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 Post subject: Arizona Teacher's Strike
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:42 pm 
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WV school employee strike explained
By Ryan Quinn Staff writer

West Virginia is in the middle of its second-ever teacher strike. Teachers, this time joined by school service personnel, walked off the job Thursday, when thousands came to the state Capitol to show their frustration with legislators and Gov. Jim Justice over what the employees believe are inadequate pay and benefits and harmful legislation. Of the employees who didn’t come to the Capitol, many demonstrated outside their schools and in their communities.

The strike continued Friday, with smaller but still robust protests at the Capitol. Monday will mark the walkout’s third day.

Below are answers to a few questions about this year’s strike, as well as the state’s first teacher strike:

How is this like/unlike the last ‘statewide’ teacher strike?
West Virginia’s first teacher strike in history was nearly three decades ago, in 1990.

But that strike wasn’t technically statewide. It started with eight and gradually grew to include 47 of the state’s 55 counties.

Cabell County was among the eight where teachers never went on strike in 1990.

Before the start of this year’s strike Thursday, one-day work stoppages earlier this month had already closed public schools in 11 counties, including Cabell.

The 1990 strike also did not involve public school service personnel, a category that generally includes non-teachers, like bus drivers and cooks.

How long did the 1990 strike last?
It lasted about 11 days, including eight school days. Teachers in several counties voted to strike March 6, 1990, and walked out the following day, later followed by teachers in other counties. Kanawha County teachers walked out March 8, and Putnam County teachers went on strike the following day.

So far, this year’s strike, not counting the previous one-day work stoppages in certain counties, has lasted two school days. Ahead of those days, county school systems all announced they would be closed.

Union leaders have called for the strike to continue Monday. If certain school systems reopen Monday, that could mean consequences for employees who don’t show up to work in those counties.

Officials in Berkeley and Jefferson counties said Friday that their school systems would be open Monday, but then reversed their decision Saturday afternoon and said schools would be closed.

Why did the 1990 strike end?
It eventually ended after then-Gov. Gaston Caperton called for a special legislative session before the start of the 1990-91 school year. Then-Senate President Keith Burdette and then-House of Delegates Speaker Chuck Chambers also promised to recommend the special session.

In the special session in August, state lawmakers approved a $5,000 pay raise for teachers to be phased in over three years and added about $27 million toward equalizing teacher salaries statewide. They also made various education changes, including creating faculty senates in each school.

On March 10, 1990, a few days into the strike, Kayetta Meadows, then-president of the West Virginia Education Association, said the strike would continue because Caperton had broken his promise to hold a special session. Caperton denied making such a promise.

Did courts try to
stop the 1990 strike?
Some did. On March 12, 1990, a circuit judge in Jefferson County granted a request from the board of education for a preliminary injunction to stop members of the Jefferson County Education Association from continuing to strike.

On March 16, the last school day before striking teachers returned to their classrooms, Kanawha Circuit Judge John Hey also granted an injunction ordering teachers back to work.

Unlike the Jefferson order, Hey’s order — requested by then-state Schools Superintendent Hank Marockie — ordered teachers across the entire state to return to work. That same day, attorneys for teachers unions persuaded the state Supreme Court to postpone enforcement of Hey’s order.

On April 12, state Supreme Court justices upheld the Jefferson preliminary injunction, saying, “Public employees have no right to strike in the absence of express legislation or, at the very least, appropriate statutory provisions for collective bargaining, mediation and arbitration.”

But later that year, on Nov. 9, the high court said Hey’s order was meritless because he didn’t confine his decision to his own circuit. Justices wrote, “We do not believe that the circuit court of one county has the authority to enjoin the acts of citizens occurring in other counties, except where the judge of the other county is interested in the proceeding and unable to act.”

Will the school days lost due
to the strike be made up?
It seems the days missed Thursday and Friday will be made up, according to statements from Christine Campbell, president of the state arm of the American Federation of Teachers union, and Deputy State Schools Superintendent Clayton Burch.

Briana Warner, communications director for the Kanawha County school system, wrote in an email that the missed days Thursday and Friday will be made up in Kanawha on May 25 and 29, which is now the planned last day for students.

She said if the school system were to close for more work stoppages, those days would have to be made up either during spring break or after May 29.

Other counties may take different steps. Mark Manchin, superintendent of Harrison County’s school system and cousin of U.S. Sen. Joe Manchin, said it’s “yet to be determined” whether missed days in Harrison would be made up. Mingo County schools Superintendent Don Spence said the days missed last week would be made up at some undetermined time.

