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 Post subject: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:12 pm 
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Women's rugby has exploded this season, especially in England right now. So I thought a thread was deserved. In no order some of the news:

The Barbarians are fielding their first ever women's team to face Munster:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/ ... t-munster/

Mean while the new Super league has been launched and it has been sponsored by Tyrell's. It may not be professional but it's a start. And of course the best thing is, there has been some cracking Rugby being played from the first 3 rounds:

http://www.premier15s.com/videos/best-o ... round-one/

http://www.premier15s.com/videos/best-t ... m-round-2/

http://www.premier15s.com/videos/best-o ... und-three/

And one form this Richmond legend:

https://twitter.com/Premier15s/status/9 ... 6919884801

The featured women's match has been streamed each week and it gets a very respectable 50k watching: https://twitter.com/Premier15s/status/9 ... 4090900482

Even the french captain has joined:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41483733

But sadly my ikle favourite wing Kay Wilson is retiring.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:09 pm 
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Lichfield got so badly f**ked over. I've got loads of time for the women's game, always enjoy watching- it's that bit slower which means it's a lot easier to see unfold :)


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:09 pm 
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I recently watched the two top teams in this Prem League and wasn't that impressed. Not bad, but thought it'd be better. I thought I'd see something like the women's 6 Nations in terms of quality, but it was obviously a mix of people who were that good and others who are truly club players fitness/skill-wise.

Reckon our best would be very competitive with them, and we should given how big girls and women's uni rugby is here, feeding into the clubs... but they talk this up as if it's got all the best players from UK, Ire, France and a few from abroad.

It might become that, but it ain't there yet. On the subject of professionalism, check out Eddie Jones' statement about it in this interview: https://youtu.be/0-8c8YP82PE?t=36m58s

Spot on, imo. Like men's clubs below Prems, they'll never be able to fund it / it's not sustainable. Pay the internationals, play for the love it below that and if you get to that level, then great.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:14 pm 
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DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over.


I'd love to know more of the behind-the-scenes of that whole drama. I feel for them and it seems unfair that these upstart clubs like Loughborough, Waterloo and Hartpury can 'buy' their way in, but I also wonder why so many (heard upwards of 15, so not just their 5 internationals) went to play for Loughborough.

I'd think that tight, loyal club members would say I'll stay and prove that we should be there, eventually seeing them to promotion. It could be more difficult to get promoted now that your best are with another club. It'd have been even more interesting for the internationals to challenge this 'requirement' and NOT play in the Premiership for the next two years, daring the national team coach not to pick them from a lower division club (which would have included Scarratt, Hunt, Millar-Mills, Fleetwood who are all starting-quality players.)


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:16 pm 
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DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over. I've got loads of time for the women's game, always enjoy watching- it's that bit slower which means it's a lot easier to see unfold :)



I agree. But apparently it was all bureaucratic. Other tems filled in forms beter and got better partnership with a big club. That allowed Harlequins ladies toc ome out of nowhere too.

Interestingly that a few sides have absolutely absorbed English and Welsh internationals from elsewhere. Wasps are the big winenrs from Lichfield's rejection, Bristol, Gloucester and Sarries are loaded. I notice Worcester and Richmond seems to hemorrhage players to elsewhere with the likes of Bristol, Gloucester and Harlequins being big winners from them.

Sarrles pack look absolutely loaded in their forwards. They gained Marley Packer and Poppy Cleall in the back row (while already having Poppy's twin). That's a meaty back row to deal with. I wonder, while it's all amateur, have some clubs offered big incentives to join? It does seem some clubs drew in quality players like a magnet.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:23 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over. I've got loads of time for the women's game, always enjoy watching- it's that bit slower which means it's a lot easier to see unfold :)



I agree. But apparently it was all bureaucratic. Other tems filled in forms beter and got better partnership with a big club. That allowed Harlequins ladies toc ome out of nowhere too.

Interestingly that a few sides have absolutely absorbed English and Welsh internationals from elsewhere. Wasps are the big winenrs from Lichfield's rejection, Bristol, Gloucester and Sarries are loaded. I notice Worcester and Richmond seems to hemorrhage players to elsewhere with the likes of Bristol, Gloucester and Harlequins being big winners from them.

