The Official Irish Rugby Thread

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Luckycharmer
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Luckycharmer »

Mr. Very Popular wrote: Sun Nov 29, 2020 5:45 pm
Jim Lahey wrote: Sun Nov 29, 2020 5:42 pm So who, apart from the coaching staff, are we throwing under the bus this week?

I only had half an eye on it and it looked proper grim. Keenan and Earls looked serviceable, as did Stockdale apart from when he was asked to make a tackle. The rest looked pish.

All the Leinster lads, just not as interested in the green jersey as the blue one.
Only 4 Leinster lads on starting team and 2 subs I think there's the problem. He gives all the other lads a go and look what happens :P
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Trostan »

Floppykid wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:13 pm I personally think Sexton is too old and has been for a while.
He gets rattled/exposed against teams higher than Wales' level and in the past year he's even started to look shakey against them.
That there isn't a ready made back up doesn't change that fact.
Please specify the FACT
As opposed to the opinion
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Trostan »

Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Harry Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Last edited by Trostan on Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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feckwanker
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by feckwanker »

Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Ross Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Ross Byrne is not the answer unfortunately.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Trostan »

I edited it. I meant Harry
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:12 pm
Floppykid wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:13 pm I personally think Sexton is too old and has been for a while.
He gets rattled/exposed against teams higher than Wales' level and in the past year he's even started to look shakey against them.
That there isn't a ready made back up doesn't change that fact.
Please specify the FACT
As opposed to the opinion
Weird, it was just a turn of phrase.
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Floppykid
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 4:36 pm
Ulsters Red Hand wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 4:04 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
You racist
What are you on? I have seen loads of photos of Paddy and he is black as the ace of spades in them
Guy is a complete dolt. :lol:
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Jim Lahey
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Jim Lahey »

Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
Would be glorious alright.
Champagne rugby.

But . . . . the collisions, man. Who’s going to lead our defensive system? What about the dominant tackles?

F**k modern rugby :thumbdown:
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shabadoo
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by shabadoo »

feckwanker wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:22 pm
Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Ross Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Ross Byrne is not the answer unfortunately.
2 very talented players for sure with Stockdale further down the development road obviously, Harry deffo needs HEC level games but I think there are a good few more players who need to be exposed to HEC level asap. Some obviously already have but need more:

Casey
Healy
Frawley
Penny
Baird
Coombes
JoB
Hume
Moore

And I'm sure there are a few more.
Last edited by shabadoo on Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Floppykid
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Jim Lahey wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:50 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
Would be glorious alright.
Champagne rugby.

But . . . . the collisions, man. Who’s going to lead our defensive system? What about the dominant tackles?

F**k modern rugby :thumbdown:
Rugby's better than ever according to the Reddit/Squidge crowd.
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shabadoo
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by shabadoo »

Jim Lahey wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:50 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
Would be glorious alright.
Champagne rugby.

But . . . . the collisions, man. Who’s going to lead our defensive system? What about the dominant tackles?

F**k modern rugby :thumbdown:
Agreed.

That's always the balance though, ever since it went pro.
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earl the beaver
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by earl the beaver »

Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Harry Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
If Ross Byrne is the answer then you are asking the wrong question.

Billy Burns is an average enough player and he's better than him. Byrne sits deep and adds no pace to the ball, you need a bit of toe to be a back in international rugby.
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Winnie
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Winnie »

feckwanker wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 4:50 pm https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/sta ... 0408022017
So with a few big names soon to be out of contract, who do you think we'll lose?
Some names up for renewal are:

Stander - YES
POM - YES
Healy - NO- due to lack of Options
Henderson - NO
Furlong - NO
Sexton - YES
Earls - YES
Some big decisions needed
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Winnie »

shabadoo wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:51 pm
feckwanker wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:22 pm
Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Ross Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Ross Byrne is not the answer unfortunately.
2 very talented players for sure with Stockdale further down the development road obviously, Harry deffo needs HEC level games but I think there are a good few more players who need to be exposed to HEC level asap. Some obviously already have but need more:

Casey
Healy
Frawley
Penny
Baird
Coombes
JoC
Hume
Moore

And I'm sure there are a few more.
Balacoune is very unlucky with the injury
He is better than Keenan by a country mile
Whether he comes back having had his hammy ripped off the bone is another matter
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Luckycharmer »

quarter2four wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 11:16 am With all the ills of deteriorating set piece we are still getting tons of ball in the opposition 22 and are still trying to play safe and barge over.

