Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

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Clogs
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Clogs »

UncleFB wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 3:16 am
Clogs wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:25 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 6:57 am An anti-vaxxer XV with Clogs as captain?
Vs the pro China regime XV with AC as dear leader?
When did pro-China become the opposite of anti-vaxxer?

Geopolitics is getting a bit confusing.
Hey you don't have to be opposites to play against one another. Take for example the Auckland Blues vs the Waikato Chiefs. Basically the same. Just a bit down the road. Or up the road.
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UncleFB
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by UncleFB »

Clogs wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:05 am
UncleFB wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 3:16 am
Clogs wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:25 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 6:57 am An anti-vaxxer XV with Clogs as captain?
Vs the pro China regime XV with AC as dear leader?
When did pro-China become the opposite of anti-vaxxer?

Geopolitics is getting a bit confusing.
Hey you don't have to be opposites to play against one another. Take for example the Auckland Blues vs the Waikato Chiefs. Basically the same. Just a bit down the road. Or up the road.
:shock:
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eldanielfire
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by eldanielfire »

UncleFB wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 3:16 am
Clogs wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:25 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 6:57 am An anti-vaxxer XV with Clogs as captain?
Vs the pro China regime XV with AC as dear leader?
When did pro-China become the opposite of anti-vaxxer?

Geopolitics is getting a bit confusing.
When Dozy started conflating the two.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by JPNZ »

The All Blacks were reportedly offered a clash with the Springboks in Dubai as a warm-up to the world champions' July series against the British and Irish Lions.

South African publication the Daily Maverick reports that New Zealand Rugby were offered the clash against the Springboks, which would have been their first meeting since the 2019 Rugby World Cup.

The All Blacks have never played in the Middle East, although the All Blacks Sevens are six-time champions of the Dubai Sevens event.

However the Daily Maverick reports the offer was turned down by New Zealand Rugby due to a scheduling conflict with a 14-day quarantine on returning to New Zealand meaning it would have clashed with an already scheduled test against Fiji on July 10.

An MIQ stay on the eve of the international season wouldn't have been appealing either.

The Springboks will instead face Georgia in preparation for the Lions series with two tests in July. The opening test against Warren Gatland's Lions is on July 24 with the opening tour game against the Stormers three weeks earlier.

South Africa haven't played a test since the World Cup final against England in November 2019 after pulling out of last year's Rugby Championship tournament in Australia.

This year marks 100 years since the All Blacks and Springboks began their famous rivalry at Carisbrook.

The All Blacks and Springboks will meet in September and October in the Rugby Championship almost two years since their pool play encounter at the 2019 Rugby World Cup.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

The Trans Tasman camp should ultimately be a winner but you’ve collectively dropped the ball on the tv rights. I know the games can be streamed but moving off Sky Sports in the UK&I is a mistake. The NRL was on an obscure third rate channel a few years ago but now is getting the live slots that Super Rugby once had (and generated decent ratings for Sky). It seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.

I’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by UncleFB »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pm The Trans Tasman camp should ultimately be a winner but you’ve collectively dropped the ball on the tv rights. I know the games can be streamed but moving off Sky Sports in the UK&I is a mistake. The NRL was on an obscure third rate channel a few years ago but now is getting the live slots that Super Rugby once had (and generated decent ratings for Sky). It seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.

I’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
I like how you pretended to comment on the actual thread discussion just so you could come and have your Covid response whine in the last few sentences.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Ali's Choice »

UncleFB wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:05 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pm The Trans Tasman camp should ultimately be a winner but you’ve collectively dropped the ball on the tv rights. I know the games can be streamed but moving off Sky Sports in the UK&I is a mistake. The NRL was on an obscure third rate channel a few years ago but now is getting the live slots that Super Rugby once had (and generated decent ratings for Sky). It seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.

I’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
I like how you pretended to comment on the actual thread discussion just so you could come and have your Covid response whine in the last few sentences.
:lol: my thoughst exactly''
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmmoving off Sky in the UK&I is a mistake.
No one cares too much about the &I part.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmIt seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.
For the better. Good riddance. :nod:

Mind you, Sanzaar is also gradually going away. That truck is being unloaded.

