NZ Politics Thread

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booji boy
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

naki wrote:A Penrose gun shop this morning.

Image

Watch your six out there, bros
WTAF???

That is frightening.
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Gordon Bennett
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Gordon Bennett »

Seneca of the Night wrote:I wonder what the process is for rolling any of this back. The UK has a genuine classically Liberal PM who understands this. There are also ancient safeguards for liberty (no bicycle helmet law for example being part of this). The US has its constitution. With ChCh and now this, Jacinda has rolled back more liberty in NZ than any PM since WW2 and probably ever. It's probably the wrong party to be in charge. With a knowledge of history and political philosophy not much above any average 15 year old, it will be interesting to see how Jacinda handles giving NZers back their liberities. The rule in these cases tends to be that it's easy to take away, very hard to give back, and really really hard to get back.
So, let me get this straight. Because Jacinda has the 'history and political philosophy' of a 15-year-old (righto mate) she's not going to roll back these impingements on civil liberties?

Yeah - she's going to keep us all at home locked down because of the Labour need for a 'nanny state'.

What a load of complete and utter spurious bollocks.

Obviously I'm taking the hyperbolic approach to your comments, much as you've taken a madly hypermegabolic approach to the Government's philosophy thus far, but which specific civil liberties which have been pegged back due to Coronavirus do you think Labour would have any interest at all in retaining? The two bog rolls per transaction one? Or the no travelling around the country one?
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Flockwitt
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Flockwitt »

Gordon Bennett wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:I wonder what the process is for rolling any of this back. The UK has a genuine classically Liberal PM who understands this. There are also ancient safeguards for liberty (no bicycle helmet law for example being part of this). The US has its constitution. With ChCh and now this, Jacinda has rolled back more liberty in NZ than any PM since WW2 and probably ever. It's probably the wrong party to be in charge. With a knowledge of history and political philosophy not much above any average 15 year old, it will be interesting to see how Jacinda handles giving NZers back their liberities. The rule in these cases tends to be that it's easy to take away, very hard to give back, and really really hard to get back.
So, let me get this straight. Because Jacinda has the 'history and political philosophy' of a 15-year-old (righto mate) she's not going to roll back these impingements on civil liberties?

Yeah - she's going to keep us all at home locked down because of the Labour need for a 'nanny state'.

What a load of complete and utter spurious bollocks.

Obviously I'm taking the hyperbolic approach to your comments, much as you've taken a madly hypermegabolic approach to the Government's philosophy thus far, but which specific civil liberties which have been pegged back due to Coronavirus do you think Labour would have any interest at all in retaining? The two bog rolls per transaction one? Or the no travelling around the country one?
House arrest ankle bracelets are due next week. More than 50m from your abode and it’ll auto tie your shoe laces together.
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JPNZ
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by JPNZ »

Just submitted my companies wage subsidy claim from Jacinda and Grant

$578,000

:smug:
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Kahu
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Kahu »

After seeing the behaviour of Mongrel Mob members in Napier Pak n Sav over Facebook this morning I don't blame people for lining up for guns n ammo
obelixtim
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by obelixtim »

Kahu wrote:After seeing the behaviour of Mongrel Mob members in Napier Pak n Sav over Facebook this morning I don't blame people for lining up for guns n ammo
What was that about?
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deadduck
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by deadduck »

Found out today my work is essential

Good news?
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Tehui
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Tehui »

deadduck wrote:Found out today my work is essential

Good news?
Porn movie actor?
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UncleFB
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by UncleFB »

booji boy wrote:
naki wrote:A Penrose gun shop this morning.

Image

Watch your six out there, bros
WTAF???

That is frightening.
I was hoping there was a, whatever the NZ equivalent of Centrelink is called these days, right next door.

That's fucked up, great for the Police to have to see that.
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Dark
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Dark »

naki wrote:A Penrose gun shop this morning.

Image

Watch your six out there, bros

You have to love the dude who dragged his kid along.

