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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:56 pm
by iarmhiman
Wendigo7 wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:So peaceful were the protests two weeks ago, now they're going ballistic! Could there be a number of Chinese Mainland plants out there now, stiring up the locals and getting them to be more violent?

Seems like a totally different feel to the crowd now.
2 million out of 8 million residents protested on Sunday, I'm not sure where China goes from here... Do you shutdown 2 million protesters? Is that possible (just thinking off the top of my head)?

Do you go to a vote, for a return to UK Rule? Do you go to a free country vote? Do you vote just to repeal this extradition law, which seems to be more increasing Chinese authoritarianism?

I don't really know where you go from here because you can't go too heavy handed, too many people are watching now.
Easy now. :lol:

Re: Hong Kong Protests

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 9:17 pm
by Yourmother
Where do I sign up?

Ah balls ... it’s about the country.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:57 pm
by wamberal99
A couple of thoughts. Where are the triads in all this? It is hard to believe that any sort of organised violence could continue for too long without them being involved one way or the other.



My other thought is, how does Taiwan's political relationship with Beijing influence all this, one way or the other? There are undoubtedly still people in Taiwan, or their descendants, who fled there to avoid prosecution in Hong Kong for corruption. Lots of the buggers.

Re: Hong Kong Protests

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:13 pm
by wamberal99
There is a fred about this.

Mods please merge.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:14 pm
by wamberal99
Merge???

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:53 pm
by Taranaki Snapper
U OK, HK?

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:05 am
by Hong Kong
wamberal99 wrote:A couple of thoughts. Where are the triads in all this? It is hard to believe that any sort of organised violence could continue for too long without them being involved one way or the other.



My other thought is, how does Taiwan's political relationship with Beijing influence all this, one way or the other? There are undoubtedly still people in Taiwan, or their descendants, who fled there to avoid prosecution in Hong Kong for corruption. Lots of the buggers.
there were rumours circulating that they were going to try and upset a pro-police meeting/procession on Sunday. They forget to turn up.

Last night, we saw the Lego (Legislative Council) being totally trashed as protestors once again took to the street to complain about everything. I cannot think of ANY other country that this would be allowed to happen - the Police just let the arseholes take control without as much as a slap. It was an incredibly sad day for HK :((

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:25 am
by village
I do wonder if this has not played into the hands of the authorities (the vandalism is bound to put a lot of HKers off the movement). Might that be why the police withdrew and allowed them in?

I walked through Admiralty this morning, right past LEGCO's broken windows. Had to keep my eyes on the pavement with all the holes where bricks had been pried out of the sidewalk to be hurled at police / windows. The bushes at the edge of the park were completely trampled and the area was strewn with plastic ties, abandoned yellow helmets and spent tear gas canisters. The police were visible but no one seemed in a rush to raise the Chinese flag which the protesters tore down and replaced with the black bauhinia yesterday.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:43 am
by Altazuma
I think the reaction to all this will be quite muted.

Since the umbrella movement, the protest movement lost a lot of steam and heart. Carrie Lam's piece of legislation refueled all that suppressed anger. It was always going to kick off on July 1 which is the traditional day of protest anyway.

With no obvious focus for another protest, I think the Govt will hope it will all die down and everyone will get back to ordinary life for a while.

Until they do something stupid again.....

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 5:17 am
by Hong Kong
village wrote:I do wonder if this has not played into the hands of the authorities (the vandalism is bound to put a lot of HKers off the movement). Might that be why the police withdrew and allowed them in?

I walked through Admiralty this morning, right past LEGCO's broken windows. Had to keep my eyes on the pavement with all the holes where bricks had been pried out of the sidewalk to be hurled at police / windows. The bushes at the edge of the park were completely trampled and the area was strewn with plastic ties, abandoned yellow helmets and spent tear gas canisters. The police were visible but no one seemed in a rush to raise the Chinese flag which the protesters tore down and replaced with the black bauhinia yesterday.
I'm pretty sure there will be have been agreement (tacit if not explicit) that the Govt. was 'happy' to let them trash legco as long as there was no physicality involved. There are so many issues that arise from this 'strategy' that it boggles the mind. Made particularly more galling when Carrie popped up at 0400 today to state that the rule of law was the most important issue - like as fuck it is.

BTW, about 12 officers were attacked with a corrosive substance during the day. Cunts

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 5:38 am
by Caley_Red
Hong Kong wrote:
BTW, about 12 officers were attacked with a corrosive substance during the day. Cunts
A minority of the protesters may be, however, let's not forget the far bigger danger is the authoritarianism of Xi and the personality cult he's established around himself in the mainland.

