Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

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mabunch78
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by mabunch78 »

guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm
Enzedder wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:16 pm Just as well it wasn't Iranians in a gunboat or the Defender would be sleeping with the fishes

Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Jay Cee Gee
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Jay Cee Gee »

mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
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guy smiley
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by guy smiley »

mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am
guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm
Enzedder wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:16 pm Just as well it wasn't Iranians in a gunboat or the Defender would be sleeping with the fishes

Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Why would my post have referred to Gallipoli?

Hitler had you done cold and the colonies came to help. I was replying to the Bimbot. Don’t try to turn it into something it isn’t.
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booji boy
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by booji boy »

guy smiley wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:53 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am
guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm
Enzedder wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:16 pm Just as well it wasn't Iranians in a gunboat or the Defender would be sleeping with the fishes

Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Why would my post have referred to Gallipoli?

Hitler had you done cold and the colonies came to help. I was replying to the Bimbot. Don’t try to turn it into something it isn’t.
I think the Yanks and the Russians had a lot more to do with saving the Brits arse from Hitler than we did.
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JB1981
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by JB1981 »

On the subject of Kiwi contributions (and what better subject on this World Test Championship day), Keith Park did his bit:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Park
While Sir Hugh Dowding controlled the Battle from day to day, it was Keith Park who controlled it hour by hour. Air Vice Marshal 'Johnnie' Johnson, one of the top Allied air aces of the war, said: "He was the only man who could have lost the war in a day or even an afternoon".[18] This was an echo of Winston Churchill's description of Admiral Jellicoe in the First World War. In February 1947, Arthur Tedder, Chief of the Air Staff, said of Park: "If any one man won the Battle of Britain, he did. I do not believe it is realised how much that one man, with his leadership, his calm judgement and his skill, did to save, not only this country, but the world."[19][20]

Another ace who fought in the Battle of Britain, the RAF pilot Douglas Bader, said that "the awesome responsibility for this country's survival rested squarely on Keith Park's shoulders. British military history of this century has been enriched with the names of great fighting men from New Zealand, of all ranks and in every one of our services. Keith Park's name is carved into history alongside those of his peers."[18]
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Anonymous 1
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Anonymous 1 »

Jay Cee Gee wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:12 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
To think the Turks have passed a law to stop aussies and kiwis using it as an excuse to have a massive pissup
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booji boy
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by booji boy »

Anonymous 1 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:24 am
Jay Cee Gee wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:12 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
To think the Turks have passed a law to stop aussies and kiwis using it as an excuse to have a massive pissup
It really makes sense bringing up Kiwis role in a battle fought over 100 years ago when Russia was Britains ally in a thread about Russia threatening a British warship steaming through the in the Black Sea in 2021.
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Anonymous 1 »

booji boy wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:21 am
Anonymous 1 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:24 am
Jay Cee Gee wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:12 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
To think the Turks have passed a law to stop aussies and kiwis using it as an excuse to have a massive pissup
It really makes sense bringing up Kiwis role in a battle fought over 100 years ago when Russia was Britains ally in a thread about Russia threatening a British warship steaming through the in the Black Sea in 2021.
what has the battle got to do with it ?
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booji boy
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by booji boy »

Anonymous 1 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:30 am
booji boy wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:21 am
Anonymous 1 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:24 am
Jay Cee Gee wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:12 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
To think the Turks have passed a law to stop aussies and kiwis using it as an excuse to have a massive pissup
It really makes sense bringing up Kiwis role in a battle fought over 100 years ago when Russia was Britains ally in a thread about Russia threatening a British warship steaming through the in the Black Sea in 2021.
what has the battle got to do with it ?
Nothing.
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not_english
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by not_english »

NZ is at the end of the world, with no strategic significance whatsoever. I don't imagine we have featured on anyone's plan for global takeover. Hence never needed saving.

