The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

All things Rugby
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

I know it's for the players long term health but considering the inherent nature of this game, I think the new rules about not tackling the head especially when clearing the rucks are killing rugby games.

I propose this: instead of excluding a player who does that and leaving his team at 14 for the rest of the game, why not definitely excluding the guy leaving his team at 14 for 15 min and then replace him by someone else?
It's still worse for his team than a simple yellow but at least it doesn't completely kill the game and doesn't overly penalize his teammates whose all the work they've done don't deserve to get destroyed just because of the stupidity/clumsiness of one of their teammates.

Anyway, I think i'm not the only one who finds the consequences of those plays far too extreme for the teams just because of one individual stupid if not sometimes accidental play
Last edited by franch fan on Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Farva
Posts: 17683
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: STRAYA PLUM

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Farva »

A law variation in super rugby this year is trialling ghat very idea. After 20 mins you will be able to replace a player who receives a red card
User avatar
blindcider
Posts: 8299
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by blindcider »

Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
User avatar
DOB
Posts: 20036
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by DOB »

No. Teams need to learn to avoid contact with the head. That's all. If it means taking the flying clearout out of the game, well, so be it.

I've played the game for more than 30 years and managed to avoid shoulder charging anyone in the cranium. Peter O'Mahony's done it twice in the last few months.

Oh, and the 20 minute rule is stupid too. If you're going to do that in the 17th minute of the game, damn right your team should suffer.
User avatar
camroc1
Posts: 43144
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by camroc1 »

DOB wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:28 pm No. Teams need to learn to avoid contact with the head. That's all. If it means taking the flying clearout out of the game, well, so be it.

I've played the game for more than 30 years and managed to avoid shoulder charging anyone in the cranium. Peter O'Mahony's done it twice in the last few months.

Oh, and the 20 minute rule is stupid too. If you're going to do that in the 17th minute of the game, damn right your team should suffer.
Very much this.

We know that red cards change players behaviour.
User avatar
BlackMac
Posts: 7205
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Middle of the Lothians

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by BlackMac »

blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32404
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by eldanielfire »

blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This! I've said it before.
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32404
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by eldanielfire »

DOB wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:28 pm No. Teams need to learn to avoid contact with the head. That's all. If it means taking the flying clearout out of the game, well, so be it.

I've played the game for more than 30 years and managed to avoid shoulder charging anyone in the cranium. Peter O'Mahony's done it twice in the last few months.

Oh, and the 20 minute rule is stupid too. If you're going to do that in the 17th minute of the game, damn right your team should suffer.
:thumbup:
User avatar
fonzeee
Posts: 4541
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:10 pm
Location: Boston

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by fonzeee »

franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:13 pm considering the inherent nature of this game,
Well, I think you'll find there are many that don't want to do that.

There's no reason for teams to be forced to play a man down, but this is what happens when the sport is ran by people from soccer-land.

Hopefully we'll at least get widespread implementation of the 20 min replacement rule.
User avatar
booze
Posts: 3589
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by booze »

BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
the laws around the ruck and how it is played need a complete rethink and change. with the laws and focus around protecting the head from impact and injury, how can a major part of the game leave a player exposed, with his head 1 or 2 feet above the ground and with his head the foremost part of his body?

How is that fair or safe to that player? its unfair to the oppostion joining the ruck when his technique means he is so low when joining the ruck but still gets a red card? the ruck is a very dynamic part of rugby and rugby has got to a point where its a bit of a mess with these kind of red cards.
User avatar
Jeff the Bear
Posts: 19459
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Jeff the Bear »

blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.
This is the answer. It's going to take a large shift in the mental space of some rugby players. In the nascent stages of professionalism, there was this call that you had to do whatever was necessary to win, whatever was necessary to win/maintain the ball.

The obvious question arises from those that don't want to see change..."What is Zander Fagerson supposed to do to remove the player in that situation?", and the uncomfortable answer is "nothing". If you have to fly in like that to attempt to remove a player on the ball, then you had already lost the ball. Your systems, somewhere, have failed long before you needed to enter the ruck like that, and you've just got to take the loss of ball on the chin and start again in defence.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
The problem with that is that it will result on almost not having any continuity in the game as the ball fetchers are way too good nowadays to not steal the ball in almost every ruck with that sort of restriction at clearing the ruck (players will basicly be frightened to clear the ruck now cause its great to say that in theory a player clearing the ruck should avoid the head but you well know that it's not that easy in real life, especially if the player targeted moves or is being moved while the guy targeting him is making his move).