Sarrles pack look absolutely loaded in their forwards. They gained Marley Packer and Poppy Cleall in the back row (while already having Poppy's twin). That's a meaty back row to deal with. I wonder, while it's all amateur, have some clubs offered big incentives to join? It does seem some clubs drew in quality players like a magnet.



To be fair to Quins, though, they'd had their fingers on Aylesford Bulls the last year or two, right?

As for people defecting, I also wonder if it's a simplicity of travel thing. I imagine some people have been making long trips from their place of residence to play for the best club in their region (like Ceri Large to Hartpury from Worcester?). When I was at Clifton - coaching kids, not women - there were a good handful of Welsh internationals driving over to Bristol from Wales for that reason.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:23 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over.


I'd love to know more of the behind-the-scenes of that whole drama. I feel for them and it seems unfair that these upstart clubs like Loughborough, Waterloo and Hartpury can 'buy' their way in, but I also wonder why so many (heard upwards of 15, so not just their 5 internationals) went to play for Loughborough.


I ranted often at this. Some at my Rgby club are quite well informed and their daughters play. They deffo feel Litchfield were robbed but also they didn't play the game and get the solid backing of one of the top men's clubs, which was a requirement. hence why Bull just let their brand be absorbed by Quins. The tragic thing is, it's just bureaucratic game that they didn't play well but they could count themselves as one of the best clubs at developing players. I know criteria should be fair but surely the point of the league is to make Rugby in England stronger, and losing one of the clubs that produced one of their greatest pathways to international player quality only weakens England a bit. Sadly we got Lougborough who while being seen at the best sporst unversity never seem to achieve much for all their resources and support from big wigs and yet they seem to get into such influential positions in English sport.

Quote:

I'd think that tight, loyal club members would say I'll stay and prove that we should be there, eventually seeing them to promotion. It could be more difficult to get promoted now that your best are with another club. It'd have been even more interesting for the internationals to challenge this 'requirement' and NOT play in the Premiership for the next two years, daring the national team coach not to pick them from a lower division club (which would have included Scarratt, Hunt, Millar-Mills, Fleetwood who are all starting-quality players.)


No promotions ow as far as I'm aware. It's a closed league now isn't it? Hence why Litchfield really feel they were screwed.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:36 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over. I've got loads of time for the women's game, always enjoy watching- it's that bit slower which means it's a lot easier to see unfold :)



I agree. But apparently it was all bureaucratic. Other tems filled in forms beter and got better partnership with a big club. That allowed Harlequins ladies toc ome out of nowhere too.

Interestingly that a few sides have absolutely absorbed English and Welsh internationals from elsewhere. Wasps are the big winenrs from Lichfield's rejection, Bristol, Gloucester and Sarries are loaded. I notice Worcester and Richmond seems to hemorrhage players to elsewhere with the likes of Bristol, Gloucester and Harlequins being big winners from them.

Sarrles pack look absolutely loaded in their forwards. They gained Marley Packer and Poppy Cleall in the back row (while already having Poppy's twin). That's a meaty back row to deal with. I wonder, while it's all amateur, have some clubs offered big incentives to join? It does seem some clubs drew in quality players like a magnet.



To be fair to Quins, though, they'd had their fingers on Aylesford Bulls the last year or two, right?


They are basically Aylesford Bulls rebranded and based in Surrey's rather swanky sports park in guildford rather then Kent.


Quote:

As for people defecting, I also wonder if it's a simplicity of travel thing. I imagine some people have been making long trips from their place of residence to play for the best club in their region (like Ceri Large to Hartpury from Worcester?). When I was at Clifton - coaching kids, not women - there were a good handful of Welsh internationals driving over to Bristol from Wales for that reason.


I've known girls to move from Richmond to Quins and Quins is deffo further away from London. I understand the Welsh girls playing for the West county teams, but Worester have lost a ton of players and I don't even know if Lydia Thompson, IMO the best winger in the world will go back there. They couldn't have all been driving up to Worcester from Gloucester and Bristol prior to this season? I mean Ceri Large, Rocky etc.

A move I certainly couldn't work out was Sarah Hunter moving from bristol to Loughborough? Bristol are a stacked squad now (and were good before), she is a west country girl and Sarah was the RFUs South West development officer. Unless her job has changed it puzzled me.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:42 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
Nieghorn wrote:
DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over.


