Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

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CM11
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:06 am
camroc1 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:01 am Last nights Operations report.

300 in hospital, 352 available beds.
32 in ICU, 29 available beds.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/ne ... r-2020.pdf
am I reading this correctly we have a total of 61 ICU beds in the country ? not sure where they're located and there's not much point in having 29 available beds in the country if we're at capacity in one part of the country ; we've had 6 months to address this, cost the economy billions and this is where we're at ?
You are not reading that correctly.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by ticketlessinseattle »

thought so, can you clarify ? how many ICU beds do we have in total the country ?
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CM11
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
What key transmission routes do you think will be shut down under the new restrictions that weren't at level 3+?
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rfurlong
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by rfurlong »

lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:11 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:03 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:00 am Anyone familiar with the restaurant scene in Howth at the moment? if i go today will have to eat lunch outdoors in a tenty thing.
Aqua? used to be nice.
Was thinking of going as far as Skerries if anyone has recommendation's will phone ahead.
See if there are tables outside stoop the head in Skerries.

Right on the habour and nice bowl of muscles with a crisp white followed by some ray.

Even Cam would be happy
Yeah the wife loves Mussels and it's her birthday soon , thanks.
You better give her some thermal underwear or wet gear as a present too .... :nod:
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CM11
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:16 am thought so, can you clarify ? how many ICU beds do we have in total the country ?
It's something like 250 with extra in the private hospitals if needed.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by camroc1 »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:20 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:14 am
EverReady wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:05 am They were never going to stop. Look at Nolans hysterical response to Lambert. They have groupthink inside a vacuum with a lid on top.
Nolan claiming we are now picking up 4 out of 5 cases vs. 1 in 3 back then was hilarious.
You lads have been at pains to point out that we only have high case numbers because of increased/more sensitive testing ..... but you're simultaneously laughing at the notion of Nolan stating that we're identifying substantially more cases than before?
We're looking at hospitalisation rates of about 2.5% at the moment, which is one hospitalisation for every 40 cases. This will give some indication of the possible number of unknown cases that were around in April, at a time when figures like 10% hospitalisations were being bandied about. Now things were different in April, and many susceptible people contracted the disease then, but the expected over running of our hospitals didn't happen; indeed we had many private hospitals standing staffed and unused during that first peak. We are not NZ; imo the virus is now endemic in Ireland, and probably has been since March. It is not possible to achieve zero covid in Ireland without locking people into their homes a la Wuhan. Even getting the 7 day average down to under 100 cases will not be easy when we're doing between 15k and 20k tests per day. At that testing regime you are looking at an incidence rate of one case per 200 tests to achieve that metric. One cluster will blow that out of the water.

So if these are NPHETS targets, what happens when we don't achieve them ?

Has NPHET ever answered Varadkars question, What happens next, if lockdown doesn't work ?
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by ticketlessinseattle »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:08 am
ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am The Irish Times view on the new Covid-19 restrictions: Admission of failure
Last Updated: Tuesday, October 20, 2020, 00:05
With incidence of Covid-19 rising rapidly and public health officials warning that hospitalisations and intensive-care admissions were climbing at rates that would soon put the healthcare system under severe pressure, the Government found itself in a difficult position when it met on Monday to consider whether to impose a nationwide lockdown. The second wave has hit. The disease is circulating widely, at a rate that cannot be checked by the State’s test-and-trace systems.

Despite some evidence that Level 3 restrictions had slowed transmission, that trend was insufficient for the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet), whose recommendation to move to Level 5, first made two weeks ago and restated last Friday, has finally been accepted by Cabinet. Ministers had resisted the advice once; to do so again, it concluded, with the epidemic worsening, would have been a potentially grave policy choice and a huge political gamble.

But let there be no mistake: moving to a Level-5 lockdown is itself a failure, and a very costly one. The WHO has described lockdowns as a last resort which can have a “profound negative impact” on individuals and societies. Many people will lose their jobs. Companies will go out of busines. Illnesses will go undiagnosed. These measures will disproportionately affect the disadvantaged, particularly those in poverty. The only bright spot in the announcement of a six-week shutdown was that schools would remain open, mitigating some of the worst effects of a lockdown for some of the most vulnerable among us.

