rating at a site meeting would have had both the civil/structural and services engineers doing a bit of digging and privately ringing the Architect to warn him he had f**ked up, followed up in writing if the advice was ignored.
I really don't understand how this could happen in any project with a professional design team.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:15 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 20060
"Jesus Christ"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-4033242 ... -the-blaze


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Posts: 31785
Location: Planet Rock
camroc1 wrote:
As someone who works in the construction industry, I am shocked that this could happen.

Even if the Architect/Project Manager f**ked up on the spec,both Main Contractor and sub contractor would have known what they were putting up wasn't fire rated, and, in my experience, both would have looked for very specifically worded letters of comfort to ensure that their arses were well and truly covered. Even pointing out the fire rating at a site meeting would have had both the civil/structural and services engineers doing a bit of digging and privately ringing the Architect to warn him he had f**ked up, followed up in writing if the advice was ignored.
I really don't understand how this could happen in any project with a professional design team.

Apparently they would just feed the crushed razer blades to the children


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 8305
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cft52h89roU&sns=em


Shame on those posters that voted Tory, quite frankly .


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:44 pm
Posts: 43735
Location: Fighting political correctness with "banter"
Panorama now :(


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Posts: 11815
Location: The centre of The Horrendous Space Kablooie!
theo wrote:


You know it's bad when firemen react that way.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1825 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31 ... 46  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: A5D5E5, Bert, bimboman, Bing [Bot], Bogbunny, bonzo, Brumby_in_Vic, earl the beaver, farmerdave, fatcat, fraz, Google Adsense [Bot], henry, iarmhiman, I like haggis, kerrandy, le chat, Leinsterman, Lobby, Mick Mannock, mileendmikey, mr bungle, Nabberuk, Nolanator, obelixtim, Rinkals, Rumham, Saint, Short Man Syndrome, sonic_attack, spookly, The Native, topofthemoon, unseenwork, WoodlandsRFC, Yer Man, zt1903 and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group