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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 4:30 am 
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Yeah....the tax question works both ways though....more tax or tax cuts.

Is living wage still on the table.....or will it be axed?

Are there any asset sales planned? There's plenty of policies to be viewed and considered before the voting starts.

Also see jobs are back to 57% (av) of precovid........and just a quick look at one sector, teaching,....there are 750 vacancies currently.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:42 am 
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Interesting post on Kiwiblog today from a 'Nosenholder', who recognises the direction if things and has a way to resist it. The question is how many Nosehoksera are out there? I couldn't identify a single one on this site. Every one here is either all in or never in. The Noseholders are the Key.

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/07/gues ... arker.html

Quote:
I probably have little in common with a lot of Kiwiblog readers. I’m pro gay marriage, anti smacking, pro decriminalisation of marijuana, support increasing our military by 100% and our police by 50% and funding it via a lot more taxation, nationalising a lot of key industries, and generally could be seen as a leftie. Even worse, I’m a public servant – yes, a dreaded “trougher.”

But the fact is, in the current times, I have a lot more in common with people here than I do with my supposedly “traditional” leftie allies. And it’s all to do with freedom of speech, freedom of opinion, and censorship.

I’ve stated my opinions, but I don’t expect everybody to agree with them. I like debate. I think people can be vitriolically anti-gay. They can say they think homosexuality is evil and should be punishable by death; that’s their opinion, and they have a right to it. It’s not my opinion, and I would try my best to convince them otherwise, but I would never hold they couldn’t have their own opinion.

This “window of opinion” was as broad as could be in the 1980s. Libertarians. Anarchists. Socialists. Big “C” Conservatives. It was a time of intellectual ferment and difference of opinions. It was a child of the liberalism of the 1960s.

Today, that window has shut, and it’s getting darker. The window of acceptable opinion is so narrow nowadays it reminds me of the Victorian era; instead of whether we’re revealing an ankle, it’s whether we’re mispronouncing Taupo. The so-called liberals are about as illiberal as can be. Freedom of speech is being shut down. We cannot have the fundamental debates about what is right, what is wrong, and what’s inbetween because there is a baying crowd that has already decided. I think George Floyd was murdered for being black. Others may disagree. They have the right to their view, and the right to a civil debate.

The “safetyists” will say that there is no need for civil debate when people’s lives or safety are at risk. That’s hypocritical; they are taking it as a given that human safety is the ultimate ethical imperative, when it’s exactly the sort of thing that is open for debate. The people of Great Britain thought that defiance, democracy, and true liberalism were more important in 1940 than saving lives by surrendering to Hitler. Alexander the Great thought fairness in war was more important than achieving an easier, less costly victory by advancing at night. Humanity has always considered some virtues more important than life and safety at specific times and places. What matters is the freedom to debate which values are more important than safety at a given time. If a slave risked his life for freedom, was he doing the right thing? Modern safetyists would be contorted in knots trying to justify that action, as it would bring into conflict their own preconceptions.

I want a country – and a world – where regardless of the economic system or political system, we have the freedom to debate everything. Where ethics classes at universities can ask whether murder or slavery can ever be morally justified. Where people can protest, or not protest, without immense peer pressure.

As a public servant, I value my political neutrality, but it is becoming harder and harder as so many politically-loaded activities (such as karakia before meetings) are loaded in and seen as “neutral” (i.e. they are so normalised now, nobody sees how political they truly are). There are examples the other way; the normalcy of capitalism, for example, is never questioned even though that is also a political, not a technical, viewpoint. When Auckland Council banned those speakers from community facilities, they were bringing politics into a bureaucratic decision.

I hope I haven’t waffled too much, but that my central point – we are losing freedom of debate – has come through. I don’t know what to do.

I’ll be voting National this year, not because I like them, but because they’re the lesser of two evils.