Hong Kong is in imminent danger of being subsumed well before 2047, the only reason they haven't already is because the mainland need HK as a conduit for investment. Due to the continued actions of Xi, the West has moved from accommodating China's rise to now seeing them as a strategic rival (or adversary, even).
If Beijing were to go with the only course of action Xi seems to know: crushing dissent, they'd give the West the excuse to cut HK out of the international order system where its legal system is treated as independent of China, therefore crippling investment into China.

The poor HK people would be mere collateral if that happened.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:01 am
by wamberal99
I heard somebody on the news saying that this is a matter of sovereignty for the PRC. And whatever we think one way or the other, there is no doubt that the PRC is the sovereign power.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:29 am
by Thomas
Anyone following the shit on Reddit about how this is a false flag and that the "violence" was all orchestrated by the government.

I can't find the link but will persevere. A police press conference that was held at 930pm but if you zoom in on the watch of one of the cops it says 5pm ot something

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:33 am
by Caley_Red
Thomas wrote:Anyone following the shit on Reddit about how this is a false flag and that the "violence" was all orchestrated by the government.

I can't find the link but will persevere. A police press conference that was held at 930pm but if you zoom in on the watch of one of the cops it says 5pm ot something
Think this could be Occam's law.

Mind you, nefarious and underhand misinformation campaigns are the new warfare. .

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:35 am
by Thomas

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:04 am
by wamberal99
There are no secrets in Hong Kong, any subterfuge would be exposed very quickly. Too many people know each other, and/or are related to each other. In some ways it is a bit like a huge village.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:25 am
by Hong Kong
Thomas wrote:Could be.

Found the link

https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/ ... pm_police/
some of the comments in that thread are gold! And the chap is the head and a career PR man (btw, we cannot do PR - we are hopeless at it!), so he's going to get a decent ribbing over it for a while.

as for this being Govt. 'inspiration' - not a fooking chance. China will be embarrassed and pissed off with lame LAM - they want to be seen NOT interfering in HK's affairs (even though they do influence it) and if they could find a replacement, they would get rid of her quicker than spring roll at Dim Sum time. But they have had a whole range of incompetent CEOs that another would show them in very bad light and a huge loss of face (AGAIN!!)

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:49 am
by Auckman
Is the city under marshall law yet?

Not sure what those protesters are going to achieve by trashing the place.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2019 2:34 am
by village
Footage from inside the legislative assembly seems to show that as the protestors began to batter their way inside they tossed in at least 1 gas bomb / canister of unknown substance (about 1 minute into the video). Must have been a scary few minutes for those police before they were withdrawn and the building conceded to the mob.

https://dms.licdn.com/playback/C4E05AQG ... rN5ppqYZ9Q

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Fri Jul 05, 2019 6:26 am
by Hong Kong
village wrote:Footage from inside the legislative assembly seems to show that as the protestors began to batter their way inside they tossed in at least 1 gas bomb / canister of unknown substance (about 1 minute into the video). Must have been a scary few minutes for those police before they were withdrawn and the building conceded to the mob.

https://dms.licdn.com/playback/C4E05AQG ... rN5ppqYZ9Q
These fuckers throw a corrosive substance at us. 12 officers injured thankfully none serious. But they are “peaceful”

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:48 am
by wamberal99
Carrie Lam has undertaken to (a) trash the extradition bill and (b) start listening a bit more intently to the demonstrators.


Farking amazing. :D

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:28 pm
by village
Joshy Wong doesn't like gweilo.

Happy to say when I've seen the doxxing going on in HK rugby club related facebook groups the posters have been told in short order to fark off.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/worl ... -js0f2pchf
The Hong Kong democracy leader Joshua Wong has lambasted the senior British police officer who has become a symbol of the suppression of anti-government demonstrations.

Chief Superintendent Rupert Dover, a British-born officer in the Hong Kong police, has been in command on two occasions when police have used force to disperse rowdy groups of demonstrators campaigning against a proposed new extradition law. Last night he was confronted by Mr Wong on the streets after riot police used batons to clear protesters who lingered after a largely peaceful demonstration in the Kowloon district.

“Rupert Dover, you are British, and [yet] you serve the interests of Beijing,” Mr Wong shouted at Mr Dover, who was guarded by a phalanx of officers.

Writing on Twitter today Mr Wong said: “#RupertDover, a white man born in the UK, enjoyed freedom in his hometown, and now came to HK serve Beijing interest with extremely high salary, decided to [use] rubber bullets & tear gas [against] HK people who fought for freedom.

