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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:22 am 
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This is GAA levels of idiocy.

Result should stand ffs


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:45 am 
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Wendigo7 wrote:
Floppykid wrote:
Who gives a shite?

The team who automatically qualifies lands straight into your group.

Which realistically makes no difference to Ireland. /arrogance


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:58 am 
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paddyor wrote:
piquant wrote:
I don't know if they've published them, or even if they normally do

So you're waffling.


There will be a replay, as per results out today (not sure if they've been released yet)

Also Spain, Romania and Belgium are being fined, most of the fine for each is suspended.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:03 pm 
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Source? Sounds weird considering the huge mess.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 1:40 pm 
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Laszlo wrote:
Source? Sounds weird considering the huge mess.


The World Rugby submissions as written up by their legal counsel on the 18th April after hearing from the various unions on the player eligibility issues. I don't know if they've gone public with it yet, I doubt it as the various unions are likely in the process of responding and then we'll get a final decision.

I'm not going to paste he whole update into here as it'd be a huge post, but the final summary is as follows:

In summary, World Rugby’s view is that the eligibility issues are dealt with fairly by applying a financial sanction and additional sanctions to each of FER, FRR and FBRB and furthermore (subject to a
review of further information provided), sanctions in respect of each of the Players. Submissions as to additional sanctions will be made having had regard to the various submissions of all the parties.
Furthermore, World Rugby submits that the Belgium v Spain match ought to be replayed.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:10 pm 
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Yeah, I haven't seen this go public, although the way they put emphasis on additional sanctions makes me think they could still disqualify them or deduct points. I'd be surprised if Russians are happy enough with that outcome.


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 7:24 am 
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This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 8:18 am 
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Auckman wrote:
This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


WR should designate it as an emergency international window for the affected teams and enforce release. They claim to run the sport after all.

Although lets face it, Samoa should beat Romania, Spain, Russia, Belgium or whoever else handily enough anyway


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 8:43 am 
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And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

I think the issue with Tahiti is down to "due diligence" or the lack thereof in the Union checking the players met the qualification criteria (in this case a false claim of continual residence in Tahiti). There is some leeway in the punishments meted out for ineligibility but if the Spain, Belgium and Romanian Unions have been / will be proven actually negligent then by rights they should expect the same treatment.

This is still complicated by the fact that WorldRugby seems to be incapable of maintaining accurate and open records of which players have been definitely "locked in" for eligibility purposes, and also allows an apparently legal switch such as Anton Rudoi who played many tests for Kazakhstan senior XV but now represents Russia.

Tl;dr - it's a shitshambles


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 9:20 am 
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jeez this is FUBAR!


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 9:36 am 
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Rudoy used the 7s loophole IIRC


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 5:30 pm 
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So who's getting fired over this? Or at least should be?


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 5:44 pm 
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The game isn't being replayed owing to the performance of the ref in the previous Belgium Vs Spain game, at least not officially. The replay is being allowed only on the basis that the appointment of the ref allowed for a perception of bias. Why that perception of bias will not repeat whenever for instance a 6N game features a ref from one of the other 6N countries isn't clear.

Also I have in mind with the proposed points deductions Spain will not be able to qualify anyway, so it'll be a nothing game. Although saying that have they had the final, final hearing yet?


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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 5:48 pm 
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blindcider wrote:

Although lets face it, Samoa should beat Romania, Spain, Russia, Belgium or whoever else handily enough anyway


The last game against Romania was very close, Samoa edged a game that wasn't close to a classic but Romania had their chances. 17-13 was the winning score I think.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 10:36 am 
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Romania and Samoa played only two games so far, Oaks winning both, last one November 2017.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 11:15 am 
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amzro wrote:
Romania and Samoa played only two games so far, Oaks winning both, last one November 2017.


I thought you beat Tonga and lost to Samoa, was it the other way around? And were they both really bad games or did I remember the wrong one as the bore fest?

The Russian union is very happy with the outcome so far, other than they seem to think Spain are getting off lightly, not clear what's got them so riled about Spain but given the lengths they went to in explaining their own use of the Olympic loophole them seem very unhappy with Spanish lack of detail in this area.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 2:13 pm 
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I see now tonga and fiji are unsure who they'll play in the June tests, was supposed to be Romania (Europe 2), now that's up in the air.
This is fked up on so many levels, from the ref appointment, players eligibility and RE and WR utter incompetence in finding a quick and fair resolution, it's been more than 1 month ffs, all the facts are there.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 5:03 pm 
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Auckman wrote:
This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


This isn't about Spain and the ref. This is about Romania, Spain and Belgium all potentially using ineligible players and deciding on what the sanctions for that may be.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 5:05 pm 
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blindcider wrote:
Auckman wrote:
This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


WR should designate it as an emergency international window for the affected teams and enforce release. They claim to run the sport after all.