If Trump was here, even though I believe he’s likely a halfwit, sex offending, buffoon, I’d vote for him. Simply because I would feel my freedom of debate would be stronger under him than it would be under Ardern


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:46 am 
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I'm pretty sure that's fake.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:49 am 
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"I hope I haven’t waffled too much, but that my central point – we are losing freedom of debate – has come through. I don’t know what to do."
Definite more waffle than debate.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:51 am 
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Yup......the electioneering has statred.......work of an influencer?

I'm a swing voter between Nats..NZ1...Green....Lab..........

When the policies turn up, I'll back those whose policies tip the balance for me......


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 7:59 am 
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And to illustrate the point, three responses all about the writer or context and none about the substance. There will be one about me soon. 8)


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:26 am 
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Santa wrote:
And to illustrate the point, three responses all about the writer or context and none about the substance. There will be one about me soon. 8)


That's because there's fuckall substance worth the description.

It's almost always about you, baby. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:19 pm 
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Anyone care to predict NZF's future after the general election?


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 6:36 pm 
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Tehui wrote:
Anyone care to predict NZF's future after the general election?


Peters to retire and NZF will die in days

Slush fund found to contain $100m


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:18 pm 
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Slush fund will be epic for COVID. NZ first won’t get near it. Hallelujah to be sung in the streets.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:00 pm 
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I see the govts much vaunted and self sacrificing 20% pay cuts have not happened which seems to have gone under the radar.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:22 pm 
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Muttonbirds wrote:
I'm pretty sure that's fake.

Maybe, but that's a pretty accurate picture of the lived experience of anyone working in the Wellington part of the public service over the last 25 years.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:52 am 
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Wednesday National criticises government for increasing fuel excise tax.

Friday announces $570 million roading plan (probably the first of many knowing them) using fuel excise tax money. They really lurch from bad to worse.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2020 5:08 am 
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Enzedder wrote:
Wednesday National criticises government for increasing fuel excise tax.

Friday announces $570 million roading plan (probably the first of many knowing them) using fuel excise tax money. They really lurch from bad to worse.


I know you are trying to be edgy and hype it up, but all fuel excise is supposed to go on roads and transport, so not sure what your point is.

Maybe they can use the cash from the Auckland fuel tax that was meant to go on the light rail Labour failed on spectacularly..........again.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:06 am 
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And the incompetence never ends.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/arti ... d=12345363

Quote:
Covid 19 coronavirus patients' details leaked: Investigation launched as agencies scramble

Confidential patient details of all the active Covid-19 cases in New Zealand have been leaked, including their names and dates of birth.

The massive breach of privacy contains the details of 18 confirmed cases, ranging from a 30-year-old woman in Auckland to a 70-year-old man in Canterbury.

It includes the personal details of the man in his 30s receiving care in Auckland City Hospital.

The leaked spreadsheet, seen by the Weekend Herald, also shows which border facility the Covid-positive people were staying in when they tested positive and where they were moved for quarantine.

Newly appointed Health Minister Chris Hipkins said the leak was "totally unacceptable" and potentially criminal.

Hipkins took over the responsibility of the health portfolio on Thursday after David Clark resigned a series of blunders.

He has asked the State Services Commission, another portfolio Hipkins is responsible for, to work with the relevant agencies to ensure there is a thorough investigation.

"I have been advised by the Ministry of Health that at this stage it cannot be confirmed beyond doubt whether a deliberate leak was involved or if this was simply human error.

"If it was the former, it is unconscionable and absolutely beggars belief why anyone would feel it was an acceptable action to take, given the trauma it is likely to cause those whose information is involved. It would, quite frankly, be abhorrent, and potentially criminal.

"Either way, it cannot happen again.

"The public has every right to expect their private information to be held securely."

One Weekend Herald journalist has seen the spreadsheet. The information has been kept secure and the publication will not contact the people included in the leak.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:08 am 
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Chris Bishop's office bound to be involved.


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:16 am 
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Muttonbirds wrote:
Chris Bishop's office bound to be involved.



:lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: NZ Politics Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:12 am 
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Is it a confirmed leak? It sounds like they are looking into things to confirm if it was deliberate or in error.


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