Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

All things Rugby
Post Reply
User avatar
Thomas
Posts: 17446
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: STRAYA!

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Thomas »

Hey, we all grow as a person. Except you. You've always been horrible.

I feel sorry for anyone who has the misfortune of interacting with you in real life.
bimboman
Posts: 71271
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by bimboman »

Thomas wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:59 pm Hey, we all grow as a person. Except you. You've always been horrible.

I feel sorry for anyone who has the misfortune of interacting with you in real life.
So horrible that you interacted for years with me and had no issues, but that’s just your level of current memory loss,

I’ve never done anything as horrific as you’ve presented here once in life, let alone the amount of “incidents” you’ve tried to present as funny rather than like a shit Aussie version of train spotting.

But hey, you’re all “woke” now m presenting the persona you’ve decided will erase what a person you were.

I feel sorry for all the people in your life you’ve currently fooled into believing the new you, they’ll be let down eventually.
towny
Posts: 21690
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:53 pm
Location: Perth

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by towny »

😂

What a nut
User avatar
Ghost-Of-Nepia
Posts: 4346
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ghost-Of-Nepia »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:29 pm
Farva wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:12 pm Labelling a country racist without any understanding of the issue just demonstrates you don’t have a clue.

Covid cases in hotel quarantine have skyrocketed. They are all coming from India. This is a huge risk to Australia. It is not a racist policy in any way. You are completely wrong here.

Whether it is a reasonable policy is a different story.

You being a dickhead is entirely accurate.
I do understand the issue.

I saw the reaction in Perth. A man who entered a quarantine facility was publicly shamed for going to get married for when it leaked out.

The ban on travellers from India is absolutely racist. The reaction of the WA Premier was dog whistling
Mr McGowan was scathing of the person who went to India for a wedding.

“It’s not OK,” he said.

“If you want to go overseas, it should be for only the most extraordinary of reasons at this point in time.

“Not to go overseas for a wedding. Even to go overseas for a funeral.

“We have to be a lot tougher in relation to letting people out of Australia at this point in time.”
A person went home for an essential reason, to get married. On return, WA’s Premier blamed this man for his own inept system.

This is all after there was a rise in racism directed towards Asian Australian’s last year because of Covid.
"It just happens it's China's turn again."

Earlier this year, the ABC was contacted by hundreds of people who shared their experiences of discrimination during the pandemic.

Asian Australians, particularly of Chinese heritage, reported an increase in abuse and racist attacks because the coronavirus was first detected in China.
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.abc.net ... e/12834324

The Premier knew what he was at. Indians are the next easy target.

When it comes to Australia and other countries during Covid, the behaviour towards certain nations is telling. Chinese and Japanese travellers were put on Christmas Island for a period. Travellers from India are called out by politicians and now travel is banned. There are some pathetic attempts here to weasel out of that.
The UK and US were also responsible for a greater share of overseas acquired cases in Australia at the height of their outbreaks, according to data released by the New South Wales health department.
In NSW, 41% of Covid-19 cases acquired overseas in December were from the United States.

...

NSW Health has released data on overseas acquired infections by source country since November. Examining the past five months, it can be seen that India, the UK and the US all had similar numbers of resident returns in the past year – 11,760 then 12,510 and 10,990 respectively.
But significantly more residents returned from the United Kingdom and the United States over the three months to January than from India.
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.theguar ... ear-factor

The data from leading epidemiologists shows it as racist.
To be fair, he should be publicly shamed for not using a pandemic as an excuse to avoid getting married.
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Hopefully someone will take these new rules to court to see if they are constitutional.
User avatar
Pat the Ex Mat
Posts: 6420
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:50 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 8:48 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 2:34 am I'm in a mixed mind at this response.

It's probably correct but also completely necessary due to the Feds Bungling of Covid from day 1.

The Vaccine Rollout is a shambles - I am not confident that overseas Australians are getting the support they need from the Consulates.