When the reopening after the last lockdown began in June, the country was assured that from then on the strategy would shift towards intensive, targeted measures. An expanded test-and-trace system would hunt down the virus before it took hold again. The entire premise of the “Living with Covid” framework was co-existence. After a quiet summer, during which test-and-trace was stepped down and even pubs were allowed to reopen, the country began rapidly to move through those levels. Where we find ourselves now, facing into a six-week closure, is the opposite of living with Covid.

A fundamental problem with that framework was that it failed to set any objective criteria for moving between levels. That gap resulted in the tensions between Government and Nphet in recent weeks and undermined one of the supposed selling-points of the framework: that it would give the public certainty on the road ahead. Nor does the plan specify how the State, or individual counties, can move down those levels. As a result, we now enter a six-week lockdown with little sense of what success might look like. And we know, because it’s a lesson many countries have learned the hard way, that it’s much easier to impose a lockdown than to lift it.

© 2020 irishtimes.com
It's all the gubbermints fault

Zero personal responsibility

First you post tin tin and then this ?

Ffs
ffs, everything is either/or ? of course people bear responsibility and they always will ; there will always be arseholes (apparently 20% of people will always behave irresponsibly) ; do you honestly think I or anyone else doesn't know that ? what we can do is demand better from our government and hold them accountable - is there anything specific in the article you think is incorrect ?
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Nolanator »

CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
What key transmission routes do you think will be shut down under the new restrictions that weren't at level 3+?
TBF, I imagine that people will generally mingle less and move about less. Won't be as dramatic as in March/April as education will still go ahead and other shops will be classed as essential, so people will have a right to be out and about.

It'll being transmission down, but it is absolutely a sledgehammer approach. Maybe the sledgehammer is what's required, given how little co-operation there was with many people.
Bwen
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Bwen »

camroc1 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:18 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:20 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:14 am
EverReady wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:05 am They were never going to stop. Look at Nolans hysterical response to Lambert. They have groupthink inside a vacuum with a lid on top.
Nolan claiming we are now picking up 4 out of 5 cases vs. 1 in 3 back then was hilarious.
You lads have been at pains to point out that we only have high case numbers because of increased/more sensitive testing ..... but you're simultaneously laughing at the notion of Nolan stating that we're identifying substantially more cases than before?
We're looking at hospitalisation rates of about 2.5% at the moment, which is one hospitalisation for every 40 cases. This will give some indication of the possible number of unknown cases that were around in April, at a time when figures like 10% hospitalisations were being bandied about. Now things were different in April, and many susceptible people contracted the disease then, but the expected over running of our hospitals didn't happen; indeed we had many private hospitals standing staffed and unused during that first peak. We are not NZ; imo the virus is now endemic in Ireland, and probably has been since March. It is not possible to achieve zero covid in Ireland without locking people into their homes a la Wuhan. Even getting the 7 day average down to under 100 cases will not be easy when we're doing between 15k and 20k tests per day. At that testing regime you are looking at an incidence rate of one case per 200 tests to achieve that metric. One cluster will blow that out of the water.

So if these are NPHETS targets, what happens when we don't achieve them ?

Has NPHET ever answered Varadkars question, What happens next, if lockdown doesn't work ?
I would argue the only certainty with this is that lockdown won't work as people will ignore it. This is only punishing people who are already doing the right thing.

EDIT: By won't work I mean the less than a 100 cases a day target set by NPHET.
Last edited by Bwen on Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by rfurlong »

ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:20 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:08 am
ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am The Irish Times view on the new Covid-19 restrictions: Admission of failure
Last Updated: Tuesday, October 20, 2020, 00:05
With incidence of Covid-19 rising rapidly and public health officials warning that hospitalisations and intensive-care admissions were climbing at rates that would soon put the healthcare system under severe pressure, the Government found itself in a difficult position when it met on Monday to consider whether to impose a nationwide lockdown. The second wave has hit. The disease is circulating widely, at a rate that cannot be checked by the State’s test-and-trace systems.

Despite some evidence that Level 3 restrictions had slowed transmission, that trend was insufficient for the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet), whose recommendation to move to Level 5, first made two weeks ago and restated last Friday, has finally been accepted by Cabinet. Ministers had resisted the advice once; to do so again, it concluded, with the epidemic worsening, would have been a potentially grave policy choice and a huge political gamble.

