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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:56 pm 
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Jumper wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
unseenwork wrote:
This quibbling about the absolute nature of a court's declaration of innocence only matters if your moral lens is shaped entirely by the British legal system.



Beautiful bit of waffle


Not really. It's the key to this whole sponsorship shite. Just because someone had been found not guilty in a court of law doesn't mean you want them associated with your brand.


I don't see how difficult that is for some to understand. Brands don't want bad publicity or to be associated with people with iffy histories.

Tiger Woods lost a tonne of sponsors a decade ago for banging all around himself.



It is difficult for you because you're an idiot and so is Biffer


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:59 pm 
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UEARFC wrote:
Jumper wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
unseenwork wrote:
This quibbling about the absolute nature of a court's declaration of innocence only matters if your moral lens is shaped entirely by the British legal system.



Beautiful bit of waffle


Not really. It's the key to this whole sponsorship shite. Just because someone had been found not guilty in a court of law doesn't mean you want them associated with your brand.


I don't see how difficult that is for some to understand. Brands don't want bad publicity or to be associated with people with iffy histories.

Tiger Woods lost a tonne of sponsors a decade ago for banging all around himself.



O.J Simpson would be perfect for Sunny Delight given he was known as 'The Juice'. I can't think why they haven't used him.



This was the OJ Simpson convicted of armed robbery? And just recently released from prison?
The one found liable for the murders in a civil court?

Great comparison, really top stuff.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:11 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
Jumper wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
unseenwork wrote:
This quibbling about the absolute nature of a court's declaration of innocence only matters if your moral lens is shaped entirely by the British legal system.



Beautiful bit of waffle


Not really. It's the key to this whole sponsorship shite. Just because someone had been found not guilty in a court of law doesn't mean you want them associated with your brand.


I don't see how difficult that is for some to understand. Brands don't want bad publicity or to be associated with people with iffy histories.

Tiger Woods lost a tonne of sponsors a decade ago for banging all around himself.



It is difficult for you because you're an idiot and so is Biffer


Not showing yourself as the sharpest tool in the box here, are you?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:30 pm 
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Says the grown man going for the "I know you are but what am I" style of debating.

Keep up the good work chief :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:34 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
Says the grown man going for the "I know you are but what am I" style of debating.

Keep up the good work chief :thumbup:


Pot and kettle there old chap.

It's bewildering what you fail to understand.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:41 pm 
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I'm going to break it down one more time for you and the other lad who wasn't allowed use the good scissors in School.

Nobody is questioning the "right" of Diageo to cease sponsoring London Irish (Read this two or three time now)
This is a line of argument entirely invented by you and spa number 2.

It has been explained to you by numerous posters now but no doubt you'll try it all again within 20 posts. Now, stop licking my fúcking windows.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:49 pm 
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UEARFC wrote:
Has anyone worked out how expensive this bargain player has cost so far?

Tangible costs;
Salary and benefits
Lost sponsorship
Season tickets

Intangible costs;
Goodwill
Team morale
Rugby focus
Clear Irish identity

It would have been cheaper to get Beauden Barritt.



BB fails that one.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:51 pm 
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UEARFC wrote:
Has anyone worked out how expensive this bargain player has cost so far?

Tangible costs;
Salary and benefits
Lost sponsorship
Season tickets

Intangible costs;
Goodwill
Team morale
Rugby focus

It would have been cheaper to get Beauden Barritt.



Have you worked out the difference between a convicted criminal and a whatsapp message?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:23 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
I'm going to break it down one more time for you and the other lad who wasn't allowed use the good scissors in School.

Nobody is questioning the "right" of Diageo to cease sponsoring London Irish (Read this two or three time now)
This is a line of argument entirely invented by you and spa number 2.

It has been explained to you by numerous posters now but no doubt you'll try it all again within 20 posts. Now, stop licking my fúcking windows.