Looking at it I never realised how close to the front I was

Seemed a longer cue

(Im joking!!)
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Kahu
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Kahu »

obelixtim wrote:
Kahu wrote:After seeing the behaviour of Mongrel Mob members in Napier Pak n Sav over Facebook this morning I don't blame people for lining up for guns n ammo
What was that about?
Lowlife scum being lowlife scum and assaulting someone then threatening bystanders who tried to intervene
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deadduck
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by deadduck »

Tehui wrote:
deadduck wrote:Found out today my work is essential

Good news?
Porn movie actor?
Some BS about cancer meds
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Enzedder
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 48hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Enzedder »

JPNZ wrote:Just submitted my companies wage subsidy claim from Jacinda and Grant

$578,000

:smug:

$75k GST plus the balance is taxable income. The lord giveth and the lord taketh away.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

Jacinda Ardern announces mortgage holiday for affected workers
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12319343

So home-owing workers affected by Covid-19 get the wage subsidy and they don't have to pay the major part of their cost of living for six months.

Meanwhile affected families who rent get no such holiday.

What am I missing here?
Last edited by Muttonbirds on Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Flockwitt
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Flockwitt »

See they’ve changed the school holidays to be 30th March to 14th April.
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deadduck
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by deadduck »

Muttonbirds wrote:
Jacinda Ardern announces mortgage holiday for affected workers
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12319343

So home-owing workers affected by Covid-19 get the wage subsidy and they don't have to pay the major part of their cost of living for six months.

Meanwhile affected families who rent get no such holiday.

What am I missing here?
Mortgage holders may get holiday from making repayments but the amount of money they owe isn't going to go down. In fact, they'll likely still get charged interest and it will end up costing more in the long run

Renters aren't affected by that for obvious reasons. A "rent holiday" would be essentially free rent, which ain't going to happen
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

deadduck wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
Jacinda Ardern announces mortgage holiday for affected workers
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12319343

So home-owing workers affected by Covid-19 get the wage subsidy and they don't have to pay the major part of their cost of living for six months.

Meanwhile affected families who rent get no such holiday.

What am I missing here?
Mortgage holders may get holiday from making repayments but the amount of money they owe isn't going to go down. In fact, they'll likely still get charged interest and it will end up costing more in the long run

Renters aren't affected by that for obvious reasons. A "rent holiday" would be essentially free rent, which ain't going to happen
But renters will still have to struggle with making rent payments every week at a time when very little income is coming in. Affected homeowners will not have to do that at this acute time.

This is the crucial time with very high stress in low income households. One section of society is given a huge breather while another is not.

That is a huge imbalance.
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deadduck
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by deadduck »

Muttonbirds wrote:
deadduck wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
Jacinda Ardern announces mortgage holiday for affected workers
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12319343

So home-owing workers affected by Covid-19 get the wage subsidy and they don't have to pay the major part of their cost of living for six months.

Meanwhile affected families who rent get no such holiday.

What am I missing here?
Mortgage holders may get holiday from making repayments but the amount of money they owe isn't going to go down. In fact, they'll likely still get charged interest and it will end up costing more in the long run

Renters aren't affected by that for obvious reasons. A "rent holiday" would be essentially free rent, which ain't going to happen
But renters will still have to struggle with making rent payments every week at a time when very little income is coming in. Affected homeowners will not have to do that at this acute time.

This is the crucial time with very high stress in low income households. One section of society is given a huge breather while another is not.

That is a huge imbalance.
There's a different mechanism for rent relief, such as the accommodation supplement
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

deadduck wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
deadduck wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
Jacinda Ardern announces mortgage holiday for affected workers
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12319343

So home-owing workers affected by Covid-19 get the wage subsidy and they don't have to pay the major part of their cost of living for six months.

Meanwhile affected families who rent get no such holiday.