But let there be no mistake: moving to a Level-5 lockdown is itself a failure, and a very costly one. The WHO has described lockdowns as a last resort which can have a “profound negative impact” on individuals and societies. Many people will lose their jobs. Companies will go out of busines. Illnesses will go undiagnosed. These measures will disproportionately affect the disadvantaged, particularly those in poverty. The only bright spot in the announcement of a six-week shutdown was that schools would remain open, mitigating some of the worst effects of a lockdown for some of the most vulnerable among us.

When the reopening after the last lockdown began in June, the country was assured that from then on the strategy would shift towards intensive, targeted measures. An expanded test-and-trace system would hunt down the virus before it took hold again. The entire premise of the “Living with Covid” framework was co-existence. After a quiet summer, during which test-and-trace was stepped down and even pubs were allowed to reopen, the country began rapidly to move through those levels. Where we find ourselves now, facing into a six-week closure, is the opposite of living with Covid.

A fundamental problem with that framework was that it failed to set any objective criteria for moving between levels. That gap resulted in the tensions between Government and Nphet in recent weeks and undermined one of the supposed selling-points of the framework: that it would give the public certainty on the road ahead. Nor does the plan specify how the State, or individual counties, can move down those levels. As a result, we now enter a six-week lockdown with little sense of what success might look like. And we know, because it’s a lesson many countries have learned the hard way, that it’s much easier to impose a lockdown than to lift it.

© 2020 irishtimes.com
It's all the gubbermints fault

Zero personal responsibility

First you post tin tin and then this ?

Ffs
ffs, everything is either/or ? of course people bear responsibility and they always will ; there will always be arseholes (apparently 20% of people will always behave irresponsibly) ; do you honestly think I or anyone else doesn't know that ? what we can do is demand better from our government and hold them accountable - is there anything specific in the article you think is incorrect ?

Yeah, let's hold the government accountable for individuals acting like pricks
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rfurlong
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by rfurlong »

CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
What key transmission routes do you think will be shut down under the new restrictions that weren't at level 3+?
I've already said that it doesn't matter whether it's level 3 or 33, if Irish people don't cop on

I'm just sick and tired of the narrative that it's up to the government/NPHET to come up with foolproof ways to keep the economy open and stop this virus spreading, while one group of people are acting like assholes, and another group are pissing and moaning about every decision the government makes

It's pathetic
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by camroc1 »

If Nolan is using his claim that back in April we were catching 1 in 3 cases in his model, it won't be a very accurate prediction tool.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Duff Paddy »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:11 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:03 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:00 am Anyone familiar with the restaurant scene in Howth at the moment? if i go today will have to eat lunch outdoors in a tenty thing.
Aqua? used to be nice.
Was thinking of going as far as Skerries if anyone has recommendation's will phone ahead.
See if there are tables outside stoop the head in Skerries.

Right on the habour and nice bowl of muscles with a crisp white followed by some ray.

Even Cam would be happy
Yeah the wife loves Mussels and it's her birthday soon , thanks.
You better give her some thermal underwear or wet gear as a present too .... :nod:
Lorcan book the Bloody Stream they have outdoor covered area that is heated, it’s a good set up
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CM11
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Nolanator wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:23 am
CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
What key transmission routes do you think will be shut down under the new restrictions that weren't at level 3+?
TBF, I imagine that people will generally mingle less and move about less. Won't be as dramatic as in March/April as education will still go ahead and other shops will be classed as essential, so people will have a right to be out and about.

It'll being transmission down, but it is absolutely a sledgehammer approach. Maybe the sledgehammer is what's required, given how little co-operation there was with many people.
But the same people ignoring the rules at 3 will do so at 5. Oh, wait, maybe they won't because they're enforcing the 5km rule. Here's an idea. Level 3 with the supposedly important 5km rule enforced?

Or maybe start fining people for leaving their house while waiting for a fúcking test result! :x
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

After Mullet and furlong (well who one week did back it, then the next week didn't & then did) said the closures of restaurants/pubs that served food was great and would work, they've now just moved into the tired trope of Irish people can't be trusted.

Irish people are not having house parties in gyms, the Art and Hobby shop etc.

