I have to say I dont agree with your statement that Muslims dont obey the law of the land. They do. They are arrested when they dont and persecuted under that law. They have been proved to do so. You pick an example of where they havent but that is an outlier not the norm.
In fact, their religion compels them to do so:
https://www.alislam.org/library/questio ... w-of-land/
In Islam obedience to the law of the land is a religious duty. The Qur’an commands Muslims to remain faithful to not only Allah and the Prophet Muhammad(sa), but also the authority they live under:
O ye who believe! obey Allah, and obey His Messenger and those who are in authority over you (Ch.4: V.60).
Any country or government that guarantees religious freedom to followers of different faiths (not just Islam) must be owed loyalty. The Prophet Muhammad(sa) stressed this point when he said:
‘One who obeys his authority, obeys me. One who disobeys his authority, disobeys me.’ (Muslim)
The present head of the worldwide Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad(aba), has also explained:
‘A true Muslim can never raise his voice in hatred against his fellow citizens, nor for that matter against the ruling authority or government of the time. It is the responsibility of a true Muslim that he should remain loyal and fully abide by the laws of the land of which he is a subject.’ (Baitul Futuh Inauguration Reception, 11 Oct 2003)
There are other examples of Muslims not accepting Australian law but again they are the minority.
I think this article goes a long way to discussing it. https://aifs.gov.au/publications/family ... sharia-law
Interestingly, some Catholics also believe they are above Australian law - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-aust ... SKCN1LG057
Many Muslims immigrate here, many more were born here. Same as for Catholics. Again, I ask why this is a Muslim only issue and Catholics (as an example, I havent looked into other religious or non-religious groups but am sure they are the same).
In regard to your point about showing respect for the country you live in, I totally agree. I see a small minority of Muslims not doing that in Australia, but I see the same for every group that immigrate there. Do you have an issue with the organised crime gangs that came with the Italian migrants for example? Should we ban Italian migrants - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ralia.html
Incidentally, I currently live in the Philippines and see a huge amount of disrespect by Australians to the locals here - mostly driven by a superiority complex but also the nefarious activity of sex tourism (its a big issue foreigners coming here for sex, particularly with underage girls). Should Australians be barred from travelling to the Philippines?
Farva, though I'm incredulous that so many on this Forum can't see the danger of the continuing massive Muslim expansion into western countries (the masses of Germans who now hate Angela Merkel for her 'You are all welcome here' policies would be equally incredulous), I am going to try one last time, and then I'll be done with this topic. I don't expect much to come of it, because I have come to the conclusion that those who won't acknowledge something so obvious are following an agenda not to notice it - 'There are none so blind, as those who will not see' stuff.
It troubles me that a number of posters made a comparison between petty or even major criminals and Islamic terrorism. That shows an inability to distinguish between vice (2 examples were Australian paedophiles using under-age children for sex in Asia, and crime gangs that came to Australia with Italian immigration) and terrorism. Vice or crime is a matter of people doing illegal things for their personal gain, whereas terrorism is people committing crimes against a whole country/society out of hatred for that country ie treason. Police in all countries have to deal with the former and it is a given. It is not a given that police should have to deal with random acts of terror, violence and destruction indiscriminately directed at all members of the society it is turned on. Crime, even at an organised level, (eg the Mafia) does not result in a country being put on a terror alert. Terrorism does, because it is an attempt at destruction of the society itself. I'm incredulous that you all can be aware Australia is on an ongoing high risk of terror alert (something that was unthinkable even 20 years ago), and not think that that calls for urgent and thorough measures to deal with the source of the matter.
So here are my points:
. (speaking of 'the source of the matter') Muslims make up 2.25% of Australia's population. Muslims have been responsible for more than 95% of acts of terrorism in Australia.(to illustrate how pointless(insulting, actually) it is to mention Italians in the same light: percentage of acts of terrorism committed by Italo-Australians(5% of the population) = 0%). Australia's intelligence agencies are currently engaged 24/7 in dealing with the detection and prevention of terrorism, and their resources are stretched to the limit in the process. The Muslim population of Australia is doubling every 10 years, as it does in other western countries. If that trend is not arrested via the cessation of Muslim immigration, we are clearly on the road to where our intelligence agencies will not be able to adequately deal with terrorist activity. From there it is so obvious to do the maths (a 5-year-old could manage, so I'm staggered that adults can't) and see where we are headed, but I will help with a couple of examples of western countries that have been subject to the same high numbers of Muslim immigration as Australia, for a more extended period of time:
1. In England in 2017, the last year for which figures are available, Muslim terrorist attacks killed 34 people and seriously injured another 237 - that is something like the toll from a natural disaster, and includes an incident where a young woman from my suburb of Brisbane was murdered on her first trip overseas. A 2018 poll of London Muslims showed 80% approve of Isis. (London has 20% Muslim population)
2.) In France (10% Muslim population), in the wake of the 2015 Paris attacks, the head of French National Security commented that the country had reached crisis point due to the 'Widespread disdain for all forms of authority demonstrated by the Muslim community'. (so much for 'remain(ing) faithful to the authority they live under'). I watched a documentary this year of a French village with 50% Muslim population, where women coming home from work are met in the town square by Muslim men who harass and sometimes beat them for being on the street after dark. I lived in France for some months many years ago, and remember it as a fun-loving, carefree society, but now the teenage daughter of a French family who are close friends speaks regularly about how people live in fear, and women especially are afraid to look to right or left when they walk the streets. What you are looking at there is the disintegration of a society and culture.