Similarly, what's left in the UK is no longer News Corp. That truck has already been unloaded.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmI’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
Caint always get watchuwant.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

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My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker
Absolutemont

Stand clear of falling debris...
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

UncleFB wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:05 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pm The Trans Tasman camp should ultimately be a winner but you’ve collectively dropped the ball on the tv rights. I know the games can be streamed but moving off Sky Sports in the UK&I is a mistake. The NRL was on an obscure third rate channel a few years ago but now is getting the live slots that Super Rugby once had (and generated decent ratings for Sky). It seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.

I’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
I like how you pretended to comment on the actual thread discussion just so you could come and have your Covid response whine in the last few sentences.
Not really. I just don’t see how you can complain given the reality right now, it’s tricky. I’m actually surprised the Lions has gone ahead because our borders (both U.K. & I) got strict on SA and it’s a pain in the arse. International sport has kept going in a European context but they are strict on its operation. Is what it is at the moment.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

kiap wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:07 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmmoving off Sky in the UK&I is a mistake.
No one cares too much about the &I part.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmIt seems as though the News Corp relationships gradually going away has impacted how SANZAR sell their product.
For the better. Good riddance. :nod:

Mind you, Sanzaar is also gradually going away. That truck is being unloaded.

Similarly, what's left in the UK is no longer News Corp. That truck has already been unloaded.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:22 pmI’m not sure what you really want on the international rugby front. Your highly restrictive border rules mean it’s inevitable. Nobody wants to travel either way with that in place.
Caint always get watchuwant.
+1

Regarding the last line in your post, I would have said 'every trade-off has a cost' but I think your Stones' reference works better.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Clogs »

towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
Europe is where the money is...
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by guy smiley »

towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
And the fans are still hungry. Even hungrier now they've had a small dose of winter... that showed them how handy the web has become for home delivery.

Cable might be dead but streaming is about to take off. Good luck to Blackrock Shacklock and his SkyPipe... down here behind the closed borders sports coverage has just entered the space age and he's still sharpening a rock with another rock.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

Clogs wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:49 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
Europe is where the money is...
For now, but cable tv will die everywhere and Europe is no exception. Europe is a big market so will always have money, but soon they may have to make do with less than they're used to.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

guy smiley wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:54 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
And the fans are still hungry. Even hungrier now they've had a small dose of winter... that showed them how handy the web has become for home delivery.

Cable might be dead but streaming is about to take off. Good luck to Blackrock Shacklock and his SkyPipe... down here behind the closed borders sports coverage has just entered the space age and he's still sharpening a rock with another rock.
But the streaming business model doesn't allow for the huge money in the way cable does. Streaming has commodised time - there is no 'prime time'. You watch a show when you like - not when they chose to show it. Each day that Netflix adds content to its bundle it grows in value - that means it gets more attractive to people who haven't signed up, so it has decreasing customer acquisition costs.

But live sport and news doesn't work in this business model because you cannot commoditise its 'time' - It is either live or it is not. Sport is worth heaps when it's live but bugger all the next day. This is why Netflix doesn't show sport or news. Instead they spend their money on the other stuff and can outspend anyone, because they can leverage the costs out to their 300 million subscribers.

This has undercut the Cable TV business and people are cutting the cord. Why pay $100 a month for something that's worst than Netflix at $15 a month? Is the sport worth $85 a month? To many it doesn't. Fox and co have introduced streaming to slow the bleeding, but instead of a customer spending $100 that includes live sport, they are just buying the live sport for $25, so Fox loses 75% of its revenue per customer and keeps all the costs it has always had. But the sport costs more than the 25% can provide so they lose money hand over fist. This is why we haven't seen a boom in sport streamers other than small markets (i.e. Rugbypass). Big money for sport has only worked when it was bundled with other stuff - advertising or cable tv content. If there is nothing to bundle it with you can only make money from the subscriptions themselves and good luck with that.

Stan and Nine have a cool model - they bundle sport with another subscription bundle, so rugby fans have to buy both. But it's good value so plenty are. Plus, they get to put one game on FTA, which means the most valuable game each week is able to generate the most value in prime time (with advertising). This is a very different business model than Fox and Netflix. It's really smart. But few can do this because what other FTA station also has a streaming platform? Having said that, I doubt even Nine/Stan could make it work if the sport costs huge money, but it will be interesting to see if they try.

Long story short, NRL and European rugby is going to take a haircut.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

guy smiley wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:54 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
And the fans are still hungry. Even hungrier now they've had a small dose of winter... that showed them how handy the web has become for home delivery.

