**OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

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Joost
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Joost »

sockwithaticket wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
I don't really see all that much of Bath tbh, so maybe I am being harsh, but when I have seen them Dunn seems like a 110% effort kind of player, but lacking in top class ability a la the two main England men.

He may well be the next best cab off the rank after LCD, but I see that more as a damning statement on our hooker stocks than any particular endorsement of his international credentials.
This may be a fair assessment tbh, but he’s been part of a Bath front row that’s looked good this season and he shows-up well at Prem level - he’s more of a ‘traditional’ hooker than George or LCD (ie is a head-down smash-it-up merchant and doesn’t really have any silky skills), but he’s got a bit of mongrel (which Jones loves in the front row) and reckon he’s worth a look.

Not convinced Ewels is going to be a top-end international, but can see why EJ is trying people out - Lawes and Kruis are both hitting 30 (and GK is reportedly off to Japan) and Launch hasn’t been in top form for a while. Would be more concerned if he wasn’t bringing in new players at this point in the RWC cycle.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by sockwithaticket »

Joost wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
I don't really see all that much of Bath tbh, so maybe I am being harsh, but when I have seen them Dunn seems like a 110% effort kind of player, but lacking in top class ability a la the two main England men.

He may well be the next best cab off the rank after LCD, but I see that more as a damning statement on our hooker stocks than any particular endorsement of his international credentials.
This may be a fair assessment tbh, but he’s been part of a Bath front row that’s looked good this season and he shows-up well at Prem level - he’s more of a ‘traditional’ hooker than George or LCD (ie is a head-down smash-it-up merchant and doesn’t really have any silky skills), but he’s got a bit of mongrel (which Jones loves in the front row) and reckon he’s worth a look.

Not convinced Ewels is going to be a top-end international, but can see why EJ is trying people out - Lawes and Kruis are both hitting 30 (and GK is reportedly off to Japan) and Launch hasn’t been in top form for a while. Would be more concerned if he wasn’t bringing in new players at this point in the RWC cycle.
Yeah, I've made the point elsewhere about Kruis and Lawes' ages and how although we're well set now, we might not be by the World Cup. I'm far from convinced Ewels should be one of their replacements and I'm not sure it's worth forcing anything at this stage of the RWC cycle given the lack of other stand out candidates available (Ribbans might have been one, but he's injured iirc).
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by polyallstar »

Joost wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
I don't really see all that much of Bath tbh, so maybe I am being harsh, but when I have seen them Dunn seems like a 110% effort kind of player, but lacking in top class ability a la the two main England men.

He may well be the next best cab off the rank after LCD, but I see that more as a damning statement on our hooker stocks than any particular endorsement of his international credentials.
This may be a fair assessment tbh, but he’s been part of a Bath front row that’s looked good this season and he shows-up well at Prem level - he’s more of a ‘traditional’ hooker than George or LCD (ie is a head-down smash-it-up merchant and doesn’t really have any silky skills), but he’s got a bit of mongrel (which Jones loves in the front row) and reckon he’s worth a look.

Not convinced Ewels is going to be a top-end international, but can see why EJ is trying people out - Lawes and Kruis are both hitting 30 (and GK is reportedly off to Japan) and Launch hasn’t been in top form for a while. Would be more concerned if he wasn’t bringing in new players at this point in the RWC cycle.
I've no issue with this, but Ewels isn't that man imho there are better candidates of a similar age to play alongside Maro. Also if this was his thinking why isn't looking at scrum-half as the two candidates are the oldest and 3rd oldest in the entire squads?
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Joost »

Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by sockwithaticket »

Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
It could well be that we've just been thoroughly spoilt for the last few years and now anyone who's pretty good and would have been better than options in previous set ups (Anyone remember Mo Botha?), just doesn't look up to it.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by The Man Without Fear »

blindcider wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
Taylor was the other, but hasn't been quite the same since his injury
Thacker? :lol:
Back to Twitter with you!
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by SaintK »

Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
Moon was injured in training camp and is on the mend.
Having watched them both reasonably regularly I'd put Jonny Hills ahead of Ewels but there again I haven't seen them close up like EJ
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Joost »

JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
Ewels? Think he's smaller than all of the others I mentioned. He's even smaller than Elliot Stooke at Bath.

Bath are doing pretty well at developing young players and getting them into the England squad :thumbup:

Then again, I can't fathom how Jack Willis isn't in the squad and Lewis Ludlum is, so get where people are coming from on EJ's selections. I'm also a fan of Dombrandt, but wonder if his conditioning/fitness is considered an issue.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

Joost wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
Ewels? Think he's smaller than all of the others I mentioned. He's even smaller than Elliot Stooke at Bath.