“For more than 10 minutes, he never answered any questions from me and journalists. We are just asking for an explanation on his decision to [use] rubber bullets and tear gas, and [for an apology] to Hong Kong people. #RupertDover you need to pay the price!”


Mr Dover has not responded to a request for comment. Mr Wong, 22, who was released last month from a prison sentence connected to earlier protests, told The Times that the British government and MPs should demand answers. “I believe that the UK government and UK parliament should not keep silence on this issue,” he said. “I believe that UK MPs should speak up.”

The past few weeks have brought intense pressure on the Hong Kong police. The crisis of confidence and morale began on June 12, when riot police commanded by Mr Dover used tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets and soft “bean bag rounds” against a few hundred young demonstrators in front of the Legislative Council (Legco), Hong Kong’s parliament.

They were protesting against a proposed new extradition law that would have allowed the pro-Beijing chief executive, Carrie Lam, to send criminal suspects wanted on the mainland to trial in Chinese courts. The spectacle of unarmed young Hong Kongers fleeing in terror and choking on tear gas appalled many people in the territory.

Four days later there was an even bigger demonstration of as many as two million people, which contributed to Ms Lam’s decision to suspend the extradition bill. It provoked a backlash against the police, who had been respected by Hong Kongers for their relative professionalism compared with other police forces in the region.

Officers have spoken privately of the stress of daily abuse from the public. Last week eight people were arrested on suspicion of posting personal details of police officers and their families online in an effort to encourage harassment, a practice known as doxxing.

The suspects are alleged to have put the names of about 600 officers on social media, as well as their addresses, phone numbers and the names of relatives. Allies say that they only shared information that was already public.

No officer has had more abuse than Mr Dover. Images of him in uniform commanding the riot police were shared on social media alongside those of two other British officers who were present, the superintendents David Jordan and Justin Shave.

The British officers David Jordan and Rupert Dover are identified on activist posters
At the march of two million, protesters carried posters of Mr Jordan and Mr Dover. “Both present/on-duty during conflict between police and peaceful protesters on 12/6,” the caption read. “Shame on HKPF [Hong Kong Police Force].”

At least one parody account, filled with satirical scurrilities, has been set up on Twitter in Mr Dover’s name.

Four police unions wrote an indignant letter of complaint to the British MP Helen Goodman, who named Mr Shave in parliament. “You owe the superintendent and the Hong Kong police force an apology,” they wrote to Ms Goodman, who asked what ministers were doing to “bring to book” the British officers.

“He, along with the two other expatriate officers, have been subjected to vitriolic cyberattacks and physical threats to their families.”

After bad publicity around the June 12 demonstration the police were strikingly more permissive in their response to subsequent protests, culminating in the events on July 1, when they withdrew to allow activists inside the Legco building. Demonstrators sprayed graffiti and vandalised office equipment.

On Sunday night, however, they adopted sterner tactics. After a peaceful march of 230,000 people through the shopping streets of the Kowloon district, a few hundred younger demonstrators lingered late into the night, temporarily blocking streets that had been reopened after the main march.

Shortly before 11pm riot police, apparently commanded by Mr Dover, ordered them to disperse and warned that they were illegally assembled.

They formed a line and advanced using batons against protesters in their way. They arrested five people for alleged assaults against police. Another person was arrested for failing to carry identification papers.

The Hong Kong Journalists Association said that photographers and reporters were assaulted by officers. “The police pushed frontline journalists and their cameras away with shields multiple times, yelled at, and even assaulted, journalists to obstruct reporting,” the group said in a statement. “[This] was a serious violation of press freedom.”

BEHIND THE STORY

It was still known as the Royal Hong Kong Police when Rupert Dover joined its ranks in 1988. Nine years later, when Britain returned Hong Kong to China, he was one of the expatriate officers who stayed. He has been there since.

In a distinguished career Mr Dover has been given the chief executive’s commendation for government or public service.

His colleague David Jordan spent three years in the Royal Navy before joining the Hong Kong police in 1992. He has served as head of the 2,000-strong riot squad, the Police Tactical Unit known as the “Blue Berets”.

In 2014 Mr Jordan helped to police the so-called umbrella movement, when democracy activists led by Joshua Wong occupied streets in central Hong Kong.