Cable might be dead but streaming is about to take off. Good luck to Blackrock Shacklock and his SkyPipe... down here behind the closed borders sports coverage has just entered the space age and he's still sharpening a rock with another rock.
There is plenty of streaming up here.

Key to streaming is doing it through a big player though. My point on Sky is that nobody up here is paying attention to Super Rugby (of any form) atm, Sky gave it a window. It was always quite successful for Sky, giving it lots of timeslots and decent ratings.

The Newscorp relationship had its drawbacks, but it did give you good global coverage. That relationship breaking down globally (along with Newscorp selling out of certain markets) is unfortunate in a way.

I guess the key for you guys is to get the Trans Tasman tournament going and get good crowds back as a first port of call, was a general comment.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 1:13 pm
guy smiley wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:54 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
And the fans are still hungry. Even hungrier now they've had a small dose of winter... that showed them how handy the web has become for home delivery.

Cable might be dead but streaming is about to take off. Good luck to Blackrock Shacklock and his SkyPipe... down here behind the closed borders sports coverage has just entered the space age and he's still sharpening a rock with another rock.
But the streaming business model doesn't allow for the huge money in the way cable does. Streaming has commodised time - there is no 'prime time'. You watch a show when you like - not when they chose to show it. Each day that Netflix adds content to its bundle it grows in value - that means it gets more attractive to people who haven't signed up, so it has decreasing customer acquisition costs.

But live sport and news doesn't work in this business model because you cannot commoditise its 'time' - It is either live or it is not. Sport is worth heaps when it's live but bugger all the next day. This is why Netflix doesn't show sport or news. Instead they spend their money on the other stuff and can outspend anyone, because they can leverage the costs out to their 300 million subscribers.

This has undercut the Cable TV business and people are cutting the cord. Why pay $100 a month for something that's worst than Netflix at $15 a month? Is the sport worth $85 a month? To many it doesn't. Fox and co have introduced streaming to slow the bleeding, but instead of a customer spending $100 that includes live sport, they are just buying the live sport for $25, so Fox loses 75% of its revenue per customer and keeps all the costs it has always had. But the sport costs more than the 25% can provide so they lose money hand over fist. This is why we haven't seen a boom in sport streamers other than small markets (i.e. Rugbypass). Big money for sport has only worked when it was bundled with other stuff - advertising or cable tv content. If there is nothing to bundle it with you can only make money from the subscriptions themselves and good luck with that.

Stan and Nine have a cool model - they bundle sport with another subscription bundle, so rugby fans have to buy both. But it's good value so plenty are. Plus, they get to put one game on FTA, which means the most valuable game each week is able to generate the most value in prime time (with advertising). This is a very different business model than Fox and Netflix. It's really smart. But few can do this because what other FTA station also has a streaming platform? Having said that, I doubt even Nine/Stan could make it work if the sport costs huge money, but it will be interesting to see if they try.

Long story short, NRL and European rugby is going to take a haircut.
Depends on the context for European Rugby. Six Nations rights are set to grow. Amazon Prime are big into sport and have bought into European Rugby already.

Imminent threat is BT Sport for the UK Premiership rights.

ESPN and DAZN are making a good fist at streaming so we shall see how they go ultimately.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:25 pm The Newscorp relationship had its drawbacks, but it did give you good global coverage. That relationship breaking down globally (along with Newscorp selling out of certain markets) is unfortunate in a way.
It's really not.

Anyone involved with rugby here couldn't be more pleased that Newscorpse is out of the picture.

Only thing better will be when ol' Rupe dies.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

kiap wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:36 pm
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:25 pm The Newscorp relationship had its drawbacks, but it did give you good global coverage. That relationship breaking down globally (along with Newscorp selling out of certain markets) is unfortunate in a way.
It's really not.

Anyone involved with rugby here couldn't be more pleased that Newscorpse is out of the picture.

Only thing better will be when ol' Rupe dies.
I've explained why I think it's a bit of a drawback. Super Rugby is now streaming for free in the NH, once upon a time it commanded a decent price.

Ultimately, SR Aus and NZ will need to find a NH partner as it did deliver decent value until a couple of years ago.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:43 pm I've explained why I think it's a bit of a drawback. Super Rugby is now streaming for free in the NH, You're misinformed. That wasn't Super Rugby, it was the Oz domestic comp. once upon a time it commanded a decent price.

