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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:47 am 
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Will she get the support of 158 Tory MPs to quell the challenge? Vote is today


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:49 am 
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Petros wrote:
Will she get the support of 158 Tory MPs to quell the challenge? Vote is today


I think she's toast this time for real.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:24 am 
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Damnit, I wrote they didn't have enough numbers in my brief. :blush:

Although I did say "unless tectonic plates move within the Conservative party...."


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:29 am 
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I think she'll win - what's the likely alternative; a GE and a Corbyn govt? Not sure the Tory party is that ready to eat itself just yet


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:29 am 
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iarmhiman wrote:
Petros wrote:
Will she get the support of 158 Tory MPs to quell the challenge? Vote is today


I think she's toast this time for real.



Depends, who is going to oppose her and how to the others feel about it.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:33 am 
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Stolen from Twitter:

Next Tory leader, latest odds:

The one who lied on a bus 6-1
The one who lied about impact assessments 8-1
The one who lied to Parliament and resigned 10-1
The one who lied and didn’t resign 15-1
The one who destroyed the NHS 20-1
The one who didn’t know we were an island 8-1

Sums it up.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:36 am 
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I reckon this was to see off a Labour no confidence vote in parliament and she wins tonight. Problem then is she's got a year before she can be challenged and there may be a GE before then.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:38 am 
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I suspect she'll win, even if only because many of the possible replacements - Javid, Rudd, etc - want to take over after the Brexit shitshow is over, not while it's still going on.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:39 am 
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bimboman wrote:
I reckon this was to see off a Labour no confidence vote in parliament and she wins tonight. Problem then is she's got a year before she can be challenged and there may be a GE before then.


One chance to ditch her before a general election - that should focus a few minds. Not sure it'll be enough though.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:41 am 
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If Putin really did have a hand in interfering with the Brexit vote he'll be wanking himself into a frenzy right about now over all these knock on effects. (Health warning: Do NOT imagine Putin jacking it, with an icy impassive look on his face and jumper cables on his nipples)


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:42 am 
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Mrs May is going nowhere.....it's like free money.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:00 am 
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Joost wrote:
I think she'll win - what's the likely alternative; a GE and a Corbyn govt? Not sure the Tory party is that ready to eat itself just yet

Yep! Though it could be very close.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:05 am 
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Auckman wrote:
Damnit, I wrote they didn't have enough numbers in my brief. :blush:

Although I did say "unless tectonic plates move within the Conservative party...."


Anybody trying to predict British politics right now is on a hiding to nothing so I wouldn't worry too much about it.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:06 am 
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SaintK wrote:
Joost wrote:
I think she'll win - what's the likely alternative; a GE and a Corbyn govt? Not sure the Tory party is that ready to eat itself just yet

Yep! Though it could be very close.

Even if she survives the Tory Party hopefully will not.
I suspect it will be very close and if she wins the prospect of a parliamentary vote of no confidence will be always on the cards.
The government will not be able to govern. The opposition is useless. We are fecked.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:07 am 
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DUP will never vote with labour in a parliamentary vote . Not as long as it's Corbyn leading the party.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:10 am 
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Joost wrote:
I think she'll win - what's the likely alternative; a GE and a Corbyn govt? Not sure the Tory party is that ready to eat itself just yet


Chaos with Ed Miliband? :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:11 am 
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I think she will be OK because they are basically all plum who don't want the job at the moment. These are the same people, on both sides of the debate, who welcomed her with open arms when she put her hand up to lead. Spineless, self serving plum just trying to get their own way and their own headlines without risking themselves.

I honestly think history will be kind to May as the only person with the guts to at least try and do the right thing.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:13 am 
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slick wrote:
I honestly think history will be kind to May as the only person with the guts to at least try and do the right thing.


I very much doubt it, she has fucked things at every turn. Ian Dunt sums it up quite nicely:

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For two and a half years we have been forced to watch Theresa May's cack-handed administration trundle on, making unforced error after unforced error, until now, with grim inevitability, we can see them all come together in a festival of inadequacy.