I'd love to know more of the behind-the-scenes of that whole drama. I feel for them and it seems unfair that these upstart clubs like Loughborough, Waterloo and Hartpury can 'buy' their way in, but I also wonder why so many (heard upwards of 15, so not just their 5 internationals) went to play for Loughborough.


I ranted often at this. Some at my Rgby club are quite well informed and their daughters play. They deffo feel Litchfield were robbed but also they didn't play the game and get the solid backing of one of the top men's clubs, which was a requirement. hence why Bull just let their brand be absorbed by Quins. The tragic thing is, it's just bureaucratic game that they didn't play well but they could count themselves as one of the best clubs at developing players. I know criteria should be fair but surely the point of the league is to make Rugby in England stronger, and losing one of the clubs that produced one of their greatest pathways to international player quality only weakens England a bit. Sadly we got Lougborough who while being seen at the best sporst unversity never seem to achieve much for all their resources and support from big wigs and yet they seem to get into such influential positions in English sport.

Quote:

I'd think that tight, loyal club members would say I'll stay and prove that we should be there, eventually seeing them to promotion. It could be more difficult to get promoted now that your best are with another club. It'd have been even more interesting for the internationals to challenge this 'requirement' and NOT play in the Premiership for the next two years, daring the national team coach not to pick them from a lower division club (which would have included Scarratt, Hunt, Millar-Mills, Fleetwood who are all starting-quality players.)


No promotions ow as far as I'm aware. It's a closed league now isn't it? Hence why Litchfield really feel they were screwed.


No promotion for 2yrs- the whole thing stinks.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:46 pm 
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Nieghorn wrote:
DragsterDriver wrote:
Lichfield got so badly f**ked over.


I'd love to know more of the behind-the-scenes of that whole drama. I feel for them and it seems unfair that these upstart clubs like Loughborough, Waterloo and Hartpury can 'buy' their way in, but I also wonder why so many (heard upwards of 15, so not just their 5 internationals) went to play for Loughborough.

I'd think that tight, loyal club members would say I'll stay and prove that we should be there, eventually seeing them to promotion. It could be more difficult to get promoted now that your best are with another club. It'd have been even more interesting for the internationals to challenge this 'requirement' and NOT play in the Premiership for the next two years, daring the national team coach not to pick them from a lower division club (which would have included Scarratt, Hunt, Millar-Mills, Fleetwood who are all starting-quality players.)


Not quite sure you can lump Waterloo in with Loughborough and Hartpury- they were already a good Championship team with promotion ambitions before this, and part of the reason they'll have got in will have been geographical.

In terms of players from Lichfield going to Loughborough, a lot of them have international ambitions and/or are on the fringes of some international team or another. They were told that the selectors wouldn't even watch the Lichfield games so if they stayed, they'd not even be considered. Since they aren't established internationals, they don't have the clout to turn around and dig in their heels because to do so would be giving up their international ambitions. Also, like it or not, there is a huge gulf between championship and premiership in terms of standard of rugby and two years is a long time to be off the selectors' radars and without access to top level rugby.

Quite agree that it would have been interesting to see what would have happened if the established internationals had refused to move though. I can only think that they'll have known the RFU have all the power and didn't want them to take away what was being offered for the new premiership, and so decided it was in the best interests of the game as a whole just to move and not kick up a huge fuss. That's pure speculation though.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:01 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
Nieghorn wrote:

As for people defecting, I also wonder if it's a simplicity of travel thing. I imagine some people have been making long trips from their place of residence to play for the best club in their region (like Ceri Large to Hartpury from Worcester?). When I was at Clifton - coaching kids, not women - there were a good handful of Welsh internationals driving over to Bristol from Wales for that reason.


I've known girls to move from Richmond to Quins and Quins is deffo further away from London. I understand the Welsh girls playing for the West county teams, but Worester have lost a ton of players and I don't even know if Lydia Thompson, IMO the best winger in the world will go back there. They couldn't have all been driving up to Worcester from Gloucester and Bristol prior to this season? I mean Ceri Large, Rocky etc.

A move I certainly couldn't work out was Sarah Hunter moving from bristol to Loughborough? Bristol are a stacked squad now (and were good before), she is a west country girl and Sarah was the RFUs South West development officer. Unless her job has changed it puzzled me.


