Reddit v Hedgefunds

All things Rugby
User avatar
paddyor
Posts: 19397
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by paddyor »

Tehui wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:11 am I don't understand the technicalities of what's taking place, but what I do understand is:

- the usual manipulators of the market are getting manipulated themselves, and
- the rich are demanding for increased regulation.


I can't wait for the movie to come out on Netflix in a few years.
No and no. The usual manipulators are heavily involved and have been for most of the week. The calls for regulation have mostly come from politicians.
User avatar
paddyor
Posts: 19397
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by paddyor »

flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:04 am
paddyor wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:41 am
flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:37 am I think some retail investors will get burnt. But the whole point of this for a lot of the guys on wsb seems to be the chance to stick it to the hedge funds. It's amazing how despised Wall Street is.
Not about WSBs and hasn't been for most of the week though

https://twitter.com/modestproposal1/sta ... 17381?s=20
That's interesting but it's beside the point imo. What's important is that retail investors probably realise the power they have. Well, until the rules are changed to suit the big boys. :x :P
It's a nice story but it's not true. The exisiting rules already suit the big boys and don't need to be changed.
User avatar
RuggaBugga
Posts: 12883
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by RuggaBugga »

paddyor wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:24 pm
flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:04 am
paddyor wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:41 am
flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:37 am I think some retail investors will get burnt. But the whole point of this for a lot of the guys on wsb seems to be the chance to stick it to the hedge funds. It's amazing how despised Wall Street is.
Not about WSBs and hasn't been for most of the week though

https://twitter.com/modestproposal1/sta ... 17381?s=20
That's interesting but it's beside the point imo. What's important is that retail investors probably realise the power they have. Well, until the rules are changed to suit the big boys. :x :P
It's a nice story but it's not true. The exisiting rules already suit the big boys and don't need to be changed.

Surprised you can find the time to post on here in between counting your millions. It must be a real burden knowing everything, how do you tune it out?
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32405
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by eldanielfire »

DOB wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:16 am
flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:37 am I think some retail investors will get burnt. But the whole point of this for a lot of the guys on wsb seems to be the chance to stick it to the hedge funds. It's amazing how despised Wall Street is.
It’s not all that amazing, really.
There's a fair narrative here. Wall Street doesn't have issues when their own do this. The small people are constantly losing out and getting screwed by Wall Street. The instant one of the plebs do it to a billionaire or two they are all over it, suddenly worried about people being screwed and are even demanding regulation FFS!

The fact is the normal guy in the street is constantly beings crewed, the one time the masses do ti to Wall Street people are all over the normal guy in the street getting screwed. They're screwed either way, so why no celebrate the ones who usually doing the screwing and getting away with it being the victim for once.
User avatar
paddyor
Posts: 19397
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by paddyor »

RuggaBugga wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:46 pm
paddyor wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:24 pm It's a nice story but it's not true. The exisiting rules already suit the big boys and don't need to be changed.

Surprised you can find the time to post on here in between counting your millions. It must be a real burden knowing everything, how do you tune it out?
I have people to count the money for me. I like to come on here and share my wealth of knowledge with you plebs, I'm generous like that.

A lot of people are reading into this what they want. I don't think the narrative holds up well at all and I don't think there'll be any lasting effects from this episode. My gf has completely skipped this story and has no idea what it's about.
User avatar
paddyor
Posts: 19397
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by paddyor »

eldanielfire wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:48 pm
DOB wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:16 am
flaggETERNAL wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:37 am I think some retail investors will get burnt. But the whole point of this for a lot of the guys on wsb seems to be the chance to stick it to the hedge funds. It's amazing how despised Wall Street is.
It’s not all that amazing, really.
There's a fair narrative here. Wall Street doesn't have issues when their own do this. The small people are constantly losing out and getting screwed by Wall Street. The instant one of the plebs do it to a billionaire or two they are all over it, suddenly worried about people being screwed and are even demanding regulation FFS!

The fact is the normal guy in the street is constantly beings crewed, the one time the masses do ti to Wall Street people are all over the normal guy in the street getting screwed. They're screwed either way, so why no celebrate the ones who usually doing the screwing and getting away with it being the victim for once.
The "small people" do pretty well out of the stock market. Index funds outperform a substantial majority of hedge funds. But yeah they're getting screwed!

This isn't new btw. Softbank did something similar last year.

This isn't really plebs. This is people with money to throw around and nothing to spend it on. Typically the way the way small guy gets screwed is a scheme like this and a phone call like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPhEBKwNZKI

ANd sure a few hedge funds will get burnt but ti's all relative. A lot fo the chumps will be little guys.
mdaclarke
Posts: 4114
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:53 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by mdaclarke »

Short shelling is gambling with people's livelihoods pure and simple. It does nothing to further humanity and the economy and should be banned.
User avatar
shanky
Posts: 21874
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by shanky »

mdaclarke wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:44 pm Short shelling is gambling with people's livelihoods pure and simple. It does nothing to further humanity and the economy and should be banned.
No it isn’t.

It aids ‘price discovery’ and weeds out inefficient companies (just like corporate raiders used to do) and is highly virtuous.

