Planet Rugby Forum

bessantj wrote:

Clive Simms wrote:George North. Downed tools apparently

Yeah I just read that here and that's bad form.

It's nice to see someone doing a reverse Ryan Giggs and putting country before club

La heinous wrote:That's bad news about Walker... was top of the Osprey winger pecking order when fit

Dragons were horrible. Not sure anyone had even a half decent game. Dorian Jones looked alright I suppose.

Bernard Jackman may be good on social media hype, but lets be frank, he is no doing anything as coach. The Kings have conceded a ton of points game in game out, lost 16 straight and Jackman who coaches the Lions, can't get more than one try? I don't think The Dragon's are going anywhere under him.

eldanielfire wrote:

La heinous wrote:That's bad news about Walker... was top of the Osprey winger pecking order when fit

Dragons were horrible. Not sure anyone had even a half decent game. Dorian Jones looked alright I suppose.

Bernard Jackman may be good on social media hype, but lets be frank, he is no doing anything as coach. The Kings have conceded a ton of points game in game out, lost 16 straight and Jackman who coaches the Lions, can't get more than one try? I don't think The Dragon's are going anywhere under him.

I assume you mean not going anywhere under him and you'd be right. The new signings will make a difference and off load the deadwood they have there.

A bugger about Walker. Poor lad

Yeah, Jackman is walking a tight line at the moment, and may well not see next season. His influence however may well be positive in the end as he's talked a good talk, and that seems to have got a fair few to come on bored...but the performances have been abject. Their defence in particular is atrocious.

The Walker news is a sickener really. He should have been a 50+ cap international. Injuries can be cruel.

And as a last point, and going back to someone a while back questioning Steff Evans' inclusion, the Wail have dropped a load of stats from the first 3 games, and Evans and Shingler shine.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rug ... x-14366009

The magnificent Jiffy jnr proving what the gent he is

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43272209

This last few games have been hard to take - Benetton at home, Edinburgh at home, Kings away. 3 losses in which we have not scored more than 15 points, and this with more of the long term injured back than we've had for most of the year. Earlier in the season there was hope that we were creating a better style of play - we were at least showing glimpses of being threatening, scoring tries, like in the Ulster and Blues games, that promised that with a stronger platform and more work on a defensive system, things could turn around.

I'm still unhappy about the areas we have recruited - without more front 5 players we'll still have a shaky platform - and the defence seems to have fallen apart, with no attacking game compensating for it. Connor leaving gives an opportunity to bring in someone who can get more out of our attacking play, but Marnitz has had a while now and the defence is not looking organised, which is worrying. You'd expect by now that they'd have been able to get systems sorted out, after all the early work on strength and conditioning that led to so many injuries. Hard to see much in the patterns of play to give hope of anything before the end of the season.

Jeff the Bear wrote:Yeah, Jackman is walking a tight line at the moment, and may well not see next season. His influence however may well be positive in the end as he's talked a good talk, and that seems to have got a fair few to come on bored...but the performances have been abject. Their defence in particular is atrocious.

The Walker news is a sickener really. He should have been a 50+ cap international. Injuries can be cruel.

And as a last point, and going back to someone a while back questioning Steff Evans' inclusion, the Wail have dropped a load of stats from the first 3 games, and Evans and Shingler shine.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rug ... x-14366009

Jackman's done a great job at making it seem something good is happening at Dragons. I was willing to give the team time, but if anything it's getting worse and it's looking worse coached. Perhaps Jackman should be more a director of Rugby with a head coach under him?

eldanielfire wrote:

Jeff the Bear wrote:Yeah, Jackman is walking a tight line at the moment, and may well not see next season. His influence however may well be positive in the end as he's talked a good talk, and that seems to have got a fair few to come on bored...but the performances have been abject. Their defence in particular is atrocious.

The Walker news is a sickener really. He should have been a 50+ cap international. Injuries can be cruel.

And as a last point, and going back to someone a while back questioning Steff Evans' inclusion, the Wail have dropped a load of stats from the first 3 games, and Evans and Shingler shine.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rug ... x-14366009

Jackman's done a great job at making it seem something good is happening at Dragons. I was willing to give the team time, but if anything it's getting worse and it's looking worse coached. Perhaps Jackman should be more a director of Rugby with a head coach under him?