Now what about these reporters who conveniently happened to be on this naval ship when the bombs were being dropped?
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message #2527204
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by message #2527204 »

JB1981 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:21 am On the subject of Kiwi contributions (and what better subject on this World Test Championship day), Keith Park did his bit:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Park
While Sir Hugh Dowding controlled the Battle from day to day, it was Keith Park who controlled it hour by hour. Air Vice Marshal 'Johnnie' Johnson, one of the top Allied air aces of the war, said: "He was the only man who could have lost the war in a day or even an afternoon".[18] This was an echo of Winston Churchill's description of Admiral Jellicoe in the First World War. In February 1947, Arthur Tedder, Chief of the Air Staff, said of Park: "If any one man won the Battle of Britain, he did. I do not believe it is realised how much that one man, with his leadership, his calm judgement and his skill, did to save, not only this country, but the world."[19][20]

Another ace who fought in the Battle of Britain, the RAF pilot Douglas Bader, said that "the awesome responsibility for this country's survival rested squarely on Keith Park's shoulders. British military history of this century has been enriched with the names of great fighting men from New Zealand, of all ranks and in every one of our services. Keith Park's name is carved into history alongside those of his peers."[18]
A bit patronising from Bader.
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message #2527204
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by message #2527204 »

not_english wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:08 am NZ is at the end of the world, with no strategic significance whatsoever. I don't imagine we have featured on anyone's plan for global takeover. Hence never needed saving.

Now what about these reporters who conveniently happened to be on this naval ship when the bombs were being dropped?
The Russians threatened that they were doing gunnery practice in the area.
Reaction from the russkis is a bit over the top. They're trying to lay claim to international water, and being belligerent about it to make it de facto theirs to control. RN once again doing its bit to police the world.
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The Optimist
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by The Optimist »

Of course, it is also dangerous for Moscow, not least as this kind of posturing may be intended to project strength of will. In practice, it simply reinforces the sense of Russia being not the kind of mature great power Vladimir Putin tried to present at Geneva, but erratic and vindictive.
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by The Optimist »

Image


A little scruffy mongrel incessantly yaps as I ride my bike past, what do I do? I call Batman!
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The Sun God
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by The Sun God »

booji boy wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:21 am
Anonymous 1 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:24 am
Jay Cee Gee wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:12 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus.
Without wanting to get into a blame game pissing contest cause it was a horrific shitshow for anyone on the frontlines, that's not accurate if you take the death totals in that wiki link.

UK population around 40 million, 34,072 dead
NZ population around 1 million, 2,721 dead.
To think the Turks have passed a law to stop aussies and kiwis using it as an excuse to have a massive pissup
It really makes sense bringing up Kiwis role in a battle fought over 100 years ago when Russia was Britains ally in a thread about Russia threatening a British warship steaming through the in the Black Sea in 2021.
Are you new here ???? :roll:
ovalball
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by ovalball »

not_english wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:08 am NZ is at the end of the world, with no strategic significance whatsoever. I don't imagine we have featured on anyone's plan for global takeover. Hence never needed saving.

Now what about these reporters who conveniently happened to be on this naval ship when the bombs were being dropped?
I would have thought that was obvious. They knew they would be sailing through disputed waters and it would provoke a response from Russia. Hence they invited media to witness/report on it. Standard practice.
towny
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am
guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm
Enzedder wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:16 pm Just as well it wasn't Iranians in a gunboat or the Defender would be sleeping with the fishes

Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Someone should tell Dan Carlin that he’s got it all wrong.
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Puma
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Puma »

The Optimist wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:28 am Image

That time when the dirty rejected basement dweller stalks you to school.
1. When it comes to "freedom of navigation" ops (sailing through waters a state intends to dispute, while excersising the right to Inocent passage granted by UNCLOS), it's all about the public / political / PR reactions afterwards. Nobody in their right minds would've thought of firing a single shot.

2. I haven't seen all sides' reports, but find it hard to believe Russian military would escalate as violently as to fire shots and bombs at a foreign warship. That's as close as an act of open war as the UN charter foresees...

3. That kind of stuff goes on everyday in disputed zones of the seas. It's kind of a game of "chicken" that is rather tense to play, and that's why I'd tend to believe the reports of shots fired could be bogus. The risk of escalation beyond control would be too high, and those kind of professionals you'd expect to find on both sides would know it. After the incident, politicians and spin doctors will be all over it, but that's part of the PR/diplomacy duel amongst nations.