It’s the retail people who are the total problem, because they’re creating uncertainty and threatening this highly virtuous capital allocation system.

:thumbup:
User avatar
DOB
Posts: 20038
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by DOB »

shanky wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 11:14 pm
mdaclarke wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:44 pm Short shelling is gambling with people's livelihoods pure and simple. It does nothing to further humanity and the economy and should be banned.
No it isn’t.

It aids ‘price discovery’ and weeds out inefficient companies (just like corporate raiders used to do) and is highly virtuous.

It’s the retail people who are the total problem, because they’re creating uncertainty and threatening this highly virtuous capital allocation system.

:thumbup:
Yes/no. If the short squeeze on Gamestop is actually bankrupting hedge funds, then those hedge funds had too much of their money banking on the Gamestop short. If anyone had too much money on the Gamestop short, then it means some actors were actively driving the Gamestop stock down.

If anyone is getting weeded out, it's the hedge funds that were immoral enough to try to ruin a company.

I had half written this post before I noticed your sarcasm, but I'll let it stand anyway.
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

DOB wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 11:50 pm
shanky wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 11:14 pm
mdaclarke wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:44 pm Short shelling is gambling with people's livelihoods pure and simple. It does nothing to further humanity and the economy and should be banned.
No it isn’t.

It aids ‘price discovery’ and weeds out inefficient companies (just like corporate raiders used to do) and is highly virtuous.

It’s the retail people who are the total problem, because they’re creating uncertainty and threatening this highly virtuous capital allocation system.

:thumbup:
Yes/no. If the short squeeze on Gamestop is actually bankrupting hedge funds, then those hedge funds had too much of their money banking on the Gamestop short. If anyone had too much money on the Gamestop short, then it means some actors were actively driving the Gamestop stock down.

If anyone is getting weeded out, it's the hedge funds that were immoral enough to try to ruin a company.

I had half written this post before I noticed your sarcasm, but I'll let it stand anyway.
:lol: :thumbup:
User avatar
shanky
Posts: 21874
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by shanky »

:lol: :thumbup:


#gammasqueeze
Mick Mannock
Posts: 25649
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Mick Mannock »

mdaclarke wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 9:44 pm Short shelling is gambling with people's livelihoods pure and simple. It does nothing to further humanity and the economy and should be banned.
I am not going to be sarcastic, and simply answer "yes"
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
Mick Mannock
Posts: 25649
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Mick Mannock »

Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:08 am I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
Robin Hood have a restricted list now.
User avatar
shanky
Posts: 21874
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by shanky »

Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:08 am I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
As you going stay staunch diamond hand?
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

Mick Mannock wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:16 am
Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:08 am I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
Robin Hood have a restricted list now.
Why would I use robin hood?
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

shanky wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:17 am
Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:08 am I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
As you going stay staunch diamond hand?
💎🖐🚀🌜
User avatar
shanky
Posts: 21874
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by shanky »

:lol:

Good luck. Keep us posted. :thumbup:
Mick Mannock
Posts: 25649
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Mick Mannock »

Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 1:37 am
Mick Mannock wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:16 am
Zakar wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:08 am I've bought 1 share just for the lolz
Robin Hood have a restricted list now.
Why would I use robin hood?
I have no idea, but if you had, you could have only have bought one share anyway.

The list might give a clue as to where there is significant shorting, and where Reddit might target.

They are not all techy type stocks. Several are pharma with Cov 19 vaccines either under development or at market.
User avatar
FairWeather_Aussie
Posts: 1304
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by FairWeather_Aussie »

The thing with the whole “retail investors giving it to the hedge funds”, is that they are not. A couple of hedge funds have been hit very hard, but a lot of other hedge funds and traders probably joined in on the action based on volume of the squeeze, so are raking it in all the way to the bank. It is the WSB’s investors, especially the “diamond hand” ones who will be left holding the bag. They are essentially “the greater fools”. The stock will eventually go back down to $10-$20 if GameStop can turn it’s business around, or $0 if not. The retail investors who bought GME at $50, $100, $200 or $400 are going to be shafted by the professionals again, as the professional investors are probably the side who sold them the shares in the first place, and will then be shorting them (once the wind goes out of the sail) all the way back down to fair value.
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32405
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by eldanielfire »

BTW, a question I don't know the mechanics of exactly, how do you "bet against" stock/companies stock in the stock market to make money? Invest in rivals or something?
User avatar
ScarfaceClaw
Posts: 12499
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by ScarfaceClaw »

eldanielfire wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:37 pm BTW, a question I don't know the mechanics of exactly, how do you "bet against" stock/companies stock in the stock market to make money? Invest in rivals or something?
It’s effectively borrowing the stock from someone who has already bought it, selling it on the market in the expectation that the price will have fallen in the meantime. When you need to return the stock buy it in the market and pocket the difference less what you paid to borrow it.
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32405
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by eldanielfire »

The Wolf of wall street comments:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On4g1uj71zc
User avatar
nardol
Posts: 20379
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by nardol »

you borrow a share thats 10 and promise to give it back next month.

When you getvthe share you sell it immediately for the 10.