Part of it will come down to money. Sarah Hunter, I think, is now some sort of coach at Loughborough, so she'll have moved because they'll have offered her a job that essentially allows her to be a professional player. I'd imagine the RFU will have had some influence in this too because of the PR- looks good that to have the England captain go across to Loughborough and gives them a chance to point out the great facilities on offer and deflect attention away from the controversy. Same sort of thing will have happened with some of the players who have gone to Gloucester-Hartpury; the college will have offered them jobs or courses there.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:00 pm 
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South Africa have decided to re-boot their women's Rugby team after not bothering to send one for the RWC:

http://www.scrumqueens.com/news/south-a ... -test-side

they will play British Army and England academy.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:05 pm 
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Rugbygirl wrote:

Part of it will come down to money. Sarah Hunter, I think, is now some sort of coach at Loughborough, so she'll have moved because they'll have offered her a job that essentially allows her to be a professional player. I'd imagine the RFU will have had some influence in this too because of the PR- looks good that to have the England captain go across to Loughborough and gives them a chance to point out the great facilities on offer and deflect attention away from the controversy. Same sort of thing will have happened with some of the players who have gone to Gloucester-Hartpury; the college will have offered them jobs or courses there.


That makes sense. I did assume that Hunter may have got a job at the Uni, though I hadn't heard of anything and she had a quite custy RFU job as well. She could of course be also setting herslef up for a post-Rugby career as well. But I always assumed she was highly regarded by the RFU and earmarked for heading upwards.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:29 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:

That makes sense. I did assume that Hunter may have got a job at the Uni, though I hadn't heard of anything and she had a quite custy RFU job as well. She could of course be also setting herslef up for a post-Rugby career as well. But I always assumed she was highly regarded by the RFU and earmarked for heading upwards.


http://loughboroughsport.com/blog/2017/ ... ing-rugby/

It says she joined as an assistant coach and player. It doesn't say she's being paid in the role, but it seems like a fairly obvious case of 1+1 = 2.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:22 pm 
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Rugbygirl wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:

That makes sense. I did assume that Hunter may have got a job at the Uni, though I hadn't heard of anything and she had a quite custy RFU job as well. She could of course be also setting herslef up for a post-Rugby career as well. But I always assumed she was highly regarded by the RFU and earmarked for heading upwards.


http://loughboroughsport.com/blog/2017/ ... ing-rugby/

It says she joined as an assistant coach and player. It doesn't say she's being paid in the role, but it seems like a fairly obvious case of 1+1 = 2.


Yeah, I can't imagine anything else being the case.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:23 pm 
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On the subject of england:

Quote:

England training squad for Bisham Abbey camp
Forwards
Rochelle Clarke (Wasps FC Ladies)
Heather Kerr (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Sarah Bern (Gloucester-Hartpury)
Abbie Scott (Harlequins Ladies)
Tamara Taylor (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Marlie Packer (Saracens Women)
Poppy Leitch (Bristol Ladies)
Sarah Hunter (Loughborough Lightning)
Vickii Cornborough (Harlequins Ladies)
Justine Lucas (Wasps FC Ladies)
Harriet Millar-Mills (Wasps FC Ladies)
Poppy Cleall (Saracens Women)
Rowena Burnfield (Richmond FC)
Jessie Hood(Bristol Ladies)
Abbie Parsons (Bristol Ladies)
Hannah West (Wasps FC Ladies)
Alex Powell (Wasps FC Ladies)
Cath O’Donnell (Loughborough Lightning)
Courtney Gill (Gloucester -Hartpury)
Olivia Jones (Loughborough Lightning)
Hannah Botterman (Saracens Women)
Lark Davies (Worcester Valkyries)
Molly Morrisey (Gloucester- Hartpury)
Jo Brown (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Izzy Noel-Smith (Bristol Ladies)

Backs
Rachael Burford (Harlequins Ladies)
Amber Reed (Bristol Ladies)
Danielle Waterman (Wasps FC Ladies)
Katy Daley-Mclean (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Leanne Riley (Harlequins Ladies)
Lotte Clapp (Saracens Women)
Jess Breach (Harlequins Ladies)
Rachael Woosey (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Celia Quansah (Loughborough Lightning)
Zoe Harrison (Saracens Women)
Ellie Kildunne (Gloucester-Hartpury)
Abby Dow (Wasps FC Ladies)
Lagi Tuima (Bristol Ladies)
Lucy Attwood (Bristol Ladies)
Brooke Bradley (Bristol Ladies)
Charlotte Pearce (Loughborough Lightning)
Lauren Cattell (Saracens Women)
Kelly Smith (Gloucester- Hartpury)