The reality is that per Nolan's own modelling, R dropped below 1 before March 28th and the full lockdown. So what has changed? People are less afraid, maybe. But surely with months gone by that Nolan et al could see what worked and what didn't.

I suppose if they had done the South Korean contact tracing like the Irish Government expected then they might have had an idea.

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/c ... 67488.html
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20200504000654

Instead NPHET watched contact tracing resources not be deployed over the summer due to "low cases"
Of the 1,700 people trained approximately 300 were deployed
to Departments of Public Health and approximately 700 were deployed in CTCs. The remaining
trained staff were not required to date. Currently there are six CTCs in operation on rotation. Only
one CTC is used per day given the current low numbers of confirmed cases
.
https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachta ... ing_en.pdf

Of course the real reason was that NPHET did not direct for contact tracing beyond 48 hours, as many in Europe weren't doing it. Unlike aviation where we ignored European advice, we just went with them here, despite that not been the strategy.
In practice, what European countries have understood this to mean is that when a sick person tests positive for Covid-19, the task of contact tracing is to find, warn, and isolate if necessary, anyone who could have been infected by the sick patient. “Contacts” are considered to be anyone who has spent time with the sick person from the 48 hours before they developed symptoms, up to 14 days after the symptoms first appeared.

In contrast, Japanese and South Korean contact tracing goes further back in time to establish where the sick person initially caught the virus. This has led to greater knowledge of what situations the virus spreads in – which differ from country to country due to cultural and social norms – and can allow for more precise policy responses to keep the virus under control.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/e ... -1.4364482

And then when Nolan lied about resources on Twitter & then claimed that Irish people are just forgetful, NPHET changed to directing for "enhanced contact tracing".

Nobody held responsible for this. Instead we have Mullet et al going on about Irish people being shit again.
Last edited by Blackrock Bullet on Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Mullet 2 »

Furlong I have that twat on ignore for a reason.

Please don’t quote his sad posts to me desperately seeking my attention. :thumbup:
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by MunsterMan!!!!! »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
This is very much not a uniquely Irish thing in fact I would say Irish people would do well if we were to compare compliance across their peers in the EU or OECD, not in the scandinavian league but still very good.

As much as I hate "its the government fault" I also hate the "People are idiots" shit too.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Mullet 2 »

Duff Paddy wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:27 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:11 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:03 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:00 am Anyone familiar with the restaurant scene in Howth at the moment? if i go today will have to eat lunch outdoors in a tenty thing.
Aqua? used to be nice.
Was thinking of going as far as Skerries if anyone has recommendation's will phone ahead.
See if there are tables outside stoop the head in Skerries.

Right on the habour and nice bowl of muscles with a crisp white followed by some ray.

Even Cam would be happy
Yeah the wife loves Mussels and it's her birthday soon , thanks.
You better give her some thermal underwear or wet gear as a present too .... :nod:
Lorcan book the Bloody Stream they have outdoor covered area that is heated, it’s a good set up
Tourists :roll:
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:24 am
CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
What key transmission routes do you think will be shut down under the new restrictions that weren't at level 3+?
I've already said that it doesn't matter whether it's level 3 or 33, if Irish people don't cop on

I'm just sick and tired of the narrative that it's up to the government/NPHET to come up with foolproof ways to keep the economy open and stop this virus spreading, while one group of people are acting like assholes, and another group are pissing and moaning about every decision the government makes

It's pathetic
No, but we expect them to deliver on a strategy. Tracing was a shitshow, we weren't given what we were told we would get. Nobody has taken accountability for that and you have no interest in that.

There isn't a country in the world where people have not broken regulations.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Nolanator »

CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:27 amBut the same people ignoring the rules at 3 will do so at 5. Oh, wait, maybe they won't because they're enforcing the 5km rule. Here's an idea. Level 3 with the supposedly important 5km rule enforced?

Or maybe start fining people for leaving their house while waiting for a fúcking test result! :x
I broadly agree with all your points, level 3 should have been enforced (and not just causing tailbacks on the motorways), and people not isolating while waiting for test results is absolutely outrageous. I also think there should have been some fallout from the aftermath of the county championship finals. People tutting and giving out about others taking the piss just isn't enough.
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CM11
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

MunsterMan!!!!! wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
This is very much not a uniquely Irish thing in fact I would say Irish people would do well if we were to compare compliance across their peers in the EU or OECD, not in the scandinavian league but still very good.

