Planet Rugby Forum

Only 1000ish days to go.

Oprah is a lock in.

/thread

the real reason why democraps lost in 2016 was because of #feminism they wanted a first woman president after their success with a first black president that they ignored that fact that their woman candidate was not really all that clean .... had they decided, "ok, she raises too many flags, lets just go with Bernie and in 2020, we will find another woman candidate who isn't all that dodgy", the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie...those votes cost hillary....and honestly right now the US deserves Trump..

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Hindsight is such a wonderful thing, isn't it?

I said it at the time.

I look forward to the Oprah Winfrey / Gwyneth Paltrow ticket up against the Kanye West / Snoop Dog ticket.

Bowens wrote:

I said it at the time.

You knew at the time that Hilary would lose and that bernie would have won?

You must be a trump-level genius

US locals, what’s the word on Harris? Centrist apparently.

Kiwias wrote:

Bowens wrote:

I said it at the time.

You knew at the time that Hilary would lose and that bernie would have won?

"Knew"? No. But after the Michigan primary it didn't seem far-fetched at all. People of a certain generation in the Rust Belt hate the Clintons (mostly because of NAFTA). I'm pretty sure fonzee, who is from St Louis so would know similar demographics, was saying the same things at the time.

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Sanders vs Trump would have almost certainly meant a real 3rd party run by a Bloomberg or Cuban type. Not only is there no real evidence Sanders would have beaten Trump straight up, he would have had to deal with that 3rd party centrist, too.

Bloomberg would have pulled no support. Cuban just likes to talk about running, I don't think he really wants to get into politics.

goeagles wrote:

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Sanders vs Trump would have almost certainly meant a real 3rd party run by a Bloomberg or Cuban type. Not only is there no real evidence Sanders would have beaten Trump straight up, he would have had to deal with that 3rd party centrist, too.

The idea that a self-confessed socialist would have walked it to the White House is hilariously misguided.

Jeff you have been spoken to about your contributions on US political threads before.

Bowens wrote:Jeff you have been spoken to about your contributions on US political threads before.

By an intellectual titan in Seneca no less. He's a twat, and so are you if you try to pull the same trick.

You are bad at it. Sorry. Recognize it and either sharpen up or move along.

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Really? You think Sanders was electable as POTUS?

HAving gotten further down the thread, yes you do. I can't see it. And yes I'm not from the US, I just don't see the US as open to his openly socialist policies.

Bowens wrote:You are bad at it. Sorry. Recognize it and either sharpen up or move along.

Tbf, one of my go-to points of reference to working out whether I'm in the right or wrong is that of Seneca believes it, or anyone else is agreeing with him, then it must be wrong...so that's you fucked.

But in the interest of pushing this thread forward, talk me through how a "A self-described democratic socialist" wins where Hillary failed.

He wins Michigan and WI (as he did in the primary) and PA. Possibly Ohio.

That was easy.

Bowens wrote:Bloomberg would have pulled no support. Cuban just likes to talk about running, I don't think he really wants to get into politics.

A Bloomberg or Cuban type, i.e. someone in the middle who would pull never Trumpers, centrists and Dems who didn't want socialism.

Bowens wrote:He wins Michigan and WI (as he did in the primary) and PA. Possibly Ohio.

That was easy.

And the media/online machinery that went to work on Clinton, with the pizza parlour nonsense etc., would have just slid off him like he was made of Teflon?

Give over, he would have come in for an almighty barrage of shit equal to, if not greater, than Clinton. I may not be a yank, but due to American Cultural hegemony, I've read and watched a shit tonne of articles , TV shows, movies from America...and the one thing that seems to come through strongest than anything, is the (unusually in my opinion) extreme antipathy towards socialism.

I think you underestimate the antipathy toward the status quo in the industrial Midwest. Obviously it's anecdotal but I know quite a few older Obama voters, lifetime democrat types, who didn't vote or voted for Trump. The Access Hollywood tape would have been the KO with no "emails!" to counter it.

Bowens wrote:I think you underestimate the antipathy toward the status quo in the industrial Midwest. Obviously it's anecdotal but I know quite a few older Obama voters, lifetime democrat types, who didn't vote or voted for Trump. The Access Hollywood tape would have been the KO with no "emails!" to counter it.