At this point and at this rate, let's better adopt League laws with no contest of the ruck and 5-6 phases max.
themaddog
Posts: 5329
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by themaddog »

In fairness not all head contact is being penalised.

https://twitter.com/martindempseyyy/sta ... 06949?s=19
User avatar
Bogbunny
Posts: 5452
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: G W C

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Bogbunny »

themaddog wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:59 pm In fairness not all head contact is being penalised.

https://twitter.com/martindempseyyy/sta ... 06949?s=19
Just like Jonny Williams taking Gary Ringrose out last week. It's the inconsistency that grates ( and helps Wales thus far)
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

In American sports like basketball, hockey or football, you never see a team being reduced indefinitely to less men than another team but only temporary numerical superiorities in hockey or definite exclusion for a player (basketball ans hockey).
Not for the first time, I think US have the best model when it comes to sports
User avatar
Enzedder
Posts: 20752
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: End of the road, turn right and first house on the left

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Enzedder »

BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
User avatar
Salient
Posts: 3766
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland!

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Salient »

Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm
BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Problem being they are red carding players who had no intent to go for the head but the tackle slipped up or the tackled player ducked into it. The game is going to continue to face viewer erosion with some of the insane rules being enforced.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm
BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the rest of the game?
Wouldn't 15min of numerical inferiority + definite exclusion of the player from the game be already enough?
Last edited by franch fan on Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

Farva wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:55 pm A law variation in super rugby this year is trialling ghat very idea. After 20 mins you will be able to replace a player who receives a red card
So we get twenty minutes of time-wasting?
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:27 pm
Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm
BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the whole game?
Because you're a team.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:27 pm
Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm
BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm
blindcider wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:26 pm Players should stop flying into rucks recklessly, then they wont get sent off for it.

Refs should also be more strict on enforcing the existing laws around rucks as well.
This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the whole game?
Because you're a team.
Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
Last edited by franch fan on Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:28 pm
Farva wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:55 pm A law variation in super rugby this year is trialling ghat very idea. After 20 mins you will be able to replace a player who receives a red card
So we get twenty minutes of time-wasting?
What do you mean?
For 20min, the whole team is penalized being reduced at 14 and the guilty player is definitely excluded from the game and being replaced by theorically a weaker player.
Isn't that enough to you?
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

DOB wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:28 pm No. Teams need to learn to avoid contact with the head. That's all. If it means taking the flying clearout out of the game, well, so be it.

I've played the game for more than 30 years and managed to avoid shoulder charging anyone in the cranium. Peter O'Mahony's done it twice in the last few months.

Oh, and the 20 minute rule is stupid too. If you're going to do that in the 17th minute of the game, damn right your team should suffer.
Ok but why going to that extreme of suffering for the rest of the game?
20 min in numerical inferiority + the player definitely excluded from the game and being replaced by probably a weaker player are not enough of a sanction for the whole team to you?
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:31 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:27 pm
Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm
BlackMac wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:35 pm

This. I always wonder, when they are targetting a player who is head down over the ball, what part of his body they think they are going to hit.
Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the whole game?
Because you're a team.
Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
So what if it's impactful? Don't get sent off is the obvious answer.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:44 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:31 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:27 pm
Enzedder wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:11 pm

Totally agree. If every player arriving at a maul had to stay on their feet throughout, we'd end the torpedo clearouts immediately. In the meantime, keep red-carding the fuckwits and they will learn.
Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the whole game?
Because you're a team.
Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
So what if it's impactful? Don't get sent off is the obvious answer.
Ok so if it's so obvious to you, why do you think US sports for example never go to those extremes?
User avatar
Monkey Magic
Posts: 822
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Monkey Magic »

The argument that it punishes the whole team is a pretty bloody good incentive not to get red carded.

The issue for me is not that these guys get carded, its that there is similar contact week to week which get little or no sanction. Why bother changing behavior if you only really suffer 25% of the time
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:46 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:44 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:31 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:27 pm

Ok but why penalizing the rest of the team for the whole game?
Because you're a team.
Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
So what if it's impactful? Don't get sent off is the obvious answer.
Ok so if it's so obvious to you, why do you think US sports for example never go to those extremes?
What have US sports got to do with it? When the US play rugby, they follow the laws like everyone else.
franch fan
Posts: 2690
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by franch fan »

message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:55 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:46 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:44 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:31 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:29 pm

Because you're a team.
Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
So what if it's impactful? Don't get sent off is the obvious answer.
Ok so if it's so obvious to you, why do you think US sports for example never go to those extremes?
What have US sports got to do with it? When the US play rugby, they follow the laws like everyone else.
Try to think by yourself instead of blablating like a bot
User avatar
Fat Old Git
Posts: 21788
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: A vacant lot next to a pile of rubble

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by Fat Old Git »

How many additional red cards have there been since the change in interpretation, and have the changes actually reduced the number of head injuries?

I think the ruck clear out is an area where it should be relatively easy to change technique to reduce the risk of contact with the head. But the tackle, and perhaps the initial formation of the ruck are another matter. There is so much happening in a short space of time and very minor errors in timing and positioning, or a sudden unexpected change such as a slip, or contact with a third player, can turn an attempt at a safe play into a red card before anyone realistically has tome to react.
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

Fat Old Git wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:06 pm How many additional red cards have there been since the change in interpretation, and have the changes actually reduced the number of head injuries?