We've gone from a team that were converting most of these into various opposition looking comfortable defending us from a couple of metres out. We've seen a couple of movez since Farrell took over but not enough variety.

The new rules mean the percentages for keeping it tight and having more rucks in the opposition 22 is a disadvantage. The defence just fronts up and eventually they will win a turnover against us. Badly need some new blood in the coaching staff to bring some fresh ideas in attack.
They couldn't even put away a simple 3 on 2 in the first half where it was harder not to score. Herring threw a long skip pass to earls when all we had to do was draw and pass and it would have been a run in.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Ringrose and Henshaw are our only two centres capable of breaking the line.
Any other combo, even including one of the two above, will struggle to do much beyond bosh/one up carries.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by camroc1 »

Don't think there's much of a difference between the two, neither are good enough, and both will play bit parts internationally in the future. It's not as if we haven't produced any OH's since Sexton. I obviously know most about Leinster, so apols if I've missed out any OHs from the other provinces.

Leinster : Ian McKinley was the chosen successor until losing the sight in one eye in a freak accident on the training pitch. Ian Madigan and Ian Keatley were also of that generation, both getting caps with Madigan moving on to Bordeaux, Bristol and now Ulster; and Keatley moving on to Connacht, Mumster and now at Benneton. The generation after that again is the Ross Byrne/Joey Carbery one, with Carbery the "golden boy" advised to go to Munster, who promptly broke him, to further his career. And now we're the generation of OH's behind that again which is Byrne Jnr/Hawkshaw and Frawley. Frawley looks like 12 will be his future position , Byrne Jnr is highly rated but raw, and Hawkshaw, through injury, has hardly played a game but was rated higher than Byrne at u/a.

Munster : Since ROG Munster have produced JJ Hanrahan, Bill Johnson (currently at Ulster), and now their new wunderkind Ben Healy. They also currently have Carbery on their books.

Ulster : have produced Paddy Jackson, who was Sextons number 2 at Ireland level until his legal problems, have Burns Jnr, Madigan and Johnson on their books, and also have their own wunderkind in Michael Lowry, who may well end up at 15 rater than 10. And,

Connacht have produced Jack Carty, who's picked a fair few caps.

So we're talking 10 - 12 decent professional level out halves produced, with perhaps 3 or 4 of them at the top pro level. That's actually quite a decent production rate, and were it not for injury, or other reasons, we would have been fine this autumn series at O.

And it all it has told us is that the two Byrnes/Burns aren't good enough, better to know now.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by earl the beaver »

Based on this international window there is quite a bit between them.
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shabadoo
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by shabadoo »

Winnie wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:21 pm
shabadoo wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:51 pm
feckwanker wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:22 pm
Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Ross Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Ross Byrne is not the answer unfortunately.
2 very talented players for sure with Stockdale further down the development road obviously, Harry deffo needs HEC level games but I think there are a good few more players who need to be exposed to HEC level asap. Some obviously already have but need more:

Casey
Healy
Frawley
Penny
Baird
Coombes
JoC
Hume
Moore

And I'm sure there are a few more.
Balacoune is very unlucky with the injury
He is better than Keenan by a country mile
Whether he comes back having had his hammy ripped off the bone is another matter
Yep, really liked the cut of his jib from what I saw of him. Could do with an Injury free run.
Last edited by shabadoo on Mon Nov 30, 2020 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by earl the beaver »

shabadoo wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:54 pm
Winnie wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:21 pm
shabadoo wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:51 pm
feckwanker wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:22 pm
Trostan wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:21 pm Sometime next year, looking into development towards 2023, we need to make decisions around 10 and 15.
To me its Ross Byrne and Stockdale, both of whom have the personality, both seriously talented and both need coaching, training and experience in those positions at HEC and test level.
There, I said it.
Ross Byrne is not the answer unfortunately.
2 very talented players for sure with Stockdale further down the development road obviously, Harry deffo needs HEC level games but I think there are a good few more players who need to be exposed to HEC level asap. Some obviously already have but need more:

