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 Post subject: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:55 pm 
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Frog link

https://www.rugbyrama.fr/rugby/6-nations/2017/noves-cest-presque-fini_sto6451542/story.shtml


Brunel and two TOP 14 trainers to replace him apparently...


Last edited by clementinfrance on Thu Dec 21, 2017 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:56 pm 
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No risk of FFR actually dealing with the core issues of French rugby then. Jolly good :thumbup:


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:58 pm 
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To be confirmed after Christmas according to the article.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 6:52 pm 
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rather like South Africa there are clearly some structural issues domestically that a change of Head Coach will not remedy

still, whatever keeps the masses happy


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 8:38 pm 
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openclashXX wrote:
rather like South Africa there are clearly some structural issues domestically that a change of Head Coach will not remedy still, whatever keeps the masses happy

This

And the "new guy" is Jacques Brunel, Bordeaux's manager at the moment, use to be the Italian coach. He's ok but come on, same all same all.
We need some drastic changes, a New Zealand coach from ITM Cup division will be fine right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:01 pm 
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Forgive my EDGY opinion here, but France desperately need more foreign coaches and less foreign players.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:19 pm 
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Floppykid wrote:
Forgive my EDGY opinion here, but France desperately need more foreign coaches and less foreign players.


Why the hell would you ever introduce a comment like that, just say what you think what is this North Korea.
Yeah well what France desperately needs is more brains and less local mob behavior. Get this they're likely going to pick another French staff from the medieval times, what's more a bunch of fkng poets who will "analyze" a match after it's well lost with verbal fluency but never actually bring solutions to the damn ongoing problem, it's what Galthié has been doing at Toulon for more than 4 months now and he should be in there somewhere. "More time is needed", game plan "needs time" to settle. They're fkng clowns. Just clowns, no other way to possibly see them these guys, well they're certainly not coaches.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:59 pm 
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Floppykid wrote:
Forgive my EDGY opinion here, but France desperately need more foreign coaches and less foreign players.


Let ROG at it.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:30 am 
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:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

first ever time in france history !


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:35 am 
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par contre brunel ? :? :?:


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:33 am 
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noves had to go, sure, but brunel wtf
isn't he a well known laporte lackey ?


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:38 am 
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In an ideal world, who would French posters have coaching France?


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:09 am 
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Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:15 am 
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TheFrog wrote:
Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


Agreed.

Removing him is only part of the solution.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:19 am 
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jolindien wrote:
par contre brunel ? :? :?:

FFS. :x


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:20 am 
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Floppykid wrote:
In an ideal world, who would French posters have coaching France?

Anyone not French.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:33 am 
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TheFrog wrote:
Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


As often witnessed since his taking in charge of the national XV, the problem seems to be originating from MacKay.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:40 am 
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I don't think this is going to help.

With the injuries in november Novès was heading to a wall.

Laporte will continue his destruction derby.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:40 am 
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Odval wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


As often witnessed since his taking in charge of the national XV, the problem seems to be originating from MacKay.

It's the end game of decades of presidents trying to take absolute power. Mackay is Palpatine only there will be no Jedi flying to the rescue.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:47 am 
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Torquemada 1420 wrote:
Odval wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


As often witnessed since his taking in charge of the national XV, the problem seems to be originating from MacKay.

It's the end game of decades of presidents trying to take absolute power. Mackay is Palpatine only there will be no Jedi flying to the rescue.


Is waiting for the final collapse and hoping for a possible rebirth the only solution left?


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:59 am 
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Akkerman wrote:
noves had to go, sure, but brunel wtf
isn't he a well known laporte lackey ?


Could be a revelation and bring in some much needed structure.

But doubt it, personally. Brunel was bang average as Italian coach and think they stagnated under his watch. Why they didn't take some time with this and bring in someone decent I can't say, as mentioned looks a very political appointment.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:16 am 
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Odval wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
Odval wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Changing the coaches is just a patch on a wooden leg.

But it gives Laporte an opportunity to help his friends. Remove Galthie from Toulon to make things easier for Boudjelal, and give a life line to Brunel who is struggling in Bordeaux.


As often witnessed since his taking in charge of the national XV, the problem seems to be originating from MacKay.

It's the end game of decades of presidents trying to take absolute power. Mackay is Palpatine only there will be no Jedi flying to the rescue.


Is waiting for the final collapse and hoping for a possible rebirth the only solution left?

Or fleeing...


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:31 am 
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lemonhead wrote:
Brunel was bang average as Italian coach and think they stagnated under his watch.


I think that Italy is most of the time average or just plainly bad for Tier 1 team, under any coach. They have a grassroots problem, that no national coach can solve.