She finally has to sell her Brexit deal. The vote is next week. And she cannot do it, because her various weaknesses have made her utterly ineffective. The prime minister is the political equivalent of someone trying to eat soup with a knife. She is strategically inept, tactically misguided, presentationally catastrophic, and promoting a deal with nothing to recommend it.

Her current strategy is to tell Remainers that the consequence of rejecting her deal is no-deal and to tell Brexiters that the consequence is no-Brexit. Everyone gets their own bogeyman. But she does not seem to have realised that both sides can hear her when she says these things. So the Remainers listen to the part where she says there'll be no Brexit and the Brexiters listen to the part where she says there'll be no-deal. It's like someone having a WhatsApp conversation on Twitter.

It's not the first time she's done this. During the negotiations she would say one thing to Brussels and then return to the Commons and speak the most god-awful pound-shop-Boudica drivel about how weak and petrified the Europeans were. She either had not realised that TV had been invented or did not think the Europeans were smart enough to take an interest in what she was saying back home.

It was this unreliability on the British side which first led to the backstop - the great humiliation which Brexiters now spend all their time complaining about. Ministers showed no consistency, no basic principles, no depth to which they would not plunge to satisfy their ideological hysteria - so an insurance policy was needed. We don't know the damage their dismissive attitude towards the EU cost us. Each time Liam Fox or David Davis said something belittling about our negotiating partners, the view of us across the Channel hardened. Part of the reason May has so little to offer with her deal is that she alienated the people who were in a position to help her.

May's second tactic is to present herself as a centrist unifier, the grown-up who tells both sides they can't have everything but offers a pragmatic middle-way. This requires connections and a track record of moderation. In reality, she has spent her premiership libelling Remainers and placating the fetish wing of the Brexit movement. Now she has lost them too and is trying to patch things up with the people she just spent years denigrating.

But what does she have to offer? A customs union which is not a customs union and which she says will not happen but probably will? In what possible world is that a convincing proposition? Security cooperation? We all want security cooperation with the EU, but that alone is not enough to get a Remainer on board. It should never have been in doubt in the first place, under any Brexit model. If that is a crumb then the biscuit is not fit for consumption.

It is the same with Labour. A few Labour votes could have saved her next week. There are Labour MPs out there with Leave-voting constituencies who would have been tempted. But May made no effort to reach out before. When No.10 brought Labour MPs in to tell them about the deal they were baffled to find it being sold as if it were a meeting of Tories. She has no intellectual or empathic ability to reach out to another view, even if she had the personal connections with which to do so.

And then, beyond the strategy or the tactics, is the deal and its salesman. The agreement she's come back with is simply rubbish. It hugs the EU tight enough to remove control, but keeps it distant enough to still take ruinous economic damage. It is like a recipe book on how to injure yourself with crockery. There is no-one on earth who would propose this model from first principle and indeed it is hard to think of a single genuine supporter of it outside Downing Street.

May herself is as pitiful a politician, on a basic presentational level, as we have ever seen. She is shy, nervous, and clearly hating every second of this. These are all perfectly acceptable qualities in a human being and it feels mean to disparage her for them. But one has to ask: If you have no ideas and cannot sell them, why in the name of God would you choose a career that involves selling ideas to a nation?

It is quite wrong to feel pity for her. Firstly, her current misery is of her own making. The deal is terrible because her red lines made any other outcome impossible. That is her responsibility. Secondly, she is still now lying with almost every word she utters. Her entire defence of the deal rests on the most grotesquely misleading characterisations of its contents and implications. Her every answer to any question is deliberately and instinctively evasive. She is a deception machine, a next-generation political mechanism which simply cannot be straight with people, whether it's negotiators in Brussels, MPs in parliament, or the public on the doorstep. The fact she is so unconvincing when lying does not remove the moral responsibility for having done so in the first place.

