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Whos Going to Lead the Labor Rabble
Albo 40%  40%  [ 4 ]
Plibbers 10%  10%  [ 1 ]
Bowen 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Chalmers 30%  30%  [ 3 ]
Uncle Tony 10%  10%  [ 1 ]
Clive Palmer 10%  10%  [ 1 ]
George Smith 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 10
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 6:55 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
I'd just like to take a moment to address the proposed Adani coal mine which is going to occupy some media space over coming weeks and suggest this as valuable analysis on why the project is a dud and a con...

https://twitter.com/davidfickling/statu ... 5124242432

Quote:
I honestly don't understand why we have had nearly ten years of pretending that the Adani Carmichael mine is viable. Here's some really simple maths explaining why it just doesn't stand up financially:

....


Personally, I don't want any new thermal coal mines, but putting the environmental realities to one side, financially, what does it matter if the mine is projected to lose money? Genuine question. Adani won't stay and jobs won't be realised? Government funds all coming to nothing?

I thought Adani wanted to be vertically integrated, so comparing to Indo coal is a bit irrelevant?


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 7:25 am 
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Sensible Stephen wrote:

Personally, I don't want any new thermal coal mines, but putting the environmental realities to one side, financially, what does it matter if the mine is projected to lose money? Genuine question. Adani won't stay and jobs won't be realised? Government funds all coming to nothing?

I thought Adani wanted to be vertically integrated, so comparing to Indo coal is a bit irrelevant?


There's a serious financial risk to Australia if any govt funds are used to set this thing up, which is a ridiculously likely scenario.

as for Adani's vertical integration,

Quote:
(d) "Coal prices in the market don't matter because we're selling to our own coal generators" -- an argument Adani have made. But of course, they do. Why build a A$3bn infrastructure project to buy low-quality coal from a remote basin when you could buy it for less on-market?

And more to the point, the generator still has to sell *electricity*, and at present coal plants in India are being badly undercut by renewables, operating at loss-making capacity factors, and loading up the entire Indian financial sector with bad debts.


The Carmichael Coal project strikes me as having devolved from a tenuously viable project 7 years ago, swamped by the rise of renewable technology at scale and now noting more than a vanity project for Guatam Adani and Matt Canavan.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 7:31 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
Sensible Stephen wrote:

Personally, I don't want any new thermal coal mines, but putting the environmental realities to one side, financially, what does it matter if the mine is projected to lose money? Genuine question. Adani won't stay and jobs won't be realised? Government funds all coming to nothing?

I thought Adani wanted to be vertically integrated, so comparing to Indo coal is a bit irrelevant?


There's a serious financial risk to Australia if any govt funds are used to set this thing up, which is a ridiculously likely scenario.

as for Adani's vertical integration,

Quote:
(d) "Coal prices in the market don't matter because we're selling to our own coal generators" -- an argument Adani have made. But of course, they do. Why build a A$3bn infrastructure project to buy low-quality coal from a remote basin when you could buy it for less on-market?

And more to the point, the generator still has to sell *electricity*, and at present coal plants in India are being badly undercut by renewables, operating at loss-making capacity factors, and loading up the entire Indian financial sector with bad debts.


The Carmichael Coal project strikes me as having devolved from a tenuously viable project 7 years ago, swamped by the rise of renewable technology at scale and now noting more than a vanity project for Guatam Adani and Matt Canavan.


Ok. Doesn't sound great. Well, sounds good actually, but doesn't sound great for the future of the mine.

But then, why would Adani keep pressing forwards.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 7:39 am 
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I dunno really mate...

unless they expect to gain some financial assistance that will help them reduce their losses so far.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 7:42 am 
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Adani are far more than just a coal mine. They are a multinational energy company who are heavily invested in power plants, both renewable and thermal.

There is every chance that they are not going to make money from this mine but will get a huge advantage from securing a source of coal to feed their power plants. The coal plant as a stand alone wont make money, when coupled with a number of coal fired power stations, they might.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 11:48 am 
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I like Albo but I don't even know what this means...

"I believe very firmly that this country needs a Labor Government that is committed not to economic growth for its own sake, but to growth in order to expand jobs, opportunity for workers, families and their communities".

From his press conference today.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 12:14 pm 
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Vuaka wrote:
I like Albo but I don't even know what this means...