Although lets face it, Samoa should beat Romania, Spain, Russia, Belgium or whoever else handily enough anyway


All RWCQs all already require releases from clubs. There's nothing additional WR can do.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 7:24 pm 
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It's complete hearsay, but BC Rugby news citing the Georgians saying Rom, Bel, Esp all disqualified ... thinking of what that means for Canada, my first thought was:


Image


From the T2 Rugby Forum's reading of the Georgian source:

Quote:
- Belgium will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Romania will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Spain will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Russia has been cleared and will be confirmed as Europe 1.
- Germany has been cleared and will become the second placed side behind Russia.
- Portugal will play against Germany with the winner officially becoming Europe 2.
- Samoa will play the winner of Europe 2 in a home-and-away RWC Play-Off.


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 7:39 pm 
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Image


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 8:04 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
It's complete hearsay, but BC Rugby news citing the Georgians saying Rom, Bel, Esp all disqualified ... thinking of what that means for Canada, my first thought was:


Image


From the T2 Rugby Forum's reading of the Georgian source:

Quote:
- Belgium will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Romania will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Spain will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Russia has been cleared and will be confirmed as Europe 1.
- Germany has been cleared and will become the second placed side behind Russia.
- Portugal will play against Germany with the winner officially becoming Europe 2.
- Samoa will play the winner of Europe 2 in a home-and-away RWC Play-Off.


WOW.

That’s huge if true.

Funny that of the all the nations involved, it was the Russians who followed the rules. That’s gotta be a first.

Wouldn’t be surprised if the German players’ strike comes to an abrupt end...


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PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 9:02 pm 
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If that's what happens, good. Sucks for innocent people and rugby fans in those countries, but maybe now they'll appoint administrators that follow the rules.

L'Equipe has reported there will be a May 10th hearing in Dublin where some Rugby Europe officials will be fired.


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PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 6:47 am 
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In the real world, whoever in Euro Rugby was responsible, would be goooooooooooooooooooooone. Is he/are they?


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PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 8:18 am 
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Peteray wrote:
In the real world, whoever in Euro Rugby was responsible, would be goooooooooooooooooooooone. Is he/are they?


Arpaillange and Robin should go, they created this mess


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 9:54 am 
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Nieghorn wrote:

From the T2 Rugby Forum's reading of the Georgian source:

Quote:
- Belgium will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Romania will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Spain will be disqualified for breaching player eligibility laws in RWC qualifiers.
- Russia has been cleared and will be confirmed as Europe 1.
- Germany has been cleared and will become the second placed side behind Russia.
- Portugal will play against Germany with the winner officially becoming Europe 2.
- Samoa will play the winner of Europe 2 in a home-and-away RWC Play-Off.


Decision will supposedly be announced on Thursday May 10th, does sound like Russia can make their travel plans for Japan 2019. Their front 5 will get minced alive by the Irish and Scots.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 11:46 am 
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Auckman wrote:
This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


It wasn't the shitty refereeing performance though. The whole process has been a farce. A South African linesman was withdrawn from England v Ireland because he had spent some time with the England team in the run up to the match. Ireland didn't object and there was no way South Africa could benefit from any result.

Yet here we had all the officials from a nation who stood to benefit on a particular result. One team had made official protests against this prior to the match. Yet they were overruled. And yes; the referee had a shitty performance which just happened to ensure that his national team made it through to the World Cup. It stinks of double standards and unprofessionalism (and yes; bias).

And now we find out that both teams (plus Belgium) have routinely been indulging in activities that would make even the WRU blush in Shane. What a mess.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 1:04 pm 
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BetterByBoat wrote:
Auckman wrote:
This is turning into an utter clusterfuck from World Rugby.

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/201 ... hopes.html

Quote:
Manu Samoa's place at the 2019 Rugby World Cup may be in further doubt - thanks to more bungling from the powers that be.

The Samoans were set to play off against either Spain or Portugal in June for a place at next year's tournament in Japan.

But they might not have their best players available, now that World Rugby has launched an investigation into reports of Belgium and Romania fielding ineligible players in earlier RWC qualifying rounds.