As for Racism? Sadly, it does still exist in bigger pockets that most of us would be comfortable with.
and you base this on what exactly? What is it that you expect that they can do?
It's not a personal attack - chill FFS
User avatar
MungoMan
Posts: 14382
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Coalfalls

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by MungoMan »

Ali's Choice wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 1:20 am Hopefully someone will take these new rules to court to see if they are constitutional.
An action might take the form of an application for judicial review of a decisionmaker's discretionary exercise of a power under legislation. It might take the form of challenge to the constitutional validity of this or that provision of the legislation. Or both, conceivably.

However, to my (limited, layperson's) knowledge, one hurdle would be that the plaintiff would need to demonstrate legal 'standing', i.e. how a decision or provision of a law has, or is likely to have, a material effect on that person's rights or interests.

If so, a decisionmaker's power may need actually to be exercised, or a provision may need to have effect, before a court proceeds with the matter. As of right now, tho', I'm not sure either has happened, plus the Cwth might (for once) be telling the truth about this being a short-term measure only.

Litigious and rich fúckwits like Clive Palmer may be willing to mount - and risk losing - grossly expensive legal challenges over short-term measures, but for most folk this would be a real barrier.
User avatar
Pat the Ex Mat
Posts: 6420
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:50 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

So near the Knuckle:

https://www.betootaadvocate.com/uncateg ... iJk5iLcQNY

Image
A Betoota-native who gave up his dreams to play for the Queensland Bulls two years ago by signing on to play in the Indian Premier League is now wondering if he can still come home or if this new travel ban with the subcontinent only applies to Indian people but have an Australian passport.

“It’s a genuine noodle-scratcher,” said Francis Dollarhyde, a genuine all-rounder who’s currently on the bench at the Delhi Capitals.
The name! :shock: :lol:
User avatar
shanky
Posts: 22734
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by shanky »

MungoMan wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 4:40 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 1:20 am Hopefully someone will take these new rules to court to see if they are constitutional.
An action might take the form of an application for judicial review of a decisionmaker's discretionary exercise of a power under legislation. It might take the form of challenge to the constitutional validity of this or that provision of the legislation. Or both, conceivably.

However, to my (limited, layperson's) knowledge, one hurdle would be that the plaintiff would need to demonstrate legal 'standing', i.e. how a decision or provision of a law has, or is likely to have, a material effect on that person's rights or interests.

If so, a decisionmaker's power may need actually to be exercised, or a provision may need to have effect, before a court proceeds with the matter. As of right now, tho', I'm not sure either has happened, plus the Cwth might (for once) be telling the truth about this being a short-term measure only.

Litigious and rich fúckwits like Clive Palmer may be willing to mount - and risk losing - grossly expensive legal challenges over short-term measures, but for most folk this would be a real barrier.
It’ll never get that far. They’re already backtracking.
User avatar
koroke hangareka
Posts: 3278
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by koroke hangareka »

bimboman wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:46 pm
Thomas wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:39 pm
bimboman wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:18 pm He’s very “political” while exhausted....

Good for him.


Stop exaggerating stuf.
God you're such a tedious cunt.

I certainly don’t pretend to be entertaining or funny.
On the contrary, these are almost your only virtues as a poster.
User avatar
Brumbie_Steve
Posts: 3375
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 2:22 am
Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 8:48 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 2:34 am I'm in a mixed mind at this response.

It's probably correct but also completely necessary due to the Feds Bungling of Covid from day 1.

The Vaccine Rollout is a shambles - I am not confident that overseas Australians are getting the support they need from the Consulates.