Around December there were signs of an interesting attacking game, we went wide but with a deliberate structure that seemed to be paying dividends. We scored tries playing a fast, offloading game with pods of 4 in wide channels that all seemed to be on the same wavelength...but since December it's like we've decided that wasn't working and reverted to...I don't know what. There is no shape to the play, despite some of the better players now being back. I find it hard to understand why we've suddenly regressed.

penguin wrote:

eldanielfire wrote:

Jeff the Bear wrote:Yeah, Jackman is walking a tight line at the moment, and may well not see next season. His influence however may well be positive in the end as he's talked a good talk, and that seems to have got a fair few to come on bored...but the performances have been abject. Their defence in particular is atrocious.

The Walker news is a sickener really. He should have been a 50+ cap international. Injuries can be cruel.

And as a last point, and going back to someone a while back questioning Steff Evans' inclusion, the Wail have dropped a load of stats from the first 3 games, and Evans and Shingler shine.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rug ... x-14366009

Jackman's done a great job at making it seem something good is happening at Dragons. I was willing to give the team time, but if anything it's getting worse and it's looking worse coached. Perhaps Jackman should be more a director of Rugby with a head coach under him?

Around December there were signs of an interesting attacking game, we went wide but with a deliberate structure that seemed to be paying dividends. We scored tries playing a fast, offloading game with pods of 4 in wide channels that all seemed to be on the same wavelength...but since December it's like we've decided that wasn't working and reverted to...I don't know what. There is no shape to the play, despite some of the better players now being back. I find it hard to understand why we've suddenly regressed.

Shoehorning in a FB at 10/ playing your 5th choice 10 has definitely not helped, as well as Griffiths' injury. He was just keeping our already very green back row's head above water

La heinous wrote: Shoehorning in a FB at 10/ playing your 5th choice 10 has definitely not helped, as well as Griffiths' injury. He was just keeping our already very green back row's head above water

I still have hope to one day see a Dragons backrow of Moriarty, Griffiths and Faletau...would be something to behold. High quality, dynamic players with a good number of years to grow together. Griffiths has been excellent with a young team around him, think he'll go up a notch with quality around.

I look at the potential backline for next season and I'm excited at some of the attacking talent there, but as Wales have shown, talent isn't enough, you still need structure to get the most out of that talent. I also don't see a place for Kirchner in a first choice backline which rather begs the question wouldn't we be better off with spending what must be one of our higher salaries on a front 5 forward?

My pick for the Italy game

Sanjay
North
someone who can play 13
Parkes the poach
Steff
Anscombe
Cawdor

Evans
Owens
Lee
AWJ
Hill
Navidi
Shingler
not Toby

Winger going to Scarlets on loan. Coming from over the bridge.

Kid A wrote:Winger going to Scarlets on loan. Coming from over the bridge.

Surely they've only got about 3 fit senior wingers anyway? Dirksen, Hassler and Howells...Habberfield was playing in the wing the other week, and that kid Cross (Dewi?) the week before...so not too many options themselves.

penguin wrote:

Kid A wrote:Winger going to Scarlets on loan. Coming from over the bridge.

Surely they've only got about 3 fit senior wingers anyway? Dirksen, Hassler and Howells...Habberfield was playing in the wing the other week, and that kid Cross (Dewi?) the week before...so not too many options themselves.

Wrong bridge

Kid A wrote:

penguin wrote:

Kid A wrote:Winger going to Scarlets on loan. Coming from over the bridge.

Surely they've only got about 3 fit senior wingers anyway? Dirksen, Hassler and Howells...Habberfield was playing in the wing the other week, and that kid Cross (Dewi?) the week before...so not too many options themselves.

Wrong bridge

I see...said the blind man.

Any suggestion of who?

penguin wrote:Any suggestion of who?

Josh Adams?!?

Saturnine wrote:

penguin wrote:Any suggestion of who?

Josh Adams?!?

Worcester already gave a 'hands off' message last week, would be a huge surprise. Would be interested to see how he would go under Pivac, but any of the regions would be happy to have him. Big, strong, quick - plays across the back 3 - I'm sure there will be some competition for him next year when his contract is up.

How does he feel about the Scarlets these days? Thought he left because he felt he was getting the sh*tty end of the stick with them.