And now all the various inadequacies we've seen through the last couple of years have joined together to undermine any chance of success she might have had. It would be satisfying, on a moral level, if we were not all forced to suffer the consequences alongside her.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:16 am 
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WhatsApp conversation on Twitter.
That's a good 'un. :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:18 am 
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slick wrote:
I think she will be OK because they are basically all plum who don't want the job at the moment. These are the same people, on both sides of the debate, who welcomed her with open arms when she put her hand up to lead. Spineless, self serving plum just trying to get their own way and their own headlines without risking themselves.

I honestly think history will be kind to May as the only person with the guts to at least try and do the right thing.


Tory press are briefing they aren't short of people who want the job.

Boris, McVay, Davies, Raab (you might know better than most of this is true), Javid, Hunt etc.

Tim Stanley did a good article yesterday saying there will never be a consensus for Brexit so you have to stop trying for one. Next PM should be a brexiteer, get a mandate in an election for Canada +++ (says a lot the deal is Canada +++ not UK +++) or no deal and go from there.

They won't, because they're terrified of Corbyn, but they should.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:18 am 
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An alternative view, Matthew Parris

Quote:
There is something disgusting about the House of Commons in full throat, in pursuit of one of its own. The hypocrisy stinks. A mob of politicians bay their rage against an individual staggering beneath the weight of an impossible burden: a burden they themselves have laid upon her.

After the referendum result was known, those MPs who had campaigned for Leave told their jubilant supporters that Brexit could now be arranged without much difficulty, negotiations with our European partners would be straightforward, and we could be taken quickly and cleanly out of the union to a better place. Some of them even believed this. None admitted to doubts.

Those MPs who had campaigned for Remain laid their public doubts aside and promised to co-operate in securing a good deal that worked well for Britain. Many of them had grave doubts as to whether this was possible. Few admitted to them.


Both sides then chose a leader, Theresa May, to do the job for them. Nobody, in the end, put up against her. They cheered her to the rafters as she set out on the task.

Almost everyone (including commentators outside Westminster) thought and said that her decision to call an election in order to secure a good majority in parliament for her Brexit work, made sense. She went ahead. The election failed. Everyone then started mocking her for her folly.

As the negotiations proceeded it became plain that the task was not straightforward, the obstacles were many, and our EU partners were resisting a Brexit that left us better off outside the union than within it. Quelle surprise. The person who had to deliver this message was the prime minister. She tried to duck an honest expression of the difficulties because she knew that MPs would blame her rather than acknowledge the difficulties.

They began to blame her anyway. Leavers cried Forward; Remainers cried Back. All sides complained that she wasn’t being open and wouldn’t tell us the score. She ploughed on. Her failure to be frank was unwise but there was a reason for it. She had no majority at Westminster so she had chosen to keep as many as possible of her own party on side.

As the negotiations grew tougher, this use of silence and cliché as a tactic failed and criticism from within the Conservative Party grew louder from almost every quarter. But she ploughed on. Her senior civil servants ploughed on too, exploring how much it was possible to secure from our EU partners. As the limits to the possible became clearer, her ministers, unwilling to be associated with difficult compromises, started resigning.

And now she stands exposed. She and her ingenious civil servants have secured a deal that takes to its limit what the European Union is – and has ever been – prepared to give. In its way it is quite an achievement: better, for instance, than Norway or Switzerland have been able to get for their own status as satellite states to the EU.

But it is not what Leave-campaigning MPs had promised their own supporters, so they have turned on her, blaming her caution rather than the inevitabilities of a negotiation between unequal partners. It is easy for them to shout that she should have taken greater risks, should have taken her country and its economy to the brink. But they do not know what might happen if she did, so abusing her for her caution is for them the easy way.


And because the shape of this deal lays bare the secret fears that Remain-supporting MPs have entertained all along, they have chosen to blame her rather than admit what they should have confessed to the voters from the start: that this was always the best Britain was going to be able to get. They point out now – correctly – that this deal isn’t as good as remaining in the EU. But it was never going to be, and they always knew that.

Mrs May is no genius, no lioness and no great persuader. But the Archangel Gabriel, tasked with designing a Brexit that did not bet the house on a future that exists only in the imaginations of a minority of right-wing MPs, would have brought back a similar deal to the one that she and Olly Robbins, her chief negotiator, have designed.

