The Australian Politics Thread

All things Rugby

Whos Going to Lead the Labor Rabble

Albo
7
37%
Plibbers
1
5%
Bowen
1
5%
Chalmers
4
21%
Uncle Tony
1
5%
Clive Palmer
3
16%
George Smith
2
11%
 
Total votes: 19

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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
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kiwigreg369
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiwigreg369 »

guy smiley wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 2:58 am I think it’s symptomatic of how we as society view the world that blame is being sought here... a target is desired to absolve the frustration and anger on.

Individuals have made decisions under extreme pressure with no prior knowledge of the situation they’re faced with. Those who disagree for any number of reasons now seem to want to make someone pay for their discomfort. I think the issue is much wider than individual decision making and lies in the way we’ve allowed society to structure itself.

Poorly trained and equipped security was appointed in Victoria because that’s what the economic model prescribed. Minimum cost labour providing the minimal degree of service to maximise profit. Outsourcing is the name of the game for governments... reduce your staffing levels, reduce your superficial spending and pass on both extra costs and most crucially, responsibility to the user. So you have the Victorian police force saying early on that they couldn’t take on the task of managing security... inference is staffing and resources can’t bear it. Federal government likewise outsource responsibilities to State level partially due to legislated division of powers and partly due to political philosophies and the wish to manoeuvre for advantage.

So we live within a social system that drives down the quality of service provision in the name of economic success and we are blinded to the failure of logic inherent in that system until something like COVID-19 rolls along and takes us right out of our comfort zones and reveals our system to be inadequate. We’re not questioning that. We’re stuck in a loop of blame and denial. Talk of accountability is really only a symptom of that dynamic. No one is accountable because outsourcing conveniently obscures responsibilities at various levels of decision making.

We don’t have a governmental structure that could come close to contemplating a shift in this overall dynamic... so we’ll bumble along through this and in all likelihood repeat the same series of mistakes again before the next pandemic rolls around... and it will. The manner in which we are degrading our physical environment and the rate with which we are doing that suggests cross species transmission of virus will be more likely to occur again, not less.

We’ll just continue to pursue a business as usual policy with profit and shareholder dividend thinking ruling the day when what we really could be doing is looking at better resourcing for community services like, for a very obvious example, aged care. Or health. Or education. Or a meaningful minimum wage and protection structure that encourages people to stay home when ill instead of feeling forced to go to work for fear of economic catastrophe.
Good post - should be top of page.

GS - which begs the question do no political parties offer that vision, or are not enough people willing to vote for it.
(my view - it's the later)
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guy smiley
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by guy smiley »

Any political party presenting anything close to that view is universally rubbished as being loony, Greg. The closest we’d see to that thinking is from the Greens... and it’s primarily from some of their key figures that I’ve formed the opinion that fuelled my post. Part of the problem, a major part, is that the dominant business model we live under includes media ownership and that shapes public opinion. So people at large aren’t inclined to vote that way... but there is a groundswell and the pandemic lockdowns have contributed to a sharing of ideas around this theme.
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kiwigreg369
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiwigreg369 »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
Come Pat - you're just making up stuff now and whining.
LNP/National party won the last election by gaining more votes than Labour/the opposition. Simples ... people are getting what they voted for, but this is what the majority voted for. Not the alternative.
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Slim 293
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Slim 293 »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(

It's just like Chris Lucas, and all of the other large CBD restaurant moguls and all their heavy financial backers and their connections to the LNP, who all systematically underpaid their staff for years and years and then cried foul at the prospect of having to compensate them...

And now they're pretending to be the champion of the workers, lobbying to have the hospital sector reopen sooner for the financial and mental well being of the same staff they refused to provide a minimum wage for.
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guy smiley
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by guy smiley »

kiwigreg369 wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:21 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
Come Pat - you're just making up stuff now and whining.
LNP/National party won the last election by gaining more votes than Labour/the opposition. Simples ... people are getting what they voted for, but this is what the majority voted for. Not the alternative.
I’ll query you on that mate... without checking the AEC website I think you’ll find more people voted for the Greens than National, yet the Nats get more seats and a place in government. Likewise... pretty much the same number of votes are cast for the Libs as the ALP... but coalition rules. If the ALP and the Greens decided to partner up and share representation in the same way the Coalition do they likely sweep the floor.
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

Slim 293 wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:24 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(

It's just like Chris Lucas, and all of the other large CBD restaurant moguls and all their heavy financial backers and their connections to the LNP, who all systematically underpaid their staff for years and years and then cried foul at the prospect of having to compensate them...