When it comes to paying back the share you buy it and hand it back. you make money if you can buy it for less that the 10 you borrowed it at.

very simplistic version.
User avatar
Cartman
Posts: 7846
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Cartman »

nardol wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:46 pm you borrow a share thats 10 and promise to give it back next month.

When you getvthe share you sell it immediately for the 10.



When it comes to paying back the share you buy it and hand it back. you make money if you can buy it for less that the 10 you borrowed it at.

very simplistic version.
Or press sell before buy instead of vice versa
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32405
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by eldanielfire »

nardol wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:46 pm you borrow a share thats 10 and promise to give it back next month.

When you getvthe share you sell it immediately for the 10.



When it comes to paying back the share you buy it and hand it back. you make money if you can buy it for less that the 10 you borrowed it at.

very simplistic version.
Cheers :thumbup:

However isn't borrowing a share an expensive thing?
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

FairWeather_Aussie wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:25 pm The thing with the whole “retail investors giving it to the hedge funds”, is that they are not. A couple of hedge funds have been hit very hard, but a lot of other hedge funds and traders probably joined in on the action based on volume of the squeeze, so are raking it in all the way to the bank. It is the WSB’s investors, especially the “diamond hand” ones who will be left holding the bag. They are essentially “the greater fools”. The stock will eventually go back down to $10-$20 if GameStop can turn it’s business around, or $0 if not. The retail investors who bought GME at $50, $100, $200 or $400 are going to be shafted by the professionals again, as the professional investors are probably the side who sold them the shares in the first place, and will then be shorting them (once the wind goes out of the sail) all the way back down to fair value.
Ape strong together.
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 39619
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Duff Paddy »

GME creeping up again pre market
bimboman
Posts: 70046
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by bimboman »

eldanielfire wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:11 pm
nardol wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:46 pm you borrow a share thats 10 and promise to give it back next month.

When you getvthe share you sell it immediately for the 10.



When it comes to paying back the share you buy it and hand it back. you make money if you can buy it for less that the 10 you borrowed it at.

very simplistic version.
Cheers :thumbup:

However isn't borrowing a share an expensive thing?

It would be in GME right now. Traded on a Basis point spread against annual interest rates though so short time frames help cost.

Normal General Collateral stock lending is about 20 BP’s annualised so cheap. The reason being the position being financed.
User avatar
JamesJames
Posts: 509
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:54 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by JamesJames »

Would the threat to hedge funds not be principally the scrutiny brought to bear on derivative trading and casino type speculation? Or will this quickly be forgotten about and no substantive regulatory changes made?
User avatar
paddyor
Posts: 19397
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by paddyor »

JamesJames wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 1:37 pm Would the threat to hedge funds not be principally the scrutiny brought to bear on derivative trading and casino type speculation? Or will this quickly be forgotten about and no substantive regulatory changes made?
The latter IMO.
de_Selby
Posts: 4154
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2014 5:47 pm

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by de_Selby »

Probably the only regulation likely would be to restrict the types of products available to retail traders. Maybe it will happen if this all ends with a lot of 💎✊ out of money.

The price seems to be dropping at the moment.
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

Media is claiming 'silver is the new gamestop' and that 'reddit is targeting SLV', when the only silver chat on reddit has been lead by bots. Very interesting.
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 39619
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Duff Paddy »

Zakar wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:41 pm Media is claiming 'silver is the new gamestop' and that 'reddit is targeting SLV', when the only silver chat on reddit has been lead by bots. Very interesting.
No there was a buy silver thread on Reddit but people who follow these things seem very sceptical about it. A bought a little bit for the craic.
User avatar
Zakar
Posts: 17750
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Haunting your dreams

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Zakar »

Duff Paddy wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:46 pm
Zakar wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:41 pm Media is claiming 'silver is the new gamestop' and that 'reddit is targeting SLV', when the only silver chat on reddit has been lead by bots. Very interesting.
No there was a buy silver thread on Reddit but people who follow these things seem very sceptical about it. A bought a little bit for the craic.
The reddit interest is nothing like what's been reported. Prevalent theme is that this is a distraction tactic from the Hfs

Image
User avatar
flaggETERNAL
Posts: 6573
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by flaggETERNAL »

JamesJames wrote: Mon Feb 01, 2021 1:37 pm Would the threat to hedge funds not be principally the scrutiny brought to bear on derivative trading and casino type speculation? Or will this quickly be forgotten about and no substantive regulatory changes made?
If nothing really changed after 2008...
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 39619
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Duff Paddy »

It’s back on lads $50 increase in share price in the past couple of hours
User avatar
Pat the Ex Mat
Posts: 6229
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:50 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

Reddit was down this morning - some stories about traffic related to this issue
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 39619
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Duff Paddy »

Are we all ready to make some money on GME today
User avatar
Jeff the Bear
Posts: 19460
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Reddit v Hedgefunds

Post by Jeff the Bear »

Duff Paddy wrote: Thu Feb 25, 2021 2:24 pm Are we all ready to make some money on GME today
Not if your are shorting:
GameStop short-sellers have lost $1.9 billion in just 2 days amid the stock's latest spike
Post Reply