And unlike the situation with Oceania neighbours Tahiti, who were disqualified after also fielding an ineligible player against the Cook Islands in March, it seems the Belgians and Romanians might get another chance to qualify.

If replays of the affected matches are allowed, it'll delay the final qualifier involving Samoa from June until July-August, when some of their best players will be unavailable, due to pre-season commitments with their European clubs.


Spain should've just been told to suck it up the little princesses. Referees will have shit days sometimes. No other match has been replayed because of shitty refereeing performances.


It wasn't the shitty refereeing performance though. The whole process has been a farce. A South African linesman was withdrawn from England v Ireland because he had spent some time with the England team in the run up to the match. Ireland didn't object and there was no way South Africa could benefit from any result.

Yet here we had all the officials from a nation who stood to benefit on a particular result. One team had made official protests against this prior to the match. Yet they were overruled. And yes; the referee had a shitty performance which just happened to ensure that his national team made it through to the World Cup. It stinks of double standards and unprofessionalism (and yes; bias).

And now we find out that both teams (plus Belgium) have routinely been indulging in activities that would make even the WRU blush in Shane. What a mess.


Yeap, but in the defence of Auckman, he is from a country which has sucked it up in a very dignified way in the past on refereeing errors, setting such dignifying precedent that no Tier 1 nation can now whinge about refereering anymore. God bless them for that. They are the spiritual guardians of the sport and of its dignity, and for the spiritual guardians, everything is (only) a forward pass, hence the difficulty to understand the crookedness of Europe Rugby.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 3:52 pm 
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From T2Rugby forum:

Quote:
I have talked to people from the Romanian Union. They all know the same version: Romania, Spain, Belgium are disqualified based on fielding ineligible players, Russia goes to Japan, Germany plays Portugal for repechage. 

Apparently, that famous letter from Tongan Union stating that Fakaosilea never played for Tonga 15s or 7s does not exist (!!!) At least, they (i.e. Romanian union) were not able to produce it when asked for it by World Rugby. Which means we (i.e. Romanian team) fully deserve to be disqualified. 

This is SOOO bitter a pill for everybody (players especially, but supporters too) that it should generate an earthquake at the Romanian Union. But I strongly doubt it will happen, knowing how things go in Romania...


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 4:28 pm 
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:lol:

if that's the case, then it's the right call for me
especially happy spain would not get in, after their shameful post match antics
and russia wasn't that far off the pace anyway, plus they had their eligibility issues in the past and paid the price


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 9:19 pm 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
From T2Rugby forum:

Quote:
I have talked to people from the Romanian Union. They all know the same version: Romania, Spain, Belgium are disqualified based on fielding ineligible players, Russia goes to Japan, Germany plays Portugal for repechage. 

Apparently, that famous letter from Tongan Union stating that Fakaosilea never played for Tonga 15s or 7s does not exist (!!!) At least, they (i.e. Romanian union) were not able to produce it when asked for it by World Rugby. Which means we (i.e. Romanian team) fully deserve to be disqualified. 

This is SOOO bitter a pill for everybody (players especially, but supporters too) that it should generate an earthquake at the Romanian Union. But I strongly doubt it will happen, knowing how things go in Romania...


It is a lie or the people who circulated this (from few days already) misunderstood.


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 3:54 am 
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Quote:
Decision will supposedly be announced on Thursday May 10th


Let’s hope so, this saga needs to end.

Hopefully it’s true that Romania won’t be there, if there’s gotta be a whipping boy let it at least be someone we don’t get to see often.

Ditto Namibia for that matter.


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 1:40 pm 
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amzro wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
From T2Rugby forum:

Quote:
I have talked to people from the Romanian Union. They all know the same version: Romania, Spain, Belgium are disqualified based on fielding ineligible players, Russia goes to Japan, Germany plays Portugal for repechage. 

Apparently, that famous letter from Tongan Union stating that Fakaosilea never played for Tonga 15s or 7s does not exist (!!!) At least, they (i.e. Romanian union) were not able to produce it when asked for it by World Rugby. Which means we (i.e. Romanian team) fully deserve to be disqualified. 

This is SOOO bitter a pill for everybody (players especially, but supporters too) that it should generate an earthquake at the Romanian Union. But I strongly doubt it will happen, knowing how things go in Romania...


It is a lie or the people who circulated this (from few days already) misunderstood.


