Planet Rugby Forum

Cthulu's Trilby

AND-y wrote:I used my own definition which is that you have 7 automatic qualification spaces.

"Get me Bath on the line".

Cthulu's Trilby

CM11 wrote:Allegedly 1m extra combined for the 4 Rabo nations and 28m extra for the clubs.

That's certainly an even-handed and not-at-all-disingenuous way of putting it.

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Now they are moaning because the structure they chose does not work as well as others and that's just not fair! Technically they're moaning that the HEC ought to be bringing in more money for everyone. So we can all sign that new deal but keep all as it is including qualification and payments etc? ...

Cthulu's Trilby

Now they are moaning because the structure they chose does not work as well as others and that's just not fair! Technically they're moaning that the HEC ought to be bringing in more money for everyone. As long as they get more of that money than the rest of the countries. Round and around we go...

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AND-y wrote:Now they are moaning because the structure they chose does not work as well as others and that's just not fair!

Technically they're moaning that the HEC ought to be bringing in more money for everyone.

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The problem is that there are a lot of mediocre English teams who see themselves as potential European contenders. ... In reality the 5 placed 21-30 have about as much chance of winning the Heino as Connacht or Treviso, but don't try telling them that. Hmm. Let's see who those 5 are: Bath Glouceste...

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Ouin Ouin wrote:Yes you are right, France wasn't world cup finalists while England was ridiculous

Meh. We were shit and in a WC final first.

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Seneca of the Night wrote:I mean they both share the same narrow restricted view of England - a sort of neo-bucolic midlands / west country small town yeoman pastoral existence, unsullied by the wider world.

The EDL generally hang out in pubs in Dagenham. If they saw a cow they'd probably think it was a foreigner.

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CM11 wrote:Which confirms that the clubs get all the extra cash.

We confirmed that about 10 pages ago. It's the three way split we've been talking about.

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So you put artificial constraints in place to maintain competitiveness at league level but take issue doing it at European level? It's the sensible way around to do it because it allows a greater volume of cash to flow in. Fwiw, I would love if there was a full share of all money coming into Europe...

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but half of England's share goes to clubs not in it. Presumably you can see why? Because they want a competitive league? And see no problem with sharing out cash based on need rather than who earned it? Absolutely. And the caps in place to prevent some clubs becoming uber-rich and powerful are at t...

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CM11 wrote:but half of England's share goes to clubs not in it.

Presumably you can see why?

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CM11 wrote:I think we can all agree that the guts of the money earned by ERC is in the HEC?

I don't know. I'm still reeling from the LV revelation.

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And you lot wonder why we feel aggrieved? I can absolutely see why you feel aggrieved. I'd happily see the HEC continue in its current format. But the clubs would say they've been compromising since the beginning. They'd say that they're dividing 10 million between 12 and 14 clubs respectively whil...

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I may be reading too much into this, but why is Wray saying he hopes the proposed new competition will have better revenue than the HEC? Even though no one seems to actually know how much money BT is putting into the Euro comp, I thought it was done deal that it was going to be much better financia...

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You think that BT will offer twice the money that they have to next time around? They'll offer what the market can bear. The point was that in amongst a long list of suppositions that was just another one. A valid supposition given it's pretty much accepted that BT paid way over the odds, as they d...

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CM11 wrote:You think that BT will offer twice the money that they have to next time around?

They'll offer what the market can bear.

The point was that in amongst a long list of suppositions that was just another one.

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Sorry, but that is exactly what I mean. Lots of 'they claim', 'according to reports', and 'in theory' but no hard facts from the protaganists that clarifies how much of the £152m will be assigned to the Euro comp. I suspect that's about as concrete as you can get outside the minutes to some secreti...

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Sorry, but that is exactly what I mean. Lots of 'they claim', 'according to reports', and 'in theory' but no hard facts from the protaganists that clarifies how much of the £152m will be assigned to the Euro comp. I suspect that's about as concrete as you can get outside the minutes to some secreti...

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The numbers make interesting reading: Such a change would see the English and French being the primary beneficiaries from the injection of the new BT cash. According to reports, the Aviva Premiership and Top14 clubs would each gain around £14m (up from £10.56 to £24m), while the four Pro12 countrie...

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epaddy wrote:On the salary cap. Surely it will only increase with all the new revenue that PRL is getting from BT. I'd be surprised if any P12 side outside of the complex IRFU arrangements, was near the current spend of the PRL sides.

