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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:32 am 
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Tehui wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Latest poll: 1 News/Colmar-Brunton

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I wonder where the other 41% of the preferred PM votes went to?
John Key


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:34 am 
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Dark wrote:
Flockwitt wrote:
Nobody has jumped any gun and what it "appears" is wrong. If Australia's banned Huawei NZ pretty much has to do the same.



This is new

Why?

Think of all the cross overs between the networks. It's free to call to Australia and back. The telecom systems need to be operating from the same legal basis effectively.

Then also consider the tendering and supply of the equipment. Yeah, Hwawei and ZTE are cheap, but if Aus is totally Nokia for example, it'll be a lot easier to tender off and integrate the equivalent systems. And this cuts both ways. New Zealand telco suppliers get an immediate in with Australia going this banning route, it makes sense to reciprocate.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:50 am 
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Kahu wrote:
jambanja wrote:
Kahu wrote:
Jambanja, what do you mean by regulating the strength too much?

When Garner was interviewing Chloe, they discussed the fact that the stuff in the States was very potent, to which Chloe said that that was one of the benefits of being able control the drug, I.e control it’s potency, if they do that to too great an extent, like speights mid, then they will drive customers away into the waiting arms of the gangs...imo
thanks wasn't sure if you were meaning potency or strength of regulations.
I'm looking forward to growing hundreds of plants of dozens of strains in my backyard. I'm looking forward to making the most potent hash possible. Sadly I think the way it is going I won't be legally allowed that opportunity.

I have a feeling it’s going to be very tightly controlled, it’s interesting, it’s not even legal yet and one company (medicinal cannabis) has already filed for receivership in Tauranga


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 11:18 am 
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Dark wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Dark wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Dark wrote:
This will be slightly awkward for Ardern after bowing to Trumps wishes over Huawei so soon

UK say they are fine to help with building 5G

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/new ... d=12204757



Why on earth would you say that?


They appear to have jumped the gun


So that you don't have to scroll back to my edit:

Ted. wrote:
Dark wrote:
This will be slightly awkward for Ardern after bowing to Trumps wishes over Huawei so soon

UK say they are fine to help with building 5G

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/new ... d=12204757



Why on earth would you say that?

To expand on the above. the article is full of cheery picking quotes fro selected sources. In a nutshell, the 5 Eyes Alliance were nervous about Huawei, including the Brits for your and the article Author's information.

If they have now set their resources to digging out some further intelligence that doesn't support their initial suspicions, they quite rightly, and within their rights, change their stance based on that information. In light of new information, I would expect them to reappraise their current stance. Why you, or anyone, would think that any belief, suspicion or statement must be for ever set in stone beggars reality. :?


More:
Quote:
... the British government has now concluded that it can mitigate the risk from using Huawei equipment in 5G networks


Now even Spark is couching the issue in terms of "concerns" that they may be able to find a way to "mitigate".

On nther other hand, if GCSB had sat on this, or the Govt had not reacted smartly, some would be spewing outrage equivalent to those vilifying the GCSB and Govt now.



And it makes Labour look weak


FFS, grow up.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 11:33 am 
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jambanja wrote:
Kahu wrote:
jambanja wrote:
Kahu wrote:
Jambanja, what do you mean by regulating the strength too much?

When Garner was interviewing Chloe, they discussed the fact that the stuff in the States was very potent, to which Chloe said that that was one of the benefits of being able control the drug, I.e control it’s potency, if they do that to too great an extent, like speights mid, then they will drive customers away into the waiting arms of the gangs...imo
thanks wasn't sure if you were meaning potency or strength of regulations.
I'm looking forward to growing hundreds of plants of dozens of strains in my backyard. I'm looking forward to making the most potent hash possible. Sadly I think the way it is going I won't be legally allowed that opportunity.

I have a feeling it’s going to be very tightly controlled, it’s interesting, it’s not even legal yet and one company (medicinal cannabis) has already filed for receivership in Tauranga



Medicinal cannabis is a different matter entirely and that market is the subject of some pretty aggressive moves by companies who have identified the profit potentials involved and invested heavily (in some cases) in setting up facilities to produce in anticipation of law changes relating to med cannabis specifically. It should be no surprise that early movers in that field may be squeezed out by better resourced entities competing aggressively...

but please don't conflate that with recreational weed and law changes pertaining to that. They are different issues.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 11:40 am 
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Tehui wrote:
Auckman wrote:
Latest poll: 1 News/Colmar-Brunton

Image


I wonder where the other 41% of the preferred PM votes went to?


