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NZ Politics Thread - NEW ZEALAND ALERT LEVEL TWO THREAD
https://forum.planetrugby.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=47826
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Author:  BillW [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

The only way of wiping out inequality is by wiping out the human race.
Why is inequality so bad?

Author:  Dark [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

CGT ain't going to happen with Winston on 3%

Author:  Gordon Bennett [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
The only way of wiping out inequality is by wiping out the human race.
Why is inequality so bad?


As someone from the lower classes who's had to fight tooth and nail to where I've got to, what annoys me the most is the inequality of opportunity - perpetuated throughout society either with the "which School did you go to" attitude of certain cities which don't need naming or the "voluntary" contributions that Schools insist upon. Inequality of opportunity is intrinsically and inexorably linked to basic inequality.

Author:  deadduck [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Think back throughout history and basically all the violent social upheavals or revolutions in the last 300 years were brought about by extreme wealth inequality

It does very bad things to countries in the long run when it gets out of hand.

Author:  BillW [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Inequality is what drives the economy and creates wealth.
It's why 20% of the people get 80% the work done.
Most of us are reliant one way or another on that 20%.
Some of that 20% had worse starts in life than you did.
Equality of opportunity is desirable.
Equality of outcome is a false god.

Author:  BillW [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

deadduck wrote:
Think back throughout history and basically all the violent social upheavals or revolutions in the last 300 years were brought about by extreme wealth inequality

It does very bad things to countries in the long run when it gets out of hand.

Most of very worst disasters were bought about by trying to achieve equality of outcome.
Stalin.
Mao.
Pol Pot.

Author:  Wilderbeast [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
Inequality is what drives the economy and creates wealth.
It's why 20% of the people get 80% the work done.
Most of us are reliant one way or another on that 20%.
Some of that 20% had worse starts in life than you did.
Equality of opportunity is desirable.
Equality of outcome is a false god.


What!?

Author:  BillW [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Wilderbeast wrote:
BillW wrote:
Inequality is what drives the economy and creates wealth.
It's why 20% of the people get 80% the work done.
Most of us are reliant one way or another on that 20%.
Some of that 20% had worse starts in life than you did.
Equality of opportunity is desirable.
Equality of outcome is a false god.


What!?

The rewards are there for the for the more capable.
If we were all paid the same rate nobody would give a shit.
There's nothing like a good dose of socialism to suck the vitality out of a nation.

Author:  Brabus [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Wilderbeast wrote:
BillW wrote:
Inequality is what drives the economy and creates wealth.
It's why 20% of the people get 80% the work done.
Most of us are reliant one way or another on that 20%.
Some of that 20% had worse starts in life than you did.
Equality of opportunity is desirable.
Equality of outcome is a false god.


What!?


It could have been put more eloquently but inequality exists as part of the human condition, and competition drives innovation. Some people are more driven than others, have more ambition and/or possess greater cognitive abilities. There is a reason that an oncologist gets paid more than a florist. Now there are arguments to be made that one may be over paid and the other under but that does not address the fact that one takes on a whole lot more commitment and risk than the other.

As mentioned by BillW: Equality of opportunity good, equality of outcome so very, very bad.

Author:  Wilderbeast [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Oh so he meant competition? Someone should tell him that competition and inequality are not the same thing.

Author:  Ted. [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Mr Mike wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Nevertheless, there is a serious shortage of non-tourist accommodation in Central Otago. This issue is pretty fundamental to Central Otago's housing policy and why, for example, QLDC are putting so much effort into finding solutions for the shortage.
I need to read my ratepayers communications more closely. All I’ve noticed is the rates appear to have come down.

Which initiatives are the QLDC pushing? I hope they aren’t pushing to increase the prices at Fergburger



I don't remember the details, it was a couple of years ago and I was nodding off at the time, but according to the mayor, who spoke at our conference, they're are desperately trying to free up land and encourage developers to construct worker and family accommodation.

Author:  Ted. [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
Ted. wrote:
BillW wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
BillW wrote:
Not sure how that would lower the price of houses.


I didn't say it would. Nice deflection though.
BillW wrote:
What is it that makes you think that anybody in parliament has got the knowledge and expertise to build houses cheaper than the professionals do it?


hmmm... the professionals are running a tidy little duopoly on supply costs and creaming the consumer blind. Great read in last weekend's Herald on that. What the govt could do is award large contracts to other companies large enough to run their own supply chains and slash costs, introducing serious competition to the market.

So there's that.

Yeah.
Source supplies from countries with lower wages, less compliance costs and no health and safety rules.


Yeah, like pinus radiata. Or portland cement. Hang on, maybe you mean greywacke aggregate. Ok, ok, it must be the steel reinforcing and roofing materials... the gib? :roll:

Pre-cut houses.


Great for the Simple House (Acceptable Solution) and Multi-Proof, but they will need to dot their i's and cross their t's before they will be granted consent(s). Great when you need to bung up a bunch of dwellings in a hurray and your clientele isn't too fussy about having the same house as a bunch of other people. Not great for when you start hitting different wind zones, for e.g. All the same, I am a fan for keeping our building materials suppliers honest and maybe even encourage them not to gouge the locals to the extent they have been doing for many many years - everyone like a competitive market, right?