I finish as I started. This week’s message is that May’s deal is as good as we’re going to get. There is something disgusting in screaming abuse at the messenger.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:21 am 
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I like haggis wrote:
slick wrote:
I think she will be OK because they are basically all plum who don't want the job at the moment. These are the same people, on both sides of the debate, who welcomed her with open arms when she put her hand up to lead. Spineless, self serving plum just trying to get their own way and their own headlines without risking themselves.

I honestly think history will be kind to May as the only person with the guts to at least try and do the right thing.


Tory press are briefing they aren't short of people who want the job.

Boris, McVay, Davies, Raab (you might know better than most of this is true), Javid, Hunt etc.

Tim Stanley did a good article yesterday saying there will never be a consensus for Brexit so you have to stop trying for one. Next PM should be a brexiteer, get a mandate in an election for Canada +++ (says a lot the deal is Canada +++ not UK +++) or no deal and go from there.

They won't, because they're terrified of Corbyn, but they should.


There are no shortage of people that want the job, I'm just not sure they want it right now. There is a real danger of taking over, being forced into a GE and losing to Corbyn, never to be seen again. As Chuckles said above, who f**king knows, the usual rules and conventions are well gone.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:23 am 
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slick wrote:
An alternative view, Matthew Parris


I like Parris, but he's a former Tory MP and doesn't actually contradict anything in Dunt's analysis there. Case in point:
Quote:
She tried to duck an honest expression of the difficulties because she knew that MPs would blame her rather than acknowledge the difficulties.


So she lied, but we shouldn't feel bad for her because MPs are delusional. Pretty damning indictment of the supposed leader of the country


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:23 am 
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Toulon's Not Toulouse wrote:
Joost wrote:
I think she'll win - what's the likely alternative; a GE and a Corbyn govt? Not sure the Tory party is that ready to eat itself just yet


Chaos with Ed Miliband? :lol:


Guess it’s better than actual chaos with Emmanuel Macron!


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:24 am 
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Leinsterman wrote:
WhatsApp conversation on Twitter.
That's a good 'un. :lol:


It does perfectly sum up her faults.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:34 am 
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My guess is she'll win, Labour then calls a no confidence vote in the Government which succeeds because disgruntled Brexiteers vote against their own party. All this is a Greek tragedy so it needs a matricide in there somewhere. A GE is called, but because of timelines A50 is 'delayed'. EU says you cannot delay it, only revoke it. After a superheated House of Commons debate, in which three Tories and a Labour MP suffer fatal cardiac arrest, the caretaker Government decides to go for a no-deal Brexit. during the debate, an angry UKIP fisherman runs into the Chamber and assassinates Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nicola Sturgeon finally gives in and unilaterally declares Scottish independence. The European Army sets up base at Gretna and Berwick. King Willem Alexander of The Netherlands sails up the Thames, grabs the Mace from the House of Commons and states that all the nonsense is hereby over. Everyone goes home and makes a cup of tea.

Frankly, it's the only feasible scenario.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:36 am 
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clydecloggie wrote:
My guess is she'll win, Labour then calls a no confidence vote in the Government which succeeds disgruntled Brexiteers vote against their own party. All this is a Greek tragedy so it needs a matricide in there somewhere. A GE is called, but because of timelines A50 is 'delayed'. EU says you cannot delay it, only revoke it. After a superheated House of Commons debate, in which three Tories and a Labour MP suffer fatal cardiac arrest, the caretaker Government decides to go for a no-deal Brexit. during the debate, an angry UKIP fisherman runs into the Chamber and assassinates Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nicola Sturgeon finally gives in and unilaterally declares Scottish independence. The European Army sets up base at Gretna and Berwick. King Willem Alexander of The Netherlands sails up the Thames, grabs the Mace from the House of Commons and states that all the nonsense is hereby over. Everyone goes home and makes a cup of tea.

Frankly, it's the only feasible scenario.



Not a feckin chance


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:36 am 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
slick wrote:
An alternative view, Matthew Parris


I like Parris, but he's a former Tory MP and doesn't actually contradict anything in Dunt's analysis there. Case in point:
Quote:
She tried to duck an honest expression of the difficulties because she knew that MPs would blame her rather than acknowledge the difficulties.