I would suggest this is where the unions need to step in in some capacity.

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As has been mentioned, the 2nd tier competition will be much improved under the new set-up. The teams in the bottom half of the Rabo will benefit more from playing in this competition than from suffering heavy defeats in the HEC. Thats fantasy stuff. No one is ever going to care about the Amlin or ...

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As has been mentioned, the 2nd tier competition will be much improved under the new set-up. The teams in the bottom half of the Rabo will benefit more from playing in this competition than from suffering heavy defeats in the HEC. Thats fantasy stuff. No one is ever going to care about the Amlin or ...

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Its all relative though. We'd just be falling further behind financially. This on top of losing four from the HEC and all the match day revenue that goes with it. In terms of negotiation there seems to be none on this, its just cutting the P12 sides off at their knees. Is that way fairer? Yes, but ...

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The fact we have to combine resources to get a half decent league should not penalised but that is exactly what is being proposed from what i can see. How are you being penalised? The HEC was set up by the Unions and the Unions put forward their teams. When it was set up there was no Pro12, hence t...

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Lorthern Nights wrote:The fact we have to combine resources to get a half decent league should not penalised but that is exactly what is being proposed from what i can see.

How are you being penalised?

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camroc1 wrote:I'll name the top six in this years Rabo in no particular order now; I'm sure the same could be done for the Aviva league.

No, it can't.

And it couldn't be until the last game of last season. The top 4? Possibly. Leicester, Sarries, Saints. Quins? We'll have to see.

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In all honestly it's hard to disagree with the new proposed HEC format. 6 from each league, the winner and the Amlin cup winner. let's go with that but leave everything else as it is. I agree with this format as well. Given the winner of the HEC-clone will likely be one of the top clubs anyway, how...

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The numbers make interesting reading: Such a change would see the English and French being the primary beneficiaries from the injection of the new BT cash. According to reports, the Aviva Premiership and Top14 clubs would each gain around £14m (up from £10.56 to £24m), while the four Pro12 countries...

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In terms of what PRL have said in public, yes. Sorry, but this started off last year with the head of a TV company telling me he owned European club rugby. Not a great starting point. You know this is a power grab. You know it's sharp business practice. You might applaud it because it benefits you ...

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epaddy wrote:Power grab, nothing else. Fans of the English and French national teams should be equally worried. These 12 or 16 guys will soon be dictating to their own unions on player release and international scheduling.

No chance. The RFU gives the clubs too much money.

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CM11 wrote:I think what you mean is 'one lies to the media, the other responds to the lies'.

How do you know which one's fibbing?

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CM11 wrote:It basically says that all ERC Unions have to agree to an Anglo-French competition? if that's the case.

It was discussed back at the beginning of all these shenanigans. It sort of presupposes the ERC survives the apocalypse though.

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DAC* wrote:This situation already exists. It will just be exacerbated. Massively.

Just so we know what page we're on, to whom are you referring?

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I and many other genuinely believe this could be the death knell for professional rugby in Ireland. As the French and English move further and further ahead financially our best players and some of our not so good players will leave. Crowds will move away from the Leinster/Munster/Ulster due to an ...

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DAC* wrote:Just because you have two super rich teams playing each other - it doesn't mean the game is going to be any game.

You and I know that but big names are still bigger draws.

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What many are losing sight of here is that "the best sides" doesn't necessarily make the best comp. At least not from the fan's perspective. The likes of those (e.g. DAC for example) who travel to all these different places are getting more utility than driving up the M4 to the Stoop repeatedly. Th...

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I think that since PRL signed with BT, there has been no room whatsoever for any give. PRL have been buoyed by the big fat contract and are doing their paymasters bidding, which means screwing Sky by any means, therefore there is no chance of the P12 teams having any influence or power to negotiate...

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I do, however, hope lots of people watch this exciting new tournament and it makes lots of money for the businessmen who own the clubs you support That's kind of you but I hope the stubborn old blazers and bowler hat wearing wankers can come to a conclusion that doesnt involve tantrums, or the end ...

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There are no real casual viewers in Rugby. If you had a pub in say, Stoke, and you had a HEC game with Edinburgh and Toulon and a low league soccer game being shown, I'd reckond 85% of the people would be causually watching the soccer. Apparently a million people watch the AP highlights programme. ...

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