Manufactured houses are going to be pretty much the norm anyway. It's a good thing in some respects as their does not seem to be a will to fix our broken trade training regime. Semi skilled people in a managed environment, under the supervision of the minimum number of LBP's; no weather to bother about and with as much automation as can be thrown at it, surely has to bring costs down and even out the quality - note: that doesn't necessarily mean high quality, just less very poor quality, which is the best we can hope for when the minimum standards our performance based building codes are, by default, maximum standards when applied to the majority of builds (hey, they get a CCC, so why go further than, say a 15 year durability for brand new cladding..... with normal maintenance of course, which incidentally is not defined anywhere in the Act or Code).

Ok, that went off piste rather quickly. It's a subject that is dear to my heart.

Author:  Ted. [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Anyway



Image




x(







Man









Walking





:nod:


Yep, the sooner the better. :thumbup:


I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:

Author:  booji boy [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Ted. wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Anyway



Image




x(







Man









Walking





:nod:


Yep, the sooner the better. :thumbup:


I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:


Yeah me too. :)

Author:  Enzedder [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

jambanja wrote:
Gordon Bennett wrote:
deadduck wrote:

The government could afford to do some kind of tax relief package in the lower brackets without a CGT but they decided to fund things like Shane Jones' slush fund and free university education for people who don't need it


Says who? I work with some of those kids, and the policy has introduced tertiary education to people wxho couldn't previously afford to access it.


Why was the free year applied to the first year rather than the final or even second year?

Is there any financial penalty for students who take advantage of the free first year and then decide that the course/degree isn’t for them


Jammy, keep in mind that year one is the hardest one in which to gain a scholarship. If you can get in (don't overload in year 1) and work like hell, it is far easier to get awarded scholarships for subsequent years. I would prefer the assistance in year one but geee, it would be tempting to chuck in that extra class, wouldn't it?

Author:  Fat Old Git [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:

I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:


Yeah me too. :)


Now I'm seriously worried about you guys! :shock:

Author:  deadduck [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
deadduck wrote:
Think back throughout history and basically all the violent social upheavals or revolutions in the last 300 years were brought about by extreme wealth inequality

It does very bad things to countries in the long run when it gets out of hand.

Most of very worst disasters were bought about by trying to achieve equality of outcome.
Stalin.
Mao.
Pol Pot.


You need to go back one step in your root cause analysis. What led to the communist revolutions in Russia and China, and the subsequent domino effect in Indochina?
They were corrections, and obviously overcorrections, to the huge disparity in wealth between the landowning elite and the newly liberated serfs and peasants who owned nothing. The disenfranchisement caused by extreme inequality led these people to throw out their own governments and spend the next 30 years exterminating the educated middle classes to prevent it happening again.


Clearly not the right way to go about things but an example of why a country should not let inequality grow unchecked.

Author:  BillW [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Fat Old Git wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:

I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:


Yeah me too. :)


Now I'm seriously worried about you guys! :shock:

She's the leader we'll need when we invade Australia.

Author:  Mr Mike [ Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:

I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:


Yeah me too. :)


Now I'm seriously worried about you guys! :shock:

She's the leader we'll need when we invade Australia.

She’s the leader that won’t need us when she invades Australia.

Author:  booji boy [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

BillW wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
booji boy wrote:
Ted. wrote:

I didn't always, but I quite like Judith. :thumbup:


Yeah me too. :)


Now I'm seriously worried about you guys! :shock:

She's the leader we'll need when we invade Australia.


Our very own Iron Lady. ;)

Perfect antithesis to the smiling windbag. :thumbup:

Author:  True Blue [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

I don't rate her highly, but I'd rate her higher than Simon Bridges. I saw him at Auckland domestic airport once and he had piss stains on his pants the grub.

Author:  maxbox [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

You would rate Crusher Collins higher than bridges? Collins was complicit in that whole scandal involving her hubby and that Chinese company. Lady is a crook

Author:  booji boy [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

maxbox wrote:
You would rate Crusher Collins higher than bridges? Collins was complicit in that whole scandal involving her hubby and that Chinese company. Lady is a crook


Didn't hurt Helen Clark.

Author:  maxbox [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

:lol:

Author:  True Blue [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Didn't Aunty Helen pretend to sign some art work and then sell them off? Something along those lines. She's hardly clean. Not to mention she fucken started the housing crisis.

Author:  Enzedder [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Quote:
I didn't always, but I quite like Judith.


I did when she was at university. Fark she was hot. 9/10

Author:  Enzedder [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

booji boy wrote:
maxbox wrote:
You would rate Crusher Collins higher than bridges? Collins was complicit in that whole scandal involving her hubby and that Chinese company. Lady is a crook


Didn't hurt Helen Clark.