It's not a lie as such, it's the truth, nothing but the truth, and nothing like the whole truth.

It's actually true to say there's no letter that says Fakaosilea never played 7s or 15s, and not just down to the letter in question being an email. Though the FRR can certainly say there's an email, it just doesn't quite say the player in question never played 7s, rather it says he wasn't captured. WR have an issue as the answer he wasn't captured was predicated on a question of him having played XVs or next senior rugby only. I can see why both Romania and Russia take a different view on proceedings, and one side (probably Romania) is going to be more than a little cross after the hearing tomorrow


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 1:59 pm 
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piquant wrote:
amzro wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
From T2Rugby forum:

Quote:
I have talked to people from the Romanian Union. They all know the same version: Romania, Spain, Belgium are disqualified based on fielding ineligible players, Russia goes to Japan, Germany plays Portugal for repechage. 

Apparently, that famous letter from Tongan Union stating that Fakaosilea never played for Tonga 15s or 7s does not exist (!!!) At least, they (i.e. Romanian union) were not able to produce it when asked for it by World Rugby. Which means we (i.e. Romanian team) fully deserve to be disqualified. 

This is SOOO bitter a pill for everybody (players especially, but supporters too) that it should generate an earthquake at the Romanian Union. But I strongly doubt it will happen, knowing how things go in Romania...


It is a lie or the people who circulated this (from few days already) misunderstood.


It's not a lie as such, it's the truth, nothing but the truth, and nothing like the whole truth.

It's actually true to say there's no letter that says Fakaosilea never played 7s or 15s, and not just down to the letter in question being an email. Though the FRR can certainly say there's an email, it just doesn't quite say the player in question never played 7s, rather it says he wasn't captured. WR have an issue as the answer he wasn't captured was predicated on a question of him having played XVs or next senior rugby only. I can see why both Romania and Russia take a different view on proceedings, and one side (probably Romania) is going to be more than a little cross after the hearing tomorrow

So does this basically come down to google translate?
:lol:


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2018 2:08 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
piquant wrote:
amzro wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
From T2Rugby forum:

Quote:
I have talked to people from the Romanian Union. They all know the same version: Romania, Spain, Belgium are disqualified based on fielding ineligible players, Russia goes to Japan, Germany plays Portugal for repechage. 

Apparently, that famous letter from Tongan Union stating that Fakaosilea never played for Tonga 15s or 7s does not exist (!!!) At least, they (i.e. Romanian union) were not able to produce it when asked for it by World Rugby. Which means we (i.e. Romanian team) fully deserve to be disqualified. 

This is SOOO bitter a pill for everybody (players especially, but supporters too) that it should generate an earthquake at the Romanian Union. But I strongly doubt it will happen, knowing how things go in Romania...


It is a lie or the people who circulated this (from few days already) misunderstood.


It's not a lie as such, it's the truth, nothing but the truth, and nothing like the whole truth.

It's actually true to say there's no letter that says Fakaosilea never played 7s or 15s, and not just down to the letter in question being an email. Though the FRR can certainly say there's an email, it just doesn't quite say the player in question never played 7s, rather it says he wasn't captured. WR have an issue as the answer he wasn't captured was predicated on a question of him having played XVs or next senior rugby only. I can see why both Romania and Russia take a different view on proceedings, and one side (probably Romania) is going to be more than a little cross after the hearing tomorrow

So does this basically come down to google translate?
:lol:


I couldn't remotely attest to the language skills at the Romanian and Tongan unions in a wider sense or in relation to this issue. However, even if we accept that Romania made a legitimate attempt to establish if a player was captured, and given they've made similar enquiries about other players and dropped interest on learning they were captured I think it fair to allow them that, there is still a player has to sign an eligibility form. And I for all rugby players are pretty much idiots to a man I do find it hard to move past the player not knowing he'd played for his country, or at least to have sympathy for him making such a bad mistake


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 7:33 pm 
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And the big news is...they're having a meeting about it.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:06 pm 
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Decisions should be made public today, allegedly.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 1:39 pm 
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Qualification process starting to look like amateur hour and these aren't the only ones with Tahiti previously rubbed.
Its also putting mice before men in potential match ups.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 2:53 pm 
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Why the fudge don't world rugby maintain a register of all players playing international rugby and their eligibility?


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 3:24 pm 
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Zakar wrote:
Why the fudge don't world rugby maintain a register of all players playing international rugby and their eligibility?


From time to time some organisations don't volunteer for extra work and costs.


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