Ultimately, SR Aus and NZ will need to find a NH partner as it did deliver decent value until a couple of years ago. Again with no actual insight. Firstly, you are miscasting the NH here due to cognitive dissonance about attributing anything to the UK (of which I'll add more below). France, Italy and the rest have always only added up to small beer.
The UK, like France for 80% of the history, was also a fairly modest market for Soup rugby. Welcome, but not large ... except for the one outlier deal which was News-owned Sky's last hurrah. The reasons for it then were at least twofold but it was primarily driven by the English sports rights war with BT. There was also cost shifting within Rupert's empire to corner the market for rugby channel rights.

In other words ... a once in a thirty-year circumstance that won't be recurring in a hurry. More normal service thence resumes.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

A not unreasonable point on the circumstances, but it was bigger for Sky. Getting the Tours was big too. They always paid well.

Tbh, I thought it was still branded as Super Rugby. All I know is that last year it was broadcast and now it isn’t, and most seem to have missed it happening. I don’t think it’s great to lose that, it’ll need to move to some larger platform.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 5:45 pm Getting the Tours was big too. They always paid well.
Correct. The Tests are always where the actual money is.

Week-to-week club stuff (with some rare big matchups excepted) is channel filler in relative terms
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 5:45 pm Tbh, I thought it was still branded as Super Rugby.
All I know is that last year it was broadcast and now it isn’t, and most seem to have missed it happening.
What was on early last year (pre-covid shutdowns) was Super Rugby, broadcast as part of a multi-year deal ... with years still to run on that deal. So why didn't it roll out again this year?

The answer is that this year's competitions are not Super Rugby; are not owned by Sanzaar; and aren't contracted in that deal. It's effectively nulled. There's a broadcast vacancy.

BTW, of course RA and NZR are looking to maintain some level of brand recognition on the new comps namings (there's also a domestic women's amateur comp using the name Super W. It's just a name).
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

Is it not still branded as Super Rugby? You seem to be splitting hairs on it, the long and the short of it is that the comps aren’t on broadcast TV and have become very niche.

My broader point was that criticism of SANZAR on internationals is neither here nor there given the circumstances, the broader point on them not acting as a central agent is the issue for me. I guess the South Africans departing to Europe is an issue; but there is still a value there in centralised sales of the rights. Super Rugby as a whole did have decent value for Sky, surprisingly enough it would regularly fill in the top 10 most watched on the smaller Sky Sports channels. Not big numbers but often decent for the time slots. For rugby as a whole, now you have the NRL (on Sky) and Aussie Rules (on BT) filling those time slots. Rugby is a more popular game and should be getting better exposure generally.

I do hope the streaming thing is temporary. Or if it does go streaming, it ends up on a platform like Prime Video that can promote it to a broader audience. Rugby Pass and World Rugby streaming it is a step backwards.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm Is it not still branded as Super Rugby? Nope.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm the long and the short of it is that the comps aren’t on broadcast TV and have become very niche.
Not at all. This season's audience is up 162% year on year. 1.3 million viewers for last weekend's AU game
https://www.mediaweek.com.au/its-a-grea ... ugby-2021/

The saffers are gorn from soup. Middle of the year, they're your problem now. :D
towny
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 4:28 pm
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 1:13 pm
guy smiley wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:54 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 10:13 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 12:12 am My understanding is that Foxtel is a massive loss-maker and it may not be operating in Australia in 12-24 months. Even with the free money being pumped into News Ltd by Facebook and Google Foxtel apparently isn't sustainable.
Almost all cable tv is a loss maker. It's a dying medium. Sports that have been living large on PayTV money have a massive reckoning coming, and unlike Rugby, may not have an 'out' with streaming. Stan's strategy appears to be to bundle niche sports as an addition to its existing bundle AND its FTA channels. Niche sports are cheap, but loyal supporters will sign up and so it might pay off. Whether this strategy can work with big, expensive sports is doubtful. When Foxtel goes, so will a ferocious competitor for sports content. Ten is broke, so Nine and 7 will fight it out. But will they fight hard, or will one choose one sport and let their competitor have the other? Without the fight, there will be a big reduction in the money they need to pay.

Winter is coming.
And the fans are still hungry. Even hungrier now they've had a small dose of winter... that showed them how handy the web has become for home delivery.

Cable might be dead but streaming is about to take off. Good luck to Blackrock Shacklock and his SkyPipe... down here behind the closed borders sports coverage has just entered the space age and he's still sharpening a rock with another rock.
But the streaming business model doesn't allow for the huge money in the way cable does. Streaming has commodised time - there is no 'prime time'. You watch a show when you like - not when they chose to show it. Each day that Netflix adds content to its bundle it grows in value - that means it gets more attractive to people who haven't signed up, so it has decreasing customer acquisition costs.

