Planet Rugby Forum

I agree that that sense of English condescension was right for the era of 1990 - 2003 but the humiliating RWC has eliminated any effect of English attempts at that for the next few years at least.

iarmhiman wrote:I agree that that sense of English condescension was right for the era of 1990 - 2003 but the humiliating RWC has eliminated any effect of English attempts at that for the next few years at least.

An elimination for which all right thinking England supporters are still thankful.

My flat cap was itchy anyway.

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

Is eldaniel English or is he plastic English (welsh)?

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

Rankings are largely a measure of depth. You don't win any awards, and certainly no trophies, for where you are ranked.

Jeff the Bear wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

Rankings are largely a measure of depth. You don't win any awards, and certainly no trophies, for where you are ranked.

Rankings are a measure of victories.
Ireland have beaten every team in the top 5 in the last 2 years.
We have either won or been 2nd in the 6N for the last 4 years.
Perhaps these things matter more than depth.

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

How many fans care if their team is 3rd in the rankings and another is 6th or whatever? Has any team ever released a DVD celebrating their world ranking? Has anyone ever stated "We didn't win the 6 Nations but at least we are ranked 3rd?" There's no silverware for rankings mate.

Floppykid wrote:Is eldaniel English or is he plastic English (welsh)?

He's a pain in the hole.

Jeff the Bear wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

Rankings are largely a measure of depth. You don't win any awards, and certainly no trophies, for where you are ranked.

Won a 6N more recently than you....

eldanielfire wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

How many fans care if their team is 3rd in the rankings and another is 6th or whatever? Has any team ever released a DVD celebrating their world ranking? Has anyone ever stated "We didn't win the 6 Nations but at least we are ranked 3rd?" There's no silverware for rankings mate.

It's still a measure of achievement - I think most supporters want their team to be high in the rankings

ovalball wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

How many fans care if their team is 3rd in the rankings and another is 6th or whatever? Has any team ever released a DVD celebrating their world ranking? Has anyone ever stated "We didn't win the 6 Nations but at least we are ranked 3rd?" There's no silverware for rankings mate.

It's still a measure of achievement - I think most supporters want their team to be high in the rankings

Oh, no doubt.

But third in the world or a Grand Slam?

Third in the world or a 6 Nations?

Jesus, third in the world or a RWC semi-final appearance?

ovalball wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

How many fans care if their team is 3rd in the rankings and another is 6th or whatever? Has any team ever released a DVD celebrating their world ranking? Has anyone ever stated "We didn't win the 6 Nations but at least we are ranked 3rd?" There's no silverware for rankings mate.

It's still a measure of achievement - I think most supporters want their team to be high in the rankings

I'm sure they do, if asked. But it's utterly irrelevant. No fan has ever said "I'm coming to watch hoping my country moves from 8th to 5th this season". Nobody watches rugby to see the movement in rankings. People do watch rugby to see their team win trophies.

It's quite hard to win trophies without winning games, and winning games is what increases your ranking, so this is very much in distinction-without-a-difference territory for me

Trostan wrote:

Jeff the Bear wrote:

Trostan wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

MrDominator wrote:The Welsh meltdown when the Scots officially overtake them is going to be a sight to behold.

They still quiver with rage about the Irish becoming better than them, and that happened about fifteen years ago.

Wales have won more 6 Nations and Grand Slams then Ireland in the past 15 years

Indeed it is difficult to understand how Ireland have remain ranked above Wales in World Rugby for years and how they are currently third in the world and 6 ranking points ahead of Wales in 7th.
How can this have happened?
Surely shome mistake?

Rankings are largely a measure of depth. You don't win any awards, and certainly no trophies, for where you are ranked.

Rankings are a measure of victories.
Ireland have beaten every team in the top 5 in the last 2 years.
We have either won or been 2nd in the 6N for the last 4 years.
Perhaps these things matter more than depth.

But depth, philosophically, is more important. If you win, but have no depth... that means your victories are superficial. It's better to lose all your games all season but have depth, than no wait that's not..

Chuckles1188 wrote:It's quite hard to win trophies without winning games, and winning games is what increases your ranking, so this is very much in distinction-without-a-difference territory for me

Chuckles1188 wrote:It's quite hard to win trophies without winning games, and winning games is what increases your ranking, so this is very much in distinction-without-a-difference territory for me

Absolutely, would rather do both, eg be 6nations champions and high in the rankings, it's not mutually exclusive.