4. That said, if I was the CO in any of those three warships at the front, I'd be at Battle Stations (and I'm pretty sure they were manning them) since even a small FPB with SS missiles could be lethal firing from the distance the Russian vessel is. It would be a nearly point blank shot.
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Margin_Walker
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Margin_Walker »

Rational informed commentary has no place in this thread Puma
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blindcider
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by blindcider »

towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:49 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am
guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm
Enzedder wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:16 pm Just as well it wasn't Iranians in a gunboat or the Defender would be sleeping with the fishes

Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Someone should tell Dan Carlin that he’s got it all wrong.
Someone clearly doesn't understand that Dan Carlin is a story teller and not a historian (as he freely admits in pretty much every podcast)
towny
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

Puma wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:35 pm
The Optimist wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:28 am Image

That time when the dirty rejected basement dweller stalks you to school.
1. When it comes to "freedom of navigation" ops (sailing through waters a state intends to dispute, while excersising the right to Inocent passage granted by UNCLOS), it's all about the public / political / PR reactions afterwards. Nobody in their right minds would've thought of firing a single shot.

2. I haven't seen all sides' reports, but find it hard to believe Russian military would escalate as violently as to fire shots and bombs at a foreign warship. That's as close as an act of open war as the UN charter foresees...

3. That kind of stuff goes on everyday in disputed zones of the seas. It's kind of a game of "chicken" that is rather tense to play, and that's why I'd tend to believe the reports of shots fired could be bogus. The risk of escalation beyond control would be too high, and those kind of professionals you'd expect to find on both sides would know it. After the incident, politicians and spin doctors will be all over it, but that's part of the PR/diplomacy duel amongst nations.

4. That said, if I was the CO in any of those three warships at the front, I'd be at Battle Stations (and I'm pretty sure they were manning them) since even a small FPB with SS missiles could be lethal firing from the distance the Russian vessel is. It would be a nearly point blank shot.
What the f*ck would you know? Around here we judge people’s military and geopolitical competency solely based on the per capita deaths of their countrymen fighting in Turkey over a 10 month period about 100 years ago.

Wiki tells me Argentina wasn’t even at Gallipoli - ergo, you don’t know jack shit about navy stuff, driving a boat and Russian aqua bombs.

In future, please restrict your comments to hot women, steak and wines that English happily pay too much for.
towny
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

blindcider wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:52 pm
towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:49 am
mabunch78 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:58 am
guy smiley wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 6:26 pm
bimboman wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:53 pm


Another country living “free” because of the money and political cost of others. Shut up in the cheap seats.
We saved your arse, you f**king idiot.
I can't believe I have to do this again. Gallipoli cost a greater proportion of the UK population its lives than NZ or Aus. The most haunting, devastating and futile arena of WWI was the meat grinder (Western Front). Aus/NZ sacrifice there was again welcome and gratefully felt but it was not in excess of those made by fellow allies. There was no mythical antipodean saving of European arses. Please adopt a little perspective. Sir Peter Jackson ONZ KNZM gets it...

For reference

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_campaign

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_F ... Casualties

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War ... %80%931918
Someone should tell Dan Carlin that he’s got it all wrong.
Someone clearly doesn't understand that Dan Carlin is a story teller and not a historian (as he freely admits in pretty much every podcast)
Can you please define what a historian is?
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by danny_fitz »

MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Lemoentjie »

So the Poms just wanted to sail through Russia's waters and thought nothing would happen? Do they still think it's the 1870s and Britannia rules the waves? :lol:
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Puma »

towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:06 pm
Puma wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:35 pm
The Optimist wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:28 am Image

That time when the dirty rejected basement dweller stalks you to school.
1. When it comes to "freedom of navigation" ops (sailing through waters a state intends to dispute, while excersising the right to Inocent passage granted by UNCLOS), it's all about the public / political / PR reactions afterwards. Nobody in their right minds would've thought of firing a single shot.