But live sport and news doesn't work in this business model because you cannot commoditise its 'time' - It is either live or it is not. Sport is worth heaps when it's live but bugger all the next day. This is why Netflix doesn't show sport or news. Instead they spend their money on the other stuff and can outspend anyone, because they can leverage the costs out to their 300 million subscribers.

This has undercut the Cable TV business and people are cutting the cord. Why pay $100 a month for something that's worst than Netflix at $15 a month? Is the sport worth $85 a month? To many it doesn't. Fox and co have introduced streaming to slow the bleeding, but instead of a customer spending $100 that includes live sport, they are just buying the live sport for $25, so Fox loses 75% of its revenue per customer and keeps all the costs it has always had. But the sport costs more than the 25% can provide so they lose money hand over fist. This is why we haven't seen a boom in sport streamers other than small markets (i.e. Rugbypass). Big money for sport has only worked when it was bundled with other stuff - advertising or cable tv content. If there is nothing to bundle it with you can only make money from the subscriptions themselves and good luck with that.

Stan and Nine have a cool model - they bundle sport with another subscription bundle, so rugby fans have to buy both. But it's good value so plenty are. Plus, they get to put one game on FTA, which means the most valuable game each week is able to generate the most value in prime time (with advertising). This is a very different business model than Fox and Netflix. It's really smart. But few can do this because what other FTA station also has a streaming platform? Having said that, I doubt even Nine/Stan could make it work if the sport costs huge money, but it will be interesting to see if they try.

Long story short, NRL and European rugby is going to take a haircut.
Depends on the context for European Rugby. Six Nations rights are set to grow. Amazon Prime are big into sport and have bought into European Rugby already.

Imminent threat is BT Sport for the UK Premiership rights.

ESPN and DAZN are making a good fist at streaming so we shall see how they go ultimately.
Where is ESPN streaming? Amazon is an interesting one because they can bundle sport with 600 things - That’s a potential source of big money.

Why do you think 6 Nations will grow?
towny
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

kiap wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 7:04 pm
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm Is it not still branded as Super Rugby? Nope.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm the long and the short of it is that the comps aren’t on broadcast TV and have become very niche.
Not at all. This season's audience is up 162% year on year. 1.3 million viewers for last weekend's AU game
https://www.mediaweek.com.au/its-a-grea ... ugby-2021/

The saffers are gorn from soup. Middle of the year, they're your problem now. :D
He’s right though. Those big numbers for Oz rugby are due to it being on FTA (and cheap streaming).
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

Test rugby isn’t where the money is when it comes to streaming. People could just get a subscription for a few weeks and then cancel when the tests are over. It’s worth a lot for broadcast because the big ratings means lots of ad revenue and it’s good for cable as they lock you in on long contracts.

On its own, there is not much money for streaming when it comes to sport - you need to be able to bundle it with something else to make it pay off.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by guy smiley »

That’s where I was headed yesterday when I brought streaming up… with the Silver Lake offer being a prime example of the sort of ‘bundling’ I see being a way to drive revenue for rugby. Amazon or the like is an interesting prospect carrying the disadvantage of no real passion for product aside from its profit generating potential. You want an entity that is invested in the game as more than simply a product to sell… I know, that’s always the overriding imperative, but NewsCorp showed how to buy something and then screw it shamelessly in a rain soaked car park right beside the traffic.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by brat »

Ali's Choice wrote: Fri May 07, 2021 10:36 pm It is now nearly mid May and the Rugby Championship schedule has not been released. At this stage there is no Rugby Championship and there are no confirmed tests for the All Blacks in 2021. What the f**k could be taking so long?

NZ and Australia are both operating in safe, low-COVID-19 environments, with full stadiums enjoying other sports. And yet international Rugby, which is the pinnacle of our game, has deserted the sporting environment. Mid Year tests against France, Italy and Fiji were announced for the All Blacks and Wallabies, but there has been no confirmation of dates.