And now they're pretending to be the champion of the workers, lobbying to have the hospital sector reopen sooner for the financial and mental well being of the same staff they refused to provide a minimum wage for.
Yep, it's a long con but they are on it
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

kiwigreg369 wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:21 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
Come Pat - you're just making up stuff now and whining.
LNP/National party won the last election by gaining more votes than Labour/the opposition. Simples ... people are getting what they voted for, but this is what the majority voted for. Not the alternative.
I think you need to educate yourself better on how the electorates are formed and votes allocated here.

Guy is right about distribution vs seats

It's like how Darren Chester kept banging on about how the Government was elected by the people on a mandate.to NOT meet the Paris Agreement.

Nothing of the sort was ever mentioned prior to the election by the LNP and it is a straight out lie
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kiap
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiap »

guy smiley wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:26 am
kiwigreg369 wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:21 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
Come Pat - you're just making up stuff now and whining.
LNP/National party won the last election by gaining more votes than Labour/the opposition. Simples ... people are getting what they voted for, but this is what the majority voted for. Not the alternative.
I’ll query you on that mate... without checking the AEC website I think you’ll find more people voted for the Greens than National, yet the Nats get more seats and a place in government. Likewise... pretty much the same number of votes are cast for the Libs as the ALP... but coalition rules. If the ALP and the Greens decided to partner up and share representation in the same way the Coalition do they likely sweep the floor.
I think this post is deluded, GS. On multiple fronts.
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Ali's Choice
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

guy smiley wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:26 am
kiwigreg369 wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:21 am
Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:41 am I too fond it ironic that the loudest voices for "Blame" are those would most likely live, and vote in LNP heartlands.

Those responsible for the McJob culture that is the root of so many of our issues (and not just Covid).

But that's ok, they are doing alright :(
Come Pat - you're just making up stuff now and whining.
LNP/National party won the last election by gaining more votes than Labour/the opposition. Simples ... people are getting what they voted for, but this is what the majority voted for. Not the alternative.
I’ll query you on that mate... without checking the AEC website I think you’ll find more people voted for the Greens than National, yet the Nats get more seats and a place in government. Likewise... pretty much the same number of votes are cast for the Libs as the ALP... but coalition rules. If the ALP and the Greens decided to partner up and share representation in the same way the Coalition do they likely sweep the floor.
% of Lower House votes in the 2019 Aus Federal Electio

Libs (+LNP in QLD) = 36.66%
ALP = 33.34%
Greens = 10.4%
National = 4.51%

So the ALP and Greens (43.74%) received more votes than the Libs and Nats (41.17%). The problem is that they don't preference each other consistently (a bug chunk of wealthy, inner city Greens preferences go to the Libs) and also 6.51% of people voted for KAP, PUP and One Nation, and their preferences almost all went to the Libs or Nats and ultimately decided the election. Keeping in mind the Coalition only have a 1 seat majority in the Lower House.
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

A lot of the Greens votes do preference the ALP.

The Nationals have a disproportionate impact from their votes

And Greg works with numbers :blush: :lol:
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kiap
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiap »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote: Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:59 am A lot of the Greens votes do preference the ALP.

The Nationals have a disproportionate impact from their votes

And Greg works with numbers :blush: :lol:
The Nats only run in something like 20 seats because, despite the name, they're not a national party. Zero chance of forming govt without an alliance deal.

Same as the Greens for the forseeable. They'll run in all 151 seats and pick up a gross of small packets but won't get close enough in even 5% of seats.

For the government to change, the ball is the ALP's court.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiwigreg369 »

I'm happy with my numbers Pat, 1, but it's clearly words that fail me (votes vs. electorates).
Let's just go with LNP/Nats won.

To a point made above - the ball is in ALP court (again).
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ellafan »

If you bring in a Hare-Clark type proportional system, you still get redistribution of excluded candidate votes within electoral districts. Maybe the excluded green vote would go to labour, maybe not. But Kiap's comment above about the NP only contesting a limited number of seats will still apply in multiple representative country districts. The most popular Nat candidate's excess votes are redistributed once s/he hits the quorum %, and you would think they will distribute to other Nat candidates.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

The Nats are extremely successful at what they do. They hold seats in some of the poorest, most economically and socially disadvantaged seats in Australia where unemployment is rising and social services are declining. I was Principal at a school in Charleville for 2 years, and the town was dying before your very eyes. The main street was random collection of 'For Sale' signs, vacant shop fronts and job recruitment agencies. There was a discernible smell of death in the town. Yet the town and electorate always voted National and everyone I met proudly told me they would continue to vote Nationals till the day they died, despite the obvious neglect and decay the town was suffering. In many places, the Nationals are more like a cult than a political party.
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shanky
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

You must have loved that

You, doing your Blackboard jungle routine

And them not giving a shit.