What am I missing here?
Mortgage holders may get holiday from making repayments but the amount of money they owe isn't going to go down. In fact, they'll likely still get charged interest and it will end up costing more in the long run

Renters aren't affected by that for obvious reasons. A "rent holiday" would be essentially free rent, which ain't going to happen
But renters will still have to struggle with making rent payments every week at a time when very little income is coming in. Affected homeowners will not have to do that at this acute time.

This is the crucial time with very high stress in low income households. One section of society is given a huge breather while another is not.

That is a huge imbalance.
There's a different mechanism for rent relief, such as the accommodation supplement
Average rent in Auckland for a three bedroom house is about $600/week. The accomodation supplement wouldn't cover 1/5th of that.

Mortgage holders don't have to pay a cent at this critical time.

That is a staggering discrepancy to the way people are treated, and kick in the guts for those at the bottom, as it ever was.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Fat Old Git »

A good percentage of landlords will still have mortgages to pay on the rental property. Would they get a mortgage holiday if there was a rent holiday. What about rates, insurances and all of the other expenses related to the rental property?
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

Fat Old Git wrote:A good percentage of landlords will still have mortgages to pay on the rental property. Would they get a mortgage holiday if there was a rent holiday. What about rates, insurances and all of the other expenses related to the rental property?
Presumably they would get a mortgage holiday because they will have been affected by the shutdown - affected in this case by the tenant not paying/not being able to pay rent.

My point is that one section of society has been offered massive relief around the most expensive part of the cost of living while another section of society has been offered no relief in the same area.

Needs to be sorted out pronto, I think.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by eugenius »

Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
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JPNZ
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by JPNZ »

eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Safe travels home :thumbup:
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by sonic_attack »

I don't know why you left it so long. The warning was drop what you're doing and get on the next plane available.
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booji boy
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
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booji boy
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Good luck Dude!

Glad you're getting out of Dodge now rather than waiting to the 29th per your original plan.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Enzedder »

Fat Old Git wrote:A good percentage of landlords will still have mortgages to pay on the rental property. Would they get a mortgage holiday if there was a rent holiday. What about rates, insurances and all of the other expenses related to the rental property?

I was working with a client yesterday. She had started work but as of yesterday is back on a benefit and will receive just $60 more than her rent. We wrote to the landlord and informed them how much she could pay ($200 instead of $320) and she will borrow the balance from Work and Income when this whole mess is over.

Thankfully, over 70 AirBnB houses went onto the rental market in the area recently so the house pressure is easing - the landlord agreed.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

booji boy wrote:If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
That's fine but again not the point. The point is the huge discrepancy in what two different sets of mostly low income people have to face in terms of costs at this crucial time.

It is also not much comfort for tenants wondering whether their landlord is the benevolent kind or not. There needs to be more certainty that that.
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booji boy
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

Muttonbirds wrote:
booji boy wrote:If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
That's fine but again not the point. The point is the huge discrepancy in what two different sets of mostly low income people have to face in terms of costs at this crucial time.

It is also not much comfort for tenants wondering whether their landlord is the benevolent kind or not. There needs to be more certainty that that.
Yeah I get what your saying. Mortgage relief for homeowners but no rent relief for renters.
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Ghost-Of-Nepia
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Ghost-Of-Nepia »

sonic_attack wrote:I don't know why you left it so long. The warning was drop what you're doing and get on the next plane available.
Because no one tells eugenius how to holiday, maaaan.
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booji boy
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

On another note that psychologist Nigel Latta has been on TV all day telling us how to cope with the crisis. I can't stand him anyway but my God what an annoying, patronizing twat!
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Enzedder »

eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Eug - in case you haven't heard. You will have to do your 2 weeks isolation in the city where you land so I hope it's Chch.
obelixtim
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by obelixtim »

Muttonbirds wrote:
booji boy wrote:If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
That's fine but again not the point. The point is the huge discrepancy in what two different sets of mostly low income people have to face in terms of costs at this crucial time.