2. I haven't seen all sides' reports, but find it hard to believe Russian military would escalate as violently as to fire shots and bombs at a foreign warship. That's as close as an act of open war as the UN charter foresees...

3. That kind of stuff goes on everyday in disputed zones of the seas. It's kind of a game of "chicken" that is rather tense to play, and that's why I'd tend to believe the reports of shots fired could be bogus. The risk of escalation beyond control would be too high, and those kind of professionals you'd expect to find on both sides would know it. After the incident, politicians and spin doctors will be all over it, but that's part of the PR/diplomacy duel amongst nations.

4. That said, if I was the CO in any of those three warships at the front, I'd be at Battle Stations (and I'm pretty sure they were manning them) since even a small FPB with SS missiles could be lethal firing from the distance the Russian vessel is. It would be a nearly point blank shot.
What the f*ck would you know? Around here we judge people’s military and geopolitical competency solely based on the per capita deaths of their countrymen fighting in Turkey over a 10 month period about 100 years ago.

Wiki tells me Argentina wasn’t even at Gallipoli - ergo, you don’t know jack shit about navy stuff, driving a boat and Russian aqua bombs.

In future, please restrict your comments to hot women, steak and wines that English happily pay too much for.
Mate, I spent two whole hours touring around the Gallipoli area, so you can go and f*ck yourself.

And don't even get me started on that thing you Australians call wine.

Feel free to comment on hot women, though.






























Better? :P
Magpie26
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Magpie26 »

danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
Magpie26
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Magpie26 »

Lemoentjie wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:16 pm So the Poms just wanted to sail through Russia's waters and thought nothing would happen? Do they still think it's the 1870s and Britannia rules the waves? :lol:
You think it is Russian waters they went through?
towny
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

Puma wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:18 pm
towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:06 pm
Puma wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:35 pm
The Optimist wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:28 am Image

That time when the dirty rejected basement dweller stalks you to school.
1. When it comes to "freedom of navigation" ops (sailing through waters a state intends to dispute, while excersising the right to Inocent passage granted by UNCLOS), it's all about the public / political / PR reactions afterwards. Nobody in their right minds would've thought of firing a single shot.

2. I haven't seen all sides' reports, but find it hard to believe Russian military would escalate as violently as to fire shots and bombs at a foreign warship. That's as close as an act of open war as the UN charter foresees...

3. That kind of stuff goes on everyday in disputed zones of the seas. It's kind of a game of "chicken" that is rather tense to play, and that's why I'd tend to believe the reports of shots fired could be bogus. The risk of escalation beyond control would be too high, and those kind of professionals you'd expect to find on both sides would know it. After the incident, politicians and spin doctors will be all over it, but that's part of the PR/diplomacy duel amongst nations.

4. That said, if I was the CO in any of those three warships at the front, I'd be at Battle Stations (and I'm pretty sure they were manning them) since even a small FPB with SS missiles could be lethal firing from the distance the Russian vessel is. It would be a nearly point blank shot.
What the f*ck would you know? Around here we judge people’s military and geopolitical competency solely based on the per capita deaths of their countrymen fighting in Turkey over a 10 month period about 100 years ago.

Wiki tells me Argentina wasn’t even at Gallipoli - ergo, you don’t know jack shit about navy stuff, driving a boat and Russian aqua bombs.

In future, please restrict your comments to hot women, steak and wines that English happily pay too much for.
Mate, I spent two whole hours touring around the Gallipoli area, so you can go and f*ck yourself.

And don't even get me started on that thing you Australians call wine.

Feel free to comment on hot women, though.






























Better? :P
🤔
I’m not 100% sure, but I suspect that holiday tours do grant one authority to lecture others on a topic, and so with that mind, I can’t see any reason why you can’t share an opinion on the Black Sea crisis.

