NZ Politics Thread

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Fat Old Git
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

Enzedder wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:Businessmen are more likely to use a door to door taxi service than take the train given the company is usually picking up the tab and time is money.
But if the train service gets rid of a lot of cars from the roads, the taxis will move faster which is the whole point, is it not.

Win-win
That would be a win win. I was just commenting regarding businesspeople actually using it themselves. If the rail option is hoping to get them as their customers then the results are likely to be disappointing.
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Dark
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Dark »

I've yet to hear anyone give a decent explanation how a light train to the airport is going to solve Auckland's traffic issues.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

Dark wrote:I've yet to hear anyone give a decent explanation how a light train to the airport is going to solve Auckland's traffic issues.
Have you read anything about it at all?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

I travel between Auckland airport and the Epsom Newmarket area a lot for work and I've almost never had any issues. I do allow for traffic when booking my return taxi but usually that just gives.me a.bit of extra time to enjoy a beer at the airport.

So I'm not sure how.much impact the rail link will really have. Although I support the idea in principle if done well.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

Fat Old Git wrote:I travel between Auckland airport and the Epsom Newmarket area a lot for work and I've almost never had any issues. I do allow for traffic when booking my return taxi but usually that just gives.me a.bit of extra time to enjoy a beer at the airport.

So I'm not sure how.much impact the rail link will really have. Although I support the idea in principle if done well.
As said in the link I provided, and Auckman’s post, this is about far more than a simple cbd airport connection.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

I'll try and check that out later. On patchy free shopping mall WiFi at the moment watching the wife in her happy place.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by brat »

Wilderbeast wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:I travel between Auckland airport and the Epsom Newmarket area a lot for work and I've almost never had any issues. I do allow for traffic when booking my return taxi but usually that just gives.me a.bit of extra time to enjoy a beer at the airport.

So I'm not sure how.much impact the rail link will really have. Although I support the idea in principle if done well.
As said in the link I provided, and Auckman’s post, this is about far more than a simple cbd airport connection.
That is old information and the airport tram plan has already been debunked as a secondary choice to heavy rail in city/regional plan, not withstanding the crl in all of this

The reason why the nzta didn’t go for heavy was the price tag.. all the other reasons are dubious at best

There’s a place for LR later on as required

I really haven’t got time to debate this now.. maybe at a later date. but I think you should do some more research other than Matt Lowry’s opinion on greater Auckland website

@grouch - you better tell them to stop tunneling for the crl then ..
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Thai guy »

How refreshing it is to hear people like brat advocating for massive public transport infrastructure spending.
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J Man
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by J Man »

When does the budget come out?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Dark »

J Man wrote:When does the budget come out?
2pm today

But Labour have promised that, so it may end up coming out over a 6 month period or not at all
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Auckman »

J Man wrote:When does the budget come out?
All the journos were let in at 10.00am. They are literally locked up in a room poring over the budget documents until 2.00pm. Biggest day of the year for the Beltway.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

I'd like to apologise in advance for Amy Adams and the cretinous comments she'll no doubt make today.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

Christchurch is waiting to see if any of the stuff it was promised unconditionally prior to the election, but which became dependent on the budget post election, will actually happen.

It would be nice to think they could do a better job than Gerry. That really shouldn't be that hard to manage.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

Brownlee still smarting from Orr’s comments I’d say.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by merlin the happy pig »

Fat Old Git wrote:I travel between Auckland airport and the Epsom Newmarket area a lot for work and I've almost never had any issues. I do allow for traffic when booking my return taxi but usually that just gives.me a.bit of extra time to enjoy a beer at the airport.

So I'm not sure how.much impact the rail link will really have. Although I support the idea in principle if done well.
Initially I'd imagine it will suit tourists who wish to spend a few nights downtown, but until other train lines are in place it would be of very little use to Auckland residents, few of whom live in the central city. A moderate amount of residents would consider a short taxi ride to the nearest station to connect to it.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by True Blue »

3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

True Blue wrote:3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.
In convincing labour they need to play by their rules? Yes, agreed.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Dark »

Wilderbeast wrote:
True Blue wrote:3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.
In convincing labour they need to play by their rules? Yes, agreed.