It's a good question. "Don't know?"


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 5:17 am 
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None of the above is always in the running it would seem.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 9:00 am 
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I walked past Sarah Dowie in central Wellington today. How JL Ross managed to bed that woman, I'll never know. Us shy boys can never achieve the same level of success.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 9:13 am 
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Tehui wrote:
I walked past Sarah Dowie in central Wellington today. How JL Ross managed to bed that woman, I'll never know. Us shy boys can never achieve the same level of success.


She's a well known sluzzer, who isn't picky. She's also not that flash up close.

JLR, of course, is a 32 year old who looks 52. But they had some deluded power politics couple buzz going on.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:52 pm 
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Dark wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Dark wrote:
This will be slightly awkward for Ardern after bowing to Trumps wishes over Huawei so soon

UK say they are fine to help with building 5G

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/new ... d=12204757



Why on earth would you say that?


They appear to have jumped the gun


It's more like due diligence than jumping the gun, isn't it. Chinese are pushing back as you'd expect - did the Poms cave first (they need trading partners so bad right now) or have they found a way to mitigate the perceived risk.

I would say that you have jumped the gun Dark - take a breath and wait for it.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:57 pm 
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Enzedder wrote:
Dark wrote:
Ted. wrote:
Dark wrote:
This will be slightly awkward for Ardern after bowing to Trumps wishes over Huawei so soon

UK say they are fine to help with building 5G

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/new ... d=12204757



Why on earth would you say that?


They appear to have jumped the gun


It's more like due diligence than jumping the gun, isn't it. Chinese are pushing back as you'd expect - did the Poms cave first (they need trading partners so bad right now) or have they found a way to mitigate the perceived risk.

I would say that you have jumped the gun Dark - take a breath and wait for it.


I'd say less caved, and more didn't play to Trumps whim Enz


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:58 pm 
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CGT announcement today.

Should we have a raffle on how long it will take Labour to backtrack massively and ditch the idea of one again?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 8:10 pm 
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Dark wrote:
CGT announcement today.

Should we have a raffle on how long it will take Labour to backtrack massively and ditch the idea of one again?


In Winston we trust. :D


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 8:39 pm 
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Dark wrote:
CGT announcement today.

Should we have a raffle on how long it will take Labour to backtrack massively and ditch the idea of one again?


Aren't the CGT idea platforms going to form part of policy for the next election? Winston will not play his cards as he doesn't have to - it's not going to be part of this Coalition's policy.

I wonder if 95% of his voters are more than single home people anyway - a CGT will see a lowering of the rate of the lower paid (or an increase in the rates of the minimim rate) which will suit most superannuitants, wouldn't it?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 8:40 pm 
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Quote:
I'd say less caved, and more didn't play to Trumps whim Enz


More like our spies caving to the CIA I reckon.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 10:38 pm 
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Enzedder wrote:
Quote:
I'd say less caved, and more didn't play to Trumps whim Enz


More like our spies caving to the CIA I reckon.



Fair point


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:12 pm 
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Quote:
Tax Working Group's main recommendations are:

Tax the capital gain on sale of land, shares, business assets, intangible assets such as intellectual property. Tax to be imposed when the asset is sold, and levied at the seller's marginal tax rate. Assets to be valued from when the tax is imposed.
The tax would NOT apply to the family home, and personal assets such as cars, paintings, jewellery, and household appliances. However, a holiday home WOULD be taxed on sale.
The capital gain on shares in companies would be taxed but in some circumstances capital losses would also be able to be offset against other income.
The capital gain on the sale of a business would be taxed, including the goodwill.
Exemptions from capital gains to be granted for some "life events" such as relationship breakup, death. A family farm passed on to a family member would be covered by a rollover and there would be no tax on the capital gain. But if the family member then sells to a third party the capital gain would be taxed.
No changes to income tax rates, but a recommendation to raise the income threshold for low and middle income groups, i.e they would earn more at a low or lower tax rate.
No change to GST and no exemptions for certain types of products, such as food and drink.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:19 pm 
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Thought the changes inquiry was supposed to be fiscally neutral.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:21 pm 
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You’re desperate to find negatives in anything.