Well, we'll just have to agree to disagree. At the very least, I doubt it would have been anything other than close. Trump seemed to energise a fair portion of the population...I'm sure a fair proportion of them wouldn't have swung all the way to the other side of the political spectrum had Bernie been there.

Is Oprah some sort of meme joke I missed out on? Surely not.

What is with the USA and their weird obsession with celebrity leaders.

Jeff the Bear wrote:

Bowens wrote:He wins Michigan and WI (as he did in the primary) and PA. Possibly Ohio.

That was easy.

And the media/online machinery that went to work on Clinton, with the pizza parlour nonsense etc., would have just slid off him like he was made of Teflon?

Give over, he would have come in for an almighty barrage of shit equal to, if not greater, than Clinton. I may not be a yank, but due to American Cultural hegemony, I've read and watched a shit tonne of articles , TV shows, movies from America...and the one thing that seems to come through strongest than anything, is the (unusually in my opinion) extreme antipathy towards socialism.

DSA memberships are shooting up. Going to be interesting to see if they can keep their momentum going. Had some interesting wins in November, Lee Carter beating Jackson Miller in Virginia for one.

Kim Kardashian.

There is no doubt in my mind that Clinton paid the cost in the rust belt. Zero, zilch, nada.

They hate the Clintons there.

Not saying Bernie would have won elsewhere, but he may well have won in a couple of those.

Bernie would have crushed Trump. No one liked Greasy Hillary, i think people just tricked themselves into trying to because the alternative was Trump.

shanky wrote:There is no doubt in my mind that Clinton paid the cost in the rust belt. Zero, zilch, nada.

They hate the Clintons there.

This guy gets it.

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

“True”? How did “a majority of Dems vote for Trump” when he lost the popular vote?

I'm sure you want a gotcha here pal, but in that context "a majority of dems voted for Trump because..." can also mean a majority of Dems who voted for Trump did so because of the DNC.

rett wrote:

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

“True”? How did “a majority of Dems vote for Trump” when he lost the popular vote?

Dems voted for Hillary 89-9 over Trump according to exit polls.

Bowens wrote:I'm sure you want a gotcha here pal, but in that context "a majority of dems voted for Trump because..." can also mean a majority of Dems who voted for Trump did so because of the DNC.

Two totally different situations.
You do understand the meaning of “majority”?

I’m not in any way suggesting that Hilary was a good candidate, or the Dems treatment of Bernie wasn’t a factor. I just think some people overdo the hyperbole. The fact that Trump received less votes than Romney managed in 2012, seems to contradict the theory that he rode in on some great popular groundswell!

No one thinks a majority of democrats voted for Trump ffs, the meaning was clear.

So which candidate out of the ones likely running will win back the voters who need winning back? Biden presumably.

Kiwias wrote:

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Hindsight is such a wonderful thing, isn't it?

A lot of people have always pointed to Hilary's flaws. A lot of people called her un-electable, dangerous, cupboard stock full of skeletons and her appeal, no matter how much spin she is given is an election loser. Lots at the time reported Bernie's ability to reach more people. None of this in hindsight, It's just the big powers in the Democratic party and a mainstream media convinced themselves and nobody else that none of this mattered.

Jeff the Bear wrote:

goeagles wrote:

Bowens wrote:

the POTUS would probably be Bernie right now cause a majority of Democrats voted for Trump because they got pissed by what the DNC did with Bernie

True. Hilariously a few people on here were convinced Hillary had a better chance than Bernie. Deep down they know they were spectacularly wrong.

Sanders vs Trump would have almost certainly meant a real 3rd party run by a Bloomberg or Cuban type. Not only is there no real evidence Sanders would have beaten Trump straight up, he would have had to deal with that 3rd party centrist, too.

The idea that a self-confessed socialist would have walked it to the White House is hilariously misguided.

Up against Trump easily. he would have negated Trumps rust belt pull which is ultimately what won it for Trump. Dem's aren't going to vote republican. Sanders appealed well beyond what Hilary did. There was loads of evidence form the primaries that Hilary just wasn't appealing to ordinary voters and she knew it as she had to buy the nomination more or less.

Bindi wrote:So which candidate out of the ones likely running will win back the voters who need winning back? Biden presumably.

Biden vs Ron Paul.


Could be a much more interesting race.

I genuinely hope Biden doesn't run. If only for how creepy he is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwXweiRjckI

I still think Kamala Harris. Or Michelle Obama if they can convince her to run.