That is about as boring a budget as you can get

It's like one of Nationals during the GFC
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Enzedder »

True Blue wrote:3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.

What??????????????????????????????

I Demand My $11Bn hole.

Or was that another lie? Who am I kidding, of course it freaking was
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

So are they doing all of the extra spending they promised?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Auckman »

THE POLICIES:

• Health: $3.2 billion injection over four years, including $2.2b more for DHBs and $126m for elective surgeries and other areas. $750m for hospital upgrades and rebuilds.

• Cheaper doctor visits for more than 500,000 people. Free GP visits extended to 13-year-olds (56,000 more children). About 540,000 people eligible for Community Services cards will get $20 to $30 cheaper GP visits. Cost $385 m.

• Midwives: $112m more for community midwives, including 8.9 per cent fee increase to level them with DHB midwives.

• Housing: $3.8b to build 6400 more state houses by 2022 and $170m for emergency housing. Insulation subsidies for low-income families. HNZ to borrow $3b.

• Education: $395 million to build new schools and classrooms. Includes $62 million for Christchurch schools rebuild and $332m nationwide.

• Education: $650m for schools. Includes $204m more for a 1.6 per cent increase to schools' operational funding and to cover school roll growth.

• $370m to fund 1500 new teacher places 2021 ($70m more than National funded).

• Early childhood education: $590m to fund more places and a 1.6 per cent funding increase for ECE centres from January 2019.

• Police: $300 mill for 920 more police officers and 240 support staff.

• Defence: $367.7m in extra operating funding to the Defence and Veterans portfolios over the next four years, underpinned by an extra $324.1m for the NZDF operating budget. Also, $42.3m in new capital funding for modernisation.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

Enzedder wrote:
True Blue wrote:3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.

What??????????????????????????????

I Demand My $11Bn hole.

Or was that another lie? Who am I kidding, of course it freaking was
They've buried all the borrowing in the books of Crown entities. Very sneky
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

deadduck wrote:It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
The government is committed to bringing down debt. You need a surplus to achieve that.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

deadduck wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
True Blue wrote:3.1b surplus expected to rise to 7b by 2022. Excellent job by National.

What??????????????????????????????

I Demand My $11Bn hole.

Or was that another lie? Who am I kidding, of course it freaking was
They've buried all the borrowing in the books of Crown entities. Very sneky
That’s a treasury call and, according to their presentation today, is how they’ve always done it.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

Auckman wrote:
THE POLICIES:

• Health: $3.2 billion injection over four years, including $2.2b more for DHBs and $126m for elective surgeries and other areas. $750m for hospital upgrades and rebuilds.

• Cheaper doctor visits for more than 500,000 people. Free GP visits extended to 13-year-olds (56,000 more children). About 540,000 people eligible for Community Services cards will get $20 to $30 cheaper GP visits. Cost $385 m.

• Midwives: $112m more for community midwives, including 8.9 per cent fee increase to level them with DHB midwives.

• Housing: $3.8b to build 6400 more state houses by 2022 and $170m for emergency housing. Insulation subsidies for low-income families. HNZ to borrow $3b.

• Education: $395 million to build new schools and classrooms. Includes $62 million for Christchurch schools rebuild and $332m nationwide.

• Education: $650m for schools. Includes $204m more for a 1.6 per cent increase to schools' operational funding and to cover school roll growth.

• $370m to fund 1500 new teacher places 2021 ($70m more than National funded).

• Early childhood education: $590m to fund more places and a 1.6 per cent funding increase for ECE centres from January 2019.

• Police: $300 mill for 920 more police officers and 240 support staff.