As much as I hate "its the government fault" I also hate the "People are idiots" shit too.
The majority of people aren't.

But we've got to stop tip toeing around those that are. We can spend weeks attacking a golf society who bent the rules but ultimately had no effect but where are the articles attacking the people who are deliberately risking spreading the virus while symptomatic and/or waiting for a test? There should be no guilt in catching covid, but there damn well should be lots of guilt, and a bill, for knowingly spreading it.
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camroc1
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by camroc1 »

Wait until people find that queueing outside in the cold and the rain is not as socially uplifting as doing so wearing shorts in the lovely April and May sun, and we'll discover which people will social distance, and which won't.
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Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

MunsterMan!!!!! wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
This is very much not a uniquely Irish thing in fact I would say Irish people would do well if we were to compare compliance across their peers in the EU or OECD, not in the scandinavian league but still very good.

As much as I hate "its the government fault" I also hate the "People are idiots" shit too.
MM, these are the same people who would have been saying that we needed to lockdown in March and April to "tool up", "build test & trace" and "improve hospital capacity".

If Irish people are just that shit, then we just need to close the country everytime hospitalisations tick forward, there is little point in throwing billions more at this as we have already done so. It's a dreadful level of argument and quite bizarre too. We have to hold people to account for their performance in their jobs, that includes the Government & the HSE. We shouldn't be hearing that the midwest public health teams were overwhelmed in August due to one guy not following restrictions in October time, not when it is on record that resources were not deployed because of "low case numbers".

We all give NPHET, the HSE & Government a pass for March/April, including on decisions like not stopping nursing home visits, but it's a bit beyond that now. Someone needs to be held accountable for that mess up. That's what's happening in France & Australia, and they are doing it for decisions taken at the outset or earlier on in the crisis. Our authorities had months.
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rfurlong
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Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am Furlong I have that twat on ignore for a reason.

Please don’t quote his sad posts to me desperately seeking my attention. :thumbup:
Yeah, just figured out how to put him on ignore there myself ......
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lorcanoworms
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rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:11 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:03 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:00 am Anyone familiar with the restaurant scene in Howth at the moment? if i go today will have to eat lunch outdoors in a tenty thing.
Aqua? used to be nice.
Was thinking of going as far as Skerries if anyone has recommendation's will phone ahead.
See if there are tables outside stoop the head in Skerries.

Right on the habour and nice bowl of muscles with a crisp white followed by some ray.

Even Cam would be happy
Yeah the wife loves Mussels and it's her birthday soon , thanks.
You better give her some thermal underwear or wet gear as a present too .... :nod:
We are former boating types so well able for a bit of weather, ar.
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Duff Paddy
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CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:22 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:15 am What exactly was hysterical about Nolan's tweet thread response to lambert ER ?
Lambert's piece was pretty objective and written by someone who has been on the battlefield. Nolan is the best laid plans guy behind the scenes. He reacted in a way that did a disservice to Lambert's position with fluff. No one has been able to perfectly model covid but Nolan thinks he has.
Twitter was a strange route to take to refute the Lambert article - why not write your response in a letter to the editor? It was strange I thought. In any case, he failed to land a blow.
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Blackrock Bullet
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CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:39 am
MunsterMan!!!!! wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
This is very much not a uniquely Irish thing in fact I would say Irish people would do well if we were to compare compliance across their peers in the EU or OECD, not in the scandinavian league but still very good.

As much as I hate "its the government fault" I also hate the "People are idiots" shit too.
The majority of people aren't.

But we've got to stop tip toeing around those that are. We can spend weeks attacking a golf society who bent the rules but ultimately had no effect but where are the articles attacking the people who are deliberately risking spreading the virus while symptomatic and/or waiting for a test? There should be no guilt in catching covid, but there damn well should be lots of guilt, and a bill, for knowingly spreading it.
And I've never had an issue with strong fines/heavier measures for not waiting for a test result.
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lorcanoworms
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Post by lorcanoworms »

Duff Paddy wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:27 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:17 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:11 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:03 am
lorcanoworms wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:00 am Anyone familiar with the restaurant scene in Howth at the moment? if i go today will have to eat lunch outdoors in a tenty thing.
Aqua? used to be nice.
Was thinking of going as far as Skerries if anyone has recommendation's will phone ahead.
See if there are tables outside stoop the head in Skerries.