"I believe very firmly that this country needs a Labor Government that is committed not to economic growth for its own sake, but to growth in order to expand jobs, opportunity for workers, families and their communities".

From his press conference today.


That's easy. He's trying to set out an agenda that talks positive growth while delivering fairness. TheAge had an article up yesterday, I think, outlining some of what the ALP were going to jettison policy wise... they know they have to drop the idea of taxing franking credits and the illusion that gives of attacking peoples' hard earned so they'll move away from the idea of redistributing wealth and focus on creating it. I reckon they'll attack the Libs on economic management for the whole 3 years using wage growth as a lever. It's going to get messy for Morrison and co as it looks like the country is heading into a possible recession. Imagine housing prices falling even more than they already have... cannon fodder.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 12:26 pm 
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wamberal99 wrote:
At that rate the Greens will form government in 2095


:lol:


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 12:59 pm 
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KPMG agreed with dumping Franking Credits


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 9:46 pm 
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Fairfax drops polling...

https://www.smh.com.au/federal-election ... 51qj6.html

Quote:
In Ipsos’s defence, the company had long been ringing alarm bells for Bill Shorten by predicting a worryingly low primary vote - the final poll had Labor gaining just 33 per cent of first preferences. These warnings were criticised by rival media outlets or, in the case of the Labor campaign team, ignored. As of Thursday afternoon the AEC count has the Labor primary vote from Saturday at 33.72 per cent.

But Ipsos can’t walk away from the fact its overall polling forecast the wrong result. Moreover, polling companies are the main reason Saturday night’s result took voters, the media and many political operatives by surprise.

The implications of our major pollsters making the same mistakes in a consistent way are serious.

ANU vice-chancellor and Nobel laureate Brian Schmidt wrote in The Guardian earlier this week the likelihood of the 16 polls published during the campaign predicting such a narrow range of results was greater than 100,000 to 1. He went on to suggest that “the polls have been manipulated, probably unintentionally, to give the same answers as each other”.

Ipsos director Jessica Elgood told me Schmidt’s analysis should be included in an industry-wide review, in which Ipsos would gladly participate.

But it’s not just the pollsters who need to reflect on their approach in the wake of this election - the Herald and Age newsrooms have some decisions to make.

Many months before the election, so therefore not influenced by the polls’ failure, we agreed that we would reassess our arrangements after May 18. From this week we have no ongoing contract with Ipsos or any other polling company.

This is not to say we will never poll again. As chief political correspondent David Crowe says, accurate polling can be an invaluable reality check when journalists are faced with relentless spinning by political parties, interest groups and think tanks.

However, we have a responsibility to put our finite reporting resources into journalism that best serves our readers. During this campaign our best reporting on the mood of the electorate was done by journalists out on the road (and I don’t mean the carefully controlled campaign busses organised by the political parties). Michael Koziol’s report from Queensland midway through the race, which suggested Labor was in deep trouble north of the Tweed, was informed by old-fashioned boot-leather journalism. Nick Bonyhady detected no dramatic shift to Labor as he travelled from Hobart to Cairns on public transport.

The cadence of polls is also worth examining. Very few would argue the country has been well-served by the political class’s obsession with the fortnightly Newspolls, which Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull weaponised to their advantage and their demise.

“Did polling create a parallel universe where all the activity of the past few years, especially the leadership coups and prime ministerial changes, were based on illusions, phantoms of public opinion that did not exist,” Labor pollster John Utting wrote in The Australian Financial Review.


I guess this is going to become something of an issue for media generally over the foreseeable future. Sooner or later someone's going to drop the truth bomb that this doesn't just apply to Australia and major polling has been right out of whack in all the supposed upsets of the last 5 years at least.

How public opinion is measured is going to be interesting to see particularly in the wake of the trust issues facing Facebook... the gathering of data and the analytical potential of 'big data', along with the 'weaponising' of that data is where battles are won and lost. I reckon some of the political parties are probably well advanced in that field and might not want their tech secrets exposed.


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 10:54 pm 
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Farva wrote:
He is sometimes known as DJ ALBO

Image

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/newsl ... 66a20bd177

Image

Quote:
“I’m really into Gang of Youths at the moment and I voted for their song ‘Let Me Down Easy’ in the Triple J Hottest 100,” DJ Albo tells InDaily.

“It’s a great track, you know – it starts with the big bass and it kicks off from there.”

...