Look at the winning percentages of the coaches since the year 2000:

New Zealand Brad Johnstone 18.5
New Zealand John Kirwan 31.3
France Pierre Berbizier 40
South Africa Nick Mallett 21.4
France Jacques Brunel 22.0
Ireland Conor O'Shea 26.66


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:52 am 
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Not suggested that they should be winning titles but he came in talking in similar terms, being consistently competitive etc, had four years to make it happen and besides the season they beat us in Rome (and coincidentally found Orquera in a bit of form) not a lot happened.

Is a tough one for them. However much they improve, the other 6N sides bar France have matched or bettered.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:37 pm 
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Worst tenure ever
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And from L'Equipe
https://www.lequipe.fr/Rugby/Actualites ... nce/860338

Quote:
En 21 matches, Guy Novès aura aligné neuf charnières différentes au coup d'envoi. Un manque de continuité pénalisant pour le XV de France.

The most was 5.

Quote:
Guy Novès, à mi-mandat, avait déjà utilisé 74 joueurs. En comparaison, Philippe Saint-André et Marc Lièvremont en avait appelé 83. Mais en quatre ans.

Just clueless. No direction or plan at all. Just shuffling deck chairs on his personal Titanic.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:48 pm 
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I thought France showed some promise in last year's AIs and the 6N. Desperately sad to see them so consistently average though.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:05 pm 
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How someone, anyone, can make the comment that putting a good coach instead of Noves wouldn't change much or would be moving a grain of salt to the left a bit is like, this most incredible thing to hear for me, it's hard to put into words...

France have played literally like children in a playground at recess. There hasn't been a coach there in the last two years. We are all vastly different and perceive things differently etc... but wouldn't you have to find it obvious on some level that a team playing with no plan or order at all, like none whatsoever, surely benefits from the prospect of trying again with this time an actual structure in place ??... no ???... Apparently for some: no. Just, plain no. So you've got this well decent racing car and the last couple of drivers have made nothing of it, and someone proposes the idea of bringing in a top pilot, and you raise your eyes at him unresponsively, and shrug: "mmm, nahhh...". Is that just dumb, or also perhaps (subconscious) disinterest. Is it French despondency ? A form of chronic prolonged state of depression with all the positive vibe and enthusiasm sucked out as a defensive mechanism to not be hurt once more having suffered so much from being a France fan in recent times ?? Like some kind of a general impression of impending doom: nothing can really improve, nothing will really improve - that scrambles the mind into not producing relevant conclusions about it ?


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:47 pm 
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Nick Mallet is the answer.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:13 pm 
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:D
Quote:
Boucherie Ovalie
Dites ce que vous voulez de Laporte, mais au moins il est reconnaissant envers le type qui bossait à sa place pendant qu’il passait à la télé et tournait des pubs pour Madrange.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:09 pm 
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Dork Lard wrote:
How someone, anyone, can make the comment that putting a good coach instead of Noves wouldn't change much or would be moving a grain of salt to the left a bit is like, this most incredible thing to hear for me, it's hard to put into words...

France have played literally like children in a playground at recess. There hasn't been a coach there in the last two years. We are all vastly different and perceive things differently etc... but wouldn't you have to find it obvious on some level that a team playing with no plan or order at all, like none whatsoever, surely benefits from the prospect of trying again with this time an actual structure in place ??... no ???... Apparently for some: no. Just, plain no. So you've got this well decent racing car and the last couple of drivers have made nothing of it, and someone proposes the idea of bringing in a top pilot, and you raise your eyes at him unresponsively, and shrug: "mmm, nahhh...". Is that just dumb, or also perhaps (subconscious) disinterest. Is it French despondency ? A form of chronic prolonged state of depression with all the positive vibe and enthusiasm sucked out as a defensive mechanism to not be hurt once more having suffered so much from being a France fan in recent times ?? Like some kind of a general impression of impending doom: nothing can really improve, nothing will really improve - that scrambles the mind into not producing relevant conclusions about it ?


I agree with Croyals' post, above yours. 6N 2016 and Automn 2016, France did show some promise. We failed to record a successful year on détails (and détails do matter in top level spots I agree), but there was some hope. So I think as far as coaching is concerned, Noves was doing his job.

What went wrong in November has a lot to do with fitness I think. The French were just as tired as their opponents and could not up their rugby for the occasion. In addition, injuries had taken their toll and Noves was forced to play a lot of new faces. The team wasn't seasoned at all.