So she lied, but we shouldn't feel bad for her because MPs are delusional. Pretty damning indictment of the supposed leaders of the country


fixed


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:39 am 
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Openside wrote:
clydecloggie wrote:
My guess is she'll win, Labour then calls a no confidence vote in the Government which succeeds disgruntled Brexiteers vote against their own party. All this is a Greek tragedy so it needs a matricide in there somewhere. A GE is called, but because of timelines A50 is 'delayed'. EU says you cannot delay it, only revoke it. After a superheated House of Commons debate, in which three Tories and a Labour MP suffer fatal cardiac arrest, the caretaker Government decides to go for a no-deal Brexit. during the debate, an angry UKIP fisherman runs into the Chamber and assassinates Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nicola Sturgeon finally gives in and unilaterally declares Scottish independence. The European Army sets up base at Gretna and Berwick. King Willem Alexander of The Netherlands sails up the Thames, grabs the Mace from the House of Commons and states that all the nonsense is hereby over. Everyone goes home and makes a cup of tea.

Frankly, it's the only feasible scenario.



Not a feckin chance


That wooosh was audible


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:44 am 
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My preference is to simply donate NI to the EU!


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:45 am 
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Betfair market erring towards her surviving at the moment.

Quote:
@MSmithsonPB
On the Betfair exchange punters currently make it a 66% chance that TMay will survive tonight's confidence vote


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:03 am 
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clydecloggie wrote:
My guess is she'll win, Labour then calls a no confidence vote in the Government which succeeds because disgruntled Brexiteers vote against their own party. All this is a Greek tragedy so it needs a matricide in there somewhere. A GE is called, but because of timelines A50 is 'delayed'. EU says you cannot delay it, only revoke it. After a superheated House of Commons debate, in which three Tories and a Labour MP suffer fatal cardiac arrest, the caretaker Government decides to go for a no-deal Brexit. during the debate, an angry UKIP fisherman runs into the Chamber and assassinates Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nicola Sturgeon finally gives in and unilaterally declares Scottish independence. The European Army sets up base at Gretna and Berwick. King Willem Alexander of The Netherlands sails up the Thames, grabs the Mace from the House of Commons and states that all the nonsense is hereby over. Everyone goes home and makes a cup of tea.

Frankly, it's the only feasible scenario.



I like the idea of taking Berwick back. I'm in.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:16 am 
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Chuckles1188 wrote:
slick wrote:
An alternative view, Matthew Parris


I like Parris, but he's a former Tory MP and doesn't actually contradict anything in Dunt's analysis there. Case in point:
Quote:
She tried to duck an honest expression of the difficulties because she knew that MPs would blame her rather than acknowledge the difficulties.


So she lied, but we shouldn't feel bad for her because MPs are delusional. Pretty damning indictment of the supposed leader of the country


Yeah I know, it's an alternative view.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:17 am 
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Stephen Bush sums things up very well

Quote:
Good morning. Theresa May is facing a vote of no confidence in her leadership of the Conservative Party tonight.

First, a brief reiteration of the rules as they stand: to survive, Theresa May simply needs a bare majority of Conservative MPs to vote confidence in her - that's 158 MPs. There are no other candidates at this stage: it's just a ballot paper asking Conservative MPs if they have confidence in her. If she loses, it triggers a full-blown contest in which she cannot be a candidate. If she wins, she is immune to further challenge for a year - so if May survives tonight's vote, she is safe in post until 12 December 2019.

In 1990, Margaret Thatcher stood down despite winning on the first ballot but back then the rules were completely different. Leadership challenges were triggered by MPs challenging the leader, and candidates needed to command both an absolute majority of MPs and a lead of more than 15 per cent over their challenger, in that case Michael Heseltine, in order to avoid a full leadership challenge in which others, not just the challenger, could stand. Thatcher stood down in order to avoid a defeat in the second round and the emergence of other challengers to her leadership.