Your world view seems to be very miserable. Deep cynicism like that is often a sign of emotional trauma. Don’t let denial rule your life, get help and think about realising your potential and leading a happier life.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:24 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:
You’re desperate to find negatives in anything.


I didn't say anything negative about it

I asked a question, oh easily triggered one.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:33 pm 
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Dark wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
You’re desperate to find negatives in anything.


I didn't say anything negative about it

I asked a question, oh easily triggered one.


You didn’t ask a question, you made a statement.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:37 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:
Dark wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
You’re desperate to find negatives in anything.


I didn't say anything negative about it

I asked a question, oh easily triggered one.


You didn’t ask a question, you made a statement.


It was a question

I just find certain punctuation marks an tacky, unnecessary extravagance


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:39 pm 
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More denial.

It’s a shame to see anyone drowning in their own issues like this.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:40 pm 
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Quote:
The capital gain on the sale of a business would be taxed, including the goodwill.


Keep wondering about this

How do you measure "goodwill"? (question mark for Guy)


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:42 pm 
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I haven't done any accounting since 6th form, but wouldn't the goodwill just be the difference between the assets of the company and its sale price?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:48 pm 
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Jay Cee Gee wrote:
I haven't done any accounting since 6th form, but wouldn't the goodwill just be the difference between the assets of the company and its sale price?



Ahh

I was thinking it as a good will from customers kind of thing, like a value in customer loyalty, or something


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:48 pm 
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Jay Cee Gee wrote:
I haven't done any accounting since 6th form, but wouldn't the goodwill just be the difference between the assets of the company and its sale price?


Goodwill is generally a vendor calculation guided by local market trends, to put it kindly. So I decide the coffee cart I set up for $3000 and operated for 6 months is now worth $25K based on my desire to turn a profit on the sale and some optimistic projections of income annually based on a couple of good weekends outside a festival.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:55 pm 
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guy smiley wrote:
Jay Cee Gee wrote:
I haven't done any accounting since 6th form, but wouldn't the goodwill just be the difference between the assets of the company and its sale price?


Goodwill is generally a vendor calculation guided by local market trends, to put it kindly. So I decide the coffee cart I set up for $3000 and operated for 6 months is now worth $25K based on my desire to turn a profit on the sale and some optimistic projections of income annually based on a couple of good weekends outside a festival.


Yeah, how would that work for a CGT? Surely they'll just be taxed on the actual capital they receive on selling the business and specifically including goodwill is just a way to prevent some potential shenanigans?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:00 am 
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Jay Cee Gee wrote:
guy smiley wrote:
Jay Cee Gee wrote:
I haven't done any accounting since 6th form, but wouldn't the goodwill just be the difference between the assets of the company and its sale price?


Goodwill is generally a vendor calculation guided by local market trends, to put it kindly. So I decide the coffee cart I set up for $3000 and operated for 6 months is now worth $25K based on my desire to turn a profit on the sale and some optimistic projections of income annually based on a couple of good weekends outside a festival.


Yeah, how would that work for a CGT? Surely they'll just be taxed on the actual capital they receive on selling the business and specifically including goodwill is just a way to prevent some potential shenanigans?


On a serious note, many established businesses with proven performance and records include goodwill in any sale price as a matter of course and where those conditions apply it’s not really an issue when you consider the effort someone has put into developing that business and reputation. It is an intangible though and wide open for exploitation.