I think the ruck clear out is an area where it should be relatively easy to change technique to reduce the risk of contact with the head. But the tackle, and perhaps the initial formation of the ruck are another matter. There is so much happening in a short space of time and very minor errors in timing and positioning, or a sudden unexpected change such as a slip, or contact with a third player, can turn an attempt at a safe play into a red card before anyone realistically has tome to react.
Which is why refs look for mitigating factors, such as those you describe.
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:57 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:55 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:46 pm
message #2527204 wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:44 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:31 pm

Ok then go to the fullest and exclude the whole team.
In rugby more than in football for example where goals are much harder to score by definition than penalties or tries, you have to take account of the fact that being in numerical inferiority is so much more impactful.
So what if it's impactful? Don't get sent off is the obvious answer.
Ok so if it's so obvious to you, why do you think US sports for example never go to those extremes?
What have US sports got to do with it? When the US play rugby, they follow the laws like everyone else.
Try to think by yourself instead of blablating like a bot
Pompous twat.

US sport isn't international sport. Someone makes a mistake there, and they lose their livelihood. Players are just consumables.
User avatar
DOB
Posts: 20036
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by DOB »

fonzeee wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:58 pm
franch fan wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 7:13 pm considering the inherent nature of this game,
Well, I think you'll find there are many that don't want to do that.

There's no reason for teams to be forced to play a man down, but this is what happens when the sport is ran by people from soccer-land.

Hopefully we'll at least get widespread implementation of the 20 min replacement rule.
Soccerland? Sending players off for foul play has been around as long as the game of rugby.

But sure, let’s imitate American sports who have 1/3 the number of players on the playing area. The NFL sure are a model for protecting player welfare.
User avatar
eldanielfire
Posts: 32404
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by eldanielfire »

I'm not sure what the issue is. Weaker sanctions only encourage more thuggish behaviour. Players must be protected from it. Also the whole players running in at full speed to rucks is a relatively recent application to the game and one that causes problems as at full speed you can hardly control yourselves and are frequently off your feet and not supporting body weight in reality.

I'm also happy with the protection of the head and it being heavily sanctioned to any team that allows their thugs to do hit peoples heads. I don't want to normalise players I adore being essentially dribbling wreaks or killing themselves by 50 like the NFL due to brain damage.
User avatar
MrDominator
Posts: 5460
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:14 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by MrDominator »

Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
Last edited by MrDominator on Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
mdaclarke
Posts: 4114
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2017 7:53 pm

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by mdaclarke »

DOB wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 8:28 pm No. Teams need to learn to avoid contact with the head. That's all. If it means taking the flying clearout out of the game, well, so be it.

I've played the game for more than 30 years and managed to avoid shoulder charging anyone in the cranium. Peter O'Mahony's done it twice in the last few months.

Oh, and the 20 minute rule is stupid too. If you're going to do that in the 17th minute of the game, damn right your team should suffer.
Agree 100% if you are going to join a ruck you have the responsibility to join it safely. Make sure you can see what you are joining.

Note you don't "hit" a ruck you "join" it
User avatar
DOB
Posts: 20036
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by DOB »

MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:52 am Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
Many people suffer from premature dementia due to a torn MCL?
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:52 am Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
What Negri did is done 50 times a match. Chicken winging a head is a different ball game entirely.
User avatar
MrDominator
Posts: 5460
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:14 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by MrDominator »

message #2527204 wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 1:00 am
MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:52 am Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
What Negri did is done 50 times a match. Chicken winging a head is a different ball game entirely.
How many players have actually been severely injured by head contact at a ruck? None that I can think of.

It's a distraction mechanism to make World Rugby feel like they're doing something.

Max Lahiff's comments about this on Twitter are spot on.
User avatar
MrDominator
Posts: 5460
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:14 am

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by MrDominator »

DOB wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:59 am
MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:52 am Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
Many people suffer from premature dementia due to a torn MCL?
What are you talking about?

Most concussions happen in the tackle.
User avatar
message #2527204
Posts: 13988
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Ultracrepidaria

Re: The multiplication of red cards in rugby because of the new laws about head tackling

Post by message #2527204 »

MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 1:03 am
DOB wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:59 am
MrDominator wrote: Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:52 am Why is the head sacrosanct and the cruciate ligament isn't?

Was Fagerson's clearout worse than what Negri did in terms of causing severe injury to the opponent? Clearly, absolutely not.

This fixation with the head is a complete nonsense.

Not least because heads are much more flexible and moveable than knees, ankles or shoulders.
Many people suffer from premature dementia due to a torn MCL?
What are you talking about?

Most concussions happen in the tackle.
Most concussions happen when you get hit in the head
Post Reply