:lol:
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:33 am You must have loved that

You, doing your Poitier Blackboard jungle routine

And them not giving a shit.

:lol:
I've enjoyed everywhere I've lived and worked. There are some amazing people living in Southwest QLD. My post was simply a commentary on the loyalty of the Nats voting block, regardless of how little their state and Federal MP's actually seem to be doing for them. They vote the way their parents and grandparents voted, and their children and grand children will vote the same way. The toughest election in any of these seats is the pre-selection battle when a sitting MP retires, because once you have the seat it's yours for life.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

So, you’re telling me you didn’t try and get them to form an ice-hockey team?
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:40 am So, you’re telling me you didn’t try and get them to form an ice-hockey team?
Weird comment. Are you Sluggy'ed?
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

It’s not weird if you get the reference
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 9:43 am It’s not weird if you get the reference
Alas, I'm a pleb. Sorry, your talents are wasted on me :blush:
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

Mighty Ducks

And others of the genre....

:thumbup:
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ellafan »

In good news for Ali,the travel shut down means there are 30,000 picking jobs up for grabs as harvest time arrives, in the absence of the usual itinerant workers. Many of those are in Qld, so people can get out in the sunshine, stop being depressed, do some exercise, and get paid for being there.

A win for them, and a win for Qld.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

Meanwhile the MUA wants 6% a year payrise, in Covid...

But have generously offered to reduce that to 2.5%, once it became clear that holding up medical supplies wasn't going to go down very well

All on top of the 174k p.a average wage of a wharfie

And they wonder why your average man in the street thinks unions are cunce
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:02 pm Meanwhile the MUA wants 6% a year payrise, in Covid...

But have generously offered to reduce that to 2.5%, once it became clear that holding up medical supplies wasn't going to go down very well

All on top of the 174k p.a average wage of a wharfie

And they wonder why your average man in the street thinks unions are cunce
Now you just trolling. No ships or medical supplies are being held up, ScoMo lied to us when he said 40 ships are waiting in Botany Bay. The unions want a tiny, 2.5% increase. The company is of course highly profitable and its executives just awarded themselves 10's of millions in bonuses.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ellafan »

Ali's Choice wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:10 pm
shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:02 pm Meanwhile the MUA wants 6% a year payrise, in Covid...

But have generously offered to reduce that to 2.5%, once it became clear that holding up medical supplies wasn't going to go down very well

All on top of the 174k p.a average wage of a wharfie

And they wonder why your average man in the street thinks unions are cunce
Now you just trolling. No ships or medical supplies are being held up, ScoMo lied to us when he said 40 ships are waiting in Botany Bay. The unions want a tiny, 2.5% increase. The company is of course highly profitable and its executives just awarded themselves 10's of millions in bonuses.
174k x 2.5% = a mere $4350 per annum.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

sadly, no semi-objective review of the facts seems to support your parroting of the Union line
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

Ellafan wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:29 pm
Ali's Choice wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:10 pm
shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:02 pm Meanwhile the MUA wants 6% a year payrise, in Covid...

But have generously offered to reduce that to 2.5%, once it became clear that holding up medical supplies wasn't going to go down very well

All on top of the 174k p.a average wage of a wharfie

And they wonder why your average man in the street thinks unions are cunce
Now you just trolling. No ships or medical supplies are being held up, ScoMo lied to us when he said 40 ships are waiting in Botany Bay. The unions want a tiny, 2.5% increase. The company is of course highly profitable and its executives just awarded themselves 10's of millions in bonuses.
174k x 2.5% = a mere $4350 per annum.
So only the company's executives can get payrises plus tens of millions in annual bonuses?
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:29 pm sadly, no semi-objective review of the facts seems to support your parroting of the Union line
You haven't mentioned any facts. You've simply regurgitated lies from News ltd. You're a sheeple.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

The 6% is a matter of public record, until reduced to merely 5x the last years CPI amount today as part of a ‘peace deal’

The 38 ships delayed/waiting is also a matter of semi-fact (inasmuch as the data comes from the Company)
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:40 pm The 6% is a matter of public record, until reduced to merely 5x the last years CPI amount today as part of a ‘peace deal’

The 38 ships delayed/waiting is also a matter of semi-fact (inasmuch as the data comes from the Company)
I watched an interview with the union yesterday and they were asking for 2.5%. And there were 4 ships waiting to unload in Botany Bay today, which i'm told is normal.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

I see...
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

shanky wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 12:53 pm I see...

here's a twitter thread you might find useful outlining the key issues involved in this IR dispute, including rolling screenshots from ship tracking apps showing ships in botany bay throughout the day, which numbered between 0 and 5.

https://mobile.twitter.com/MichaelPasco ... 8417421320
Last edited by Ali's Choice on Wed Sep 30, 2020 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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shanky
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by shanky »

The company has said the 38 ships are waiting. Not all in Botany. Many are in international waters

I didn’t get the info from ScMo.