My apologies.
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by danny_fitz »

Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
towny
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Location: Perth

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
How’d they go near Malaysia in 1941?
towny
Posts: 22992
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Location: Perth

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:27 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
No. The poms secured their objective so that’s a clear win.
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not_english
Posts: 2018
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Location: London

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by not_english »

Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
There's probably a few in the Anglo-Dutch wars for instance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_on_the_Medway
It was one of the worst defeats in the Royal Navy's history, and one of the worst suffered by the British military.[1] Horace George Franks called it the "most serious defeat it has ever had in its home waters."[2]
ovalball
Posts: 13362
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by ovalball »

Lemoentjie wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:16 pm So the Poms just wanted to sail through Russia's waters and thought nothing would happen? Do they still think it's the 1870s and Britannia rules the waves? :lol:
Russia's waters ???

And they clearly did expect a response from Russia - thats why they invited the press along. And, apart from some posturing, 'nothing' is what actually happened.
Magpie26
Posts: 2660
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Location: Switzerland

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Magpie26 »

danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:27 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
Mmm not sure, they didn't take home the cup and they didn't progress through to the next round.
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Puma
Posts: 4122
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Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Puma »

towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:30 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:27 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
No. The poms secured their objective so that’s a clear win.
It all depennds on the perspective:

Tactical victory for Germany.
Operational / Strategic victory for the RN.

I'd rather take a tactical kicking in the teeth while winning the war goals every day of the week...
Magpie26
Posts: 2660
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Location: Switzerland

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Magpie26 »

towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:29 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
How’d they go near Malaysia in 1941?
Not good but at a guess they probably inflicted more than 3 wounded on the Japanese.

Yep 18 Japanese killed so a significant improvement over Coronel.
towny
Posts: 22992
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:53 pm
Location: Perth

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by towny »

Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:36 pm
towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:29 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
How’d they go near Malaysia in 1941?
Not good but at a guess they probably inflicted more than 3 wounded on the Japanese.
They clearly lost.

You don’t score a battle on deaths - it’s all about which side achieves their objective.
ovalball
Posts: 13362
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by ovalball »

Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:34 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:27 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm
MrDominator wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:27 pm Sounds like the Russians didn't dare get within three miles of our gunboat.

Isn't the Royal Navy the only military force in the history of the planet never to have been defeated in battle? :smug: :thumbup:
Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
Mmm not sure, they didn't take home the cup and they didn't progress through to the next round.
Well, progressing to the next round is what really happened. The German Fleet ran back to Port and pretty well never came out again.
Magpie26
Posts: 2660
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Switzerland

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by Magpie26 »

ovalball wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:44 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:34 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:27 pm
Magpie26 wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:19 pm
danny_fitz wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 pm

Not sure about that. they took a kicking at Jutland.
Jutland was more of a score draw.
Battle of Coronel was a definite kicking.
According to wiki

Royal Navy
Total: 151 combat ships
28 battleships
9 battlecruisers
8 armoured cruisers
26 light cruisers
78 destroyers
1 minelayer
1 seaplane carrier

The Hun
Total: 99 combat ships
16 battleships
5 battlecruisers
6 pre-dreadnoughts
11 light cruisers
61 torpedo-boats[a]

Casualties and losses

Royal Navy
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers sunk
3 armoured cruisers sunk
8 destroyers sunk
(113,300 tons sunk)[1]

Zee Germans
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser sunk
1 pre-dreadnought sunk
4 light cruisers sunk
5 torpedo-boats sunk
(62,300 tons sunk)[1]

Britain secured it's overall aims of restricting the German navy to port for the rest of the war but as a single engagement I would say it was an extra time penalties win for Germany after Admiral Jellicoe shot over the bar.
Mmm not sure, they didn't take home the cup and they didn't progress through to the next round.
Well, progressing to the next round is what really happened. The German Fleet ran back to Port and pretty well never came out again.
Thats what I said, the Germans didn't progress to the next round. They took the team bus back to the hotel, shut up shop and watched on TV from there on in.
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danny_fitz
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Location: Mostly London........Mostly

Re: Russian aircraft and ships scare away British destroyer

Post by danny_fitz »

towny wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:44 pm
They clearly lost.

You don’t score a battle on deaths - it’s all about which side achieves their objective.
Pyrrhus of Epirus after the Battle of Asculum in 279 BC has a different view.
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