Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

All things Rugby
Nolanator
Posts: 38244
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Nolanator »

Nothing alleged, Cam!
User avatar
Gavin Duffy
Posts: 14948
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Gavin Duffy »

And Varadkar has alluded to this.
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
User avatar
Gavin Duffy
Posts: 14948
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Gavin Duffy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:52 pm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
Not for deaths.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:52 pm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
The key is to understand the why for the downturn.

Spain was looking similar but now it is steading out somewhat.

But if they continue downwards in general, it should be very interesting for the rest of Western Europe who are tracking their numbers by a few weeks.

A watching brief ...
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Gavin Duffy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:57 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:52 pm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
Not for deaths.
Deaths lag cases. Compare deaths now to cases 3 weeks ago.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

Gavin Duffy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:57 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:52 pm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
Not for deaths.
If you want to talk COVID deaths, you need to see the criteria by which they are applied for each country.

Any associated Covid case (ie. positive RT-PCR test for COVID19 in previous 28 days) are typically included as a COVID death until a coroner may possible reassess the case weeks later. So it could be terminal cancer, a car crash victim but you can go down as a Covid case.

In general, we are seeing a massive overstating of COVID deaths as acknowledged by Leo Varadkar, our Taoiseach at the time, in the first week in July.

So in summary, be careful taking death figures from any jurisdiction and thinking they mean the person died of Covid disease. A review of Death certificates in the UK in July showed folks who died in a car crash recorded as Covid deaths as they had a positive test result in the previous 28 days.
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

OK Gemma.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
User avatar
Mullet 2
Posts: 27923
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 9:43 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Mullet 2 »

This is the problem with all thick cúnt conspiracy types.

The end goal never makes any sense.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

Mullet 2 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:49 pm This is the problem with all thick cúnt conspiracy types.

The end goal never makes any sense.
You replied within 3 seconds ... which shows how much consideration you gave the previous message.

Glad you are rested now ... :lol: :lol: :lol:
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:46 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
I think you've confused me with someone who thinks every covid death is entirely related to covid, Gemma.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:56 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:46 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
I think you've confused me with someone who thinks every covid death is entirely related to covid, Gemma.
So explain your "workings", Statski ? Or do you have any ? ... :roll:
iarmhiman
Posts: 39264
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by iarmhiman »

Go easy with the smileys man.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:56 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:46 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
I think you've confused me with someone who thinks every covid death is entirely related to covid, Gemma.
What proportion of the Covid death stats are falsely assigned to Covid19 as you have stated ? ... Your time starts now .......................
User avatar
Leinsterman
Posts: 9285
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Leinsterman »

iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:03 pm Go easy with the smileys man.
Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:04 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:56 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:46 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
I think you've confused me with someone who thinks every covid death is entirely related to covid, Gemma.
What proportion of the Covid death stats are falsely assigned to Covid19 as you have stated ? ... Your time starts now .......................
It really doesn't, Gemma.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:05 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:03 pm Go easy with the smileys man.
Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:08 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:04 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:56 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:46 pm
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:12 pm OK Gemma.
Yeah, Statski ... you come across as a misinformation Bot, the way you state stuff without references all the time ...

This time I will quote the Taoiseach of Ireland ... at the time ... you may have heard of him ...

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-19-deat ... 0-Jul2020/

You can apologise without penalty in the first hour following; after that you are exposed as a "no-data nothing" ... :roll: :D :lol: :twisted:
I think you've confused me with someone who thinks every covid death is entirely related to covid, Gemma.
What proportion of the Covid death stats are falsely assigned to Covid19 as you have stated ? ... Your time starts now .......................
It really doesn't, Gemma.
The "no data nothing" clock is running, Statski ... :lol: :lol: :lol:
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Anyway, hospitalisations up to 290 but ICU figures stubbornly refusing to budge. Hovering around 30 for over a week.
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Gemma, you're now confusing me with someone who gives a fúck about proving anything to you. If you're too dim to understand basic stats, a more complicated graph won't help.
iarmhiman
Posts: 39264
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by iarmhiman »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:10 pm
Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:05 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:03 pm Go easy with the smileys man.
Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:16 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:10 pm
Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:05 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:03 pm Go easy with the smileys man.
Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
I get the message.