“I’ll be playing some Gang of Youths, for sure, as well as Vera Blue, Tkay Maidza, Sticky Fingers, The Cure, New Order, Polish Club and [David] Bowie,” he says.


https://indaily.com.au/arts-and-culture ... -adelaide/


Biiig shoes to fill, DJAlbo

Image


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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 11:22 pm 
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As much as I would have preferred to see Albo as leader instead of Shorty, I am of the opinion that he is not the answer. Six more years of Scummo.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:41 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
I dunno really mate...

unless they expect to gain some financial assistance that will help them reduce their losses so far.


Never seen the point of propping up marginal businesses


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:43 am 
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wamberal99 wrote:
As much as I would have preferred to see Albo as leader instead of Shorty, I am of the opinion that he is not the answer. Six more years of Scummo.


Agree. He's yesterdays man for me....and labor will now turn into Lib lite. We'll go back to the old days of hardly any differentiation between the two main parties


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 2:47 am 
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_fatprop wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
I dunno really mate...

unless they expect to gain some financial assistance that will help them reduce their losses so far.


Never seen the point of propping up marginal businesses



Depends which electorate they are in.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 2:59 am 
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MungoMan wrote:
Farva wrote:
He is sometimes known as DJ ALBO

Image

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/newsl ... 66a20bd177

Image

Quote:
“I’m really into Gang of Youths at the moment and I voted for their song ‘Let Me Down Easy’ in the Triple J Hottest 100,” DJ Albo tells InDaily.

“It’s a great track, you know – it starts with the big bass and it kicks off from there.”

...

“I’ll be playing some Gang of Youths, for sure, as well as Vera Blue, Tkay Maidza, Sticky Fingers, The Cure, New Order, Polish Club and [David] Bowie,” he says.


https://indaily.com.au/arts-and-culture ... -adelaide/


Biiig shoes to fill, DJAlbo

Image


His playlist is a nightmare. Not looking good for the Labor leadership with that mess going through his head.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:03 am 
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Lucius wrote:
_fatprop wrote:
Thought provoking article

https://quillette.com/2019/05/20/at-aus ... -to-roost/

Quote:
Progressive politicians like to assume that, on election day at least, blue-collar workers and urban progressives will bridge their differences, and make common cause to support leftist economic policies. This assumption might once have been warranted. But it certainly isn’t now—in large part because the intellectuals, activists and media pundits who present the most visible face of modern leftism are the same people openly attacking the values and cultural tastes of working and middle-class voters. And thanks to social media (and the caustic news-media culture that social media has encouraged and normalized), these attacks are no longer confined to dinner-party titterings and university lecture halls. Brigid Delaney, a senior writer for Guardian Australia, responded to Saturday’s election result with a column about how Australia has shown itself to be “rotten.” One well-known Australian feminist and op-ed writer, Clementine Ford, has been fond of Tweeting sentiments such as “All men are scum and must die.” Former Australian Race Discrimination Commissioner Tim Soutphommasane, who also has served as a high-profile newspaper columnist, argues that even many mainstream political positions—such as expressing concern about the Chinese government’s rising regional influence—are a smokescreen for racism.

In an interview conducted on Sunday morning, Deputy Labor leader Tanya Plibersek opined that if only her party had more time to explain to the various groups how much they’d all benefit from Labor’s plans, Australians would have realized how fortunate they’d be with a Labor government, and Shorten would’ve become Prime Minister. Such attitudes are patronizing, for they implicitly serve to place blame at the feet of voters, who apparently are too ignorant to know what’s good for them.

What the election actually shows us is that the so-called quiet Australians, whether they are tradies (to use the Australian term) in Penrith, retirees in Bundaberg, or small business owners in Newcastle, are tired of incessant scolding from their purported superiors. Condescension isn’t a good look for a political movement.

Taking stock of real voters’ needs would require elites to exhibit a spirit of empathic understanding—such as by way of acknowledging that blue-collar workers have good reason to vote down parties whose policies would destroy blue-collar jobs; or that legal immigrants might oppose opening up a nation’s border to migrants who arrive illegally. More broadly, the modern progressive left has lost touch with the fact that what ordinary people want from their government is a spirit of respect, dignity and hope for the future. While the fetish for hectoring and moral puritanism has become popular in rarefied corners of arts and academia, it is deeply off-putting to voters whose sense of self extends beyond cultish ideological tribalism.
...........................................................