What the f**k is SANZAAR actually doing right now? It's still an organisation and people are still being paid to do nothing. NZR and RA also need to sort their shit out. If the South Africans aren't able to play again because the NH clubs won't release them for quarantine, then we need a Plan B. It's simply not good enough that no scheduling has been announced at this late stage.
Just seen this..
After just five home Tests across nearly three years, the All Blacks will play nine matches on home soil between the start of July and the end of October this year.
The blockbuster international season will begin with a historic Test against Tonga at Mt Smart Stadium on July 3, the first ever Test at the venue, before two matches against Fiji later in the month.
Two Bledisloe Cup Tests against the Wallabies follow in August, before two Tests apiece against South Africa and Argentina in September and October as part of the Rugby Championship set to be staged here and in Australia.
A home Test for the Springboks and Pumas will be played on New Zealand soil due to the tournament being localised because of Covid-19.
As for venues, Eden Park, Wellington and Dunedin are all expected to host multiple games, assuming bubbles remain open and isolation logistics work.
The All Blacks will host the Wallabies twice, with the third Bledisloe Cup Test set down for Perth.
The Australians announced a new jersey sponsor today, in the form of Cadbury. It is the first time in 25 years the Wallabies have had a new principal partner. The pair have entered a partnership for the next five years.
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kiap
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:39 pm He’s right though. Those big numbers for Oz rugby are due to it being on FTA (and cheap streaming).
Kindly point out where I used the word 'streaming', or show me where I said there was no FTA in Oz.

Old mate was talking about "a NH" deal. I'll humour you both and pretend such a thing did exist if you like, but really it was a patchwork of small TRC+Supe agreements. That one-off aside, these were low to modest revenue drivers and that's the sort of levels they'd be at again.
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:42 pm Test rugby isn’t where the money is when it comes to streaming.
There was an Irish bloke on here who always had these great business maxims. Carried extra weight coz he said he had an MBA.

The thing with NH vs SH tests is that the rights still get negotiated with the host union and, ... feel free to take out your pencil and underline this bit, ... the host broadcaster where the audience is.

I'm happy to receive any streaming business case notes from class, though. :thumbup:
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by les@mooloolaba »

Clogs wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:05 am
UncleFB wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 3:16 am
Clogs wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:25 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 6:57 am An anti-vaxxer XV with Clogs as captain?
Vs the pro China regime XV with AC as dear leader?
When did pro-China become the opposite of anti-vaxxer?

Geopolitics is getting a bit confusing.
Hey you don't have to be opposites to play against one another. Take for example the Auckland Blues vs the Waikato Chiefs. Basically the same. Just a bit down the road. Or up the road.
Your delusional and obvious dont realise the difference between the two, this is not Transvaal and Norther Transvaal you know.

The Chiefs players at least have a heart and know how to put in each week. :yawn:
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Clogs »

les@mooloolaba wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 3:17 am
Clogs wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 11:05 am
UncleFB wrote: Wed May 12, 2021 3:16 am
Clogs wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:25 am
Ali's Choice wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 6:57 am An anti-vaxxer XV with Clogs as captain?
Vs the pro China regime XV with AC as dear leader?
When did pro-China become the opposite of anti-vaxxer?

Geopolitics is getting a bit confusing.
Hey you don't have to be opposites to play against one another. Take for example the Auckland Blues vs the Waikato Chiefs. Basically the same. Just a bit down the road. Or up the road.
Your delusional and obvious dont realise the difference between the two, this is not Transvaal and Norther Transvaal you know.

The Chiefs players at least have a heart and know how to put in each week. :yawn:

Cmon mate, we both know Hamilton is part of Greater Auckland. No point having 2 teams in each others back yards. Just set up the side in Hamilton and be done with it.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:37 pm
Where is ESPN streaming? Amazon is an interesting one because they can bundle sport with 600 things - That’s a potential source of big money.

Why do you think 6 Nations will grow?
ESPN+

An increasing part of their business

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/dis ... bob-chapek

Rumour is that they are looking to acquire BT Sport to bundle it with Disney + in the UK
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

kiap wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 7:04 pm
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm Is it not still branded as Super Rugby? Nope.
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 6:45 pm the long and the short of it is that the comps aren’t on broadcast TV and have become very niche.
Not at all. This season's audience is up 162% year on year. 1.3 million viewers for last weekend's AU game
https://www.mediaweek.com.au/its-a-grea ... ugby-2021/

The saffers are gorn from soup. Middle of the year, they're your problem now. :D
I specifically referred to globally. I agree that that the move in NZ and Aus is a good one all round. My point on SANZAR was that seems to me to be the biggest loss right now, there is no coordination of rights.