Right on the habour and nice bowl of muscles with a crisp white followed by some ray.

Even Cam would be happy
Yeah the wife loves Mussels and it's her birthday soon , thanks.
You better give her some thermal underwear or wet gear as a present too .... :nod:
Lorcan book the Bloody Stream they have outdoor covered area that is heated, it’s a good set up
Will look up both right now, starting to recall a few like Potager?
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Duff Paddy
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Rumham wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:25 am
camroc1 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:01 am Last nights Operations report.

300 in hospital, 352 available beds.
32 in ICU, 29 available beds.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/ne ... r-2020.pdf
This is a political decision to lockdown as NPHET have backed them into a corner.
Yep agree. It’s the easiest option for NPHET and it’s the safest play for the government. To hell with the consequences.
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Blackrock Bullet
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Post by Blackrock Bullet »

CM11 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:39 am
MunsterMan!!!!! wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:34 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:14 am
Blackrock Bullet wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am
Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:56 am Level three can’t be enforced, they tried it and NPHET were correct.

We don’t follow rules here, it took 30 years to convince us that drinking 10 pints and driving wasn’t the best idea.
You said a couple of weeks ago that everyone would be saying that Level 3 worked and was deadly so NPHET were right a few weeks ago.

Remember of course that we moved from saying stay on Level 2 to Level 5 in 72 hours with NPHET.

NPHET will be right to the end of time with you. Yourself and furlong will twist it that you were always on side.
So it's NPHET's fault that Irish people are idiots and the gardai can't enforce restrictions ?

Away to fvck you clown
This is very much not a uniquely Irish thing in fact I would say Irish people would do well if we were to compare compliance across their peers in the EU or OECD, not in the scandinavian league but still very good.

As much as I hate "its the government fault" I also hate the "People are idiots" shit too.
The majority of people aren't.

But we've got to stop tip toeing around those that are. We can spend weeks attacking a golf society who bent the rules but ultimately had no effect but where are the articles attacking the people who are deliberately risking spreading the virus while symptomatic and/or waiting for a test? There should be no guilt in catching covid, but there damn well should be lots of guilt, and a bill, for knowingly spreading it.
And I've never had an issue with strong fines/heavier measures for not waiting for a test result.

But that is life and some will still break them and get away with it. That's why we needed good contact tracing too. We haven't had that.
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hermie
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Do we all know the guy in Cogs?? Haha, great shop alright.
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What the fudge do you do if you're the Gardai?

You start fining people, and you create even more resentment? You rely on good will and people take advantage of that?

We're into the cold , dark winter and people won't spend as much time outdoors meaning that if they continue to socialise at peoples houses and the GardaI don't have the resources to break that up ( or don't even know it's happening which is more likely), it's hard to see these restrictions working. We're relying on the people to follow the rules again for this to work as it really can't be enforced.
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Post by Duff Paddy »

camroc1 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:43 am Wait until people find that queueing outside in the cold and the rain is not as socially uplifting as doing so wearing shorts in the lovely April and May sun, and we'll discover which people will social distance, and which won't.
Another reason why this second lockdown Is doomed to failure. Stick to 5km from your house isn’t too bad during the sunniest March/April in living memory. 5 weeks of that during dark cold and wet October/November will be very tough on people.
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We need snow to cheer everyone up in late November as we're no longer commuting
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EverReady
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Report from on the ground far away from Mullet and Furlongs lofty towers of bullshit. Client lists being sent out left right and centre. Two lads have told me I am on theirs wink and a nod. One lad was super super Covid the last time. I asked him to do a job and he made out I wanted to kill babies but this time he has approached me.
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iarmhiman wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:00 am What the fudge do you do if you're the Gardai?

You start fining people, and you create even more resentment? You rely on good will and people take advantage of that?

