Planet Rugby Forum

mr bungle wrote:
Couldn’t agree with you more, and we agree on most things

That scene wasn’t just a FaceTime call & firefight. She was bouncing around taking names like Alvin the chipmunk meets Rambo. What did it add to the story? And why feature such ludicrous cartoonesque nonsense?

I presume it was to explain why she couldn't give them specific and detailed information about who they were looking for apart from being deliberately vague and unhelpful

Chuckles1188 wrote:

mr bungle wrote:
Couldn’t agree with you more, and we agree on most things

That scene wasn’t just a FaceTime call & firefight. She was bouncing around taking names like Alvin the chipmunk meets Rambo. What did it add to the story? And why feature such ludicrous cartoonesque nonsense?

I presume it was to explain why she couldn't give them specific and detailed information about who they were looking for apart from being deliberately vague and unhelpful

I assumed that she was being deliberately vague and unhelpful to get all our hopes up that it would be the only other black guy in the universe making a welcome return, only to dash them later on.

Is Benicio del Toro due to return in the third one does anyone know?

I presumed from the way he left that we’ll probably see him in ep9. Probably Finn and Rose run into him somewhere and give him a piece of their minds, then show him the error of his ways.

Like I said, probably the biggest plot hole for me was BDT giving up the cloaked transport plan to the First Order, at a stage when Poe didn’t even know the plan to explain it to Finn and Rose.

DOB wrote:I presumed from the way he left that we’ll probably see him in ep9. Probably Finn and Rose run into him somewhere and give him a piece of their minds, then show him the error of his ways.

Like I said, probably the biggest plot hole for me was BDT giving up the cloaked transport plan to the First Order, at a stage when Poe didn’t even know the plan to explain it to Finn and Rose.

Agreed.

Science

They're magnetic, or something.

But of course that's not the most risible part about a film about space monks that can move things with their minds, oh no. The worse is that they can all breathe on other planets.

They were in orbit at the time. It remains a much less egregious violation of the laws of physics than all the sound in space

Bullettyme wrote:They're magnetic, or something.

But of course that's not the most risible part about a film about space monks that can move things with their minds, oh no. The worse is that they can all breathe on other planets.

You mean planets already colonized by similar creatures as humans?

DOB wrote:I presumed from the way he left that we’ll probably see him in ep9. Probably Finn and Rose run into him somewhere and give him a piece of their minds, then show him the error of his ways.

Like I said, probably the biggest plot hole for me was BDT giving up the cloaked transport plan to the First Order, at a stage when Poe didn’t even know the plan to explain it to Finn and Rose.

Not a plot hole as such but it annoyed me during the First Order assault on the derelict base the rebel force dusted off their Battle of Hoth plans and concluded that a full frontal attack on beefed up AT-ATs with antique craft was the correct course of action, because that worked so well last time. Maybe, you know, try and flank the not terribly agile walkers and attack from the sides or rear.

When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Minnosu wrote:When you see that kind of nitpicking one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Yup. There now exist at least one movie-going generation which thinks that the way you critique a film is by flat-out refusing to suspend your disbelief and then complain that the story about space wizards doesn't make any sense

Sandstorm wrote:

Bullettyme wrote:They're magnetic, or something.

But of course that's not the most risible part about a film about space monks that can move things with their minds, oh no. The worse is that they can all breathe on other planets.

You mean planets already colonized by similar creatures as humans?

Some planets are colonised by weird alien things. And why is it that everything looks so humanoid? And can breath oxygen? And some wear clothes why others don't? And you can hear noise in space? And fighters need to bank in space?

The movies are silly and slightly mental. I think it's ok to not delve too deeply into some of the science-y parts .

Chuckles1188 wrote:They were in orbit at the time. It remains a much less egregious violation of the laws of physics than all the sound in space

Didn't the sound cut at one point, I think when Laura Dern crashed into the big ship? Or did the Surround Sound at the Southampton Odeon just fritz out temporarily?

So, we’re not allowed to discuss the features of the movies or (much less) criticise them?

Chuckles1188 wrote:

Minnosu wrote:When you see that kind of nitpicking one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Yup. There now exist at least one movie-going generation which thinks that the way you critique a film is by flat-out refusing to suspend your disbelief and then complain that the story about space wizards doesn't make any sense

I think people are more then happy to suspend their beliefs and buy into the universe that has been presented to them. That's just a basic requirement if you want to fully enjoy sci-fi or fantasy escapism. People just get annoyed when lazy or ill conceived plot lines push the envelope of what is possible even within the created universe they are being asked to buy into.

shanky wrote:So, we’re not allowed to discuss the features of the movies or (much less) criticise them?