Bath are doing pretty well at developing young players and getting them into the England squad :thumbup:
Yeah, good for Bath and Bath's players.

Now, from an England perspective, if we could also ensure those players were good...

Ewels I thought was a squat, heavy lock. His stats suggest otherwise. Hmm, oh well - for a second there I had a good reason why a Bath player was being picked, now I've got nothing :(
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

Dombrandt is having one of those seasons where even if he doesn't play particularly well he does something eye catching (and usually scores), which can make it hard to judge his overall worth. Would love to see him given an opportunity.

Willis I'd have in ahead of pretty much anyone else, he's ridiculous
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by sockwithaticket »

Joost wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
Ewels? Think he's smaller than all of the others I mentioned. He's even smaller than Elliot Stooke at Bath.

Bath are doing pretty well at developing young players and getting them into the England squad :thumbup:

Then again, I can't fathom how Jack Willis isn't in the squad and Lewis Ludlum is, so get where people are coming from on EJ's selections. I'm also a fan of Dombrandt, but wonder if his conditioning/fitness is considered an issue.
That one's looking like an increasingly jokeshop decision. That said, given Eddie's reluctance to utilise the inexperienced back rowers in the squad so far, he's probably more usefully deployed at Wasps helping us stay in the hunt for a respectable league position and leading the league in turnovers.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Joost »

JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
Ewels? Think he's smaller than all of the others I mentioned. He's even smaller than Elliot Stooke at Bath.

Bath are doing pretty well at developing young players and getting them into the England squad :thumbup:
Yeah, good for Bath and Bath's players.

Now, from an England perspective, if we could also ensure those players were good...

Ewels I thought was a squat, heavy lock. His stats suggest otherwise. Hmm, oh well - for a second there I had a good reason why a Bath player was being picked, now I've got nothing :(
Keep the uninformed irrational hatred coming :smug:
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

I will!
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Balls Out! »

JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
Joost wrote:Believe Ewels is seen as one of those players who gets very high ruck marks and does the basics of lock play and the 'unseen' stuff well, but isn't particularly conspicuous in his carrying or destructive in his tackling.

Daresay people will advocate the likes of Jonny Hill, Nick Isiekwe and Alex Moon as players of a similar age with higher potential - that may or may not be true, but EJ has had them all in camp and presumably had good look at all of them and thought they were behind Ewels.
He is very large.

I think that's it, honestly.
Ewels? Think he's smaller than all of the others I mentioned. He's even smaller than Elliot Stooke at Bath.

Bath are doing pretty well at developing young players and getting them into the England squad :thumbup:
Yeah, good for Bath and Bath's players.

Now, from an England perspective, if we could also ensure those players were good...

Ewels I thought was a squat, heavy lock. His stats suggest otherwise. Hmm, oh well - for a second there I had a good reason why a Bath player was being picked, now I've got nothing :(
small-ish for a lock, but maybe now our biggest #8 after Billy... if you subscribe to my new crackpot theory that Eddie and Proudfoot are trying to upsize our pack after the SA manshaming, by filling the back 5 with interchangeable players
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by duke »

The other hooker besides Tommy Taylor who might have been up for the squad is Mike Haywood.

Is he on his way back from long term injury, I haven't seen much of him recently?
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by choc »

Ewels is a “leader” according to Eddie, which may have some merit considering he was Bath skipper at 22. Quite what that means though, apart from he talks a good game at training. Another Brad Shields who was someone else who had these mysterious leadership qualities that we saw nothing of on the pitch.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

I can see it. The way he directs players who've been substituted to the correct seat on the bench can't be ignored.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by ChipSpike »

choc wrote:Ewels is a “leader” according to Eddie, which may have some merit considering he was Bath skipper at 22. Quite what that means though, apart from he talks a good game at training. Another Brad Shields who was someone else who had these mysterious leadership qualities that we saw nothing of on the pitch.
Have we got any leaders who know anything changing tactics to fit the current match position, that would be useful. As ooposed to mouthy on the training pitch.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Oxbow »

duke wrote:The other hooker besides Tommy Taylor who might have been up for the squad is Mike Haywood.