And eh?

https://www.rugby.com.au/competitions/super-rugby-au
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by towny »

Blackrock Bullet wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 11:36 am
towny wrote: Thu May 13, 2021 11:37 pm
Where is ESPN streaming? Amazon is an interesting one because they can bundle sport with 600 things - That’s a potential source of big money.

Why do you think 6 Nations will grow?
ESPN+

An increasing part of their business

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/dis ... bob-chapek

Rumour is that they are looking to acquire BT Sport to bundle it with Disney + in the UK
Disney and Amazon might be the only two companies that can bundle stuff at that level. But it’s one thing to use sport to acquire customers, but can they do it with Disney+ that is such a cheap price? It’d be interesting to see what they come up with but if anyone can work it’s out it’s Disney.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

Disney Bundle is $14, gets you Disney+, ESPN+ and Hulu. There’s a rebundling going on currently between all the major studios and the networks, as they are all owned by the same people. Fox are the only ones really who don’t have that tie up because they sold out to Disney, will see how that ends up in time for them.

I think a point you use on Netflix is that selling ads is outside of their core competencies and needs for now. They have had enough outside content to make themselves a draw for everyone for a decade and now have a huge library of their own stuff and still having licences for various bits and bobs. In time I wouldn’t be surprised if they opened up an ad sales division and went into sports but they just haven’t needed to so far to sustain growth.
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by JPNZ »

AB's 2021 mid year tests confirmed
The All Blacks upcoming July schedule has been confirmed.

Ian Foster's side will begin the 2021 season on Saturday July 3 at Mt Smart Stadium, Auckland, for the first time in what will be an historic Test against Tonga. The match is also a double-header with the Māori All Blacks playing Manu Samoa beforehand.

The All Blacks will then play back-to-back tests against Fiji - their first ever series against the Pacific Island nation.

The All Blacks have played Fiji nine times before, but not since 2011 in what was the final test match at Carisbrook in Dunedin. The first match against Fiji was in Suva in 1974, with the All Blacks pipping the home side that day 14-13.

The first test against Fiji is at Forsyth Barr Stadium, Dunedin, on Saturday 10 July followed by the second test at Stadium Waikato in Hamilton on July 17. It will also be a double-header with Tonga playing Samoa in a Rugby World Cup 2023 Qualifying match prior.

"We're absolutely delighted to be able to confirm what will be a fantastic series of matches featuring the All Blacks, Māori All Blacks and our Pacific neighbours, Fiji, Tonga and Samoa," New Zealand Rugby NZR CEO Mark Robinson said.

"We look forward to welcoming the Flying Fijians to New Zealand for what will be an historic, first-ever, back-to-back All Blacks Test Series against them.

"We know the passionate All Blacks and Māori All Blacks fans, together with the fanatical Pasifika fans, will make these game days very special occasions."

The All Blacks last played Tonga in Hamilton in 2019 ahead of the Rugby World Cup and have played 'Ikale Tahi six times.

Meanwhile, Manu Samoa will also play a second RWC 2023 Qualifying match against Tonga, with further details on that match to be confirmed at a later date.

The All Blacks schedule for The Rugby Championship, as well as an additional Bledisloe Cup Test, will be announced in due course, with Eden Park and Wellington's Sky Stadium expected to host a number of games.

July tests
All Blacks vs Tonga, Saturday 3 July, 7.05PM, plus Māori All Blacks vs Manu Samoa (kick-off TBC), Mt Smart Stadium
All Blacks vs Fiji, Saturday 10 July, 7.05PM, Forsyth Barr Stadium
All Blacks vs Fiji, Saturday 17 July, 7.05PM, plus Tonga vs Samoa (kick-off TBC), FMG Stadium Waikato
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kiap
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Re: Sort your shit out SANZAAR!

Post by kiap »

JPNZ wrote: Sun May 16, 2021 11:24 pm AB's 2021 mid year tests confirmed
...

July tests

All Blacks vs Tonga
, Saturday 3 July, 7.05PM, plus

Māori All Blacks vs Manu Samoa (kick-off TBC), Mt Smart Stadium

All Blacks vs Fiji, Saturday 10 July, 7.05PM, Forsyth Barr Stadium

All Blacks vs Fiji, Saturday 17 July, 7.05PM, plus

Tonga vs Samoa kkick-off TBC), FMG Stadium Waikato
Good to see. :thumbup:

And Saturday tests, eh. Lucky bastards!

;)
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