This is an interesting non-sequitur. Please elaborate.

Brazil wrote:

Chuckles1188 wrote:They were in orbit at the time. It remains a much less egregious violation of the laws of physics than all the sound in space

Didn't the sound cut at one point, I think when Laura Dern crashed into the big ship? Or did the Surround Sound at the Southampton Odeon just fritz out temporarily?

There are a few times when the sound cuts out in space in the film - actually it's really well done and adds to the drama/realism.

Minnosu wrote:When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

1) A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
2) f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
3) Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
4) Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
5) Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
6) The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
7) Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

1) Given to this day Yoda's scenes are awesome I doubt this.
2) It would take a special kind of troll to pick a scene were Yoda is purposely playing up as dumb to complain
3) After only a New Hope why would this be out of place?
4) I always saw this a a minor flaw. It always looks like a patchy effect too.
5) It's obvious Luke is contacting her using th force. I don't see how anyone would think this was out of line.
6) The same Star Destroyer that can't detect two robots in a escape pod? That's pretty consistent in anybodies eyes.
7) Really? She taunts and banters with Han all film until their kiss and kills as many Stormtroopers as Chewie by the end and flys the Falcon. How anyone thinks she isn't badass after watching that is beyond me.
At no point where they described as the most advanced killing machines the empire had. All we know is that they are used for ice worlds.

Bullettyme wrote:

shanky wrote:So, we’re not allowed to discuss the features of the movies or (much less) criticise them?

This is an interesting non-sequitur. Please elaborate.

I could, but I prefer to suggest that you don’t delve too deeply into my reasoning. Just accept it.

eldanielfire wrote:

Minnosu wrote:When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

1) A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
2) f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
3) Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
4) Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
5) Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
6) The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
7) Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

1) Given to this day Yoda's scenes are awesome I doubt this.
2) It would take a special kind of troll to pick a scene were Yoda is purposely playing up as dumb to complain

Yoda? I thought he was talking about Ja Ja Binks.

Chuckles1188 wrote:

Minnosu wrote:When you see that kind of nitpicking one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Yup. There now exist at least one movie-going generation which thinks that the way you critique a film is by flat-out refusing to suspend your disbelief and then complain that the story about space wizards doesn't make any sense

I think people are more then happy to suspend their beliefs and buy into the universe that has been presented to them. That's just a basic requirement if you want to fully enjoy sci-fi or fantasy escapism. People just get annoyed when lazy or ill conceived plot lines push the envelope of what is possible even within the created universe they are being asked to buy into.[/quote]

I'd also say that a film can have magical space wizards but it still needs to look and feel real to be able to suspend belief. That is good movie making. A good example is Lord of the Rings vs the Hobbit. In Fellowship when they are fighting inside the mountain you feel the tension, the battle which has wizards, ogres, elves and dwarfs feels realistic and gritty and you believe in what is happening. In the Hobbit films when the Dwarfs are in the goblin caves they fall 50 feet and just get up and run and jump in ways that just feels like a computer game. The tension is gone and the physics look and feel unreal despite good CGI so the film is a bit shit because you can't suspend your disbelief.

Good film making makes you suspend your disbelief without intending to. Bad film making doesn't achieve this. Sneering at people because some films clearly get audience to suspend their dibelief while other fail to do it successfully doesn't change that.

Sandstorm wrote:

Brazil wrote:

Chuckles1188 wrote:They were in orbit at the time. It remains a much less egregious violation of the laws of physics than all the sound in space

Didn't the sound cut at one point, I think when Laura Dern crashed into the big ship? Or did the Surround Sound at the Southampton Odeon just fritz out temporarily?

There are a few times when the sound cuts out in space in the film - actually it's really well done and adds to the drama/realism.

Yes, I did love the effect and editing when the spaceship crashed into the star destroyer.

Jar Jar Binks was a Sith Lord rather than a Jedi master but point taken.