So you missed all the stuff about Diageo being hypocrites and virtue signalling twats then? About them being badly wrong? People being shocked by their handling of it? Or saying Diageo don't accept the trial verdict?

Or have you forgotten it because you've had a couple too many knocks on the head?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:39 pm 
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UEARFC wrote:
Has anyone worked out how expensive this bargain player has cost so far?

Tangible costs;
Salary and benefits (Sure)
Lost sponsorship (Yep, definitely an issue)
Season tickets (Perhaps, although I'm not convinced it will make a big dent. Would expect us to shift more season tickets that we did this time two years ago)

Intangible costs;
Goodwill (for sure)
Team morale (Remains to be seen but I doubt this will be an issue. Several of the lads know him and don't seem to have a huge problem with him given they've liked various social media posts of his recently, including Franco van der Merwe who will likely start the season as club captain. If anything it could even galvanise the team if it feels like the club is under siege a bit. We'll see though)
Rugby focus (Could be an issue if the financial pressure becomes too much of an issue. Only really becomes a big problem though if team morale is a problem)

It would have been cheaper to get Beauden Barritt.


Honestly, I'd rather not have signed the bloke and found another 10. It was always going to be a boat load of hassle. Him and the lads he hung around with were clearly a bunch of idiots who needed to grow the fuck up.

That said it would be naive to think that he's not one of a bunch of players that will have passed through the club who have displayed similar behaviour (that's not blown up in public) and I'm satisfied with the court's verdict that nothing criminal occurred. I expect he'll be a different guy now to the one he was back then and deserves a chance to show it rather than be hounded into exile on the continent for the rest of his career.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:45 pm 
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Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
I'm going to break it down one more time for you and the other lad who wasn't allowed use the good scissors in School.

Nobody is questioning the "right" of Diageo to cease sponsoring London Irish (Read this two or three time now)
This is a line of argument entirely invented by you and spa number 2.

It has been explained to you by numerous posters now but no doubt you'll try it all again within 20 posts. Now, stop licking my fúcking windows.


So you missed all the stuff about Diageo being hypocrites and virtue signalling twats then? About them being badly wrong? People being shocked by their handling of it? Or saying Diageo don't accept the trial verdict?

Or have you forgotten it because you've had a couple too many knocks on the head?



So you believe that they have the right to pull sponsorship but the rest of us don't have the right to criticise it? :lol: :lol:

What happened your cherished right to free speech.

Whose shít multi is this? :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:51 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
I'm going to break it down one more time for you and the other lad who wasn't allowed use the good scissors in School.

Nobody is questioning the "right" of Diageo to cease sponsoring London Irish (Read this two or three time now)
This is a line of argument entirely invented by you and spa number 2.

It has been explained to you by numerous posters now but no doubt you'll try it all again within 20 posts. Now, stop licking my fúcking windows.


So you missed all the stuff about Diageo being hypocrites and virtue signalling twats then? About them being badly wrong? People being shocked by their handling of it? Or saying Diageo don't accept the trial verdict?

Or have you forgotten it because you've had a couple too many knocks on the head?



So you believe that they have the right to pull sponsorship but the rest of us don't have the right to criticise it? :lol: :lol:

What happened your cherished right to free speech.

Whose shít multi is this? :lol:


So the bit where you've quoted yourself as saying 'Nobody is questioning the "right" of Diageo to cease sponsoring London Irish' is bullshit then? Maybe you want to read that two or three times.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:53 pm 
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You don't understand the word right.

Colour me shocked :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:54 pm 
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Jesus wept, you're as dumb as your reputation.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:56 pm 
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How dare you criticise my right to an opinion you fascist pig


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:58 pm 
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You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.

Loving the simplistic attempts at triggers by the way, you're not in the least bit transparent.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 3:59 pm 
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Biffer29 wrote:
You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.

Loving the simplistic attempts at triggers by the way, you're not in the least bit transparent.



And despite yourself you stumbled ass backwards into the point everybody has been telling you for 10 pages.