Most of the bolded ones I'm really glad are getting a closer look, they were superb U20 players and are tearing up the Premiership now. Especially LagiTYuima who is heir to Waterman's 15 shirt (she plays 12 as well) and Abby Dow who i think has that x-factor for slicing through defences with her lines and speed and a great wingers sporting IQ. I think those two can be very special players. Likewise Catherine O’Donnell and Poppy Leitch. The England U20 side dropped massively in quality when many of those girls progressed upwards.

However some omissions I am surprised at are Garnet Mackinder who has scored a few superb wingers trys and has pace unmatched in the women's game I think. Though they might prime her for a 7's career. Also Brooke Bradley looks like she has been on top form for Bristol. I'm also surprised Poppy Cleall's twin Bryony has not had a look in at number 8. Sarries back row is looking ridiculously dominate and both twins are a physical handful few sides can cope with.

Likewise I'm not sure why Ceri Large has been overlooked recently, she's been superb and I think Kate McLean (who i do think highly of usually) had a bad world cup final for the econd time in these past 3 she has played in (2010 and 2017). I don't know why but against New Zealand in RWCs her decision making just goes to pot, perfoms in a shell of herself and not changing things which are obvious. Certainly other options should be considered and tried out early in an RWCcycle. Especially as McLean might well be off for Sevens anyway.


Last edited by eldanielfire on Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:28 pm 
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Back from my old farts rugby training, and the girls at the club have a game this afternoon, and were training this morning

Few years ago, the poor few girls had no option to play rugby when being 16+, just 1 or 2 of them lost in the club... now there is a massive team of 18+ in my club, they must easily be 30 girls.
And I heard the LOU (Lyon) have 130-sthg girls too.

Incredible.
Many are new to the sport, but what a change !

And to be honest, many girls are really really pretty :shock: :shock: :o ... you'd wonder how they chose rugby as their sport, but i will surely not complain having charming smiling rugby girls all around 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:53 pm 
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No rule 1's?
*Leaves thread*


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:00 pm 
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It's a joke the England women's rugby team don't get paid the same as men. Pure sexism.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:51 pm 
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le chat wrote:
It's a joke the England women's rugby team don't get paid the same as men. Pure sexism.

:uhoh:


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:03 pm 
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happyhooker wrote:
le chat wrote:
It's a joke the England women's rugby team don't get paid the same as men. Pure sexism.

:uhoh:

??


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:27 am 
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Rugbygirl wrote:
In terms of players from Lichfield going to Loughborough, a lot of them have international ambitions and/or are on the fringes of some international team or another. They were told that the selectors wouldn't even watch the Lichfield games so if they stayed, they'd not even be considered. Since they aren't established internationals, they don't have the clout to turn around and dig in their heels because to do so would be giving up their international ambitions. Also, like it or not, there is a huge gulf between championship and premiership in terms of standard of rugby and two years is a long time to be off the selectors' radars and without access to top level rugby.

Quite agree that it would have been interesting to see what would have happened if the established internationals had refused to move though. I can only think that they'll have known the RFU have all the power and didn't want them to take away what was being offered for the new premiership, and so decided it was in the best interests of the game as a whole just to move and not kick up a huge fuss. That's pure speculation though.


It's angers me so much, and I'm Canadian with no stake, because it's further ruining the club loyalty aspect of the game we (pretend) to hold so dear. Our country pressures national players to move to Vancouver Island or Vancouver away from their home clubs where they are inspirations not to mention weakening those teams.

I'm not even convinced it helps as our FH played very little rugby since the last WRWC and no one at the training centre helped her kicking. For me, efforts should be made to strengthen more than just one elite level. In an amateur sport life will keep some of the best talent close to home. The national team should have the duty to seek out and support the best wherever they are, not corral a limited group into one area.