As for Racism? Sadly, it does still exist in bigger pockets that most of us would be comfortable with.
and you base this on what exactly? What is it that you expect that they can do?
It's not a personal attack - chill FFS
Maybe I know some people who have been working in that area and get a little annoyed at the ranting of the clueless. So chill yourself - FFS
User avatar
Pat the Ex Mat
Posts: 6420
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:50 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

Brumbie_Steve wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 12:40 am
Maybe I know some people who have been working in that area and get a little annoyed at the ranting of the clueless. So chill yourself - FFS
I'll remember to check all your posts :nod:
User avatar
Anonymous 1
Posts: 42322
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 3:15 pm
Location: Planet Rock

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Anonymous 1 »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:36 am So near the Knuckle:

https://www.betootaadvocate.com/uncateg ... iJk5iLcQNY

Image
A Betoota-native who gave up his dreams to play for the Queensland Bulls two years ago by signing on to play in the Indian Premier League is now wondering if he can still come home or if this new travel ban with the subcontinent only applies to Indian people but have an Australian passport.

“It’s a genuine noodle-scratcher,” said Francis Dollarhyde, a genuine all-rounder who’s currently on the bench at the Delhi Capitals.
The name! :shock: :lol:
:twisted:
User avatar
Mog The Almighty
Posts: 13183
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:33 am
Location: Stockholm

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Mog The Almighty »

Australian volunteer literacy teacher Tom Delaney isn’t fazed by the Morrison government’s ban on travel from India. He’s more worried about how his neighbours in an Indian slum will survive.

Delaney, 24, lives in a shanty community in Lucknow, the capital of the densely populated northern state of Uttar Pradesh. He teaches children how to read and write and helps locals gain access to healthcare and other services.

Delaney has tested positive for COVID-19 twice – first in August and then again last month – although his symptoms were mild.

“I’m not concerned for my safety or wellbeing - I’m perfectly fine,” he says. “But I’m definitely very concerned about my neighbours.”

India is grappling with a surge in COVID-19 infection. Last week it became the first country to register 400,000 new cases in a day and health services have been pushed to breaking point.

In some cities lifesaving oxygen supplies are running low and cremation grounds have been overflowing.

The Morrison government has temporarily banned all travellers from India entering Australia including citizens who face big fines and even jail if they attempt to return home.

Delaney, whose family is from Brisbane, had not even heard about the controversial decision until he was contacted by The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age.

Although Delaney thinks banning all travel from India to Australia is “maybe an overreaction”.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/asia/i-don ... 57ohb.html

Firstly, what an amazing human. The dude is only 24 too.

Secondly:
Although Delaney thinks banning all travel from India to Australia is “maybe an overreaction”.
Overreaction"? what? ... obviously he hasn't considered all the facts. Like the fact that people back home can now drink a cold beer in public spaces.
User avatar
Sandstorm
Posts: 28956
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Chickenrunning...

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Sandstorm »

IPL is off. Anyone know where Warner, Cummins and Co are heading to? Dubai?
User avatar
Mog The Almighty
Posts: 13183
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:33 am
Location: Stockholm

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Mog The Almighty »

Mog The Almighty wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:00 pm
Farva wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 12:42 pm
Mog The Almighty wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 12:38 pm
towny wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 12:31 pm Thomas is fine unless you start talking about who built the pyramids.
He's an idiot.

viewtopic.php?p=5952728#p5952728

:lol: That went on for about nine pages. Good old PR pile-ons.
That is some serious grudge holding :shock:

For the record, spell wasn’t exonerated. It was found that the evidence wasn’t sufficient for a criminal conviction.
I am still of the opinion that the guy is dodgy.
So am I but that's beside the point.

It's not grudge-holding. You'd just think the usual suspects, of which Thomas is certainly one of the more prominent, would think before gleefully belly-flopping onto the PR pile-ons regardless of what is actually being said or whether they've put any real thought into it themselves. I think the last one was suggesting that the vaccines were rushed, followed by about ten pages of name-calling and childish nonsense. Followed by a bunch of vaccines being withdrawn among safety concerns. :lol:

In this thread what I'm saying is simply 100% reasonable and rational: The Australian government barring entry -- and making it an imprison-able offence -- for Australian citizens in desperate need to return home to Australia is disgraceful.

The Liberals can apparently afford to drop (b?)millions on submarines and jet fighters, the need for which is extremely dubious. And apparently everything in Australia is rosy-as-can-be due to the overwhelming success of their strategy. Considering these things, then the Australian government should be reaching out to Australians in need, not hanging them out to dry and/or treating to imprison them. This kind of policy is nothing to be proud about, it's gross.