The point consistently whooshing over your head and then you jumped and got caught with it square in the face.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:02 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.

Loving the simplistic attempts at triggers by the way, you're not in the least bit transparent.



And despite yourself you stumbled ass backwards into the point everybody has been telling you for 10 pages.

The point consistently whooshing over your head and then you jumped and got caught with it square in the face.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


You live in a parallel reality don't you?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:06 pm 
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I'd try to play the man too after such a complete and utter ass kicking.

Quote:
You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.


Beautiful :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:13 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
I'd try to play the man too after such a complete and utter ass kicking.

Quote:
You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.


Beautiful :lol:


You started the playing the man fella.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:14 pm 
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UEARFC wrote:
Margin_Walker wrote:
UEARFC wrote:
Has anyone worked out how expensive this bargain player has cost so far?

Tangible costs;
Salary and benefits (Sure)
Lost sponsorship (Yep, definitely an issue)
Season tickets (Perhaps, although I'm not convinced it will make a big dent. Would expect us to shift more season tickets that we did this time two years ago)

Intangible costs;
Goodwill (for sure)
Team morale (Remains to be seen but I doubt this will be an issue. Several of the lads know him and don't seem to have a huge problem with him given they've liked various social media posts of his recently, including Franco van der Merwe who will likely start the season as club captain. If anything it could even galvanise the team if it feels like the club is under siege a bit. We'll see though)
Rugby focus (Could be an issue if the financial pressure becomes too much of an issue. Only really becomes a big problem though if team morale is a problem)

It would have been cheaper to get Beauden Barritt.


Honestly, I'd rather not have signed the bloke and found another 10. It was always going to be a boat load of hassle. Him and the lads he hung around with were clearly a bunch of idiots who needed to grow the fuck up.

That said it would be naive to think that he's not one of a bunch of players that will have passed through the club who have displayed similar behaviour (that's not blown up in public) and I'm satisfied with the court's verdict that nothing criminal occurred. I expect he'll be a different guy now to the one he was back then and deserves a chance to show it rather than be hounded into exile on the continent for the rest of his career.




What do you reckon the cash costs might be? £120k salary (low estimate), £600k sponsorship (£500k Diageo, £100k CashConv) plus maybe £50k in season tickets (low estimate)? If it's just that (and it's all guesswork) then I reckon the intangible costs are worse.


No idea. I'd be guessing massively but Paddy will be on a lot more than 120k and the sponsorship will probably be a lot less. Guinness aren't a title sponsor and I think the deal more surrounds the Paddy's Day fixture.

Not even going to guess at the season tickets. The bigger problem isn't the sponsorship that's been lost, it's the potential new sponsors who won't want the hassle.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:15 pm 
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Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
I'd try to play the man too after such a complete and utter ass kicking.

Quote:
You're entitled to it. I'm entitled to call it dumb.


Beautiful :lol:


You started the playing the man fella.



You still here?

Games over mate, you're on our side. :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:54 pm 
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Same same but different. Parkland high school shooting survivor Kyle Kashuv has his Harvard Admission rescinded due to the discovery of racist messages he sent when he was 16.

https://twitter.com/KyleKashuv/status/1140605133346283521


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:08 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
Same same but different. Parkland high school shooting survivor Kyle Kashuv has his Harvard Admission rescinded due to the discovery of racist messages he sent when he was 16.

https://twitter.com/KyleKashuv/status/1140605133346283521


Online grievance archaeology is very much the in thing at the moment.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:14 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
Same same but different. Parkland high school shooting survivor Kyle Kashuv has his Harvard Admission rescinded due to the discovery of racist messages he sent when he was 16.

https://twitter.com/KyleKashuv/status/1140605133346283521

Social media is a disaster waiting to happen for most young people
When they are young and stupid and thinking they are being clever/controversial they fail to grasp how it will be there on the internet forever


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:28 pm 
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Margin_Walker wrote:
UEARFC wrote:
Margin_Walker wrote:
UEARFC wrote:
Has anyone worked out how expensive this bargain player has cost so far?