I think that might be what this recommendation is aimed at but we may be getting sidetracked over one term here, it’ll be more the over sale price and profit they’re looking at.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:17 am 
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guy smiley wrote:
Quote:
Tax Working Group's main recommendations are:

Tax the capital gain on sale of land, shares, business assets, intangible assets such as intellectual property. Tax to be imposed when the asset is sold, and levied at the seller's marginal tax rate. Assets to be valued from when the tax is imposed.
The tax would NOT apply to the family home, and personal assets such as cars, paintings, jewellery, and household appliances. However, a holiday home WOULD be taxed on sale.
The capital gain on shares in companies would be taxed but in some circumstances capital losses would also be able to be offset against other income.
The capital gain on the sale of a business would be taxed, including the goodwill.
Exemptions from capital gains to be granted for some "life events" such as relationship breakup, death. A family farm passed on to a family member would be covered by a rollover and there would be no tax on the capital gain. But if the family member then sells to a third party the capital gain would be taxed.
No changes to income tax rates, but a recommendation to raise the income threshold for low and middle income groups, i.e they would earn more at a low or lower tax rate.
No change to GST and no exemptions for certain types of products, such as food and drink.


No direct mention of Kiwisaver but I'm guessing the highlighted bit would apply to any share component?

There's been a lot of talk in the past about the need to move investment away from housing and into more productive parts of the economy. But if you are going to tax the alternatives I can't see how you achieve it. Although, tbf, I'm not sure that was in the working groups ToR (And I'm too lazy to go back and check).


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:24 am 
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Looks fiscally neutral for me, with some additional opportunities to shelter gains on options due to US-NZ Tax Treaty. Those re-entry rules and retrospective double tax impacts for Fleewees repatriating from Australia are horrendous.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:27 am 
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There are suddenly going to be a lot really really nice, renovated to the max "family homes"

Be a good time to be an accountant. Wonder I can train to be one in 2 years.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:32 am 
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There’s more to it of course, I’m on the phone so lazy quoting and I lifted that section from the RNZ blog covering the release. KiwiSaver may be mentioned elsewhere...

also, CGT as we’ve said before is only paid on any sale, it’s not an ongoing tax. Overcapitalising the family home thinking to get around it would be silly.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:50 am 
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Mr Mike wrote:
Looks fiscally neutral for me, with some additional opportunities to shelter gains on options due to US-NZ Tax Treaty. Those re-entry rules and retrospective double tax impacts for Fleewees repatriating from Australia are horrendous.

Wait, what's happening to us Fleewees in Oz? :shock: (Hmm, maybe I should read the report.)

Anyway, just the other day Simon Bridges was telling me I'd be joined by a lot more Fleewees if a CGT was introduced in NZ - no CGT in good old Oz, ah actually, ignore that.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:02 am 
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If they are going to tax Kiwisaver investment gains, will we be allowed to use Kiwisaver depreciation as a deductible against our income tax calculations?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:13 am 
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Fat Old Git wrote:
No direct mention of Kiwisaver but I'm guessing the highlighted bit would apply to any share component?

There's been a lot of talk in the past about the need to move investment away from housing and into more productive parts of the economy. But if you are going to tax the alternatives I can't see how you achieve it. Although, tbf, I'm not sure that was in the working groups ToR (And I'm too lazy to go back and check).


I struggle to see why we need to move investment away from housing.
Is there or is there not a housing crisis?
Don't we need more housing?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:22 am 
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Just noticed something I like a lot

Quote:
Review taxation of charities to ensure the income from commercial activities are being used for the charitable causes they are being raised for.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:39 am 
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UncleFB wrote:
Mr Mike wrote:
Looks fiscally neutral for me, with some additional opportunities to shelter gains on options due to US-NZ Tax Treaty. Those re-entry rules and retrospective double tax impacts for Fleewees repatriating from Australia are horrendous.

Wait, what's happening to us Fleewees in Oz? :shock: (Hmm, maybe I should read the report.)

Maybe I should as well...


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:41 am 
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:lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:38 am 
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BillW wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
No direct mention of Kiwisaver but I'm guessing the highlighted bit would apply to any share component?

There's been a lot of talk in the past about the need to move investment away from housing and into more productive parts of the economy. But if you are going to tax the alternatives I can't see how you achieve it. Although, tbf, I'm not sure that was in the working groups ToR (And I'm too lazy to go back and check).


I struggle to see why we need to move investment away from housing.
Is there or is there not a housing crisis?
Don't we need more housing?


It’s talking about landlords, who do nothing to increase the supply of housing. Developers are already taxed on property development. This means nothing to them.


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