• Defence: $367.7m in extra operating funding to the Defence and Veterans portfolios over the next four years, underpinned by an extra $324.1m for the NZDF operating budget. Also, $42.3m in new capital funding for modernisation.
How much of this will be a real increase in services as opposed to keeping up with increased costs and demands? Is there a breakdown of that?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

Wilderbeast wrote:
deadduck wrote:It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
The government is committed to bringing down debt. You need a surplus to achieve that.
The two aren't mutually exclusive

There's been a lot of talk from Labour about the squeeze on middle NZ, alleviating bracket creep is one thing the Govt could do with the stroke of a pen.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Auckman »

Fat Old Git wrote:
How much of this will be a real increase in services as opposed to keeping up with increased costs and demands? Is there a breakdown of that?
No idea. It's all over the media at the moment so there will be a breakdown somewhere.

The $300 million for Christchurch became official today though.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

Fat Old Git wrote:
Auckman wrote:
THE POLICIES:

• Health: $3.2 billion injection over four years, including $2.2b more for DHBs and $126m for elective surgeries and other areas. $750m for hospital upgrades and rebuilds.

• Cheaper doctor visits for more than 500,000 people. Free GP visits extended to 13-year-olds (56,000 more children). About 540,000 people eligible for Community Services cards will get $20 to $30 cheaper GP visits. Cost $385 m.

• Midwives: $112m more for community midwives, including 8.9 per cent fee increase to level them with DHB midwives.

• Housing: $3.8b to build 6400 more state houses by 2022 and $170m for emergency housing. Insulation subsidies for low-income families. HNZ to borrow $3b.

• Education: $395 million to build new schools and classrooms. Includes $62 million for Christchurch schools rebuild and $332m nationwide.

• Education: $650m for schools. Includes $204m more for a 1.6 per cent increase to schools' operational funding and to cover school roll growth.

• $370m to fund 1500 new teacher places 2021 ($70m more than National funded).

• Early childhood education: $590m to fund more places and a 1.6 per cent funding increase for ECE centres from January 2019.

• Police: $300 mill for 920 more police officers and 240 support staff.

• Defence: $367.7m in extra operating funding to the Defence and Veterans portfolios over the next four years, underpinned by an extra $324.1m for the NZDF operating budget. Also, $42.3m in new capital funding for modernisation.
How much of this will be a real increase in services as opposed to keeping up with increased costs and demands? Is there a breakdown of that?
Indeed, the $3.2 billion for health over four years is pretty much the same as the much maligned Jonathan Coleman achieved in last year's budget, unless this is on top of that?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

deadduck wrote:
Wilderbeast wrote:
deadduck wrote:It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
The government is committed to bringing down debt. You need a surplus to achieve that.
The two aren't mutually exclusive

There's been a lot of talk from Labour about the squeeze on middle NZ, alleviating bracket creep is one thing the Govt could do with the stroke of a pen.
They could, but lessening the tax burden is not seen as a priority for this government. That was made abundantly clear at the election with Labour campaigning on increased spending on social services and national campaigning on tax cuts.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

How much of the top up last year was the pay equity settlement?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by deadduck »

Bracket adjustments aren't tax cuts, they just maintain status quo. Without them, taxpayers face ever increasing tax burdens. That's unfair on taxpayers and unreasonable from the government.
In 2 years time in the run up to the next election when Ardern and Robertson are crowing about Labour's economic management it might well be possible that about 40% of NZ earners are paying in the top tax bracket.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

deadduck wrote:Bracket adjustments aren't tax cuts, they just maintain status quo. Without them, taxpayers face ever increasing tax burdens. That's unfair on taxpayers and unreasonable from the government.
In 2 years time in the run up to the next election when Ardern and Robertson are crowing about Labour's economic management it might well be possible that about 40% of NZ earners are paying in the top tax bracket.
You’re right, but in the political world you’re wrong. Ongoing funding never takes inflation into account. Instead, the govt of the day announces the “new” funding to much fanfare. It’s the same for taxes. Why give up an opportunity to claim a win for your government?

The greens supported indexing funding to inflation (chasing the moral high ground again). Doubt they’d go as far as to index tax brackets though, even though it’s simply the other side of the coin.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

Auckman wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
How much of this will be a real increase in services as opposed to keeping up with increased costs and demands? Is there a breakdown of that?
No idea. It's all over the media at the moment so there will be a breakdown somewhere.

The $300 million for Christchurch became official today though.
Woot!