Last year, Justice signed into law a bill (House Bill 2711) that, among many other education changes, allowed county school boards that extend their school days by at least 30 minutes beyond the state minimum requirements to use this accrued extra time to make up days canceled due to necessary school closures.

Will striking employees
lose pay for those days?

Burch said, “The counties that are closing are simply closing school, and any made-up days would be paid as makeup days.”

But he also said it’s yet to be seen whether it makes any difference that these closures were for work stoppages.

“If the system chooses to stay open any day during a work stoppage — and there are enough teachers present to keep the school open — any teacher who didn’t show up to work would have their pay docked for that day,” Warner wrote. “Alternately, the school system could close again — either by choice or because there weren’t enough staff to care for children.”

She said the missed work stoppage days Thursday and Friday wouldn’t affect Kanawha employees’ pay. Manchin said Harrison employees’ pay would likewise be unaffected, and Spence said the same regarding Mingo employees.

State law says, “Personal leave may not be used in connection with a concerted work stoppage or strike,” though, as discussed earlier, school days that school systems agree to cancel ahead of time may be considered neither.

When did West Virginia school
employees last get a raise?
Many school employees interviewed say maintaining Public Employees Insurance Agency health insurance costs and benefits at their current levels is a bigger issue than pay increases. PEIA Finance Board members, at the governor’s urging, have delayed premium increases and benefit cuts, but teachers say that just delays the pain, and a long-term solution is needed.

Employees have also connected their strike to their opposition to bills that would downplay the role of seniority in layoff and transfer decisions, and have other effects.

As established in state law, many school employees already receive an annual pay increase for each additional year of service. Also, individual county school systems can provide raises if they have available local funds.

As for a statewide pay increase, the last one was in 2014, when then-Gov. Earl Ray Tomblin signed into law Senate Bill 391, giving $1,000 pay raises to public school teachers and 2 percent raises to school service personnel.

That law also added this language to state code: “It is the goal of the Legislature to increase the state minimum salary for teachers with zero years of experience and an A.B. [bachelor’s] degree, including the equity supplement, to at least $43,000 by fiscal year 2019.”

Fiscal year 2019 begins July 1, 2018. The state minimum salary plus equity supplement for a teacher described by that law is currently about $33,000, according to state Department of Education data.

On Wednesday, Justice signed a bill (S.B. 267) that will give teachers a 2 percent raise in 2018-19 and a 1 percent raise each year for the next two years. The bill will also give school support staff a 2 percent raise this year and a 1 percent raise next year.

How does West Virginia compare with other states in teacher pay?
The National Education Association, of which the WVEA is part, maintains teacher pay rankings from state to state.

The NEA’s rankings show West Virginia was 48th among the 50 states and Washington, D.C., in average teacher pay in 2017.

https://www.wvgazettemail.com/news/educ ... adf2e.html

From the politcial angle here is the WV Gov. - https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/01/us/west- ... index.html

And here is a local Dem who is a big teacher supporter (ironically also voted Trump) saying his piece and running for office. -
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... one-217217

And how it finally ended
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/ ... ike-438737

The key is gonna be the taskforce and if it does deal with healthcare cost. Yet again an argument for nationalized healthcare.


Edit: Changed title as Oklahoma has had their own.
Edit Again; Kentucky got in the act so we are now adding them.


Last edited by Deadtigers on Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:30 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:52 pm 
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There was a lot of historical symbolism with Blair Mountain (area where Ojeda is from) and the red bandana: https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/03/05/o ... trike.html

Oklahoma could be next. :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:59 pm 
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I am big union guy as my mom was union and I am sure as your family did manufacturing work in Cleveland, your the same way Bowens.

I love Unions and though not perfect, I think they have been disparaged in America for far too long. The only untoucable union people are police unions but courtesy of a 50 years of Dems pushing globalization and GOP attacking them they have lost a lot of clout and respect but think about how all these non-union places essentially adhere to rules created by Unions. And don't get me started on "right to work", that is just Union freeloading.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:27 pm 
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My uncle was Union for a while. But yeah they look out for their people. I grew up near a huge Ford plant, next to the Cleveland airport, and all of those guys had jobs for life basically and were able to provide nice lives for their families. It once employed 15000 people. By the 2000s the number had gone down into the hundreds but I think they are back up to 1500 now.

I think labor is coming back in the Rust Belt, Kucinich could be the next Ohio governor. He's the guy that first got me interested in politics when I was 12/13 years old.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:34 pm 
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Bowens wrote:
My uncle was Union for a while. But yeah they look out for their people. I grew up near a huge Ford plant, next to the Cleveland airport, and all of those guys had jobs for life basically and were able to provide nice lives for their families. It once employed 15000 people. By the 2000s the number had gone down into the hundreds but I think they are back up to 1500 now.