It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if that is widely acknowledged as a disgraceful policy, even possibly in the not-to-distant future. Will anyone here admit they were wrong if that happens?
... so ... ?

Seems like the mob has quietened down and slunk off regarding this shitshow.

Yeah old Mog was right again all along.
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

Farva wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:46 am The question of how we manage hotel quarantine and quarantine in general is worth discussing.
The federal government has forced the responsibility into the states and into hotels that aren’t designed for quarantining. .
That statement is not entirely true Farva. You anti-LNPers never mention the 3000 person Howards Springs facility the Government has been operating for over a year. It's a world best quality quarantine facility. Individual cabins,and verandahs, fresh air, warm comfortable weather, medical facilities on site. I guess its existence just doesn't fit your political narrative. It is being earmarked to take returnees from India - starting with 450 people on 15 May.
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:02 pm
Farva wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:46 am The question of how we manage hotel quarantine and quarantine in general is worth discussing.
The federal government has forced the responsibility into the states and into hotels that aren’t designed for quarantining. .
That statement is not entirely true Farva. You anti-LNPers never mention the 3000 person Howards Springs facility the Government has been operating for over a year. It's a world best quality quarantine facility. Individual cabins,and verandahs, fresh air, warm comfortable weather, medical facilities on site. I guess its existence just doesn't fit your political narrative. It is being earmarked to take returnees from India - starting with 450 people on 15 May.
Your post is so full of lies. The Howard Springs facility has had a capacity for 800-850 people. Where the f**k did you imagine that 3000 people have been housed there for "over a year"? More News Ltd lies that you have swallowed? As a FIFO centre it held 2000 people but as a quarantine centre this capacity is greatly reduced. Because it was never built for quarantine.

Moreover just recently the Federal Govt handed full control of this facility to the NT govt because it doesn't want the responsibility of running it. It doesn't have an interest in running quarantine. Yet you want us to congratulate the Feds?
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

Thomas wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 1:16 pm As I said earlier, almost to a man the entire Aussie contingent is critical of Morrison and the current government. Personally, they are an utter bunch of plum.
And almost the "entire Aussie contingent" (so not including maybe 4-5 persons, +/-?) are labour or green voters. The criticism is politically motivated. The Government, in concert with state governments, has overseen one of the best covid responses in the world, keeping infection rates at almost world best % lows, and deaths below the 1000 mark, and you're still whinging for politically motivated reasons x( .

Now man up and admit it. :nod:
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

MungoMan wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 4:40 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 1:20 am Hopefully someone will take these new rules to court to see if they are constitutional.
An action might take the form of an application for judicial review of a decisionmaker's discretionary exercise of a power under legislation. It might take the form of challenge to the constitutional validity of this or that provision of the legislation. Or both, conceivably.

However, to my (limited, layperson's) knowledge, one hurdle would be that the plaintiff would need to demonstrate legal 'standing', i.e. how a decision or provision of a law has, or is likely to have, a material effect on that person's rights or interests.

If so, a decisionmaker's power may need actually to be exercised, or a provision may need to have effect, before a court proceeds with the matter. As of right now, tho', I'm not sure either has happened, plus the Cwth might (for once) be telling the truth about this being a short-term measure only.

Litigious and rich fúckwits like Clive Palmer may be willing to mount - and risk losing - grossly expensive legal challenges over short-term measures, but for most folk this would be a real barrier.
Google up the "proportionality" principle in constitutional law, Mungo. It's a 2 week emergency measure, harsh on those caught up in it, but with a significant upside for the other (25,737,355 - 9000=) about 25,728,000 persons around about.
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