The rules are so different now that trying to take lessons of what happened to Thatcher to what might happen to May is about as useful as applying the lessons of Labour's old electoral college. If May wins by one vote, she will hang on until the bitter end.

The question is, will she win? We've always known that there were enough disgruntled Eurosceptics to trigger a confidence vote in May's leadership - but there have never been enough of them to win one alone. So it's significant that, as I wrote in greater detail last night, there is a shift in the Tory mood among middle-ground opinion in the parliamentary party. There are some suggestions that she could increase her chances of survival by promising to stand down after 29 March 2019 if she wins, but the problem is that Conservative MPs remember that May promised MPs in marginal seats that she would not call an election in the 2016 leadership election, and broke that promise less than a year later. (Resentment at that is part of why middle-ground opinion is curdling against her.)

The big question of course is not what this means for who leads the Conservative Party but what it means for Brexit. The Prime Minister is right this morning to say that whether she wins or loses, the parliamentary arithmetic and the political imperatives of the 27 other member states of the European Union will not change. There is no harder negotiated Brexit available than the one agreed by May.

But if Theresa May loses tonight, it triggers a leadership election in which the incentive for every candidate will be to pander to the Tory party membership. There are certainly more than seven pro-European Conservatives who might, if it looks as if a no-deal Prime Minister is planning to control the legislative timetable and prevent a negotiated exit, vote to trigger an election. But there's no guarantee that the next parliament will be anymore able to unite around a Brexit deal than this one and it could simply return a pro no-deal Prime Minister to office. If May goes down in flames, the prospects of a negotiated exit from the European Union may well go up in smoke with her.


Looks like we're leaving without a deal


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:19 am 
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I'm feeling pretty good about Brexit. I've been around the country a bit, this place is going places, which is more than can be said for most of Europe. There you have it.

:thumbup:


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:21 am 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
I'm feeling pretty good about Brexit. I've been around the country a bit, this place is going places, which is more than can be said for most of Europe. There you have it.

:thumbup:


:thumbup: Fantastic news.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:23 am 
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The Sun God wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
I'm feeling pretty good about Brexit. I've been around the country a bit, this place is going places, which is more than can be said for most of Europe. There you have it.

:thumbup:


:thumbup: Fantastic news.


I didn't even open a spreadsheet on it. I just got a good feel. It's all in the gutz you see.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:24 am 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
The Sun God wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
I'm feeling pretty good about Brexit. I've been around the country a bit, this place is going places, which is more than can be said for most of Europe. There you have it.

:thumbup:


:thumbup: Fantastic news.


I didn't even open a spreadsheet on it. I just got a good feel. It's all in the gutz you see.


Are you the guy that predicted a Trump win?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:27 am 
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clydecloggie wrote:
My guess is she'll win, Labour then calls a no confidence vote in the Government which succeeds because disgruntled Brexiteers vote against their own party. All this is a Greek tragedy so it needs a matricide in there somewhere. A GE is called, but because of timelines A50 is 'delayed'. EU says you cannot delay it, only revoke it. After a superheated House of Commons debate, in which three Tories and a Labour MP suffer fatal cardiac arrest, the caretaker Government decides to go for a no-deal Brexit. during the debate, an angry UKIP fisherman runs into the Chamber and assassinates Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nicola Sturgeon finally gives in and unilaterally declares Scottish independence. The European Army sets up base at Gretna and Berwick. King Willem Alexander of The Netherlands sails up the Thames, grabs the Mace from the House of Commons and states that all the nonsense is hereby over. Everyone goes home and makes a cup of tea.

Frankly, it's the only feasible scenario.


Nah!


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:30 am 
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slick wrote:
I think she will be OK because they are basically all plum who don't want the job at the moment. These are the same people, on both sides of the debate, who welcomed her with open arms when she put her hand up to lead. Spineless, self serving plum just trying to get their own way and their own headlines without risking themselves.

I honestly think history will be kind to May as the only person with the guts to at least try and do the right thing.


She has bigger testicklers than the rest of them added together. Might have made a few blunders but has stuck to her guns like a limpet.


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