We're into the cold , dark winter and people won't spend as much time outdoors meaning that if they continue to socialise at peoples houses and the GardaI don't have the resources to break that up ( or don't even know it's happening which is more likely), it's hard to see these restrictions working. We're relying on the people to follow the rules again for this to work as it really can't be enforced.
Have a little faith Amigo

Time the Irish people front up.
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Mullet 2
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EverReady wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:18 am Report from on the ground far away from Mullet and Furlongs lofty towers of bullshit. Client lists being sent out left right and centre. Two lads have told me I am on theirs wink and a nod. One lad was super super Covid the last time. I asked him to do a job and he made out I wanted to kill babies but this time he has approached me.
You tell a lot of these stories

Funny that
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EverReady
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Mullet 2 wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:22 am
EverReady wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:18 am Report from on the ground far away from Mullet and Furlongs lofty towers of bullshit. Client lists being sent out left right and centre. Two lads have told me I am on theirs wink and a nod. One lad was super super Covid the last time. I asked him to do a job and he made out I wanted to kill babies but this time he has approached me.
You tell a lot of these stories

Funny that
All true Mullet. It's hard down here livin with de peoples
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I met a fella with two pints yesterday and he said everything is grand and that I look like an Adonis
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Post by ticketlessinseattle »

rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:24 am
ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:20 am
rfurlong wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:08 am
ticketlessinseattle wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:01 am The Irish Times view on the new Covid-19 restrictions: Admission of failure
Last Updated: Tuesday, October 20, 2020, 00:05
With incidence of Covid-19 rising rapidly and public health officials warning that hospitalisations and intensive-care admissions were climbing at rates that would soon put the healthcare system under severe pressure, the Government found itself in a difficult position when it met on Monday to consider whether to impose a nationwide lockdown. The second wave has hit. The disease is circulating widely, at a rate that cannot be checked by the State’s test-and-trace systems.

Despite some evidence that Level 3 restrictions had slowed transmission, that trend was insufficient for the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet), whose recommendation to move to Level 5, first made two weeks ago and restated last Friday, has finally been accepted by Cabinet. Ministers had resisted the advice once; to do so again, it concluded, with the epidemic worsening, would have been a potentially grave policy choice and a huge political gamble.

But let there be no mistake: moving to a Level-5 lockdown is itself a failure, and a very costly one. The WHO has described lockdowns as a last resort which can have a “profound negative impact” on individuals and societies. Many people will lose their jobs. Companies will go out of busines. Illnesses will go undiagnosed. These measures will disproportionately affect the disadvantaged, particularly those in poverty. The only bright spot in the announcement of a six-week shutdown was that schools would remain open, mitigating some of the worst effects of a lockdown for some of the most vulnerable among us.

When the reopening after the last lockdown began in June, the country was assured that from then on the strategy would shift towards intensive, targeted measures. An expanded test-and-trace system would hunt down the virus before it took hold again. The entire premise of the “Living with Covid” framework was co-existence. After a quiet summer, during which test-and-trace was stepped down and even pubs were allowed to reopen, the country began rapidly to move through those levels. Where we find ourselves now, facing into a six-week closure, is the opposite of living with Covid.

A fundamental problem with that framework was that it failed to set any objective criteria for moving between levels. That gap resulted in the tensions between Government and Nphet in recent weeks and undermined one of the supposed selling-points of the framework: that it would give the public certainty on the road ahead. Nor does the plan specify how the State, or individual counties, can move down those levels. As a result, we now enter a six-week lockdown with little sense of what success might look like. And we know, because it’s a lesson many countries have learned the hard way, that it’s much easier to impose a lockdown than to lift it.

© 2020 irishtimes.com
It's all the gubbermints fault

Zero personal responsibility

First you post tin tin and then this ?

Ffs
ffs, everything is either/or ? of course people bear responsibility and they always will ; there will always be arseholes (apparently 20% of people will always behave irresponsibly) ; do you honestly think I or anyone else doesn't know that ? what we can do is demand better from our government and hold them accountable - is there anything specific in the article you think is incorrect ?

Yeah, let's hold the government accountable for individuals acting like pricks
how about holding them accountable for how they're managing the pandemic ? do you think they've managed the 7 months since March effectively ? are you happy with the performance of their track and trace roll out, getting ICU beds to hospitals that may need them ? coming up a clear communication strategy of what are the numbers in terms of cases, hospitalisations, deaths for us to move from level 3 to 4 to 5 to 4 to 3 etc ....or is everything the lads acting the maggots fault ? and even if you were daft enough to think that then what measures are the gubernment introducing to curb people acting the bollix ?
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