Proper breakdowns always seem to be hard to find when politics is involved.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Fat Old Git »

deadduck wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
Auckman wrote:
THE POLICIES:

• Health: $3.2 billion injection over four years, including $2.2b more for DHBs and $126m for elective surgeries and other areas. $750m for hospital upgrades and rebuilds.

• Cheaper doctor visits for more than 500,000 people. Free GP visits extended to 13-year-olds (56,000 more children). About 540,000 people eligible for Community Services cards will get $20 to $30 cheaper GP visits. Cost $385 m.

• Midwives: $112m more for community midwives, including 8.9 per cent fee increase to level them with DHB midwives.

• Housing: $3.8b to build 6400 more state houses by 2022 and $170m for emergency housing. Insulation subsidies for low-income families. HNZ to borrow $3b.

• Education: $395 million to build new schools and classrooms. Includes $62 million for Christchurch schools rebuild and $332m nationwide.

• Education: $650m for schools. Includes $204m more for a 1.6 per cent increase to schools' operational funding and to cover school roll growth.

• $370m to fund 1500 new teacher places 2021 ($70m more than National funded).

• Early childhood education: $590m to fund more places and a 1.6 per cent funding increase for ECE centres from January 2019.

• Police: $300 mill for 920 more police officers and 240 support staff.

• Defence: $367.7m in extra operating funding to the Defence and Veterans portfolios over the next four years, underpinned by an extra $324.1m for the NZDF operating budget. Also, $42.3m in new capital funding for modernisation.
How much of this will be a real increase in services as opposed to keeping up with increased costs and demands? Is there a breakdown of that?
Indeed, the $3.2 billion for health over four years is pretty much the same as the much maligned Jonathan Coleman achieved in last year's budget, unless this is on top of that?
I would imagine it's on top of that unless Coleman's was a series of one offs rather than a general budget increase?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Gordon Bennett »

It's hard to sift through the appropriation documents. Looking at the tertiary education one, I see an increase for the government subsidy for teaching delivery. John Gerritsen on the other hand looks at the same document and sees no increase. He'll know vastly more what he's looking at, so I'm sure he's right - so is there an increase or not? Is there not an increase as an increase was already locked in from the last budget? Or perhaps the rate per student is flat but the number of students is increasing?

Any picks for the next polytech to fold?
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Wilderbeast »

Gordon Bennett wrote:It's hard to sift through the appropriation documents. Looking at the tertiary education one, I see an increase for the government subsidy for teaching delivery. John Gerritsen on the other hand looks at the same document and sees no increase. He'll know vastly more what he's looking at, so I'm sure he's right - so is there an increase or not? Is there not an increase as an increase was already locked in from the last budget? Or perhaps the rate per student is flat but the number of students is increasing?

Any picks for the next polytech to fold?
9 times out of 10 the detail is hidden beneath appropriation level. Government docs are amazingly comprehensive and just as amazingly short on actual useful information.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Tehui »

deadduck wrote:It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
They should increase the tax rate. Better yet, they should increase the tax rate from whatever amount you are earning. That sounds fair.
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Dark »

Tehui wrote:
deadduck wrote:It shouldn't remain unsaid that much of this surplus is a result of wage inflation and Labour are refusing to adjust the income tax brackets. In 2017 a person on the mean income pays about $1000 more tax each year than a person on the mean income in 2010. People most people are pushing well into the second-highest tax bracket which starts at a lowly $48,000. Many are also hitting the top bracket at just $70k and would by no means consider themselves rich.

It's all well and good for Robertson to crow about surpluses but that's basically admitting that the tax take is too high. Give it back Grant
They should increase the tax rate. Better yet, they should increase the tax rate from whatever amount you are earning. That sounds fair.
Raise the tax brackets?

They can't

That is what national electioneered on. Raising the low and middle tax brackets

Labour twisted it to tax cuts for the rich (as they get the same lower money untaxed)

Cynical, but it means they cant
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Re: NZ Politics Thread

Post by Hareaway »

I’m sure it’s all happy days and flowers and Shit

Did smokes and petrol go up ?

Any help for the village of the damned to get a big new footy shed ?
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