Ali's Choice wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:16 pm
Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:02 pm
Farva wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:46 am The question of how we manage hotel quarantine and quarantine in general is worth discussing.
The federal government has forced the responsibility into the states and into hotels that aren’t designed for quarantining. .
That statement is not entirely true Farva. You anti-LNPers never mention the 3000 person Howards Springs facility the Government has been operating for over a year. It's a world best quality quarantine facility. Individual cabins,and verandahs, fresh air, warm comfortable weather, medical facilities on site. I guess its existence just doesn't fit your political narrative. It is being earmarked to take returnees from India - starting with 450 people on 15 May.
Your post is so full of lies. The Howard Springs facility has had a capacity for 800-850 people. Where the f**k did you imagine that 3000 people have been housed there for "over a year"? More News Ltd lies that you have swallowed? As a FIFO centre it held 2000 people but as a quarantine centre this capacity is greatly reduced. Because it was never built for quarantine.

Moreover just recently the Federal Govt handed full control of this facility to the NT govt because it doesn't want the responsibility of running it. It doesn't have an interest in running quarantine. Yet you want us to congratulate the Feds?
The report was on ABC news channel yesterday AC, on the 6pm bulletin. I don't have Foxtel. I'm surprised you still have Foxtel.
User avatar
guy smiley
Posts: 35339
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: in transit

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by guy smiley »

Laura Tingle has a way of capturing the vibe...
The shambolic handling of repatriating Australian citizens from India reveals the government's priorities.
The media release from the Prime Minister announcing the resumption of repatriation flights from India to Australia hit journalists' inboxes just before midday on Friday.
And within seven words, it was clear just how "back on track" was the debacle which this week saw Australia not just close its borders to its own citizens, but threatened them with jail if they came home.
"Government chartered repatriation flights to the Centre for National Resilience at Howard Springs for Australians returning from India will resume on May 15," the statement began.
The Centre for National Resilience? Who knew? Most people just thought it was a quarantine centre set up by the federal government.
The important bit of getting this life-and-death piece of policy had been sorted out, it seemed. Getting a jazzy name for it. A bit like that ritzy social media post featuring the defence force contribution to the bushfires that was produced by the PM's office and produced when things were at the most sticky for him over bushfires.
It's about priorities. And depressingly, the priorities in this episode tell us much about the priorities of this government.
What it tells us is that, whatever the underlying principles or quality of a policy, the government rarely considers telling taxpayers about it from the starting point of "we need to know", but instead see it too often through the prism of a political opportunity, or political badging.
India's COVID-19 pandemic has reached catastrophic levels. COVID in India looks like our worst pandemic nightmares.
Not entirely surprisingly, the number and proportion of Australians coming from India carrying the disease started to rise, given new variants were emerging that seemed even more contagious in one of the most populous countries on earth.
Australian authorities became alarmed at the risks this posed to people here if the virus escaped quarantine, particularly when it seemed some people were only showing signs of infection after the normal 14 day quarantine period had elapsed.
The decision was made to stop direct flights from India and, then, when it became clear that systems were not in place to track people who might fly from India via another hub, to put penalties in place to deter them.
To do this, Health Minister Greg Hunt made a declaration under the COVID-19 Human Biosecurity Emergency powers granted in March last year.
Technically, it was the Biosecurity (Human Biosecurity Emergency) (Human Coronavirus with Pandemic Potential) (Emergency Requirements— High Risk Country Travel Pause) Determination 2021.
Section 477 of the Biosecurity Act sets out jail terms and fines for people who breach determinations like this one, which is actually the eighth such determination Hunt has made.
Previous ones – also subject to the terms of this Act — have covered everything from banning cruise ships, to stopping Australians going overseas, to visiting remote Indigenous communities.
It's just that no one has really mentioned the whole "going to jail" thing much before.
Chief medical officer Paul Kelly wrote to Hunt late on Friday "to provide advice to assist your considerations to make a determination under section 477 of the Biosecurity Act 2015 (the Act) to make it an offence for a person, including Australian citizens and permanent residents, to enter Australia if they have been in India in the preceding 14 days.
"I note that such a determination, if made, would be the first time that such a determination has been used to prevent Australian citizens and permanent residents entering Australia".
The Prime Minister this week tried to defend the government's shambolic handling of information about its actions by arguing that it was the media that was responsible for emphasising the jail terms, not the government.
That would be fine, except for the fact that the whole point of making the determination was presumably to deter people from trying to sneak back into the country via a different travel hub.
And there was also the fact that Hunt mentioned jail terms in his press release, issued at midnight last Friday night.
The information flow from the government from that late night media release onwards has appeared as chaotic as the government's handling of the issue.
Fair enough to impose a ban if you think you need to temporarily pause the arrival of people from a country suffering the worst of the global pandemic because the quarantine system will be overrun.
But given you are dealing with Australian citizens who are being refused the right to come home (which we are told apparently doesn't actually exist by the way), you would think you might outline what you are doing to fix things during the pause.
What are you doing to help people stranded in India, for example? What are you putting in place to facilitate their arrival after the pause? Are you increasing quarantine capacity?
As news of the ban erupted over the weekend amid outrage and increasing questions about the legality of the move, and accusations of racism, the PM was nowhere to be seen. Any of his ministers who did appear looked flummoxed by the questions. The High Commissioner to India Barry O'Farrell also didn't appear for several days.
And it only seemed to become a real emergency when the usual Coalition media cheer squad and the government's own backbench started to say it was in fact a really, really bad idea.
Despite this, government sources were still "briefing out" that the move was running hotly in the government's favour among voters.
Which apparently is a thing when you are trying to shape a policy to deal with a pandemic.
By Friday, the government was announcing repatriation flights would start at the end of the pre-determined pause.
But the Prime Minister was also saying that people testing positive for COVID would be left in India. The protest from the government is that this has always been the policy, whether for Indians or anyone else, and that this is standard practice around the world.
Given the scale of the problem in India, and the sense from events of the past week that the government has abandoned Indian Australians, or at least failed to put systems in place to help them, this will create new pressure points and questions about its capacity to run things.
The federal government only had two jobs: quarantine and vaccines.
It shunted quarantine to the states but in the last week seems to have stuffed it up anyway. And four million of us were not vaccinated by the end of March.
Determining who comes to Australia, and the circumstances in which they come, just doesn't seem to work for the Coalition as it once did.
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:33 pm The report was on ABC news channel yesterday AC, on the 6pm bulletin. I don't have Foxtel. I'm surprised you still have Foxtel.
Your post was plain wrong. A five second google search will find all the information you need about the actual capacity of the Howard Springs centre (800-850 people not the 3000 that you boasted about) and the fact that it's now being run by the NT government because the Federal Govt wanted out. You came on this thread last night and demanded that posters congratulate the Federal govt for a facility that is run by the NT govt. Hence my comment about you being drunk.
User avatar
Brumbie_Steve
Posts: 3375
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