Casey
Healy
Frawley
Penny
Baird
Coombes
JoC
Hume
Moore

And I'm sure there are a few more.
Balacoune is very unlucky with the injury
He is better than Keenan by a country mile
Whether he comes back having had his hammy ripped off the bone is another matter
Yep, really liked the cut of his job from what I saw of him. Could do with an Injury free run.
Tbf this is his first injury, it's just a horror one.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Yeah, hopefully it's not as bad as it sounds like it could be.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by earl the beaver »

Floppykid wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:58 pm Yeah, hopefully it's not as bad as it sounds like it could be.
I've been told it's a really bad one, torn off the bone is not an overstatement.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by jezzer »

Having watched it today I'd be in the Statto/Mullet camp of "not as bad as being made out", "lot of new blood tried out early RWC cycle" and "not a million miles off putting up a big score"

Ryle didn't help the pessimistic narrative much, he was in particularly whingy form.

All in all, the attack had a better shape to it, though we're sorely lacking link players and anyone properly linking with the guys around them. I still think Catt has achieved very little so far, hopefully there's more to come.

I don't think Bealham got mullered at all. First half both front rows were setting too low without their feet under them and it was a zero sum game that got sorted out when both decided to set their bases properly. That's not to say I think he's the answer at LH, but he was ok. I'd leapfrog Dooley over Byrne.

Back row has a lot of quality to come back to it. Leavy, Conan, Deegan.

I think once we figure out what kind of attack we're going to be, the midfield choices 10/12/13 will sort themselves out. Just hoping we'll find some kind of combo to get through or around defences. Ringrose and Farrell looks like it could be an interesting one.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by IBWT »

Cummiskey's player ratings in the Irish Times! No problem with the ratings but the snidey tone is very evident.


15 Jacob Stockdale
Poor decision under pressure to trust that Burns could tackle Giorgi Kveseladze. The fullback makes the hit. Has the skills, the pace and a booming left boot to become a world-class operator at 15 but the wait continues. Rating: 4

14 Hugo Keenan
One of the bright sparks of 2020, looking every inch an international calibre wing or fullback, particularly in the air or finishing off attacks. Rating: 5

13 Chris Farrell
Lovely flick to create the Burns try, after convincing the defenders he was going to charge into contact. Attempted to bring some variety to his game but swallowed up by Jalagonia to gift Georgia three points. Rating: 4

12 Stuart McCloskey
The Ulster centre, who never gets a prolonged run in the team, was unable to drag Ireland from their second-half gloom. Henshaw or Aki would have done more. Rating: 4

11 Keith Earls
May as well pick a tractor. The obvious criticism of Mike Catt’s attack strategy was the lack of times the playmakers managed to put Earls into space. Why bother having a wing of this calibre on the field? Rating: 4

10 Billy Burns
Kicked his points before the injury. Missed tackle on Kveseladze should not take away from the centre’s magic try but the Scots will be licking their lips to expose this club standard outhalf, much like Ross Byrne was shown up at Twickenham. Rating: 4

9 Conor Murray
Felt like another needless selection pre-match but Ireland needed him. The path to becoming the starting Lions scrumhalf in South Africa next summer should open up now. Rating: 5

1 Finlay Bealham
Pancaked on the grass at enough scrums to bring into question the coach’s decision to move the Australian from tighthead to loosehead when there is already a loosehead playing tighthead. Out of his depth, he drowned. Rating: 2


2 Rob Herring
Fixed the lineout and piloted an outdated maul towards the Georgia try line (where he came up short). Ronán Kelleher needs all the exposure and live tutorials that are going, starting with Scotland next week. Rating: 4

3 Andrew Porter
Muscled some scrum dominance back Ireland’s way with another impressive display against an opponent not named Mako Vunipola. Sat down at half-time before he blew a gasket. Rating: 5