England's has a larger proportion but just as narrow a scope, imo


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:52 pm 
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The IRFU are getting a kicking from all quarters and especially the women's players for only appointing a part time coach to the women's team.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41666183

It especially looks bad when you consider that Wales, France and especially England are making big advances in the women's game right now. It must be especially bitter considering the big avances the women in Ireland made this past half decade. A few 6 Nations titles, a world cup semi-final and that victory over New Zealand. Now they are seeing their rivals move ahead of them from their shear lack of support. Already they have a few players playing in England. It could get to the point most of their good players plays in the England. Claire Malloy already plays for Bristol (she makes a great break for the try in the clip below):

https://twitter.com/WomRugbyComp/status ... 5800649728


Last edited by eldanielfire on Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:55 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
The IRFU are getting a kicking from all quarters and especially the women's players for only appointing a part time coach to the women's team.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41666183

It especially looks bad when you consider that Wales, France and especially England are making big advances in the women's game right now.

I know one of the Irish ladies from this year's RWC squad - to say she was scathing about the coaching and preparation they received in advance of the tournament would be an understatement.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:02 pm 
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ZappaMan wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
The IRFU are getting a kicking from all quarters and especially the women's players for only appointing a part time coach to the women's team.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41666183

It especially looks bad when you consider that Wales, France and especially England are making big advances in the women's game right now.

I know one of the Irish ladies from this year's RWC squad - to say she was scathing about the coaching and preparation they received in advance of the tournament would be an understatement.



I know, it's been openlyopenly reported in the press. It appears the women weren't even told when or where the training camps were and how they would be supported to get time off work until the training camps were about to start and they couldn't organise time off work properly because it was to late. That's ridiculous gong into an RWC, let alone a tournament Ireland hosted.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:04 pm 
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Wales announce their training squad for the Autumn internationals:

http://www.gloucesterrugby.co.uk/news/14283.php#.

Abbie Flemming; Alecs Donovan; Alisha Butchers; Amy Evans; Amy Morgan; Amy Thomas; Angharad Desmet; Beth Harriett Jones; Beth Lewis; Cara Hope; Caryl Thomas; Carys Phillips; Cerys Hale; Charlie Murray; Dyddgu Hywel; Elinor Isaacs; Elinor Snowsill; Ffion Lewis; Gemma Rowland; Gwen Crabb; Gwenllian Pyrs; Hannah Bluck; Hannah Jones; India Berbillion; Jasmine Joyce; Jessica Kavanagh-Williams; Jodie Evans; Katie Jenkins; Katie Thicker; Kayleigh Powell; Keira Bevan; Kelsey Jones; Kerin Lake; Laurie Harries; Liliana Podpadec; Lleucu George; Lucy Packer; Megan York; Mel Clay; Morfudd Ifans; Natalia John; Nia Elen Davies; Philippa Tuttiett; Rebecca de Filippo; Rhian Noakes; Rhi Parker; Robyn Wilkins; Shona Powell-Huges; Sian Moore; Sian Williams; Sinead Breeze; Sioned Harries; Siwan Lillicrap.

8 of them alone from Gloucester.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:30 pm 
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http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/39575.php#.WefD-TBrxPY

Welsh school girl numbers playing rugby is boosted to 10,000 :)


Last edited by eldanielfire on Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:20 am 
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eldanielfire wrote:
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/39575.php#.WefD-TBrxPY

Welsh school girl numbr playing rugby s boosted to 10,000 :)


That's about 5% of the population - that's a HUGE number.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:14 am 
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ManInTheBar wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/39575.php#.WefD-TBrxPY

Welsh school girl number playing rugby is boosted to 10,000 :)


That's about 5% of the population - that's a HUGE number.


0.5%


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:56 am 
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eldanielfire wrote:
On the subject of england:

Quote:

England training squad for Bisham Abbey camp
Forwards
Rochelle Clarke (Wasps FC Ladies)
Heather Kerr (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Sarah Bern (Gloucester-Hartpury)
Abbie Scott (Harlequins Ladies)
Tamara Taylor (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Marlie Packer (Saracens Women)
Poppy Leitch (Bristol Ladies)
Sarah Hunter (Loughborough Lightning)
Vickii Cornborough (Harlequins Ladies)
Justine Lucas (Wasps FC Ladies)
Harriet Millar-Mills (Wasps FC Ladies)
Poppy Cleall (Saracens Women)
Rowena Burnfield (Richmond FC)
Jessie Hood(Bristol Ladies)
Abbie Parsons (Bristol Ladies)
Hannah West (Wasps FC Ladies)
Alex Powell (Wasps FC Ladies)
Cath O’Donnell (Loughborough Lightning)
Courtney Gill (Gloucester -Hartpury)
Olivia Jones (Loughborough Lightning)
Hannah Botterman (Saracens Women)
Lark Davies (Worcester Valkyries)
Molly Morrisey (Gloucester- Hartpury)
Jo Brown (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Izzy Noel-Smith (Bristol Ladies)

Backs
Rachael Burford (Harlequins Ladies)
Amber Reed (Bristol Ladies)
Danielle Waterman (Wasps FC Ladies)
Katy Daley-Mclean (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Leanne Riley (Harlequins Ladies)
Lotte Clapp (Saracens Women)
Jess Breach (Harlequins Ladies)
Rachael Woosey (Darlington Mowden Park Sharks)
Celia Quansah (Loughborough Lightning)
Zoe Harrison (Saracens Women)
Ellie Kildunne (Gloucester-Hartpury)
Abby Dow (Wasps FC Ladies)
Lagi Tuima (Bristol Ladies)
Lucy Attwood (Bristol Ladies)
Brooke Bradley (Bristol Ladies)
Charlotte Pearce (Loughborough Lightning)
Lauren Cattell (Saracens Women)
Kelly Smith (Gloucester- Hartpury)


Mostof the bolded ones I'm eally gald are getting a closer look, they were superb U20 players and are tearing up the Premiership now. Especially Lagi Yuima who is hier to Waterman's 15 shirt (she plays 2 as well) and Abby Dow who i think has that x-factor for slicing through defences with her lines and speed and a great wingers sporting IQ. I think those two can be very special players. Likewise Catherine O’Donnell and Poppy Leitch. The England U20 side dropped massively in quality when many of those girls progressed upwards.

However some omissions I am surprised at are Garnet Mackinder who has scored a few superb wingers trys and has pace unmatched in the women's game I think. Though they might prime her for a 7's career. Also Brooke Bradley looks like she has been on top form for Bristol. I'm also surprised Poppy Cleall's twin Bryony has not had a look in at number 8. Sarries back row is looking ridiculously dominate and both twins are a physical handful few sides can cope with.

Likewise I'm not sure why Ceri Large has been overlooked recently, she's been superb and I think Kate McLean (who i do think highly of usually) had a bad world cup final for the econd time in these past 3 she has played in (2010 and 2017). I don't know why but against New Zealand in RWCs her decision making just goes to pot, perfoms in a shell of herself and not changing things which are obvious. Certainly other options should be considered and tried out early in an RWCcycle. Especially as McLean might well be off for Sevens anyway.

Three of the Saracens girls in that training squad graduated from the girls section of my very junior club in Hertfordshire. Including an 18 year old prop!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:07 am 
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eldanielfire wrote:
ManInTheBar wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/39575.php#.WefD-TBrxPY

Welsh school girl number playing rugby is boosted to 10,000 :)


That's about 5% of the population - that's a HUGE number.


0.5%



5% of the 11-18 female population. Should have made that clear.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:45 am 
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ManInTheBar wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
ManInTheBar wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/39575.php#.WefD-TBrxPY

Welsh school girl number playing rugby is boosted to 10,000 :)


That's about 5% of the population - that's a HUGE number.


0.5%



5% of the 11-18 female population. Should have made that clear.


Ah! :thumbup:

Though I do question what "Playing rugby" is. It could be one lesson where the girls throw a rugby ball a few times and that is it. Though any increase is a good thing. It appears women taking up Rugby is what is driving up global playing numbers. Last year England cracked 26k to become the nation with the highest number of women's rugby players (It was New Zealand and the USA before, England had less than half the numbers before the world cup win in 2014), that was doubled inside of 4 years. I can only imagine the depths of talent they will have in 5-10 years time.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 1:09 pm 
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Getting a 'density' of people in one activity is BOUND to make it stronger - it's something that all team sports are struggling with by comparison with former years.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:22 pm 
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eldanielfire wrote:
The IRFU are getting a kicking from all quarters and especially the women's players for only appointing a part time coach to the women's team.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41666183



Makes for a nice, controversial headline for the Beeb, but how many nations actually have full time coaches. Ours has recently moved into a higher position, but he was part-time and took the ladies to a 2nd place finish last WRWC.