Wasn't Howard Springs a repurposed mining camp? I thought the NT govt actually came up with the idea.
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:09 am Wasn't Howard Springs a repurposed mining camp? I thought the NT govt actually came up with the idea.
Yes it was a FIFO centre.
User avatar
UncleFB
Posts: 14037
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by UncleFB »

Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:09 am Wasn't Howard Springs a repurposed mining camp? I thought the NT govt actually came up with the idea.
I think it was a fancy construction site camp (designed to be nicer than the usual camps) that was closed in 2018.

Quite funny to see Ellfan make out it was some great federal govt initiative when it was pure luck it was a. nice and b. abandoned.
User avatar
Brumbie_Steve
Posts: 3375
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

Has Mong the unbelievable read Laura Tingle's article yet? Puts some perspective into what actually happened and more facts than emotion.
User avatar
guy smiley
Posts: 35339
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: in transit

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by guy smiley »

So, an Australian citizen in his late 50s has died in India due to Covid.

What sort of liability would the Australian government be facing for that sad event considering they made it temporarily illegal for that man to return to Australia and presumably, better care?
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

UncleFB wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:17 am
Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:09 am Wasn't Howard Springs a repurposed mining camp? I thought the NT govt actually came up with the idea.
I think it was a fancy construction site camp (designed to be nicer than the usual camps) that was closed in 2018.