I said it was semi-factual. Thereby noting it’s compromised source. On the basis that the Company might exaggerate. I doubt they would simply make the number up.

I take the Union’s word for it, for example, when they say that the 2.5% claim is a ‘peace deal’ instead of the rampant climb down that it might look to the average person
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Brumbie_Steve »

I thought the claim was for 6% over 4 years which is the same deal that was agreed to by the other major port operator in the country. How dare wharfies get compensated for the disruption that their employment causes in their life. They don't work 40 hours a week 9 to 5.

We have Patricks' creating an issue with their labour force cheered on by the LNP. How long before we have a sustained attack on workplace standards in the name of economic recovery? Coming soon from an IPA sponsored LNP politician real soon. If things start to look like labour might win there will be balaclava wearing scabs behind armed security guards. This is the same moves that the same players made last time.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Ali's Choice »

So the ongoing Royal Commission into Aged Care has released a scathing and damning report into the way aged care facilities have managed covid-19, pointing the finger squarely at the Federal govt.
Royal commission demands additional staff in aged care immediately
By Julie Power and Dana McCauley
Updated October 1, 2020 — 6.49pmfirst published at 5.09pm


The Aged Care Royal Commission has called on the federal government to immediately fund additional staff in aged care facilities, and has criticised the government's lack of a dedicated plan or clear leadership which left families and facilities wondering who was in charge.

On Thursday, the commission made six recommendations, including the establishment of an aged care advisory body and a COVID plan for the sector which would include protocols between state and federal governments to remove confusion.

All too often, the commissioners said in the report, families, providers and health care workers "did not have an answer to the critical question: Who is in charge?"

Commissioner Tony Pagone and Lynelle Briggs said levels of depression, anxiety, confusion, loneliness and suicide risk among aged care residents have increased since lockdowns began in March which resulted in most families being unable to visit.

Two recommendations address the "tragic, irreparable and lasting effects" of the restriction of visits. These include more funding for staff so families can visit loved ones in care and measures to provide mental health services to those residents whose mental health has suffered.

In the special report on the impact on the impact of the pandemic on aged care tabled in Parliament on Thursday, the commissioners say COVID-19 is a public health crisis that has disproportionately affected aged care in Australia.

The Morrison government yesterday accepted the six recommendations. Aged Care Minister Richard Colbeck announced an initial $40.6 million in immediate funding, and agreed to the commission's first recommendation that the government respond by December 1.

He would not say how much more the government would spend, but described the recommendations as "quite constructive". But he rejected the commission's claim the government lacked a plan.

Senator Colbeck said the government would also provide extra funding to help aged care residents access allied health services during the pandemic. It would also bring forward the start date of the serious incident response scheme to 2021, which was first recommended by the Australian Law Reform Commission almost four years ago.

Commissioners Pagone and Briggs said they were releasing the special report now "because, although no-one knows how long the pandemic will last, aged care residents continue to suffer and, tragically, more may die as a result of COVID-19".

"There is too much at stake to apportion blame at this time. However, the public needs to know what lessons have been, and can still be, learnt."

The commissioners also said much was "made during the hearing of whether there was an aged care-specific plan for COVID-19".

They conclude: "There was not a COVID-19 plan devoted solely to aged care. But there was a national COVID-19 plan that the Australian Government sought to adapt and apply to the aged care sector."

The commissioners said the key decision-making authority for national emergencies, the Australian Health Protection Principal Committee, the AHPPC, had released a statement in March warning that COVID-19 posed a significant health risk particularly for the elderly and individuals with co-morbidities or low immunity.

But this wasn't enough. "While the AHPPC acknowledged this significant issue, it is now clear that the measures implemented by the Australian Government on advice from the AHPPC were in some respects insufficient to ensure preparedness of the aged care sector," they said.

The commissioners also heard evidence that "confused and inconsistent messaging from providers, the Australian Government, and State and Territory governments emerged as themes in the submissions."

The commission also recommended that the government require providers to appoint infection control officers and arrange for the deployment of accredited infection prevention and control experts into residential aged care homes.

