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Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:41 pm
by Hellraiser
Bindi wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:28 am
Hellraiser wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 12:28 am
Bindi wrote: Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:55 pm
Hellraiser's point is refuted. There's no evidence that phosphine levels probably aren't a measure of biological activity.
Read what I actually wrote, moron.
I did; it was laughable. Your a priori justification is that life cannot exist on Venus, therefore any evidence that it does is misinterpreted.

That isn’t the way science works; when an astonishing but repeatable result comes up like this, it can’t be explained away without a mechanism. Either it’s life, or it’s a currently unknown mechanism.

The authors, who are experts, couldn’t come up with a way that it isn’t life. It’s simply an open question now, not something explained away with a bit of deductive reasoning. It is certainly something that should be investigated, with actual evidence determining the outcome.

You're a painfully stupid individual.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:54 pm
by Floppykid
Not even two pages before the shit flinging starts.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:30 pm
by Ewinkum
What ever happened to the promising methane emissions from Mars’ crack?

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:34 pm
by PornDog
Floppykid wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:54 pm Not even two pages before the shit flinging starts.
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition - or in this instance the Knights of Columbanus.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:43 pm
by HighKingLeinster
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:40 am Munster are busy looking for the bacteria's agent.
I hear Boris has opened trade negotiations with Venus

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:05 pm
by flaggETERNAL
Floppykid wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:54 pm Not even two pages before the shit flinging starts.
And this is why aliens won't talk to us.

Would have thought Europa was a better bet for etlife anyway from what little I know.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:39 pm
by Bindi
Hellraiser wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:41 pm
Bindi wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:28 am
Hellraiser wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 12:28 am
Bindi wrote: Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:55 pm
Hellraiser's point is refuted. There's no evidence that phosphine levels probably aren't a measure of biological activity.
Read what I actually wrote, moron.
I did; it was laughable. Your a priori justification is that life cannot exist on Venus, therefore any evidence that it does is misinterpreted.

That isn’t the way science works; when an astonishing but repeatable result comes up like this, it can’t be explained away without a mechanism. Either it’s life, or it’s a currently unknown mechanism.

The authors, who are experts, couldn’t come up with a way that it isn’t life. It’s simply an open question now, not something explained away with a bit of deductive reasoning. It is certainly something that should be investigated, with actual evidence determining the outcome.

You're a painfully stupid individual.
I thought I’d managed to block most of the worthless posters here, but somehow I’d never noticed you before.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:48 pm
by Leinster in London
HighKingLeinster wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:43 pm
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:40 am Munster are busy looking for the bacteria's agent.
I hear Boris has opened trade negotiations with Venus
Well I suppose that's a polite euphemism for the transaction.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:54 pm
by DOB
AlanBengio wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:51 am I always thought, with no scientific basis, that Venus is Earth as it used to be, Earth is Earth as it currently is, and Mars is Earth as it will be in the future (ie impling that all three planets did experience / will experience life of some sort at a certain point)
It could be the other way around. The thick atmosphere on Venus could be the result of life getting out of hand and reaching some apex of unsustainability, or teh whole thing just getting too close to the sun. Some process on the planet, be it natural or artificial, heated up and accelerated by an at-the-time-expanding sun, that ended up belching out all the CO2 and other toxic gases that killed all life or chance of life that may or may not have ever been there. And Mars is a lump of rock still collecting gases and an atmosphere (and having a harder time doing it, being smaller than all the other rock planets), but may one day develop a thick enough atmosphere to support some form of life.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:59 am
by Pat the Ex Mat
The Drake equation should be interesting now

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:31 am
by Bindi
Given life has managed to colonise pretty much everywhere on earth where there's energy available, it doesn't suprise me that life could adapt to Venus's atmosphere where the temperatures and pressures aren't extreme.

Don't know too much about organic chemistry, but given some plastics are resistant to sulphuric acid and plastics are often hydrocarbons, is it not possible that bacteria or bacterial analogs could evolve a similar acid resistant coating? The building blocks are all there. Venus wasn't always like it is now, so seems quite plausable that something could adapt as the atmosphere changed.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:47 am
by Nolanator
DOB wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:54 pm
AlanBengio wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:51 am I always thought, with no scientific basis, that Venus is Earth as it used to be, Earth is Earth as it currently is, and Mars is Earth as it will be in the future (ie impling that all three planets did experience / will experience life of some sort at a certain point)
It could be the other way around. The thick atmosphere on Venus could be the result of life getting out of hand and reaching some apex of unsustainability, or teh whole thing just getting too close to the sun. Some process on the planet, be it natural or artificial, heated up and accelerated by an at-the-time-expanding sun, that ended up belching out all the CO2 and other toxic gases that killed all life or chance of life that may or may not have ever been there. And Mars is a lump of rock still collecting gases and an atmosphere (and having a harder time doing it, being smaller than all the other rock planets), but may one day develop a thick enough atmosphere to support some form of life.
Mars is geologically dead, though.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:02 am
by PornDog
Nolanator wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:47 am
DOB wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:54 pm
AlanBengio wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:51 am I always thought, with no scientific basis, that Venus is Earth as it used to be, Earth is Earth as it currently is, and Mars is Earth as it will be in the future (ie impling that all three planets did experience / will experience life of some sort at a certain point)
It could be the other way around. The thick atmosphere on Venus could be the result of life getting out of hand and reaching some apex of unsustainability, or teh whole thing just getting too close to the sun. Some process on the planet, be it natural or artificial, heated up and accelerated by an at-the-time-expanding sun, that ended up belching out all the CO2 and other toxic gases that killed all life or chance of life that may or may not have ever been there. And Mars is a lump of rock still collecting gases and an atmosphere (and having a harder time doing it, being smaller than all the other rock planets), but may one day develop a thick enough atmosphere to support some form of life.
Mars is geologically dead, though.
Depends on what you mean by geological activity I suppose. Sure there aren't going to be any volcanic eruptions of molten rock, but there has been recent evidence of the likes of carbon monoxide geysers and such.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:18 am
by jezzer
Ewinkum wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:30 pm What ever happened to the promising methane emissions from Mars’ crack?
No, that was Uranus.

Re: Life on Venus (possibly)

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:32 am
by koroke hangareka
Bindi wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:31 am Given life has managed to colonise pretty much everywhere on earth where there's energy available, it doesn't suprise me that life could adapt to Venus's atmosphere where the temperatures and pressures aren't extreme.

Don't know too much about organic chemistry, but given some plastics are resistant to sulphuric acid and plastics are often hydrocarbons, is it not possible that bacteria or bacterial analogs could evolve a similar acid resistant coating? The building blocks are all there. Venus wasn't always like it is now, so seems quite plausable that something could adapt as the atmosphere changed.
Very much this. We don't know how likely it is that life will develop on a given planet; it's certainly not clear that Venus couldn't have produced life at some point in its history. And all the evidence available to us suggests that once life does develop, it's damned hard to eradicate.