My cousin made an interesting observation tonight.

“The political party that tells Australians what to do, is the party that loses the election. Australians don’t like being told what to think and do”


That's the single most accurate remark that's appeared on here for a long while.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:10 am 
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kiap wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
This is not about 'retards not understanding'... if it was, then 'the Left' is the retard. Antagonising your voting base through some sort of moral superiority is a one way ticket to fail town.

Indeed. It brings to mind an Australian political quote:

    "Do you know why I have credibility? Because I don't exude morality."

Yes, if there was one thing Shorten did exude it was a self-righteous smugness, even when answering quesitons before a Royal Commission.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:11 am 
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mightyreds wrote:
kiap wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
This is not about 'retards not understanding'... if it was, then 'the Left' is the retard. Antagonising your voting base through some sort of moral superiority is a one way ticket to fail town.

Indeed. It brings to mind an Australian political quote:

    "Do you know why I have credibility? Because I don't exude morality."

Yes, if there was one thing Shorten did exude it was a self-righteous smugness, even when answering quesitons before a Royal Commission.


:yawn:


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:39 am 
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Farva wrote:
Mightyreds, you say that you support the policy that Fraser Anning and Pauline Hanson have put forward of stopping Muslim immigration to Australia and suggest that this is the biggest issue for Australia.
I have some questions.
Given the royal commission found 7% of all priests have been accused of child abuse, why do you feel Muslims are more dangerous than Catholics?

There are around 1.5 billion Muslims in the world. Does the ban exist for all of them? For example if SBW wanta to immigrate would he be blocked? What hapoens if he converts to Christianity, comes here then converts back? Is that OK?


Farva, answer to the first one is very simple: our society supports prosecution of anyone convicted of child abuse, or any other crime against the laws of the land. Muslims do not recognise the laws of the land, only their own law. They will not take an oath of allegiance to the country they have said they want to live in. That is why, when police arrived to arrest the men who organised the murder of a Sydney policeman, the exclusively Muslim residents of the streets turned out in numbers to pelt the media with eggs. That is the difference exposed by one event. They do not accept democracy and are at odds with it - not a fit for democratic countries, an experiment that failed long ago. When murderers are protected and the people protecting society from them are hated, you have an unworkable situation.

Question 2: Ban all of them. they have become 1.5 billion living where they are and they can stay there. Put it this way: If Australians were migrating to other countries in vast numbers and creating havoc everywhere they went, I would not be in the least surprised if Australian migration to those areas was banned by their governments. In fact I would regard those countries as very stupid if they did not, which I think applies to anyone in Australia who opposes the Muslim immigration ban. The SBW thing is not worth comment as you have picked a hypothetical example involving possible fraud which would have to be dealt with on its own merits. That would leave it up to the Muslim groups still here to work on compatibility with society, and those that infringe, like Jihadis, to have their citizenship cancelled.

The bottom line is, I despise anyone who receives a new start in another country and does not respect the opportunity they have been given and make every effort to become a model citizen. I lived in a number of countries overseas for short periods, and it has always been important for me to respect their culture, laws and hospitality while there, and I believe no country needs people who will not.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 3:57 am 
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mightyreds wrote:
Farva wrote:
Mightyreds, you say that you support the policy that Fraser Anning and Pauline Hanson have put forward of stopping Muslim immigration to Australia and suggest that this is the biggest issue for Australia.
I have some questions.
Given the royal commission found 7% of all priests have been accused of child abuse, why do you feel Muslims are more dangerous than Catholics?

There are around 1.5 billion Muslims in the world. Does the ban exist for all of them? For example if SBW wanta to immigrate would he be blocked? What hapoens if he converts to Christianity, comes here then converts back? Is that OK?


Farva, answer to the first one is very simple: our society supports prosecution of anyone convicted of child abuse, or any other crime against the laws of the land. Muslims do not recognise the laws of the land, only their own law. They will not take an oath of allegiance to the country they have said they want to live in. That is why, when police arrived to arrest the men who organised the murder of a Sydney policeman, the exclusively Muslim residents of the streets turned out in numbers to pelt the media with eggs. That is the difference exposed by one event. They do not accept democracy and are at odds with it - not a fit for democratic countries, an experiment that failed long ago. When murderers are protected and the people protecting society from them are hated, you have an unworkable situation.