It is also not much comfort for tenants wondering whether their landlord is the benevolent kind or not. There needs to be more certainty that that.
I thought they put some protections in place for tenants. Like no rent increases, and no evictions. So the renter and landlord can come to some agreement about the amount they can afford, and maybe pay the owed amount after the crisis is over.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Muttonbirds »

obelixtim wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
booji boy wrote:If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
That's fine but again not the point. The point is the huge discrepancy in what two different sets of mostly low income people have to face in terms of costs at this crucial time.

It is also not much comfort for tenants wondering whether their landlord is the benevolent kind or not. There needs to be more certainty that that.
I thought they put some protections in place for tenants. Like no rent increases, and no evictions. So the renter and landlord can come to some agreement about the amount they can afford, and maybe pay the owed amount after the crisis is over.
Still not the holiday homeowners have been offered. This also relies on some pretty uncertain negotiations between tenant (the powerless) and landlord (the clue is in the name) as I said above.

And what would happen at the end of this reduce rent period when the tenant then has to stump up thousands in back pay forcing already crippled families into massive private debt?

The government needs to balance things up or it could get ugly.

They are not going to pay people's rent so it might have to be if you claim the mortgage holiday then you are not eligible for the wage relief package or at least only eligible for a fraction of it.
merlin the happy pig
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by merlin the happy pig »

Muttonbirds wrote:
obelixtim wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
booji boy wrote:If my tenant falls on hard times during this crisis I will be happy to negotiate a lower weekly rent. Not sure about a rent holiday unless it is forced on us but certainly open to lowering the rent to keep a roof over their heads.
That's fine but again not the point. The point is the huge discrepancy in what two different sets of mostly low income people have to face in terms of costs at this crucial time.

It is also not much comfort for tenants wondering whether their landlord is the benevolent kind or not. There needs to be more certainty that that.
I thought they put some protections in place for tenants. Like no rent increases, and no evictions. So the renter and landlord can come to some agreement about the amount they can afford, and maybe pay the owed amount after the crisis is over.
Still not the holiday which homeowners have been offered. This also relies on some pretty uncertain negotiations between tenant (the powerless) and landlord (the clue is in the name) as I said above.

And what would happen at the end of this reduce rent period when the tenant then has to stump up thousands in back pay forcing already crippled families into massive private debt?

No, government need to balance thing up or it could get ugly.
There's almost certainly a strong correlation between those unable to work from home and those who are renting, even as a recent Nat voter it seems unconscionable that the working class bear the brunt of this crisis.

As an aside it would be interesting trying to evict someone when there is a lockdown. Who would enforce it if the tenant said "Suck a big fat one"?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Kiwias »

eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Have a safe flight, mate. Still pissed off about not getting to watch the rugby with you.
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Kiwias
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Kiwias »

booji boy wrote:
eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Good luck Dude!

Glad you're getting out of Dodge now rather than waiting to the 29th per your original plan.
Oi!!!!! I'm still in Dodge, you know
:x :x :x
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by Auckman »

Muttonbirds brings up a good point. Tenants are going to be shafted; either owing massive amounts in rent or kicked out after the lockdown period is over.

Would a situation where mass unemployment leads to mass tenant evictions lead to a collapse of the rental market?
merlin the happy pig
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by merlin the happy pig »

Auckman wrote:Muttonbirds brings up a good point. Tenants are going to be shafted; either owing massive amounts in rent or kicked out after the lockdown period is over.

Would a situation where mass unemployment leads to mass tenant evictions lead to a collapse of the rental market?
And/Or a spate of GBH.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread - 33hrs to Lockdown!

Post by booji boy »

Kiwias wrote:
booji boy wrote:
eugenius wrote:Jesus - talk about last heli out of Saigon !

On the bullet train enroute to Narita airport to fly home .

Pushed it for as long as we could but Im not gambling against the obvious flow of events .

Air NZ pretty darn good service .
Good luck Dude!

Glad you're getting out of Dodge now rather than waiting to the 29th per your original plan.
Oi!!!!! I'm still in Dodge, you know
:x :x :x
Yeah but you're a local resident dude not a tourist trying to get home! Big difference. ;)
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