Strictly speaking. most dentists aren't doctors. They have Bachelor degrees.

For that matter, MBBS-esses are also medically "doctored", i.e. with a courtesy title.

On the other hand, there's bugger all legal restriction on the title "Doctor". We could all style ourselves as one.

No.

Really? Do you tend to check each Countries official religion before visiting?

So strictly speaking I can call you a moron or should it be Dr Moron?

She doesn't need a visa.

No need. I know who they are.

The reporting is really unclear on this, but it seems she had a standard tourist 30 day pay on arrival visa from a previous trip. It was still in date, but they're only single entry, so she was told she needed to pay for a new visa. She protested and got into an argument with the immigration officer - which most of us know is a pretty stupid thing to do.

Her Swedish passport was expired. Her Iranian passport was valid, but didn't have a current visa. She was offered a 4 day short stay visa which would have been enough time to resolve issues, but kicked off at having to pay for a processing fee.

Thanks - as I said, the reporting of this is really poor

Dubai is still a shithole though.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/co ... 64368.html

I hope what you rmeaneally my attitude towards archaic theocracies. No, I'm not very interested in visiting any of them, with the exception of Iran. Like I said, slavish dark aged unthinking and sexism just ain't my thing and it doesn't become my thing just because "they have different skin colour so it's okay".

I'm pretty sure that the only actual theological theocracies left in the world are all Islamic, and that says something about Islam, either good or bad depending on whether you think the doctrine of Islam is a net positive or negative force in the world.

BTW, you have no idea what my attitude to "anyone Muslim" is because you don't listen to what I say or you read between the lines and guess at what I "really think" in favour of going off an justice warrior crusades.

A woman complaining about a processing fee? Allegedly according to someone on a rugby forum? Good enough for me! Lock her up with her kid without food or water or a toilet, to be released only upon paying 10,000 of thousands pounds and the personal intervention of some Sheik Mohummad. Sounds fair. All her fault, the damn woman shouldn't be so hysterical, am I right? Woman causing a fuss deserve what they get and so do their children.

Lovely to see you riding into battle on behalf of social justice for this wronged woman, Mog. Right on comrade, right on.

It just does my head in how otherwise intelligent people, when it comes to anything even tediously connected to one certain religion, clamour to throw their brains out the window as well as all their allegedly previously held moral ideologies. This thread is very inductive of that phenomenon.

This a country that charged a Norweigan woman for having unwed sex after she reported rape. And now we have people here leaping to their defence over this Swedish woman because she (allegedly) "caused a fuss". What in the f_ck?

you're conflating things a bit there mate...

the original 'news report' from the Daily Mail over egged it. A lot. The details have all been clarified in this thread. There was no barbaric treatment. I've got no great tolerance for the various governments practising their weird shit in the ME myself but I don't think the UAE deserve the shit they've been flung in this thread.

Well, there is the Vatican City.
And didnt Netanyahu just announce Israel as one too?

The border guards at the Vatican City are right bastards n all.

Border guards are fine. And people are generally fine when they visit. Unless they are an attractive child of course...

Bit like muslim theocracies tbh.

Helveticist

Your attitude to muslims is plain to see, they are "unthinking", "dark aged" and "sexist" by virtue of their birth and religion.

I've been to a couple of muslim countries and found the people pretty nice (and indeed in non muslim countries). I didn't spit nails at them and think they were inferior to Europeans (like, say, defending a Swedish woman unthinkingly despite her having broken the law) just because they were born into a certain religion.

Now that's not to say the Emirates isn't a shithole, it certainly is.

How many hundreds of thousands of people pass through Dubai entry checks each year without issue?
Border check officials in many countries can be sour faced humourless individuals, but so long as you follow the rules and are polite then things like this don't happen.
While I agree that Dubai and similar countries are repressive and backwards regimes, and their laws are sporadically applied.... surely that means you don't get all hysterical at airport security. That won't go well in any country. And getting shirty with them after you try and enter on an expired passport is just extremely special.