Question 2: Ban all of them. they have become 1.5 billion living where they are and they can stay there. Put it this way: If Australians were migrating to other countries in vast numbers and creating havoc everywhere they went, I would not be in the least surprised if Australian migration to those areas was banned by their governments. In fact I would regard those countries as very stupid if they did not, which I think applies to anyone in Australia who opposes the Muslim immigration ban. The SBW thing is not worth comment as you have picked a hypothetical example involving possible fraud which would have to be dealt with on its own merits. That would leave it up to the Muslim groups still here to work on compatibility with society, and those that infringe, like Jihadis, to have their citizenship cancelled.

The bottom line is, I despise anyone who receives a new start in another country and does not respect the opportunity they have been given and make every effort to become a model citizen. I lived in a number of countries overseas for short periods, and it has always been important for me to respect their culture, laws and hospitality while there, and I believe no country needs people who will not.


:lol: Not sure if serious


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:12 am 
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I have to say I dont agree with your statement that Muslims dont obey the law of the land. They do. They are arrested when they dont and persecuted under that law. They have been proved to do so. You pick an example of where they havent but that is an outlier not the norm.

In fact, their religion compels them to do so:

Quote:
In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)


https://www.alislam.org/library/questio ... w-of-land/

There are other examples of Muslims not accepting Australian law but again they are the minority.
I think this article goes a long way to discussing it. https://aifs.gov.au/publications/family ... sharia-law

Interestingly, some Catholics also believe they are above Australian law - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-aust ... SKCN1LG057

Many Muslims immigrate here, many more were born here. Same as for Catholics. Again, I ask why this is a Muslim only issue and Catholics (as an example, I havent looked into other religious or non-religious groups but am sure they are the same).

In regard to your point about showing respect for the country you live in, I totally agree. I see a small minority of Muslims not doing that in Australia, but I see the same for every group that immigrate there. Do you have an issue with the organised crime gangs that came with the Italian migrants for example? Should we ban Italian migrants - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ralia.html

Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:15 am 
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Betoota nails it again

https://www.betootaadvocate.com/headlin ... -fuck-qld/

https://www.betootaadvocate.com/breakin ... g-farmers/

Channelling Godfather I with this one
https://www.betootaadvocate.com/breakin ... n-her-bed/

One for Bill Shorten fans
https://www.betootaadvocate.com/enterta ... -election/


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:58 am 
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Farva wrote:
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


Only fat Qld politicians .......................

On the challenges of assimilation, there is a clear cost, particularly for refugees that needs to be invested in helping them. That needs to be factored into the programs

Realistically the 2nd & 3rd generations are assimilated 99% of the time


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 5:19 am 
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_fatprop wrote:
Farva wrote:
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


Only fat Qld politicians .......................

On the challenges of assimilation, there is a clear cost, particularly for refugees that needs to be invested in helping them. That needs to be factored into the programs

Realistically the 2nd & 3rd generations are assimilated 99% of the time


Refugees and immigrants, my only problem is the government needs to invest more to cater for both groups. I agree with Kevin 07 in a big Australia (sorry D. Smith), but its one thing to let people in, its another to make serious investments in "think big" infrastructure projects.

High speed rail, subways, high density housing hubs... and on and on. Get on it you dicks.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 5:46 am 
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_fatprop wrote:
Farva wrote:
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


Only fat Qld politicians .......................

On the challenges of assimilation, there is a clear cost, particularly for refugees that needs to be invested in helping them. That needs to be factored into the programs

Realistically the 2nd & 3rd generations are assimilated 99% of the time


Yup.
Every wave of immigration has had its issues and raised a similar amount of ire, be it the Chinese and Irish in the 19th C, the post war Greek and Italians, the Lebanese in the 70s, Cambodian / Vietnamese in the 80s or the Muslims and Africans today.
Each bought with them an underbelly of gangs, violence, assimilation issues and crime, which still exists today, but I think everyone would agree that these groups have made Australia better.
There does need to be support for immigrants I agree, to help with assimilation. And having them all move to the same suburb of the same city is not the solution.
Interestingly, when I was in Melbourne, there was a little old Italian lady living next to me. She had lived in that house since 1965 when she moved across from Italy. She had lived in Australia in the northern suburbs of Melbourne for 50 years. But she didnt speak a word of English.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 5:48 am 
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Sensible Stephen wrote:
_fatprop wrote:
Farva wrote:
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


Only fat Qld politicians .......................