The minister also announced an additional $10.8 million "to enhance skills and leadership of aged care nurses" by expanding the Australian College of Nursing scholarship program, establishing an aged care practice program and creating "skills development programs for nurses and personal care workers in aged care".

It starts with recommendations to restore physical connection between older people in aged care homes and their families and friends because "older people must always be at the heart of the aged care sector and of any response to any event affecting their physical and mental wellbeing."

The report coincides with another two deaths in aged care in Victoria, lifting the number of deaths to 637 in that state alone.

The Federal Opposition said the commission’s special report on COVID-19 showed that the Morrison Government had no plan for COVID-19 in aged care. "The foundations of our country’s aged care system have buckled under the pressure of a deadly disease and the Morrison Government did not do enough to stop it," Opposition spokeswoman Julie Collins said.

Ian Yates, the chief executive of the Council on the Ageing (COTA) Australia, was pleased that the report emphasised the quality of life and wellbeing of residents in aged care.

The commissioners said government had to treat aged care facilities as people's homes.

"This is what COTA has advocated for throughout the COVID-19 pandemic, unfortunately often against strong resistance and even opposition," he said.

“This sentiment is clearly articulated through the recommendations to increase the provision of staff to facilitate visits by family and loved ones, and for the increased provision of health and mental health services through the Medical Benefits Scheme, which must also be implemented immediately," said Mr Yates.

Others welcomed the government's swift response: Catholic Health said it knew delays could have "tragic consequences on this vulnerable cohort of society." Pat Sparrow, CEO of Aged & Community Services Australia (ACSA) said they were "fantastic recommendations to safeguard aged care from the pandemic and the government should adopt them urgently".

The Aged Care commission will release its final report in February next year.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/royal-c ... 560l6.html
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiwigreg369 »

I suspect others will disagree but based on that report to me By not having a dedicated aged care plan for COVID - given the clear evidence of risk to those in aged care - the minister has not acted in a reasonable way and not taken reasonable steps.

Colbeck - either now or in the short term after rectifying the major problems - should be accountable for the failings her and resigned/ be removed from role.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Farva »

kiwigreg369 wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 8:52 pm I suspect others will disagree but based on that report to me By not having a dedicated aged care plan for COVID - given the clear evidence of risk to those in aged care - the minister has not acted in a reasonable way and not taken reasonable steps.

Colbeck - either now or in the short term after rectifying the major problems - should be accountable for the failings her and resigned/ be removed from role.
Sure, but I don’t think Scott Morrison should resign for it though.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by kiwigreg369 »

Farva wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 10:01 pm
kiwigreg369 wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 8:52 pm I suspect others will disagree but based on that report to me By not having a dedicated aged care plan for COVID - given the clear evidence of risk to those in aged care - the minister has not acted in a reasonable way and not taken reasonable steps.

Colbeck - either now or in the short term after rectifying the major problems - should be accountable for the failings her and resigned/ be removed from role.
Sure, but I don’t think Scott Morrison should resign for it though.
For me that would depend on whether he had any direct involvement, direct accountability, and/or the scale of the issue is so big.

I still am of the opinion than Dan Andrews is a lot more accountability for the failings in Victoria than ScoMo is on aged care/ national response to COVID.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread

Post by Farva »

kiwigreg369 wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 10:10 pm
Farva wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 10:01 pm
kiwigreg369 wrote: Thu Oct 01, 2020 8:52 pm I suspect others will disagree but based on that report to me By not having a dedicated aged care plan for COVID - given the clear evidence of risk to those in aged care - the minister has not acted in a reasonable way and not taken reasonable steps.

Colbeck - either now or in the short term after rectifying the major problems - should be accountable for the failings her and resigned/ be removed from role.
Sure, but I don’t think Scott Morrison should resign for it though.
For me that would depend on whether he had any direct involvement, direct accountability, and/or the scale of the issue is so big.

I still am of the opinion than Dan Andrews is a lot more accountability for the failings in Victoria than ScoMo is on aged care/ national response to COVID.
I just can’t agree.
Why would Scott Morrison not be accountable as leader of the government but Dan Andrews is (for the record I don’t think either are, well both are accountable in a way but neither should go).
However, my reading of the article is that the findings in the aged care commission was that there just wasn’t a plan in place, and it cost nearly 700 lives.
It would be akin to no quarantine procedures being put in place and people just told to quarantine. That is for me negligence. The hotel quarantine issue is that they put in place a plan that was appropriate but those in charge of implementing it did poorly. I’m inclined to give them more slack.
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