Is he on his way back from long term injury, I haven't seen much of him recently?
Haywood is still some way off his best, though it probably doesn't help that Saints are down to 5th/6th choice locks and the team as a whole are playing like dogshit.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by happyhooker »

The Man Without Fear wrote:
blindcider wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
Taylor was the other, but hasn't been quite the same since his injury
Thacker? :lol:
Back to Twitter with you!
Huh? Taylor was on fire before his injury
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

He was the best military medium player in the league. Not particularly good hands, not a hard carrier, not a brilliant scrummager - but a really good lineout thrower, an excellent tackler, a willing carrier, a great engine

Basically if Robshaw was a hooker and had little breakdown ability and no handling / vision
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by inactionman »

JM2K6 wrote:He was the best military medium player in the league. Not particularly good hands, not a hard carrier, not a brilliant scrummager - but a really good lineout thrower, an excellent tackler, a willing carrier, a great engine

Basically if Robshaw was a hooker and had little breakdown ability and no handling / vision
Your glass seems quite half empty today.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

inactionman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:He was the best military medium player in the league. Not particularly good hands, not a hard carrier, not a brilliant scrummager - but a really good lineout thrower, an excellent tackler, a willing carrier, a great engine

Basically if Robshaw was a hooker and had little breakdown ability and no handling / vision
Your glass seems quite half empty today.
Just living up to expectations!

(I've always rated him behind George and LCD for various reasons, but ahead of the rest)
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Margin_Walker »

Dave Porecki. Here. First

Fellow Manly lad. EQP. Obsessive about his fitness. Tidy player, consistently first choice when fit in front more heralded names at LI.

Would be good for a laugh.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by happyhooker »

Margin_Walker wrote:Dave Porecki. Here. First

Fellow Manly lad. EQP. Obsessive about his fitness. Tidy player, consistently first choice when fit in front more heralded names at LI.

Would be good for a laugh.
The aussie? Is he residency qualified?
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Margin_Walker »

happyhooker wrote:
Margin_Walker wrote:Dave Porecki. Here. First

Fellow Manly lad. EQP. Obsessive about his fitness. Tidy player, consistently first choice when fit in front more heralded names at LI.

Would be good for a laugh.
The aussie? Is he residency qualified?
Family (not sure how). And would be residency now anyway.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by inactionman »

What's happened to Singleton? Looked good in U20 etc.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

inactionman wrote:What's happened to Singleton? Looked good in U20 etc.
Went to Saracens and spent so much time counting his money he forgot how to throw. Legendarily awful start to his Sarries career and I'm not sure he's properly recovered.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Joost »

inactionman wrote:What's happened to Singleton? Looked good in U20 etc.
He’s jacked in rugby and started up a property development business...
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by SaintK »

inactionman wrote:What's happened to Singleton? Looked good in U20 etc.
His throwing is so inconsistent. Can lose as many throws as he wins some matches!
Sarries have even had former England line out coach Si Hardy working with him but he doesn’t appear to be improving
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by geordie_6 »

blindcider wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
SaintK wrote:
sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
Only 2 hookers so Dunn will see game time. Think you are being a bit harsh, he has looked more than "decent" the past couple of seasons. Agree with your other point mind you there aren't many putting their hands up
Taylor was the other, but hasn't been quite the same since his injury
Thacker? :lol:
Thacker is putting his hand up, but we just can't see it over the others.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by DragsterDriver »

Whatever Thackers quality he’s too small, Haywood is a decent club pro but spent too long at saints behind Hartley. Singleton makes Rory Best look like Eric Bristow.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Keith »

Not sure if this has been done yet, but Mat Protheroe has now decided he's Welsh and has signed for the Ospreys.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

Keith wrote:Not sure if this has been done yet, but Mat Protheroe has now decided he's Welsh and has signed for the Ospreys.
I thought that was inevitable as soon as smoke stopped getting blown up his arse and it was obvious he wasn't some sort of generational talent

Does make sense given Bristol's salary situation next year too
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by DragsterDriver »

Margin_Walker wrote:Dave Porecki. Here. First

Fellow Manly lad. EQP. Obsessive about his fitness. Tidy player, consistently first choice when fit in front more heralded names at LI.

Would be good for a laugh.
Only seen him play once but he was decent.
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by piquant »

sockwithaticket wrote:My heart always sinks a bit seeing Dunn in the squad, he's just a decent Prem player imo. Then I remember that outside George and LCD, there really aren't any standout English hookers, which is a bloody travesty.
It's not much of a travesty, we've very rarely had two hookers as good as our 1st and 2nd choice right now
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by Gospel »

JM2K6 wrote:Willis I'd have in ahead of pretty much anyone else, he's ridiculous
What's the thinking behind his non-selection? Does Eddie see him as something of a sick-note?
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by JM2K6 »

Gospel wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:Willis I'd have in ahead of pretty much anyone else, he's ridiculous
What's the thinking behind his non-selection? Does Eddie see him as something of a sick-note?
Christ only knows. Maybe he's had too much publicity so Eddie instinctively won't pick him
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Re: **OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

Post by DragsterDriver »

Eddie would ply ewels at 6 ahead of Willis. Ted Hill is getting a rough deal as well.
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