You think Smileys are evil ... REALLY ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
iarmhiman
Posts: 39264
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by iarmhiman »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:18 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:16 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:10 pm
Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:05 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:03 pm Go easy with the smileys man.
Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
I get the message.

You think Smileys are evil ... REALLY ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
I find their overuse a little disturbing. You do come across a little disturbed though.

A little bit of advice. Using your PR username on other social media outlets isn't a good idea. Your card is marked
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:21 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:18 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:16 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:10 pm
Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:05 pm

Careful now or he'll start quoting Domini Kemp
Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
I get the message.

You think Smileys are evil ... REALLY ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
I find their overuse a little disturbing. You do come across a little disturbed though.

A little bit of advice. Using your PR username on other social media outlets isn't a good idea. Your card is marked
Sorry, petal, I will try and cut down on the Smileys so you are not offended too much ...
iarmhiman
Posts: 39264
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by iarmhiman »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:27 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:21 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:18 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:16 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:10 pm

Oh, you wish ... why would you even notice ... :D :lol: :twisted:
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
I get the message.

You think Smileys are evil ... REALLY ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
I find their overuse a little disturbing. You do come across a little disturbed though.

A little bit of advice. Using your PR username on other social media outlets isn't a good idea. Your card is marked
Sorry, petal, I will try and cut down on the Smileys so you are not offended too much ...
Cheers. I'll be even less offended if you stop posting period
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:15 pm Gemma, you're now confusing me with someone who gives a fúck about proving anything to you. If you're too dim to understand basic stats, a more complicated graph won't help.
Okay, I have been dismissed by your intellectual superiority. Your pride in understanding basic stats is laudable.

But once again, you are actually a "no data nobody" who has nothing as usual to support your arguments.

And sorry for the prior complicated graphs ... didn't mean to make you feel bad ... :D :lol: :twisted:
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:30 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:27 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:21 pm
Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:18 pm
iarmhiman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:16 pm
We had a poster who used to constantly use smileys like that.

His/her name was MissI

It is possible to post like a sane adult.
I get the message.

You think Smileys are evil ... REALLY ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
I find their overuse a little disturbing. You do come across a little disturbed though.

A little bit of advice. Using your PR username on other social media outlets isn't a good idea. Your card is marked
Sorry, petal, I will try and cut down on the Smileys so you are not offended too much ...
Cheers. I'll be even less offended if you stop posting period
Period ? :lol: :lol: :lol:
User avatar
Leinsterman
Posts: 9285
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Leinsterman »

Just looking at Amazon there and Prime delivery times are now stating October 27th. Looks like everyone is bracing themselves for a rough few weeks.
iarmhiman
Posts: 39264
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by iarmhiman »

Leinsterman wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:48 pm Just looking at Amazon there and Prime delivery times are now stating October 27th. Looks like everyone is bracing themselves for a rough few weeks.
Going all the way to December at least. I dont mind. It's winter and can't go anywhere anyway.
User avatar
Conspicuous
Posts: 6842
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Conspicuous »

Botha maybe give yourself a few days off from Covid news and analysis ? I genuinely mean that in the best possible way . It’s looks like things are getting a bit manic at your end so I’d suggest taking a wee break to get your head straight. We all need it from time to time :thumbup:
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

Conspicuous wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 12:13 am Botha maybe give yourself a few days off from Covid news and analysis ? I genuinely mean that in the best possible way . It’s looks like things are getting a bit manic at your end so I’d suggest taking a wee break to get your head straight. We all need it from time to time :thumbup:

You are possibly right.

What are the alternatives at this stage ?


A trip to Woodies for some more paint ...

A trip to Italy for the mid-term break ...