Quite funny to see Ellfan make out it was some great federal govt initiative when it was pure luck it was a. nice and b. abandoned.
And according to your ABC it was in fact a federal govt initiative and federal money that repurposed it 12 months + ago.

Here is an ABC report about how nice it is from last September.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-11/ ... y/12648762

You blokes a so ideologically blinkered it's tragic.
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ella fan, would you at least concede that your crazy claim that 3000 people are being quarantined at a time at Howard Springs was fantasy? Pure fantasy. And that the actual number is around 800 people at a time? We'll never know whether you were being deliberately dishonest, or you were just ignorant, but being incorrect by such a margin is pretty embrassing.

And would you also admit that this facility is currently run by the NT govt?
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ellafan wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:36 am And according to your ABC it was in fact a federal govt initiative and federal money that repurposed it 12 months + ago.
Quarantine is a Federal responsibility of course they should be funding it. You want us all to suck Scott Morrison's dick for simply doing his job?
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

Ali's Choice wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:55 pm
Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:33 pm The report was on ABC news channel yesterday AC, on the 6pm bulletin. I don't have Foxtel. I'm surprised you still have Foxtel.
Your post was plain wrong. A five second google search will find all the information you need about the actual capacity of the Howard Springs centre (800-850 people not the 3000 that you boasted about) and the fact that it's now being run by the NT government because the Federal Govt wanted out. You came on this thread last night and demanded that posters congratulate the Federal govt for a facility that is run by the NT govt. Hence my comment about you being drunk.
I'm sure you're aware that the federal govt/nt govt announced it as being expanded by the federal govt last year.

I just passed on what your ABC reported. Do you deny that the facility has been expanded to 3000 beds?

Yes/no?
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ellafan wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:44 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:55 pm
Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:33 pm The report was on ABC news channel yesterday AC, on the 6pm bulletin. I don't have Foxtel. I'm surprised you still have Foxtel.
Your post was plain wrong. A five second google search will find all the information you need about the actual capacity of the Howard Springs centre (800-850 people not the 3000 that you boasted about) and the fact that it's now being run by the NT government because the Federal Govt wanted out. You came on this thread last night and demanded that posters congratulate the Federal govt for a facility that is run by the NT govt. Hence my comment about you being drunk.
I'm sure you're aware that the federal govt/nt govt announced it as being expanded by the federal govt last year.

I just passed on what your ABC reported. Do you deny that the facility has been expanded to 3000 beds?

Yes/no?
Last night you proudly boasted that the facility was processing 3000 people at a time and had been operating for 12 months. The reality is that this facility has never quarantined more than 850 people at the same time. Were you deliberately lying, or were you just ignorant? Please tell us. Are you a liar or are you just dumb?
User avatar
Brumbie_Steve
Posts: 3375
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

guy smiley wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:24 am So, an Australian citizen in his late 50s has died in India due to Covid.

What sort of liability would the Australian government be facing for that sad event considering they made it temporarily illegal for that man to return to Australia and presumably, better care?
I am sure that the 50 people who didn't die from the Covid that this man may have spread and their families are relieved. If we import an epidemic the care may not necessarily be any better. People here have been paying a price for the Covid outcomes we have achieved. The events are tragic and it would be great to save everyone but that is not always possible. I don't know the full story but I would be surprised if there was no action or decision made by the man that contributed to the situation he found himself in.
User avatar
Brumbie_Steve
Posts: 3375
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

Ali's Choice wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:42 am
Ellafan wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:36 am And according to your ABC it was in fact a federal govt initiative and federal money that repurposed it 12 months + ago.
Quarantine is a Federal responsibility of course they should be funding it. You want us all to suck Scott Morrison's dick for simply doing his job?
Scotty doesn't operate a syringe or a boom gate mate.
User avatar
Ellafan
Posts: 5719
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ellafan »