I doubt she had a Chinese businessman as a hubby somehow. Are you talking about the little airport scandal and her hubby that nobody got any info on - wonder if it was true or another National stitchup? If you are moaning about the art thing, that's not even worth a single breath of indignation on

Being a crook didn't hurt Bill English either remember.

Author:  kiwinoz [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
I didn't always, but I quite like Judith.


I did when she was at university. Fark she was hot. 9/10


We have rules Sir!

Spoiler: show
Image

Author:  Enzedder [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

kiwinoz wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
I didn't always, but I quite like Judith.


I did when she was at university. Fark she was hot. 9/10


We have rules Sir!

Spoiler: show
Image


I tried - what did you google to find her

Author:  Wignu [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Enzedder wrote:
kiwinoz wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
I didn't always, but I quite like Judith.


I did when she was at university. Fark she was hot. 9/10


We have rules Sir!

Spoiler: show
Image


I tried - what did you google to find her

He probably had to go to the dark web :twisted:

Author:  Enzedder [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Wignu wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
I tried - what did you google to find her

He probably had to go to the dark web :twisted:


In his wank bank more like (it's what I've just done)

Author:  Waka Nathan [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

True Blue wrote:
Didn't Aunty Helen pretend to sign some art work and then sell them off? Something along those lines. She's hardly clean.

Good grief. Clark signed a blank canvas, like many MPs and celebrities, and someone daubed some paint on it. The "artwork" was auctioned off for a charity. Some silly old Dutchman bought the "painting" thinking he'd make some money on it in the future. The idea that he was actually making a donation to a charity seemed to escape him.

Author:  Wilderbeast [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

maxbox wrote:
You would rate Crusher Collins higher than bridges? Collins was complicit in that whole scandal involving her hubby and that Chinese company. Lady is a crook


She also came out the worst on dirty politics, being pretty tight with that fucktard Slater. Collins is a nasty piece of work who I want nowhere near the seat of power. Bridges is infinitely better.

Author:  Waka Nathan [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Wilderbeast wrote:
maxbox wrote:
You would rate Crusher Collins higher than bridges? Collins was complicit in that whole scandal involving her hubby and that Chinese company. Lady is a crook


She also came out the worst on dirty politics, being pretty tight with that fucktard Slater. Collins is a nasty piece of work who I want nowhere near the seat of power. Bridges is infinitely better.

Collins is a hideously corrupt person:

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/politics/jud ... s-minister

Author:  kiwinoz [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Enzedder wrote:
kiwinoz wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
I didn't always, but I quite like Judith.


I did when she was at university. Fark she was hot. 9/10


We have rules Sir!

Spoiler: show
Image


I tried - what did you google to find her


I used DDG and just her name but interestingly now that picture does not come up. Poor use of the internet does not excuse violations of Rule 1.

Author:  Fat Old Git [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Waka Nathan wrote:
True Blue wrote:
Didn't Aunty Helen pretend to sign some art work and then sell them off? Something along those lines. She's hardly clean.

Good grief. Clark signed a blank canvas, like many MPs and celebrities, and someone daubed some paint on it. The "artwork" was auctioned off for a charity. Some silly old Dutchman bought the "painting" thinking he'd make some money on it in the future. The idea that he was actually making a donation to a charity seemed to escape him.


I'm not sure committing fraud for charity is really a reasonable excuse. If it was marketed as a painting by the PM and that was what the guy believed he was paying for as a result then that really isn't ok. It might be low level compared to what crusher was accused of ( and I admit I can't remember the details now, or if she ever actually convicted of anything?), but wrong is wrong.

Author:  Enzedder [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Quote:
but wrong is wrong.


:lol: it's right up there with pony tail pulling

Author:  Dark [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Did anyone else listen to question time today?

Chris Hipkins acted like a twelve year old having a tantrum when Mallard gave 10 extra free supplementary questions a day for 3 weeks to National because of his crap ability to do his job.

It was hilarious

Author:  Waka Nathan [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Fat Old Git wrote:
Waka Nathan wrote:
True Blue wrote:
Didn't Aunty Helen pretend to sign some art work and then sell them off? Something along those lines. She's hardly clean.

Good grief. Clark signed a blank canvas, like many MPs and celebrities, and someone daubed some paint on it. The "artwork" was auctioned off for a charity. Some silly old Dutchman bought the "painting" thinking he'd make some money on it in the future. The idea that he was actually making a donation to a charity seemed to escape him.


I'm not sure committing fraud for charity is really a reasonable excuse. If it was marketed as a painting by the PM and that was what the guy believed he was paying for as a result then that really isn't ok. It might be low level compared to what crusher was accused of ( and I admit I can't remember the details now, or if she ever actually convicted of anything?), but wrong is wrong.

Clark didn't "commit fraud for charity"; she signed a blank canvas at the behest of the charity. Only a complete fcking idiot would equate that non event with the behavior of Collins--behaviour that caused Key to sack her.

Author:  Fat Old Git [ Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NZ Politics Thread

Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
but wrong is wrong.


:lol: it's right up there with pony tail pulling


So you agree with me then?

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