Tangible costs;
Salary and benefits (Sure)
Lost sponsorship (Yep, definitely an issue)
Season tickets (Perhaps, although I'm not convinced it will make a big dent. Would expect us to shift more season tickets that we did this time two years ago)

Intangible costs;
Goodwill (for sure)
Team morale (Remains to be seen but I doubt this will be an issue. Several of the lads know him and don't seem to have a huge problem with him given they've liked various social media posts of his recently, including Franco van der Merwe who will likely start the season as club captain. If anything it could even galvanise the team if it feels like the club is under siege a bit. We'll see though)
Rugby focus (Could be an issue if the financial pressure becomes too much of an issue. Only really becomes a big problem though if team morale is a problem)

It would have been cheaper to get Beauden Barritt.


Honestly, I'd rather not have signed the bloke and found another 10. It was always going to be a boat load of hassle. Him and the lads he hung around with were clearly a bunch of idiots who needed to grow the fuck up.

That said it would be naive to think that he's not one of a bunch of players that will have passed through the club who have displayed similar behaviour (that's not blown up in public) and I'm satisfied with the court's verdict that nothing criminal occurred. I expect he'll be a different guy now to the one he was back then and deserves a chance to show it rather than be hounded into exile on the continent for the rest of his career.




What do you reckon the cash costs might be? £120k salary (low estimate), £600k sponsorship (£500k Diageo, £100k CashConv) plus maybe £50k in season tickets (low estimate)? If it's just that (and it's all guesswork) then I reckon the intangible costs are worse.


No idea. I'd be guessing massively but Paddy will be on a lot more than 120k and the sponsorship will probably be a lot less. Guinness aren't a title sponsor and I think the deal more surrounds the Paddy's Day fixture.

Not even going to guess at the season tickets. The bigger problem isn't the sponsorship that's been lost, it's the potential new sponsors who won't want the hassle.


Fair play to LI for sticking by their decision (contrast with Sale, who dipped their toe in the water a year ago then ran a mile when twitter got into gear); whatever you think of it, someone high-up there has some big balls to take a gamble on this paying-off in the long run.

Will be an interesting plot to see if PJ can justify the backing they’ve given him and, just maybe, win some fans around with his performances and (no doubt exemplary) off-field conduct.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:36 pm 
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This thread x(

(Mullet is right btw)


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:44 pm 
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Jumper wrote:
Biffer29 wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
unseenwork wrote:
This quibbling about the absolute nature of a court's declaration of innocence only matters if your moral lens is shaped entirely by the British legal system.



Beautiful bit of waffle


Not really. It's the key to this whole sponsorship shite. Just because someone had been found not guilty in a court of law doesn't mean you want them associated with your brand.


I don't see how difficult that is for some to understand. Brands don't want bad publicity or to be associated with people with iffy histories.

Tiger Woods lost a tonne of sponsors a decade ago for banging all around himself.


Technically Woods is still sponsored by Nike

It would be strange to see him pick up a load of sponsors again, because no one deserves a second chance


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:52 pm 
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Ulsters Red Hand wrote:
It would be strange to see him pick up a load of sponsors again, because no one deserves a second chance



What about a third chance?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:23 pm 
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frillage wrote:
Ulsters Red Hand wrote:
It would be strange to see him pick up a load of sponsors again, because no one deserves a second chance



What about a third chance?


It would be fourth or fifth chance in this case :nod:


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:14 pm 
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Would the Irish Rugby Union have him back at all ?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:17 pm 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Would the Irish Rugby Union have him back at all ?


:lol:


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:33 pm 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Would the Irish Rugby Union have him back at all ?

Quote:
IRFU Prerformance Director David Nucifora has said that he would be open to the idea of former Ulster duo Paddy Jackson and Stuart Olding returning to the Ireland national team in the future.


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