When Wales got to the /f's their ranking stayed still. So basically who gives a flying

Frodder wrote:When Wales got to the /f's their ranking stayed still. So basically who gives a flying

The Irish?

henry wrote:

Frodder wrote:When Wales got to the /f's their ranking stayed still. So basically who gives a flying

The Irish?

Oh yes, I forgot about that

Novès is about 95% certain he won't feature in the next Six Nations, which is objectively a blessing whichever way you look at it for France. However, of course it remains to be seen whether Laporte and family can conjure a coherent and at least somewhat relevant coaching staff team in a couple days (staff should be revealed after tomorrow).
Should be Jacques Brunel, remember, was an assistant for France early mid 2000's, coached Italy before O'Shea took over... and they could be implementing a sort of part time coaching program from various others.

Anyways: if you're Irish (first encounter) or anyone in this 6N, how much more (or less) confident do you feel about facing France in light of those immediate changes ?

Dork Lard wrote:Novès is about 95% certain he won't feature in the next Six Nations, which is objectively a blessing whichever way you look at it for France. However, of course it remains to be seen whether Laporte and family can conjure a coherent and at least somewhat relevant coaching staff team in a couple days (staff should be revealed after tomorrow).
Should be Jacques Brunel, remember, was an assistant for France early mid 2000's, coached Italy before O'Shea took over... and they could be implementing a sort of part time coaching program from various others.

Anyways: if you're Irish (first encounter) or anyone in this 6N, how much more (or less) confident do you feel about facing France in light of those immediate changes ?

Meh, none.

I've seen nothing to change my opinion that Ireland should be hot favourites for the 6N trophy, possibly another GS.

henry wrote:
Oh, no doubt.

But third in the world or a Grand Slam?

Third in the world or a 6 Nations?

Jesus, third in the world or a RWC semi-final appearance?

It's about turning up in the big games- England were ranked 4th going into rwc15...

Ireland had to go to Russia one year to qualify for the wc due to being down in the rankings, so why not keep an eye on them.

So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

Dork Lard wrote:So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

It doesn’t matter who coaches you, you’ll be 4th, 5th or 6th. Players are the primary problem.

henry wrote:

Dork Lard wrote:So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

It doesn’t matter who coaches you, you’ll be 4th, 5th or 6th. Players are the primary problem.

This ^

Wendigo7 wrote:

henry wrote:

Dork Lard wrote:So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

It doesn’t matter who coaches you, you’ll be 4th, 5th or 6th. Players are the primary problem.

This ^

That ?! ^

Dork Lard wrote:

Wendigo7 wrote:

henry wrote:

Dork Lard wrote:So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

It doesn’t matter who coaches you, you’ll be 4th, 5th or 6th. Players are the primary problem.

This ^

That ?! ^

And the next thing !

malky wrote:

Dork Lard wrote:

Wendigo7 wrote:

henry wrote:

Dork Lard wrote:So it turns out Azéma (Clermont) refused...

France staff to be: Brunel (headcoach) Sébastien Bruno (forwards) and.........Fabien Galthié (backs, currently Toulon headcoach).
France to finish fifth in the tournament despite favorable 3home/2away format.

It doesn’t matter who coaches you, you’ll be 4th, 5th or 6th. Players are the primary problem.

This ^

That ?! ^

And the next thing !

Ugh...no, now that is TOO much !

It's pretty simple btw: if you think, whoever you are, Noves and his staff were anywhere near decent you simply don't understand the basics of Rugby - and then if you actually think that what the xv de France has displayed is anywhere remotely representative of the effective level of their individual players then you haven't seen those players perform for their club (domestic or European) when their talent is accommodated properly. France are one of the top 3 deepest nations in the world right now 1 to 15, even when decimated by injury and with no gameplan in sight they'll be competitive, they're full to burst with talent and options at each position that isn't the wing.

This 6N will probably go to whoever suffers the least injuries. A bit of a lottery. I think Ireland will take it this year.

Mick Mannock wrote:This 6N will probably go to whoever suffers the least injuries. A bit of a lottery. I think Ireland will take it this year.

At the very minimum I expect Ireland to win their home games.

iarmhiman wrote:

Mick Mannock wrote:This 6N will probably go to whoever suffers the least injuries. A bit of a lottery. I think Ireland will take it this year.