On the challenges of assimilation, there is a clear cost, particularly for refugees that needs to be invested in helping them. That needs to be factored into the programs

Realistically the 2nd & 3rd generations are assimilated 99% of the time


Refugees and immigrants, my only problem is the government needs to invest more to cater for both groups. I agree with Kevin 07 in a big Australia (sorry D. Smith), but its one thing to let people in, its another to make serious investments in "think big" infrastructure projects.

High speed rail, subways, high density housing hubs... and on and on. Get on it you dicks.


Australia's problem is our major cities dont have the population density for decent infrastructure, particularly in the suburbs. There are less people across whom the cost of installing the asset can be spread. Part of that is down to the "Australian dream" of a 1/4 acre block in the suburbs. Get some density happening and the infrastructure will improve.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 5:57 am 
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Farva wrote:
Interestingly, when I was in Melbourne, there was a little old Italian lady living next to me. She had lived in that house since 1965 when she moved across from Italy. She had lived in Australia in the northern suburbs of Melbourne for 50 years. But she didnt speak a word of English.


There are old folks like that around Freo too... I met a small old woman all dressed in black at a bus stop years ago who told me she was going to Fre Mantilly.

Multi cultural suburbs rock.


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:08 am 
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Farva wrote:
_fatprop wrote:
Farva wrote:
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


Only fat Qld politicians .......................

On the challenges of assimilation, there is a clear cost, particularly for refugees that needs to be invested in helping them. That needs to be factored into the programs

Realistically the 2nd & 3rd generations are assimilated 99% of the time


Yup.
Every wave of immigration has had its issues and raised a similar amount of ire, be it the Chinese and Irish in the 19th C, the post war Greek and Italians, the Lebanese in the 70s, Cambodian / Vietnamese in the 80s or the Muslims and Africans today.
Each bought with them an underbelly of gangs, violence, assimilation issues and crime, which still exists today, but I think everyone would agree that these groups have made Australia better.
There does need to be support for immigrants I agree, to help with assimilation. And having them all move to the same suburb of the same city is not the solution.
Interestingly, when I was in Melbourne, there was a little old Italian lady living next to me. She had lived in that house since 1965 when she moved across from Italy. She had lived in Australia in the northern suburbs of Melbourne for 50 years. But she didnt speak a word of English.


The biggest "ocker" I know is a 17 stone Greek guy. He sounds like an extra from a Crocodile Dundee movie, except louder


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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:13 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
Multi cultural suburbs rock.



:thumbup:

I can't imagine how insufferable Brunswick would've been to live in had it not been for the Italians, and the Arabs mightyreds hates so much...


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:48 am 
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David Speers poached by the ABC, according to todays "Hurled".


That would be very bad news for Rupert. The only credible journalist on Sky. A good one, too.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:59 am 
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wamberal99 wrote:
David Speers poached by the ABC, according to todays "Hurled".


That would be very bad news for Rupert. The only credible journalist on Sky. A good one, too.

Would it be? Do they really care about being seen as 'credible'?


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 4:01 am 
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wamberal99 wrote:
David Speers poached by the ABC, according to todays "Hurled".


That would be very bad news for Rupert. The only credible journalist on Sky. A good one, too.


Yeah, I was going to post abut that earlier. Industry wide, it's being hailed as a major blow to NewsCorp. He's extremely well regarded and will prove a worthy successor to the much admired Barry Cassidy. Word is that News may try to obstruct the move under contractual obligations and they're entitled to do so, of course... but he'll end up there regardless.

It's something of a boost for the ABC too, facing a difficult future under yet another coalition govt. My inclination is that News will ratchet up the hostility now, out for vengeance.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 8:10 am 
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UncleFB wrote:
wamberal99 wrote:
David Speers poached by the ABC, according to todays "Hurled".


That would be very bad news for Rupert. The only credible journalist on Sky. A good one, too.

Would it be? Do they really care about being seen as 'credible'?




There is a halo effect from Speers, so it is said. He gives the whole channel credibility. Without him they have got none.

This is not Merka, fortunately. Even the misfits on Sky would feel his loss, I reckon.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 10:01 am 
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Farva wrote:
I have to say I dont agree with your statement that Muslims dont obey the law of the land. They do. They are arrested when they dont and persecuted under that law. They have been proved to do so. You pick an example of where they havent but that is an outlier not the norm.