I think labor is coming back in the Rust Belt, Kucinich could be the next Ohio governor. He's the guy that first got me interested in politics when I was 12/13 years old.


Squeaks Kucinich!?! Wow! that will be interesting.

Labor is becoming an issue because we have allowed labor to be gutted with out back-up plans. I fully believe the road to fixing this is architecture and infrastructure type new deal but too many of these pols don't have the heart for it.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:37 pm 
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I fully believe the road to fixing this is architecture and infrastructure type new deal but too many of these pols don't have the heart for it.


Agree 100%


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:26 am 
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Kucinich is actually live on TYT at 8:15 tonight. Didn't know until I just saw a tweet but I will be tuned in.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AMBM8GU-Pek


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:26 pm 
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https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklah ... index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:08 am 
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Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:36 pm 
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Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:44 pm 
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Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


:thumbup:

Got my full support. Mary Fallin is on the wrong side of things already.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:18 pm 
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Bowens wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


:thumbup:

Got my full support. Mary Fallin is on the wrong side of things already.


The question is when is she on the right side of things? from tornadoes, to the environment, to education!!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:36 pm 
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Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper (still is on a region vs. region basis). Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in its existence.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:39 pm 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper. Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in it since he wasn't allowed to strike.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


Maybe I am too damn Northeast for my own good. Buffalo is the furthest I have lived outside of NYC so my perspective is definitely slanted. However, I thought you Union so you have strike as a weapon if you need it but you should always have it, it can't be taken from you.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:48 pm 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper (still is on a region vs. region basis). Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in its existence.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


Union membership was traditionally heavily Catholic. After the New Deal, many southern blacks (eg Memphis Sanitation strike) tried to organize. Not hard to work out why it wasn't popular in pre-Civil Rights era south.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:55 pm 
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Deadtigers wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper. Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in it since he wasn't allowed to strike.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


Maybe I am too damn Northeast for my own good. Buffalo is the furthest I have lived outside of NYC so my perspective is definitely slanted. However, I thought you Union so you have strike as a weapon if you need it but you should always have it, it can't be taken from you.


I can't agree with teachers striking philosophically because they're public servants. What are we going to have, the kids not get educated? If cops go on strike, do the laws not get enforced that day?

Unionization doesn't really fit with my generation because we're far more transient in jobs than the people older than us are. My way to protect myself is if I'm upset with my current place of work, I take my knowledge and go work somewhere else. Now I'm a salaried professional, so unions aren't geared toward me anyway.

My old employer there was one employee that was the gung-ho unionization guy on everything. Looked like a stereotypical Harley biker when you looked at him. Never got much if any support from the hourly employees. One person once put it "if you wanted a union, would you want him to be the one running it?"


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:59 pm 
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Bowens wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper (still is on a region vs. region basis). Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in its existence.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


Union membership was traditionally heavily Catholic.


Union membership was traditionally heavily urban because that's where industry was, and that is where a lot of Catholics lived. Traditionally, very few Catholics in the South. The immigrants came over and went to where the jobs were, which was not in the South. Even the Catholics there now, chances are they're either Yankee transplants one generation ago or they're Latinos.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:09 pm 
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New Orleans had a big catholic population and industry. The traditional New Orleans 'Yat' accent (dying out now) sounds more Brooklyn than southern. But unions never took off in the south because of anti-Catholic, anti-black policies mostly.

Quote:
But for far-right conservatives like Muse, as well as industry groups like the Southern States Industrial Council, labor—including Black labor—posed an especially dangerous threat in Texas. Thanks to a burgeoning wartime economy, along with labor organizing drives spearheaded by the Congress of Industrial Organi­zations and, to a lesser extent, the American Federation of Labor, unions were rapidly growing in Texas. After hovering around 10 percent of the workforce during the 1930s, union membership exploded by 225 percent during the next decade.

Muse and the Christian American Association saw danger. Not only were the unions expanding the bargaining power—and therefore improving the wages and working conditions—of working-class Texans, they also constituted a political threat. The CIO in particular opposed Jim Crow and demanded an end to segregation. Unions were an important political ally to FDR and the New Deal. And always lurking in the shadows was the prospect of a Red Menace, stoked by anti-communist hysteria.

Working in concert with segregationists and right-wing business leaders, Muse and the Association swiftly took action. Their first step in 1941 was to push an “anti-violence” bill that placed blanket restrictions on public union picketing at workplaces. The stated goal was to ensure “uninterrupted” industrial production during World War II, although Texas had the fewest number of strikes in the South, and the law applied to all industries, war-related or not.