Fitness: Noves has to take the blame for players who did the conditionning with the French squad last summer. A guy like Picamoles is a typical example. He was only a shadow of himself. I heard him on the radio saying that they trained to run long to support an attacking rugby philosophy, to the detriment of sheer explosivity, which is Picamoles' strength. So, it seems that Noves and his staff had a rigid game plan and did not try to match individuals abilities with the plan. For that reason, I agree that Noves could pay the price for the failure.

But after, I am not sure we'll get much better game coaching, with players showing a structure they've never shown in the past 10 years. But I'd be happy to be proven wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:10 pm 
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Odval wrote:
:D
Quote:
Boucherie Ovalie
Dites ce que vous voulez de Laporte, mais au moins il est reconnaissant envers le type qui bossait à sa place pendant qu’il passait à la télé et tournait des pubs pour Madrange.


:lol:

Ils sont bons.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:42 pm 
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Floppykid wrote:
In an ideal world, who would French posters have coaching France?

Mike Horn, seriously.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:23 pm 
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Dork Lard wrote:
How someone, anyone, can make the comment that putting a good coach instead of Noves wouldn't change much or would be moving a grain of salt to the left a bit is like, this most incredible thing to hear for me, it's hard to put into words...

France have played literally like children in a playground at recess. There hasn't been a coach there in the last two years. We are all vastly different and perceive things differently etc... but wouldn't you have to find it obvious on some level that a team playing with no plan or order at all, like none whatsoever, surely benefits from the prospect of trying again with this time an actual structure in place ??... no ???... Apparently for some: no. Just, plain no. So you've got this well decent racing car and the last couple of drivers have made nothing of it, and someone proposes the idea of bringing in a top pilot, and you raise your eyes at him unresponsively, and shrug: "mmm, nahhh...". Is that just dumb, or also perhaps (subconscious) disinterest. ?


You seriously consider Brunel or Galthie to be top pilots? How many times do you change the pilot w/o any success b4 you start wondering about the car parts and how they're being actually developed?

That's too fkcing easy to blame it all on Noves. Very convenient too for Laporte to move the attention away form all his shoddy involvements and problems. But then he had in mind to fire Noves from the get go, so...

Youpidou, the 6N is ours now...


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:33 pm 
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Oh and if I was Marti I would be absolutely fuming. Ibanez was already thinking about something else than the club when so much noise was made around him and potentially leading les Bleus, blablabla... Now it's Brunel... Wtf seriously?!


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:30 pm 
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Jacques Brunel lol :lol: :lol: :lol:


What a joke. Seriously, fudge em.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:29 am 
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GDBFC99 wrote:
You seriously consider Brunel or Galthie to be top pilots? How many times do you change the pilot w/o any success b4 you start wondering about the car parts and how they're being actually developed?

That's too fkcing easy to blame it all on Noves. Very convenient too for Laporte to move the attention away form all his shoddy involvements and problems. But then he had in mind to fire Noves from the get go, so...

Youpidou, the 6N is ours now...

Galthie and Brunel are part of the problem i.e. Fre coaches in a broken Fre system.

The truth here lies between the 2. Doubtless a decent coach would have done better. A lot better. But the ills of the system would mean even if Kerrist was the coach, we'd see nothing better than 4th or 5th on world rankings. At the moment Fra are fractionally above Fiji FFS.


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 Post subject: Re: Novès gooooooone ?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 23, 2017 1:08 pm 
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GDBFC99 wrote:
You seriously consider Brunel or Galthie to be top pilots? How many times do you change the pilot w/o any success b4 you start wondering about the car parts and how they're being actually developed?

That's too fkcing easy to blame it all on Noves. Very convenient too for Laporte to move the attention away form all his shoddy involvements and problems. But then he had in mind to fire Noves from the get go, so...

Youpidou, the 6N is ours now...

Uhm...no. I really, really don't. Where you get that from is a mystery.
Wow, easiest reply I've had to make here !


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:26 pm 
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It's now official. As expected, Guy Noves has been fired and is replaced by Jaques Brunel who was coaching Bordeaux Begles.

Laporte said he wants Brunel to have deputy coaches who are currently coaching in the Top 14; They will keep on coaching their clubs but will be available for the national team schedule.

A few names are being mentionned : Fabien Galthié (Toulon), Franck Azema (Clermont) and Patrice Collazo (La Rochelle).

Sebastien Bruno and Julien Bonnaire are also likely to be in the coaching staff.

https://www.lequipe.fr/Rugby/Actualites ... ves/862378


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:30 pm 
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yeep. Iss owfishow now.

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Lord have mercy on this Rugby nation.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:35 pm 
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Quote:
They will keep on coaching their clubs but will be available for the national team schedule.
]

So basically Bordeaux have until February to find a new head coach.


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