In fact, their religion compels them to do so:

Quote:
In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)


https://www.alislam.org/library/questio ... w-of-land/

There are other examples of Muslims not accepting Australian law but again they are the minority.
I think this article goes a long way to discussing it. https://aifs.gov.au/publications/family ... sharia-law

Interestingly, some Catholics also believe they are above Australian law - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-aust ... SKCN1LG057

Many Muslims immigrate here, many more were born here. Same as for Catholics. Again, I ask why this is a Muslim only issue and Catholics (as an example, I havent looked into other religious or non-religious groups but am sure they are the same).

In regard to your point about showing respect for the country you live in, I totally agree. I see a small minority of Muslims not doing that in Australia, but I see the same for every group that immigrate there. Do you have an issue with the organised crime gangs that came with the Italian migrants for example? Should we ban Italian migrants - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ralia.html

Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:37 pm 
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mightyreds wrote:
Farva wrote:
I have to say I dont agree with your statement that Muslims dont obey the law of the land. They do. They are arrested when they dont and persecuted under that law. They have been proved to do so. You pick an example of where they havent but that is an outlier not the norm.

In fact, their religion compels them to do so:

Quote:
In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)


https://www.alislam.org/library/questio ... w-of-land/

There are other examples of Muslims not accepting Australian law but again they are the minority.
I think this article goes a long way to discussing it. https://aifs.gov.au/publications/family ... sharia-law

Interestingly, some Catholics also believe they are above Australian law - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-aust ... SKCN1LG057

Many Muslims immigrate here, many more were born here. Same as for Catholics. Again, I ask why this is a Muslim only issue and Catholics (as an example, I havent looked into other religious or non-religious groups but am sure they are the same).

In regard to your point about showing respect for the country you live in, I totally agree. I see a small minority of Muslims not doing that in Australia, but I see the same for every group that immigrate there. Do you have an issue with the organised crime gangs that came with the Italian migrants for example? Should we ban Italian migrants - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ralia.html

Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?

Fantastic. Great move. Well done Farva.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2019 7:31 pm 
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:lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 1:38 am 
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Vuaka wrote:
I like Albo but I don't even know what this means...

"I believe very firmly that this country needs a Labor Government that is committed not to economic growth for its own sake, but to growth in order to expand jobs, opportunity for workers, families and their communities".

From his press conference today.


Like most countries around the world, I assume Oz governments keep ramming home GDP growth figures as economic success while the masses see wages grow stale or flatline, job options decrease and homes become so expensive as they become ever bigger percentages of people's income and mos ever further away from affordability. Meanwhile the very rich get ever richer. SO it's claiming he can reverse or alter drastically those conditions. Tragically every new government around the world is promising these to little or no effect.


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 1:50 am 
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Farva wrote:
mightyreds wrote:
Farva wrote:
I have to say I dont agree with your statement that Muslims dont obey the law of the land. They do. They are arrested when they dont and persecuted under that law. They have been proved to do so. You pick an example of where they havent but that is an outlier not the norm.

In fact, their religion compels them to do so:

Quote:
In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:

O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).

Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:

‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)

The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:

‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)


https://www.alislam.org/library/questio ... w-of-land/

There are other examples of Muslims not accepting Australian law but again they are the minority.
I think this article goes a long way to discussing it. https://aifs.gov.au/publications/family ... sharia-law

Interestingly, some Catholics also believe they are above Australian law - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-aust ... SKCN1LG057

Many Muslims immigrate here, many more were born here. Same as for Catholics. Again, I ask why this is a Muslim only issue and Catholics (as an example, I havent looked into other religious or non-religious groups but am sure they are the same).

In regard to your point about showing respect for the country you live in, I totally agree. I see a small minority of Muslims not doing that in Australia, but I see the same for every group that immigrate there. Do you have an issue with the organised crime gangs that came with the Italian migrants for example? Should we ban Italian migrants - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ralia.html

Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?

Fantastic. Great move. Well done Farva.


My exact thoughts last night when I read it

:lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2019 12:23 pm 
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Caley_Red wrote:
Sensible Stephen wrote:
See, you seem to be presuming that the votes were based on conservative christian values or something. Rather than say... economics and fear of losing jobs/retirement funding.

I doubt being gay, or Asian would matter much to most of the electorate.


More reflective of people inserting their own politics into a narrative they feel vindicates the loss.


Looks very much like that.


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