“I’ve experienced abuse unlike I’ve ever had in over 20 years,” he told the South China Morning Post, who said that he was 47. “The volume of abuse and almost unadulterated hatred was quite surprising.” He quit Facebook because of the vitriol and said that it had affected his friends and family. “Professionally, the politicisation doesn’t affect me but personally, for a lot of my local friends . . . the Facebook abuse is an aspect that this operational deployment brought to the fore,” he said.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:31 am
by Hong Kong
Apart from this nibble, you’re going to need better bait than that

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 3:48 am
by wamberal99
At this stage, it might be worth reading Dick Hughes' book "Hong Kong - borrowed place, borrowed time". Originally published as "Borrowed Place, Borrowed Time".



Makes me think of the good old, bad old, days, when I first went there to work. 1976. Just had an email from one of my work colleagues, he has lived there on and off since the mid seventies. He now lives on one of the islands, and is a bit despondent about things.


The only conclusion I can reach is that the PRC will be quite happy to see the place revert to being a little fishing village again, in comparative terms. Taiwan is the big prize, of course.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 5:57 am
by Sun Tzu
A Beijing hit squad have attacked commuters on the MRT.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/as ... d-11741980

:uhoh:

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 7:29 am
by wamberal99
Sun Tzu wrote:A Beijing hit squad have attacked commuters on the MRT.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/as ... d-11741980

:uhoh:

Do you mean pro-Beijing? They could be anybody. Triads would be my pick.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:57 pm
by Sun Tzu
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:A Beijing hit squad have attacked commuters on the MRT.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/as ... d-11741980

:uhoh:

Do you mean pro-Beijing? They could be anybody. Triads would be my pick.
Paid by Beijing certainly. Beijing previously bussed in a load of Pro-Beijing supporters to boost the numbers of Pro-Beijing protests and paid them quite a bit of money.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:35 pm
by wamberal99
Do you have inside information?

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:47 pm
by Hong Kong
Sun Tzu wrote:
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:A Beijing hit squad have attacked commuters on the MRT.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/as ... d-11741980

:uhoh:

Do you mean pro-Beijing? They could be anybody. Triads would be my pick.
Paid by Beijing certainly. Beijing previously bussed in a load of Pro-Beijing supporters to boost the numbers of Pro-Beijing protests and paid them quite a bit of money.
😂😂😂

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:09 am
by Flockwitt
Hong Kong wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:A Beijing hit squad have attacked commuters on the MRT.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/as ... d-11741980

:uhoh:

Do you mean pro-Beijing? They could be anybody. Triads would be my pick.
Paid by Beijing certainly. Beijing previously bussed in a load of Pro-Beijing supporters to boost the numbers of Pro-Beijing protests and paid them quite a bit of money.
😂😂😂
:lol: :lol: :lol: muppets are going to muppet

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:43 am
by Hong Kong
quite! Anyone with a smidgen of knowledge of the YL mob, know they don't need funds form Beijing or anyone else to enjoy a BBQ on 'their' patch!

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:57 am
by Sun Tzu
Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:

You will no doubt argue the Uyghur Camps to be Happy Camps.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:59 am
by wamberal99
Sun Tzu wrote:Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:

How long have you lived in Hong Kong?

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:00 am
by Sun Tzu
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:

How long have you lived in Hong Kong?
I don't need to. I get all the information I need from the NYT, CNN and The Guardian in order to reach such a conclusion.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:03 am
by wamberal99
Sun Tzu wrote:
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:

How long have you lived in Hong Kong?
I don't need to. I get all the information I need from the NYT, CNN and The Guardian in order to reach such a conclusion.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


So, basically, when it all boils down, you know fark all about the place, do you?

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:05 am
by Hong Kong
go on sunny - which triad groups are dominant in YL?

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:35 pm
by Flyin Ryan
Sun Tzu wrote:Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:
No. Dozy was banned from the board some years ago.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:39 pm
by sockwithaticket
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:
wamberal99 wrote:
Sun Tzu wrote:Beijing puppets all up in this thread :uhoh:

How long have you lived in Hong Kong?
I don't need to. I get all the information I need from the NYT, CNN and The Guardian in order to reach such a conclusion.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


So, basically, when it all boils down, you know fark all about the place, do you?
Mate, he's a weird troll parodying a lefty. Quite why is anyone's guess.

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:00 am
by Taranaki Snapper
Sefton wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote: Mate, he's a weird troll parodying a lefty. Quite why is anyone's guess.
What else is a westerner hanging around Thailand going to do.
Image

Re: The masses against the (political) classes in Hong Kong

Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:17 am
by Sun Tzu
Well this isn't provocative at all.

https://youtu.be/2mj0JeSp3UU

China releases video showing drill of troops quelling protests in Hong Kong.