An outside restaurant experience with up to 15 in October ...

A staycation within the county ?


Its Okay, I've got the Lemsip in ... ;)
User avatar
Blackrock Bullet
Posts: 13818
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: #68

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Blackrock Bullet »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:52 pm https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... ry/israel/
7 day average plummeting for weeks.
Christ almighty, read the piece. The point is bigger than any graph. A monkey could tell you that locking people at home would reduce cases, even if a portion of society ignore it. The issue is the larger societal fabric and likely yo yo nature of things.

Interestingly, as that graph shows, cases were peaking by the time of the second lockdown.
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 35695
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Duff Paddy »

CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:13 pm Anyway, hospitalisations up to 290 but ICU figures stubbornly refusing to budge. Hovering around 30 for over a week.
ICU numbers are fantastic - but they will keep on increasinf slowly right through February, which is why pressing the panic button is a mistake unless we’re happy to lockdown again and again until Spring. Track and trace, and proper enforcement of level 2 with localised level 3’s is the only way our economy could survive
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Duff Paddy wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:01 am
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:13 pm Anyway, hospitalisations up to 290 but ICU figures stubbornly refusing to budge. Hovering around 30 for over a week.
ICU numbers are fantastic - but they will keep on increasinf slowly right through February, which is why pressing the panic button is a mistake unless we’re happy to lockdown again and again until Spring. Track and trace, and proper enforcement of level 2 with localised level 3’s is the only way our economy could survive
Did you read this article posted a few days ago?

https://unherd.com/2020/10/the-case-for ... t-breaker/

Very interesting graph regarding locking down and its effect but it has to be a full lockdown, I guess, and the article does point out it might not be actually worth it.
User avatar
Botha Boy
Posts: 2787
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Botha Boy »

Unfortunately we will get a raft of additional measures today that no rational person actually believes will be genuinely impactful but will make people perversely feel better for doing something, anything.

Much like wearing a mask ... :(
User avatar
Mullet 2
Posts: 27923
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 9:43 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Mullet 2 »

Botha Boy wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:53 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:49 pm This is the problem with all thick cúnt conspiracy types.

The end goal never makes any sense.
You replied within 3 seconds ... which shows how much consideration you gave the previous message.

Glad you are rested now ... :lol: :lol: :lol:
Yeah and I'll do the same when you start talking about the moon landings.
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 35695
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Duff Paddy »

CM11 wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:09 am
Duff Paddy wrote: Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:01 am
CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:13 pm Anyway, hospitalisations up to 290 but ICU figures stubbornly refusing to budge. Hovering around 30 for over a week.
ICU numbers are fantastic - but they will keep on increasinf slowly right through February, which is why pressing the panic button is a mistake unless we’re happy to lockdown again and again until Spring. Track and trace, and proper enforcement of level 2 with localised level 3’s is the only way our economy could survive
Did you read this article posted a few days ago?

https://unherd.com/2020/10/the-case-for ... t-breaker/

Very interesting graph regarding locking down and its effect but it has to be a full lockdown, I guess, and the article does point out it might not be actually worth it.
Interesting point regarding lockdowns - how people only take them seriously if deaths are high.
User avatar
CM11
Posts: 58916
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by CM11 »

Can I start blaming the idiots yet, Mullet?

https://www.thejournal.ie/man-failed-re ... 0-Oct2020/

56 cases that wouldn't have happened if guidance in place was followed. I have some sympathy for the initial case not immediately restricting but once he got some mild symptoms you start laying low. But the idiots socialising while waiting for a test result? String em up.
User avatar
Duff Paddy
Posts: 35695
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: Rugby NAMA thread Revisited Rugby

Post by Duff Paddy »

Finally getting a discussion on the cost of lockdown.

6 weeks at level 4 - 120,000 jobs gone
6 weeks at level 5 - 160,000 jobs gone

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politic ... 1?mode=amp

Fine if people want lockdown but this is the cost of it.
Post Reply