Frodder wrote:My pick for the Italy game

Sanjay
North
someone who can play 13
Parkes the poach
Steff
Anscombe
Cawdor

Evans
Owens
Lee
AWJ
Hill
Navidi
Shingler
not Toby

My pick for the Italy game

Halfpenny
Sanjay
Scottie - agree his form is going downhill
Parkes
Steff
Anscombe
Cawdor

Smith
Dee
Lee
AWJ
Hill
James Davies
Shingler
not Toby

Seb Davies, Tipuric, Rob Evs, Ken, Tomos, Aled, Patchell, North

GWO2 wrote:How does he feel about the Scarlets these days? Thought he left because he felt he was getting the sh*tty end of the stick with them.

Who knows. His Dad is not best pleased with us. But new coaches, new Board, good development, good place to be......... or he can go to the Ospreys and play Challenge Cup.

Kid A wrote:Winger going to Scarlets on loan. Coming from over the bridge.

Tom Varndell it is then.

He just put a pic of teh Severn Bridge on his twitter feed too.
https://twitter.com/tom_varndell?lang=en

LandOTurk wrote:

Frodder wrote:My pick for the Italy game

Sanjay
North
someone who can play 13
Parkes the poach
Steff
Anscombe
Cawdor

Evans
Owens
Lee
AWJ
Hill
Navidi
Shingler
not Toby

My pick for the Italy game

Halfpenny
Sanjay
Scottie - agree his form is going downhill
Parkes
Steff
Anscombe
Cawdor

Smith
Dee
Lee
AWJ
Hill
James Davies
Shingler
not Toby

Seb Davies, Tipuric, Rob Evs, Ken, Tomos, Aled, Patchell, North

James Davies is so not going to get picked. More than happy to be book marked

LandOTurk wrote:

GWO2 wrote:How does he feel about the Scarlets these days? Thought he left because he felt he was getting the sh*tty end of the stick with them.

Who knows. His Dad is not best pleased with us. But new coaches, new Board, good development, good place to be......... or he can go to the Ospreys and play Challenge Cup.

Typical Turk response. One or two good seasons and they think they are gods gift. Suppose we better get used to it, they`ll still be telling us how good they were now, in 30 to 40 years time. (as in the day the pubs ran dry)

You want to remember how many times the Ospreys have won the league compared to Llanelli

GWO2 wrote:

LandOTurk wrote:

GWO2 wrote:How does he feel about the Scarlets these days? Thought he left because he felt he was getting the sh*tty end of the stick with them.

Who knows. His Dad is not best pleased with us. But new coaches, new Board, good development, good place to be......... or he can go to the Ospreys and play Challenge Cup.

Typical Turk response. One or two good seasons and they think they are gods gift. Suppose we better get used to it, they`ll still be telling us how good they were now, in 30 to 40 years time. (as in the day the pubs ran dry)

You want to remember how many times the Ospreys have won the league compared to Llanelli

The Ospreys were the dominant force

Were

WERE

GWO2 wrote:

LandOTurk wrote:

GWO2 wrote:How does he feel about the Scarlets these days? Thought he left because he felt he was getting the sh*tty end of the stick with them.

Who knows. His Dad is not best pleased with us. But new coaches, new Board, good development, good place to be......... or he can go to the Ospreys and play Challenge Cup.

Typical Turk response. One or two good seasons and they think they are gods gift. Suppose we better get used to it, they`ll still be telling us how good they were now, in 30 to 40 years time. (as in the day the pubs ran dry)

You want to remember how many times the Ospreys have won the league compared to Llanelli

One should never miss an opportunity, mate.

I remember working in England in 1999 and was in an internal meeting. Gibbs of course scored that try and the English in the office were pissed off that their significantly better team (which was true) did not win. In a very very rare moment of understanding for them, I said I thought they were the better team too. As we all headed out of the meeting room, one of the other Manager's, who was also Welsh called me back in and gave me a proper dressing down for not "kicking them when they were down". I apologized and learned my lesson from that.

Oh and if we are talking history, do you remember how many times Swansea have won the cup compared to the Scarlets?

Cups? Pah, try going two seasons unbeaten back to back, beating an actual quality All Blacks side, unlike that shite one that Llanelli beat, and beating the other giants of the southern hemisphere. You can all thank Newport's Arthur "Monkey" Gould for actually teaching the Welsh how to play the "Welsh" way. I could go on, but I can't maintain an erection for long these days.