Any one notice one of the ships landing on the Battle cruiser looked like a modified steam iron. Me and the boy both went "that's a bloomin iron" at the same time - maybe one of teh special leffects boys having a larf ???

carlos_c wrote:Any one notice one of the ships landing on the Battle cruiser looked like a modified steam iron. Me and the boy both went "that's a bloomin iron" at the same time - maybe one of teh special leffects boys having a larf ???

carlos_c wrote:Any one notice one of the ships landing on the Battle cruiser looked like a modified steam iron. Me and the boy both went "that's a bloomin iron" at the same time - maybe one of teh special leffects boys having a larf ???

Wasn't that a joke in film? What looked like a ship landing but was actual iron ironing some first order uniforms?

Bullettyme wrote:

carlos_c wrote:Any one notice one of the ships landing on the Battle cruiser looked like a modified steam iron. Me and the boy both went "that's a bloomin iron" at the same time - maybe one of teh special leffects boys having a larf ???

Wasn't that a joke in film? What looked like a ship landing but was actual iron ironing some first order uniforms?

Correct.

eldanielfire wrote: I'd also say that a film can have magical space wizards but it still needs to look and feel real to be able to suspend belief. That is good movie making. A good example is Lord of the Rings vs the Hobbit. In Fellowship when they are fighting inside the mountain you feel the tension, the battle which has wizards, ogres, elves and dwarfs feels realistic and gritty and you believe in what is happening. In the Hobbit films when the Dwarfs are in the goblin caves they fall 50 feet and just get up and run and jump in ways that just feels like a computer game. The tension is gone and the physics look and feel unreal despite good CGI so the film is a bit shit because you can't suspend your disbelief.

Good film making makes you suspend your disbelief without intending to. Bad film making doesn't achieve this. Sneering at people because some films clearly get audience to suspend their dibelief while other fail to do it successfully doesn't change that.

I'm sneering at people who deliberately withhold their suspension of disbelief in order to feel smarter than the moviemakers, not whatever it is you think I'm doing.

mr bungle wrote:

DOB wrote:There will absolutely be a lot of Phasma tie-in stuff in books, comics, etc.

Similarly, I can see no other reason to have Maz Kanata taking a FaceTime call while in the middle of a firefight than because said firefight will feature in an episode of Maz’s spinoff cartoon/comic/novel series.[/quote

That was an exceptionally shit scene. Typical of the OTT shite the originals avoided.

This was the worse scene in the film, mostly because I couldn't work out what was going on, too dark/too much cgi

Bullettyme wrote:

Sandstorm wrote:

Bullettyme wrote:They're magnetic, or something.

But of course that's not the most risible part about a film about space monks that can move things with their minds, oh no. The worse is that they can all breathe on other planets.

You mean planets already colonized by similar creatures as humans?

Some planets are colonised by weird alien things. And why is it that everything looks so humanoid? And can breath oxygen? And some wear clothes why others don't? And you can hear noise in space? And fighters need to bank in space?

The movies are silly and slightly mental. I think it's ok to not delve too deeply into some of the science-y parts .

It's all explained in Star Trek Next Generation where the Enterprise and a few other species are chasing some kind of treasure.

badmannotinjapan wrote:

Bullettyme wrote:

Sandstorm wrote:

Bullettyme wrote:They're magnetic, or something.

But of course that's not the most risible part about a film about space monks that can move things with their minds, oh no. The worse is that they can all breathe on other planets.

You mean planets already colonized by similar creatures as humans?

Some planets are colonised by weird alien things. And why is it that everything looks so humanoid? And can breath oxygen? And some wear clothes why others don't? And you can hear noise in space? And fighters need to bank in space?

The movies are silly and slightly mental. I think it's ok to not delve too deeply into some of the science-y parts .

It's all explained in Star Trek Next Generation where the Enterprise and a few other species are chasing some kind of treasure.

The common ancestor populating various planets millions of years ago? I quite like that as a way to explain why humanoid species dominate the galaxy and even how they can reproduce together.

eldanielfire wrote:
The common ancestor populating various planets millions of years ago? I quite like that as a way to explain why humanoid species dominate the galaxy and even how they can reproduce together.

You just know there's some fan fic pr0n out there for TNG and DS9 with all the inter-species hookups in those shows.

Yeah Star Trek runs on the panspermia hypothesis. Makes sense even if it is lame

Bullettyme wrote:

Floppykid wrote:

mr bungle wrote:

DOB wrote:There will absolutely be a lot of Phasma tie-in stuff in books, comics, etc.