Their success with the “anti-violence” bill spurred Muse and the Christian American Association to push for—and pass—similar laws throughout the South. Mississippi adopted an anti-violence statute in 1942; Florida, Arkansas, and Alabama passed similar laws in 1943. It also emboldened them to take on a much bigger prize: ending the ability of labor groups to run a “closed shop,” where union benefits extend only to union members.

In 1945, the Christian American Association—along with allies cemented in earlier anti-union legislative battles, including the Fight for Free Enterprise and the vehemently anti-union Texas Lt. Gov. John Lee Smith—introduced a right-to-work bill in Texas. It passed the House by a 60 to 53 margin, but pro-New Deal forces stopped it in the state senate. Two years later, thanks to a well-funded campaign from the Association and industry—and internal divisions between the craft-oriented AFL and the more militant CIO—Texas’ right-to-work bill was signed into law.

While working to pass right-to-work legislation in Texas, Muse and the Association took their efforts to Arkansas and Florida, where a similar message equating union growth with race-mixing and communism led to the passage of the nation’s first right-to-work laws in 1944. In all, 14 states passed such legislation by 1947, when conservatives in Congress successfully passed Section 14(b) of the Taft-Hartley Act, enshrining the right of states to pass laws that allow workers to receive union benefits without joining a union.

Civil rights leaders like Martin Luther King, Jr., who saw an alliance with labor as crucial to advancing civil rights as well as economic justice for all workers, spoke out against right-to-work laws; this 1961 statement by King was widely circulated last week during Michigan’s labor battles:

In our glorious fight for civil rights, we must guard against being fooled by false slogans, such as ‘right to work.’ It is a law to rob us of our civil rights and job rights. Its purpose is to destroy labor unions and the freedom of collective bargaining by which unions have improved wages and working conditions of everyone…Wherever these laws have been passed, wages are lower, job opportunities are fewer and there are no civil rights.

Interestingly, 11 years later, Kansas also passed a right-to-work law, with the support of Texas-born energy businessman Fred Koch, who also viewed unions as vessels for communism and integration. Koch’s sons Charles and David went on to form the Tea Party group Americans for Prosperity, which pushed for the Michigan right-to-work measure, and is now advocating for states that already have such laws, like North Carolina and Virginia, to further enshrine them in their state constitutions.

https://bit.ly/2H8JM2N


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:14 pm 
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New Orleans is hardly representative of the damn region for obvious reasons. That is a dumb cheap trick and you know that. And the reason they had their own accent is because they were culturally isolated from everyone else in the region for a long time - they were New Orleans but didn't spread too far from New Orleans.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:23 pm 
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No the Yat accent was spoken by the types of working class white Catholics (many Irish and Italians) who settled there compared to the rest of the south because Louisiana was more tolerant of Catholicism. Plus you had lots of people from further up the Mississippi coming down on barges etc since it was the main port. It's not just isolation but a specific set of social circumstances that didn't exist elsewhere. Otherwise the "Uptown" New Orleans elites would have spoken in a similar way, instead of like typical wealthy southerners. It's a class thing.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:33 pm 
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Bowens wrote:
No the Yat accent was spoken by the types of working class white Catholics (many Irish and Italians) who settled there compared to the rest of the south because Louisiana was more tolerant of Catholicism. Plus you had lots of people from further up the Mississippi coming down on barges etc since it was the main port. It's not just isolation but a specific set of social circumstances that didn't exist elsewhere. Otherwise the "Uptown" New Orleans elites would have spoken in a similar way, instead of like typical wealthy southerners. It's a class thing.


IT WAS COLONIZED BY THE FRENCH WHICH WERE CATHOLIC! THEY IN FACT TAUGHT IN FRENCH IN THEIR SCHOOLS UNTIL THE UNION MILITARY GOVERNOR BANNED IT POST-CIVIL WAR! THIS ENTIRE POINT YOU'RE PUSHING IS A LEVEL OF HISTORIC IGNORANCE EQUATING AS THOUGH THE RESIDENTS OF NEW ORLEANS WERE REPRESENTATIVE OF THE RESIDENTS OF ATLANTA, CHARLOTTE, CHARLESTON, OR THE WHOLE REGION!


Last edited by Flyin Ryan on Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:36 pm 
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I don't understand the point you're making at all. I live in Atlanta and am very familiar with how they used to view Catholics down here, including throwing fish at Notre Dame when they came to play Georgia Tech. All you're doing is reinforcing that the south had a Catholicism problem into the 20th century. Which is, among other reasons, why labor unions never took off.