Not Frankie wrote:Cups? Pah, try going two seasons unbeaten back to back, beating an actual quality All Blacks side, unlike that shite one that Llanelli beat, and beating the other giants of the southern hemisphere. You can all thank Newport's Arthur "Monkey" Gould for actually teaching the Welsh how to play the "Welsh" way. I could go on, but I can't maintain an erection for long these days.

Fair play. That 1887-89 team for Newport was excellent. It's the 129 years since that have been a bit sparse mind.

Genuine question though for 'port fans. Is Jackman worth a punt for another year or is he all talk? I can't but help feel a good coach would have got at least 8 wins out off that team by the end of the season. He appears to be all bluster, which is how he got the job in the first place.

I was very optimistic, but I'm starting to worry that he's lost the dressing room. The selection of Kirchner at 10 over Christmas was also something to flutter the nerves. Connor is off at the end of the season, and I hope that'll be a positive step, but who's going to replace him? Strange I'm hoping. So, yeah, apart from the backs, I haven't a clue if Jackman is a good thing or bad thing, entertaining though. We shall see come December.

LandOTurk wrote: Oh and if we are talking history, do you remember how many times Swansea have won the cup compared to the Scarlets? [/size][/color]

That`s proving my point.

Not Frankie wrote:Cups? Pah, try going two seasons unbeaten back to back, beating an actual quality All Blacks side, unlike that shite one that Llanelli beat, and beating the other giants of the southern hemisphere. You can all thank Newport's Arthur "Monkey" Gould for actually teaching the Welsh how to play the "Welsh" way. I could go on, but I can't maintain an erection for long these days.

Lucky you can get one

I think his problem is he's treated this entire season like one long extended trial session. Constantly chopping and changing, trying different things here and there, nad with no continuity.

Granted, injuries have been an issue, but his selections seem to suggest that had he had everyone available he'd have still been at it.

LandOTurk wrote:

Not Frankie wrote:Cups? Pah, try going two seasons unbeaten back to back, beating an actual quality All Blacks side, unlike that shite one that Llanelli beat, and beating the other giants of the southern hemisphere. You can all thank Newport's Arthur "Monkey" Gould for actually teaching the Welsh how to play the "Welsh" way. I could go on, but I can't maintain an erection for long these days.

Fair play. That 1887-89 team for Newport was excellent. It's the 129 years since that have been a bit sparse mind.

Bollocks they won the cup in 77 AND 2001!

LandOTurk wrote:Genuine question though for 'port fans. Is Jackman worth a punt for another year or is he all talk? I can't but help feel a good coach would have got at least 8 wins out off that team by the end of the season. He appears to be all bluster, which is how he got the job in the first place.

Not sure we have that much of a choice. He'll have some new players and should know what his starting side is by now. I wrote this season off before it started but a repeat of it next season would be devastating.

Jeff the Bear wrote:I think his problem is he's treated this entire season like one long extended trial session. Constantly chopping and changing, trying different things here and there, nad with no continuity.

Granted, injuries have been an issue, but his selections seem to suggest that had he had everyone available he'd have still been at it.

I think that's right...and then the effect of that is multiplied by the fact that all the other teams at this stage of the season are pretty well drilled, and are comfortable in their style of play.

Jackman is now talking about a lack of mental toughness and leadership but he's spent most of the season playing teams with average ages in the low 20s, so he surely can't be surprised that there is a lack of leadership.

And that he's a dreadful coach, with the worst squad in the comp.

15. Liam
14. Steff
13. Watkin
12. Parkes
11. North
10. Patchell
9. Gareth Davies
8. Navidi
7. Davies
6. Tipuric
5. AWJ
4. Shingler
3. Sampson
2. Owens
1. Evans

100-0

I'm still prepared to postpone judgment on Jackman until we've seen him with a decent squad, but we'll need to see a different Dragons team early on next season. He's not going to have the benefit of blaming the squad in the same way, the conditioning, the coaching (as he'll have mostly his own choices by the start of next season), so no excuses. I don't expect us to be world beaters from game 1, but it has to be a level up from this season.

I wonder how much the honesty around players who know they are on the way out has hurt. Defence is about attitude, and perhaps that has been a factor recently.

The other point is - if not Jackman, then who? It's all very well questioning how good he is, but who would we get who is better?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-43302261

No BBC two Pro14 rugby next season

Bonkers, nobody will pay to watch the Pro14, nobody.