4 Iain Henderson
This World Cup cycle will be the years that define Henderson’s injury-prone career. There’s a raw strength in his bones that makes him essential to the cause but he failed to inspire a respectable result here. Rating: 4

5 James Ryan
The young captain looks jaded. The dominance we have grown to expect from him in the loose exchanges has fallen off in November. Perhaps he was spooked by Maro Itoje. More likely, he is carrying an injury. Rating: 4

6 Tadhg Beirne
Blindside has always looked like his best position, simply because it offers more opportunities to steal the ball, but he lacks the power to become Ireland’s resident number six. Rating: 4

7 Will Connors
For all the talk of deep stocks at backrow and Connors’s excellent tackling technique – which should be a given – this team badly needs an athletic flanker that does damage top of the ground. Rating: 4

8 CJ Stander
Charged around like a 10-year-old playing against under-8s which required plenty of bodies to haul him down but showed nothing that we did not already know. The under-8s had him well sussed. Rating: 4

Bench
Ross Byrne kicked his points, whoop-de-doo. Cian Healy shored up an embarrassing scrum. No true impact from a bench clearly operating on a low ebb. Rating: 3

Coach
If the rookie head coach presumed 2020 would provide scope to rebuild and remove the “detail” that fatigued players under Joe Schmidt, Andy Farrell now realises the standard of coaching that is required to succeed at this level. Enough excuses about the player pool numbers and being on a new journey. He needs help. Rating: 3
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Mr. Very Popular
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Mr. Very Popular »

It does come across a bit snide, isn't too far from what a lot of us are saying though.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

Floppykid wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:55 pm
Jim Lahey wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:50 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
Would be glorious alright.
Champagne rugby.

But . . . . the collisions, man. Who’s going to lead our defensive system? What about the dominant tackles?

F**k modern rugby :thumbdown:
Rugby's better than ever according to the Reddit/Squidge crowd.

Geeks like loads of laws and zero physicality shocker
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Duff Paddy
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Duff Paddy »

Rugby has never been worse
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:00 pm
Floppykid wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:55 pm
Jim Lahey wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:50 pm
Mullet 2 wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:48 pm Murray
Jackson
Stockdale
Frawley
Ringrose
Larmour
Keenan

Wouldn't mind a look at that
Would be glorious alright.
Champagne rugby.

But . . . . the collisions, man. Who’s going to lead our defensive system? What about the dominant tackles?

F**k modern rugby :thumbdown:
Rugby's better than ever according to the Reddit/Squidge crowd.

Geeks like loads of laws and zero physicality shocker
Remember inside centres at international level?
Weren't they great?
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Floppykid »

Duff Paddy wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:10 pm Rugby has never been worse
Again, I'm flogging a dead horse/repeating myself, but inside centre weakness in the game as a position is kind of illustrative of the game as a whole. Any creativity or individuality coached out of the position.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by jezzer »

I mean, drawing the man and passing it 5m to your left or right is not the hardest thing in the world.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Risteard »

Tom Ahern in for Whycherly.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by blindsider »

Any links for the Munster game?

Can't seem to get beyond pop-ups.....
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by danthefan »

blindsider wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:00 pm Any links for the Munster game?

Can't seem to get beyond pop-ups.....
https://www.vipleague.lc/1-munster-vs-z ... -streaming

But the match hasn't started yet so wouldn't expect to see anything for another 10-15 mins
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by blindsider »

Thanks Dan!!!
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lorcanoworms
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by lorcanoworms »

Nucifora asked about the central contracts and was anyone likely to lose their job he said it was unlikely.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Munster-fogs »

Risteard wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:51 pm Tom Ahern in for Whycherly.
What happened him?
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Risteard »

Munster-fogs wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:14 pm
Risteard wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:51 pm Tom Ahern in for Whycherly.
What happened him?
Groin strain. TOD to bench.
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danthefan
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by danthefan »

blindsider wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:03 pm Thanks Dan!!!
No problemo, that's working for me anyway now.
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Bogbunny »

Moore 3 tries in 3 games :thumbup:
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Mr. Very Popular
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Re: The Official Irish Rugby Thread

Post by Mr. Very Popular »

Ouch, could be a long night for that front row
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