At the very minimum I expect Ireland to win their home games.

It's Ireland's year with Scotland/England to fight it out for 2nd.

Wales, France and Italy to have a shite fight for 4th

I must reiterate, it's certainly England, then Ireland, then Scotland in that order for me. The rest don't matter atm this year.

England will win their first two certainly, Italy-away and Wales-home, and then can afford their slipup in Murrayfield. But then, England are too good collectively to lose against a France in shambles, so away win in Paris 80% sure. Meanwhile..
Ireland should win Paris but the fans would consider that a relief and great omen for the tourney: they'll beat Italy Wales and Scotland in Dublin....... but that's THE BEST CASE SCENARIO, 4 straight wins, and then it's off to Twickenham which they MUST win and Eddie Jones' England are undefeated there, so in the besttttt case scenario coming in undefeated, Ireland are still head at water level. It would mean a pts diff. win at the end, and England do score more tries and have a more expansive/complete attacking Rugby and stack up points.

I think we've been beaten so many times in Paris that the Irish fans on here won't feel all that much confidence before that match, despite how poor France are at the moment.

danthefan wrote:I think we've been beaten so many times in Paris that the Irish fans on here won't feel all that much confidence before that match, despite how poor France are at the moment.

Plus, they'll save their one semi-competent game for us.

i really hope all the team of the 6N put us france to shame with the biggest scores ever, and that we drop below 12 or 15, and remain a load of shit until laporte goes to prison for some of the many affairs he is in.

That bag of shit of laporte is trying to fire noves under some french work law charges not to pay the contract early ending fees.

We french new laporte was a crook and a bag of shit, we knew he would the worst of the worst, but really i wish him all the bad possible, starting with the most miserable era of french rugby ever, and eraof death we will able to label "laporte's" for the 1000 years to come.

Please guys, put 50 and more on us on all games until laporte ends to some prison.

I'll be supporting whoever plays france now.

Nolanator wrote:

danthefan wrote:I think we've been beaten so many times in Paris that the Irish fans on here won't feel all that much confidence before that match, despite how poor France are at the moment.

Plus, they'll save their one semi-competent game for us.

Hard to know what Brunel will mean for them but under Noves I didn't think they were doing the old French routine of staggering inconsistency so much as being big, obstinate but also brainless week in and week out. So they'd have been a tough ask at home but certainly beatable. There's a possibility of a new coach bounce but tbh the issues with French rugby are so divorced from who is running the show that I'm not even confident about that. I thought JB checked out about 3 seasons before actually leaving Italy, but perhaps coaching his own country will make a difference. I have to say I was pretty astonished by his appointment.

Anyway, all told I think Ireland will beat France, but I'd hope and expect that England would beat Ireland at Twickenham. Suspect BPs or even points difference could decide it out of England, Ireland, and (and I can scarce believe I'm typing this but here we are) Scotland

Chuckles1188 wrote:

Nolanator wrote:

danthefan wrote:I think we've been beaten so many times in Paris that the Irish fans on here won't feel all that much confidence before that match, despite how poor France are at the moment.

Plus, they'll save their one semi-competent game for us.

Hard to know what Brunel will mean for them but under Noves I didn't think they were doing the old French routine of staggering inconsistency so much as being big, obstinate but also brainless week in and week out. So they'd have been a tough ask at home but certainly beatable. There's a possibility of a new coach bounce but tbh the issues with French rugby are so divorced from who is running the show that I'm not even confident about that. I thought JB checked out about 3 seasons before actually leaving Italy, but perhaps coaching his own country will make a difference. I have to say I was pretty astonished by his appointment.

Anyway, all told I think Ireland will beat France, but I'd hope and expect that England would beat Ireland at Twickenham. Suspect BPs or even points difference could decide it out of England, Ireland, and (and I can scarce believe I'm typing this but here we are) Scotland

I still fancy Ireland as favourites for this season's 6N. They have less glaring weaknesses than England - don't seem to be suffering from injuries too much. They rest their players better and they've got pretty good depth. They also have the ideal game to take exploit our weak areas. The only thing counting against them is playing us at Twickers - but they'll have plenty of support there. We also have a very tough fixture against the resurgent Scots at Murrayfield.

Ireland are the very devil to beat when they outmuscle you, and they can summon the manic intensity to do that to literally any team at this point.

BUT.

They struggle to do it away from home. So I think England have a good shot.