I'd expect similar treatment in most countries for any person of any race or gender for trying to enter a country on an expired passport, then refusing to pay a fairly small fee to be allowed entry. I guess I've never been in a similar situation despite visiting many countries as I'm not stupid enough to try to use an expired passport, and I don't get into a hissy fit with border control guards.

No. Stop that. You're now trying to cover your initial emotional response with fallacies and exclamation marks.

It wasn't just complaining about the processing fee, she was photographing people in a secure area of the airport. Try that anywhere in the World, that will go down like a lead balloon. She REFUSED a 4 day short stay visa, they were STILL trying to help her at this point. It was her decision not to take up that offer.

The purgatory of an airport where people denied entry remain is NOT a holding cell, there are toilets, there is food and water, I have dealt with several people in there and it is nothing like the account you are clinging to. She is flat out lying about that one.

10,000 of thousands of pounds? Link?

Quit trying to make this about her being a woman, if anything, she got an easier ride than many other men (especially men with browner skin than her). You're just pushing this to feed your white knight fantasy and use it to leverage in your virtue signalling about your feelings about Muslims.

No dude you're just not really getting it. In fact you're just doing what I predicted.

Let's put it this way and perhaps we can come to some agreement if we just leave out all mention of Islam or Muslims: the UAE is hardly the most progressive, tolerant place for women, or indeed any minority group, and that's something we should agree to condemn. That is. if we care about those social issues.

Likewise, assuming the human rights organization is correct, locking up a mother and daughter with no access to food, water or toilet for three days, only to be released at the personal intervention of Sheik Muhummad after tens of thousands of pounds were paid, all under the pretense that she "drank alcohol", when the real reason appears to be that she "caused a fuss about her visa" probably demonstrates to at least a moderate degree that those attitudes we should be condemning from the first paragraph.

Can we agree on that?

Every time you get caught out wildly misunderstanding issues, giving emotional responses based on next to no information, making up entirely imagined narratives in your head, you then lash out at people showing you the error of your ways, and attempt to describe them as being SJWs, Islam supporters, or whatever else you think will help give you a toehold on the high moral ground.

Every damn time.

This is NOTHING to do with supporting Islam, no matter how much you're attempting to paint it as such.

But, yeah, you'll just continue with this line yet again, attempt to introduce every other broad why-you-disagree-with-Islam dogwhistle you can think of, all to disguise your initial embarrassmnet of a post where crawled up the arse of your high horse and completely shat the bed.

This is just all complete rubbish. I didn't even bring up Islam, Bullettyme did. I answered his question honestly, he's the one that wanted to talk about that. You're just ranting because I pointed out that I can't see that there's any reason to make excuses or apologize on the part of the UAE custom's officials in this instance, and assuming that the woman was "being hysterical" and "deserved it" is pretty misogynistic, and it was a damn good point. Did that hit a nerve?




Mate I'm just repeating what was written in the OP. You can read it there. The source material may or may not be wrong. that human rights organization maybe lying about the conditions she was held in, but I'm just recounting the story. And you don't have the facts any more than I do, btw. But you have obviously picked your side. Personally, faced with conflicting versions of events, I'd be very cautious about making benign assumptions about any nation that charges foreign women for the crime of sex when they report rape to the police.

That's what I have basically heard also...... she got off very leniently and this is a non story really.

That's a nine year old article in which there was a massive 'online' inquest into it's veracity and source material and where the journalist who penned it was forced to make various apologies as to the journalistic liberties he took in writing it......Bottom line, it was largely dis-credited. Not saying he was completely wrong but if you're going to do a hatchet job on any subject, don't spoof.

There’s a bit more to it allegedly - can we start to make sense of why she was such a frequent visitor

Ahhhhh...tips nose and nods sagely . Silly woman anyway getting lippy with a passport control officer.