Ali's Choice wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:48 am
Ellafan wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:44 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:55 pm
Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:33 pm The report was on ABC news channel yesterday AC, on the 6pm bulletin. I don't have Foxtel. I'm surprised you still have Foxtel.
Your post was plain wrong. A five second google search will find all the information you need about the actual capacity of the Howard Springs centre (800-850 people not the 3000 that you boasted about) and the fact that it's now being run by the NT government because the Federal Govt wanted out. You came on this thread last night and demanded that posters congratulate the Federal govt for a facility that is run by the NT govt. Hence my comment about you being drunk.
I'm sure you're aware that the federal govt/nt govt announced it as being expanded by the federal govt last year.

I just passed on what your ABC reported. Do you deny that the facility has been expanded to 3000 beds?

Yes/no?
Last night you proudly boasted that the facility was processing 3000 people at a time and had been operating for 12 months. The reality is that this facility has never quarantined more than 850 people at the same time. Were you deliberately lying, or were you just ignorant? Please tell us. Are you a liar or are you just dumb?
So that is a 'no', you don't deny it. The expansion relates to staffing levels and throughput capacity*, not bed space.

I passed on a report from the ABC that said they were ramping up capacity there. They have the beds, and are increasing staffing to accept, initially, 2000 persons in June. They can go to 3000 if they bring in more staff.
User avatar
guy smiley
Posts: 35339
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: in transit

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by guy smiley »

Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:49 am
guy smiley wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:24 am So, an Australian citizen in his late 50s has died in India due to Covid.

What sort of liability would the Australian government be facing for that sad event considering they made it temporarily illegal for that man to return to Australia and presumably, better care?
I am sure that the 50 people who didn't die from the Covid that this man may have spread and their families are relieved. If we import an epidemic the care may not necessarily be any better. People here have been paying a price for the Covid outcomes we have achieved. The events are tragic and it would be great to save everyone but that is not always possible. I don't know the full story but I would be surprised if there was no action or decision made by the man that contributed to the situation he found himself in.
Well, the quarantine facilities at border entry aim to stop importing the epidemic. The issue is that the govt made it illegal for this man to re-enter the country, and he lost his life... the argument would lie along the lines of whether the govt's decision cost him his life. An interesting angle on that argument would be whether he had applied for and received permission to leave the country under the travel ban exemption program, as Michael Slater has argued in his situation.
User avatar
UncleFB
Posts: 14037
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by UncleFB »

Ellafan wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:36 am
UncleFB wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:17 am
Brumbie_Steve wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 1:09 am Wasn't Howard Springs a repurposed mining camp? I thought the NT govt actually came up with the idea.
I think it was a fancy construction site camp (designed to be nicer than the usual camps) that was closed in 2018.

Quite funny to see Ellfan make out it was some great federal govt initiative when it was pure luck it was a. nice and b. abandoned.
And according to your ABC it was in fact a federal govt initiative and federal money that repurposed it 12 months + ago.

Here is an ABC report about how nice it is from last September.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-11/ ... y/12648762

You blokes a so ideologically blinkered it's tragic.
I said in my post it was extremely lucky that there was an abandoned and relatively nice facility for the Feds to use for quarantine. It was also handy the NT govt owned it so that it could be used straight away.

Also, how is the ABC my ABC?
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ella Fan

Just so we are crystal clear, this is what you wrote;
Ellafan wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 11:02 pm You anti-LNPers never mention the 3000 person Howards Springs facility the Government has been operating for over a year.
You inference is clear, that the facility is operating at a capacity of 3000 people, not that it might reach that level in the years ahead.

Will you at least concede that it's current capacity is between 800-850 people?
User avatar
Ali's Choice
Posts: 32477
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Queensland

Re: Overseas Australians could face jail for trying to come home

Post by Ali's Choice »

UncleFB wrote: Sat May 08, 2021 2:07 am Also, how is the ABC my ABC?
Ella Fan thinks he's being delightfully clever referring to it as "your ABC".
Post Reply