Similarly, I can see no other reason to have Maz Kanata taking a FaceTime call while in the middle of a firefight than because said firefight will feature in an episode of Maz’s spinoff cartoon/comic/novel series.

That was an exceptionally shit scene. Typical of the OTT shite the originals avoided.

Everything has to be bigger, better, louder and quicker.
None of these movies come close to the originals.

Well tbf that was the progression of the original trilogy. Don't kid yourself though; if the same technology was available to Lucas post A New Hope we'd have the same ridiculous computer-gamery storytelling from the prequels. This trilogy is rather tame and tasteful compared to scenes like say, a giant robot army fighting a giant frog army in a giant field, or a Jedi riding a lizard monster like a horse, complete with the same 3....2.....1.....GO! loading screen.

Also, have you even seen this movie?!

Nah, thought I'd just chime in with an opinion anyway.

Minnosu wrote:When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Also, how the fudge did Vader NOT know Leia was his daughter in A New Hope?

Thomas wrote:

Minnosu wrote:When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Also, how the fudge did Vader NOT know Leia was his daughter in A New Hope?

What you don't know can't be beaten out of you.

Thomas wrote:

Minnosu wrote:When you see (incorrect) nitpicking over gravity in space one has to wonder what the twitter reaction would be to empire.

A f**king frog muppet is a Jedi master?
f**king frog muppet gets into a fight with trash can r2d2 over food. Bent.
Asteroid cave is actually a giant space worm with teeth? Laughable
Luke manages to slide perfectly into tube after falling for half a mile. Ridiculous.
Leia can hear Luke's thoughts? So is Leia a Jedi now? Since when did Jedi powers include long distance Skype calls?
The millennium falcon is able to hide on the side of a star destroyer? Please.
Leia in the first movie was a badass hero, now she's just a helpless love interest for Han. Pathetic squandering of a character.
Those imperial walkers? My theater burst out laughing when we saw them. Who designed those things? The most advanced killing machines the empire have, but are no match for some cables. Laughable.

Also, how the fudge did Vader NOT know Leia was his daughter in A New Hope?

He didn't know in an understated way though. Smaller, quieter, slower. Peak filmmaking. And the way he was cut down by a dude who'd fought with a lightsaber once before? Extremely good and believable.

I always thought it was pretty good how Leia had to comfort Luke after an old drifter he'd just met a couple of days ago had died, while she'd just witnessed her entire planet and population get annihilated.

Turbogoat wrote:I always thought it was pretty good how Leia had to comfort Luke after an old drifter he'd just met a couple of days ago had died, while she'd just witnessed her entire planet and population get annihilated.

Luke had known Obi wan for years even if he didn't really know he was a Jedi. I think also after his aunt and uncle died Luke still had Obi Wan's father like figure and direction and the excitement of adventure Obi Wan offered, so by that point Luke realised he had nothing, his mates had all gone off to join the rebels as well, he could be reflecting on all that he lost by that point in a short time. Leia at this point was still all business and was brought up to be a rebel leader and absorb shit like that, even if she would mourn later.

eldanielfire wrote:

Turbogoat wrote:I always thought it was pretty good how Leia had to comfort Luke after an old drifter he'd just met a couple of days ago had died, while she'd just witnessed her entire planet and population get annihilated.

Luke had known Obi wan for years even if he didn't really know he was a Jedi. I think also after his aunt and uncle died Luke still had Obi Wan's father like figure and direction and the excitement of adventure Obi Wan offered, so by that point Luke realised he had nothing, his mates had all gone off to join the rebels as well, he could be reflecting on all that he lost by that point in a short time. Leia at this point was still all business and was brought up to be a rebel leader and absorb shit like that, even if she would mourn later.

I can't believe that got a serious response.

Turbogoat wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

Turbogoat wrote:I always thought it was pretty good how Leia had to comfort Luke after an old drifter he'd just met a couple of days ago had died, while she'd just witnessed her entire planet and population get annihilated.

Luke had known Obi wan for years even if he didn't really know he was a Jedi. I think also after his aunt and uncle died Luke still had Obi Wan's father like figure and direction and the excitement of adventure Obi Wan offered, so by that point Luke realised he had nothing, his mates had all gone off to join the rebels as well, he could be reflecting on all that he lost by that point in a short time. Leia at this point was still all business and was brought up to be a rebel leader and absorb shit like that, even if she would mourn later.

I can't believe that got a serious response.

I'm purposely giving serious responses to all these posts.