From a financial standpoint, I can see why they don't go full time for just someone whose responsibility is the women's national team. There'd probably be a lot of time when he/she would be doing nothing. But why not combine the job with a girls and women's club development role that is year-round, and obviously not as involved in that when the national team is in session?

I used to coach at a club that has a guy who coached for a Canadian national development program and his opinion is that both our national coaches should have a massive role in developing at least one, if not several tiers down. If they're truly knowledgeable about the game and want the best possible players for the senior national team, then they should be sharing this knowledge with coaches and athletes that feed upwards to it. It seems (and is currently true by what he was telling to me), they get paid a lot to not do a whole lot compared to a country that has professional leagues, players, longer seasons with many more tests, etc. I think if you made that part of the job description from the start, you'd also get the right sort of person who can truly grow the game over a long period of time. Too often, I feel, men use women's national teams as a stepping stone to get to a 'better' position in the union and don't truly want to do more work beyond that single team.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:45 pm 
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In my sport (which is amateur apart from perhaps 50 athletes receving bursaries for Intl performance) we are NEARLY at 50-50 male v female, though different age groups vary.

Our problem now, it appears, is the lack of female coaches at all levels. In some way this reflects the past of the sport which was very male dominated, so those who have given up competing now coach and there are not yet enough females in the class. But we also suffer significantly, I think, from the sense that coaching is very 'male' in style.

I don't know how we crack that.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:40 pm 
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ManInTheBar wrote:
In my sport (which is amateur apart from perhaps 50 athletes receving bursaries for Intl performance) we are NEARLY at 50-50 male v female, though different age groups vary.

Our problem now, it appears, is the lack of female coaches at all levels. In some way this reflects the past of the sport which was very male dominated, so those who have given up competing now coach and there are not yet enough females in the class. But we also suffer significantly, I think, from the sense that coaching is very 'male' in style.

I don't know how we crack that.



I think the emerging approaches to coaching probably suit the traditional 'female' approach better than the traditional 'male' one, so maybe more will take up the cause (maybe stereotyping there, but bear with me ... ). The common language coming from coach educators and sport scientists focuses on the greater impact that can be had from athlete-centred, holisitic approaches which take into account the desires of each individual athlete, not the coach's. Not many male coaches I know are good at that, and even with best intentions coming from their mouths at times, I've seen some revert to barking at players or making selection decisions that focused more on winning than development (when it didn't matter, being at school or club level).

I've been coaching women in rugby on-and-off since 2003, and really do think these approaches are the way forward and in addition, that the women's game can be very different from the attritional men's game that's often played with more attention to skill and tactics. I've been successful with it myself, but it takes a lot more effort, I think.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:44 pm 
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I have successfuly coached both a mens group and a womens group (at a low, domestic evel I should emphasise).

They were VERY different groups to deal with and conformed to too many stereotypes to list. I learnt more about my coaching from the women, partly cos the men were SO easy to wind into action.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:13 pm 
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Well I'm off now to watch Quins Ladies play Bristol at the Stoop for the first time :)


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:09 am 
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Good game, Harlequins thrashed Bristol who were missing a ton of players. Bristols 14 didn't appear to want to tackle, Quins knew this and attacked for for the first two tries before they moved her to crum half move 11 to the right wing and the scrum half to the left wing. Sadly some of Bristols forwards didn't appear to want to arce to the rucks, which made the fact Quins forwards were dominate even more obvious. Bristols front row showed up and their 7 and 8 did but the other forwards did not. In their backs the 13 and 15 and Amber Reed were the only ones who showed up. Their 21 crashed the ball well when on but sadly bristol didn't have the depth to make it a game with key players missing. Quins look awesome and Rachel Burford was great. She literally produced one of the best ball steals from a ruck I've seen a back do.


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 Post subject: Re: Women's Rugby thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 4:53 pm 
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England squad for the tst series against Canada.

Image



Sadly not to many countries are playing tests. I know South Africa just played two, behind closed doors games against England academy. I have no idea what Wales or Scotland are doing.


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