You wouldn't go to Turkey? Its consistently in the worlds top ten tourist destinations for a reason and I can't wait to go back

Apparently she performs Botox treatments for the expat community

My sister was there with friends and they got hassled morning, noon and night by local menfolk, including one incident that would have turned very ugly if police hadn't intervened. Couldn't wait to get home.

Maybe they just picked a bad resort or they were perceived as being "up for it" because they weren't accompanied by husbands/boyfriends/etc but something like that puts people off visiting.

Yikes. Working on a visitor's visa? Working without having a registered company? Undertaking medical procedures without a licence to practice in the country?

Hope she's already left the country...

I can agree that it is a repressive place, I've never lived there so I'd hate to be shitting all over it for the people who actually do live there but stories from friends who lived there painted a very dark picture of the place.

"According to a press release by the Dubai Media Office..."

The dentist and her young daughter were initially denied access to a toilet, water and food while being held in a cell for three days, according to the human rights group "Detained in Dubai". The OP says it cost the family tens of thousands of pounds to secure a release, and that was only after the personal intervention of the Sheikh.

So ... what the "actual FACTS" are, the truth is that nobody really knows. And it's perfectly possible that this is a whole storm in a teacup. It's also entirely possible that it's not. I don't know who "Detained in Dubai" are, and I don't know that woman, maybe, just maybe they're liars. But maybe they're not. In any case, I'm not about to trust them as much as you clearly are willing to trust the Dubai Media Office, for example. I don't know who is telling the truth, although personally, when dealing with a nation that charges foreign women for the crime of sex outside marriage when they report being raped to the police, I'd be very cautious when siding with the Dubai authorities, and I think that's a fair enough stance.

Regarding your bullshit about "white knights" ignoring Bangladeshis and Indonesians: get the f-ck out of here with that shit. I'm talking about condemning archaic ideologies. It's all you social justice warriors that keep trying desperately to make it about race or Islam or whatever it is you want to get social justice warrior-y about. I'm talking about ideas and actions, not skin colours. I'm criticising the archaic mentality over there, regardless of the skin colour of the "victims", and I'm using the case of this Swedish woman as an example. It is, afterall, the topic of the thread. I'm basically saying that, considering the UAE's long history of misogyny and poor human rights record, one's very first reaction, not really knowing "the actual facts", should definitely not be "hysterical woman got what she deserved". That's pretty f-cking dense. The appropriate response is, serious scepticism of any claims made by the Dubai Media Office and unapologetic condemnation if the reports are true. However on the other hand - and thankyou very much - if this thing with the Swedish woman all turns out to be hot air, I can just point to the Bangladeshi blokes and the Indonesian women and say, "well there then ... we still should be condemning their mentality over there and not excusing it and apologising for it" (which, please note, is all I've been saying from the very start).

My daughter feels the same way about Ballybunion.

We love it. It's great for sailing. We took the family from Marmaris to Datça in a 44 footer. We have made great friends there. It started with a trip to Perili having chartered from Sunsail. We snuck over to Simi. Bit dodgy as it's in Greece and there's not a lot of love between them. (We flouted the charter contract to do so.)

Loads of overflying planes.

My conversational Greek is not bad but my Turkish is hopeless.

The food is terrific, the people friendly, especially in the tourist areas.

One of the family we met grows garlic on the Isle of Wight! We remain close friends. They put us up if we are sailing in the Solent and could do with a good night's sleep.

I can imagine but I didn't see anything like that, perhaps my ex prop physique wasn't to their liking

Agree about the hassle for pretty ladies. It is tiresome but you just need to tell them off. I was taught the Turkish equivalent of stop it and go away. It's a bit stonger than that. It works though.

My sister and some friends experienced the same thing in South America. Although not to the extent of getting the police involved.

Never experienced it in Turkey or UAE but with my girlfriend in Morocco I was expecting the same based on some reviews from people here, it actually wasn't that bad although huge pain in the ass with people hassling you to buy something.