Quote:
The rivalry grew in 1978 as angry Georgia Tech fans pelted the Notre Dame sidelines with bottles during the game, to the point where Devine was concerned about team safety.

They also threw fish in a reference to the derogatory term for Catholics “mackerel snappers,” said Sperber. But the anti-Catholicism of the 1970s was nothing compared to what Rockne faced in the 1920s, when the Klan attempted to march on the university.

“Any game against Georgia Tech was particularly charged with all this extra meaning,” Sperber said, noting that the staunchly anti-Catholic Klan was based in Atlanta.

https://ndsmcobserver.com/2006/09/irish ... tradition/


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:44 pm 
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Bowens wrote:
I don't understand the point you're making at all. I live in Atlanta and am very familiar with how they used to view Catholics down here, including throwing fish at Notre Dame when they came to play Georgia Tech. All you're doing is reinforcing that the south had a Catholicism problem into the 20th century. Which is, among other reasons, why labor unions never took off.

Quote:
The rivalry grew in 1978 as angry Georgia Tech fans pelted the Notre Dame sidelines with bottles during the game, to the point where Devine was concerned about team safety.

They also threw fish in a reference to the derogatory term for Catholics “mackerel snappers,” said Sperber. But the anti-Catholicism of the 1970s was nothing compared to what Rockne faced in the 1920s, when the Klan attempted to march on the university.

“Any game against Georgia Tech was particularly charged with all this extra meaning,” Sperber said, noting that the staunchly anti-Catholic Klan was based in Atlanta.

https://ndsmcobserver.com/2006/09/irish ... tradition/


No, you're ignoring reality. Yes, people didn't like Catholics much, that is completely different from what you seem to be saying that we had sizable numbers of Catholics living in the South and that's why there's no unions because people were anti-Catholic. To even attempt to make your point you went off the reservation relying on a historical anachronism in New Orleans completely unrepresentative of the region as a whole. That'd be like looking at Belfast and thinking that was representative of the UK.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:50 pm 
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No. You say Catholics didn't go to the south because of no industry, which means no unions. I pointed out that up until the last 40 years or so, the south wasn't very welcoming to anyone but white Protestants (outside of Louisiana which was a French colony). And certainly anything blacks experienced was much worse, which is why so many went to work in northern factories. Houston is a perfect example of an industrial city that heavily discriminated against unions, as the article I posted above points out.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:07 am 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
Old Man by the Sea wrote:
Deadtigers wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/us/oklahoma-teachers-textbooks-trnd/index.html

Oklahoma is now in on a strike. They gave the teachers 6K raises but they want 10 and they want more funding for textbooks and school support staff. I as always fully support the teachers.


Oklahoma has treated teachers like crap for too long. I'm all in favour of teachers being paid a decent wage. My state of North Carolina needs to up it's teachers salaries as well. Nurses need an increase in pay and a decrease in patient load in our area. Nurses should unionize.


Their not? I can't believe how these states sell that to people. You can never sell me on union being bad. Or is it illegal?


Outside of stuff like mining, unionization didn't go much past the northeast and upper Midwest because those were the only areas that really saw the Industrial Revolution. Unionization in the South never really occurred because it was an economic backwater until say the 1970s. In North Carolina, maybe the textiles workers did, but the textile business went en masse to Asia 20 or more years ago. There's longshoremen at the two ports, can't think of much else outside of federal jobs such as postal workers (uncle of mine is a postal worker and boy he hates his union :lol: ). It's a large reason why the automakers moved their operations south, labor was cheaper (still is on a region vs. region basis). Publicly, they say it was for diversity, at least my old employer did in a factory that was 80% black. My dad was part of a union as a federal worker, but he saw little to no point in its existence.

Remembering back to what my teachers said as a young North Carolina student. They're unionized but they're not allowed to strike.

Old Man, you're in Hyde County right?


Dare County. Hope you are doing well.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:37 pm 
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Now Kentucky is in the act.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/15/politics ... index.html

It appears the Kentucky Gov is another asshole too. Thank goodness for this tea party stupidity that got guys like this elected. People are seeing how fake these guys are.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:43 pm 
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https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/04/13/us/tea ... index.html


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:33 pm 
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Another red state or now more a purple state has been added. This time the teachers turned down 20K increase over a series of years. Apparently they had cut the Ed budget for 10 straight years. This is why it is such baloney the whole no or low taxes on business to come some place because when the biz arrives there is no infrastructure because all the tax proceeds the town could be getting aren't there and now they have to meet the budget by cutting services.


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