Those are just a couple of many examples, but the absolutely reliable pattern is that terrorism in countries to which Muslims migrate increases in direct proportion to the Muslim population - I could have picked Germany, Spain, Belgium, Sweden, Italy...etc. It is the norm. You mentioned the Quran commands Muslims to remain faithful to ...the authority they live under.' It also says, 'You should live in peace with others, but...if someone says, Allah is not God, you should kill him.'
From there it is a very short step to limitless interpretations of someone saying Allah is not God, such as a Christian saying 'Jesus is God.' This is so much the case in practise that I think the messages of peace are just lip-service, damage control in the wake of the latest atrocity.
Something people on the other side of this debate are not asking themselves, is why there are such massive Muslim migrations to the west (and other countries) at the moment. Wahhabi Muslimism, which began in 1948 and is practised by a majority of Muslim refugees to Australia, promotes the conquest and domination of all the worlds countries under Sharia Law. After many years of fighting each other and western countries, they have found an easier way: migrate, outbreed the local population to the point that you are a majority, take over, declare Sharia Law (Hitler would be proud of the idea). It's exactly why Isis say, 'The Black Flag will fly above every country in the world'; why the head of Isis in Germany makes speeches saying, 'We will come here in great numbers, we will breed with your women and their children will be Sharia Muslims. Then we will take over.' In case you think this is my personal fantasy, a leading French writer has written a novel of a future France under Sharia Law, which he considers not just a risk, but inevitable. There are some people arguing that the majority of Muslims are peaceful, but you need to be asking yourself why their communities are not speaking out against terror. If this was being generated by the European-Australian community, that community would be in an uproar of protest.
For those who have spoken of living in Melbourne and enjoying the presence of Islamic communities, I also got along well with Muslim neighbours and shopkeepers, but I'd like to share some of my experience from that time. I left Melbourne in 2004, and since well before that, a work colleague shared with me the following preachings of his Imam (at Melbourne's biggest Mosque):
. Hitler was one of history's great heroes, because he killed so many Jews.
. 9/11 was a righteous event.
. women who have sex outside of marriage should be stoned to death. I asked him, 'What about the men?' No reply.
. Music and dancing are the devils work and should be punished by imprisonment or worse.
It went on and on, in the same vein. I used to go to clubs on the weekend, and sometimes had to take a quick detour to avoid large groups of semi-violent Muslim youth on a Saturday night in the CBD. One such group knifed a female policewoman to death in the same area. The same groups would leave numerous graffiti messages on building walls of the 'Allah rules, death to Jews and Christians' type. One night beside the Yarra I saw such a group stop at the traffic lights and lay into the car in front of them with metal bars, leaving it undriveable. All that was pre-terror alert Australia. I would hate to live in Melbourne now.
As you're a resident of the Phillipines, I'm surprised that you didn't look at the example of Muslim communities in the south of the country who conduct an ongoing terrorist campaign with the intention of becoming a breakaway country from the area they originally invaded. In the south of Thailand, where the Muslim community consists of huge numbers of illegal migrants and their descendants (from Malaysia), murders and bombings are a never-ending occurrence, with Malaysian terrorists crossing the border to kill men, women and children, then crossing back before they can be pursued, with the support of the Muslim Malaysian government. The Islamic groups in South Thailand are fighting for independence from Thailand. That is the arrogance that's at work: illegal immigrants claiming the land they have invaded for their own, and it fits the Wahhabi formula perfectly.
That's just a little bit of what's going on, and it's too long for this Forum which is about discussion, but I want to put it out there so I don't have to talk any more about it. It's incontestable, and it's happening now. I believe 21st century western countries have adopted The Kings New Clothes approach of, 'pretend it's not happening, so we don't upset anyone,' but inaction will only make the danger greater. The best we can do is stop the migrational movement now, and then try to work with Muslim communities that are here to bring their communities into the 21st century, because they are currently working with belief systems and a world view that is stuck in the Dark Ages.
I'm done with this topic now (finally).