‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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Ted.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Ted. »

Seneca of the Night wrote:
Zakar wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Zakar wrote:I know I'm going to regret asking, but what evidence do you have that Obama is a 'psychopathic narcissist '?
Where did I say I had evidence of it?
Nowhere, but you must have something that illustrates what gives you that impression. An interview, a news article, something?

If it's gut feel, thats a pretty gross thing to say about a person.
There's an enormous amount of stuff out there that broadly reflects what I said. I'm not going to link to any one thing. But it's there.

Bear in mind the 'psychopathic' personality is not necessarily someone who is an axe murderer. Many CEOs probably have a psychopathic personality. I worked for one once.
That's no recommendation, on either level. In fact, you could say it's commerces' greatest failing, giving a leg up to people that otherwise should be just blokes on the line at the freezing works, at most livestock farmers.....
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by maxbox »

Lacrobat wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:It goes without saying of course that I suspect Obama is a psychopathic narcissist but you say that around here too often the young angry Irish come at you with broken pint glasses. I suspect we'll know one way or another in 50 years though.
Speaking of psychopathic narcissists:
Trump Leads Among GOP Voters Nationwide

A new Suffolk University/USA TODAY national poll finds Donald Trump leading the Republican presidential field with 17%, followed by Jeb Bush at 14%, Scott Walker at 8%, Ted Cruz at 6%, Marco Rubio at 5%, Ben Carson at 4%, Mike Huckabee at 4% and Chris Christie at 3%.

Said pollster David Paleologos: “Trump is making daily headlines in advance of the primary season. This has vaulted him to the top of the pack on the backs of conservative voters.”
While I am against Trumps policies against Mexicans, I am for Trumps policies against Rosie O Donnell :nod:
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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If my palms and elbows were constantly dry I'd be angry too.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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Seneca of the Night wrote:It never ends.
Hopefully it will one day
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Anonymous 1 »

NGD80 wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:
Wilson's Toffee wrote:
“We will demand greater representation for blacks at the university, removal of colonial iconography on any of its campuses, and a curriculum that is more representative,” Mpofu-Walsh said.
Twat thinks he's still in Africa. :lol:
Surely this is the one and only occasion that you can say "f**k off back to Africa" and not be called a racist?
A group of Oxford university students call for a statue at their university to be removed and you come up with that :thumbup:
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Eight_Eye »

ox wagon wrote:
Eight_Eye wrote:
ox wagon wrote:Rhodes was definitely homosexual.

"Rhodes must fall" isn't connected to any traditional African/conservative instincts. It is a movement of a small group of young urban middleclass elite, that go to the best universities. As such it reflects their concerns. One of the criticisms the UCT branch levelled against the Rhodes statue there, was that it "perpetuated heteronormativity". Work that one out.
They are without doubt opportunists, but it is unclear to what extent they believe their own bluster. The problem is that even if they don't, there is a potentially large captive audience who will.

And yes, they are young and middle-class, but it's not as if this group hasn't given birth to revolutionaries before.
There are two reasons why they would say Rhodes represented "heteronormativity" I can think of.

1. They are morons and did not know Rhodes was homosexual.

2. They know Rhodes was homosexual, but he does not fit their archetype of what a homosexual is (basically in their view a perpetual victim). Therefore, to them he represents being hetrosexual. If they accepted that Rhodes was homosexual, it would also mean reassessing their imagined archetype about what that identity means. With the inevitable conclusion being, Rhodes being homosexual said not a lot about him as a person, it didn't doom him to being a victim anymore than it ensured he was an oppressor. Once that door is opened it leads to other questions, did Rhodes being white mean his business success was inevitable? Or that he was certain to be an oppressor? How do those two identities tally with his philanthropic work? These are places they would rather not go, as they don't want their beliefs questioned. Instead because Rhodes was rich, powerful, white and oppressed people, that means he certainly isn't a victim and so even if he was homosexual he can't have been, and instead represents "heteronormativity". It's the same logic, if you can call it that, that was behind the Wits student president saying "all whites are like Hitler" (which was a view officially endorsed by RhodesMustFall).

Both these possibilities are equally likely.
There could be another possibility.This opposition to "heteronormativity" could be a ruse to garner support, especially from the liberal establishment, and to add credibility to the movement.

For all their rhetoric about gender and sexuality, this movement prioritises race. The fact that it doesn't matter to them that Rhodes was a homosexual indicates this. For them, race trumps gender and sexuality every time. It could well be that they are trying to disguise their racist agenda by employing stock liberal discourse. And we know how every social justice warrior out there is a sucker for such discourse.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by NGD80 »

Anonymous. wrote:
NGD80 wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:
Wilson's Toffee wrote:
“We will demand greater representation for blacks at the university, removal of colonial iconography on any of its campuses, and a curriculum that is more representative,” Mpofu-Walsh said.
Twat thinks he's still in Africa. :lol:
Surely this is the one and only occasion that you can say "f**k off back to Africa" and not be called a racist?
A group of Oxford university students call for a statue at their university to be removed and you come up with that :thumbup:
The group, led by Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh, son of EFF national chairman Dali Mpofu,
Have you not heard of the EFF?

I'll enlighten you, here is their leader encouraging the murder of innocent people (when he was ANCYL leader):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm9nUhTFYfM
Malema was again accused of hate speech last week after he led college students in singing the protest song "Shoot the boere, they are rapists." Boere translates as farmers in Afrikaans, the language of white South African descendants of the early Dutch settlers. Afrikaners and others accused Malema of inciting violence against whites, but the ANC said the song is symbolic of the anti-apartheid struggle.
Oh, and while we're at it, here is the President doing the same:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cb3MLHblnbQ

So yeah, fudge off back to Africa and take your racism with you.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Eight_Eye »

Anonymous. wrote:
NGD80 wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:
Wilson's Toffee wrote:
“We will demand greater representation for blacks at the university, removal of colonial iconography on any of its campuses, and a curriculum that is more representative,” Mpofu-Walsh said.
Twat thinks he's still in Africa. :lol:
Surely this is the one and only occasion that you can say "f**k off back to Africa" and not be called a racist?
A group of Oxford university students call for a statue at their university to be removed and you come up with that :thumbup:
If you examine their thinking, you should realise they are enemies of the English nation. Any right-minded Englander should want them barred from the country.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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NGD80 wrote: I'll enlighten you, here is their leader encouraging the murder of innocent people (when he was ANCYL leader):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm9nUhTFYfM
Malema was again accused of hate speech last week after he led college students in singing the protest song "Shoot the boere, they are rapists." Boere translates as farmers in Afrikaans, the language of white South African descendants of the early Dutch settlers. Afrikaners and others accused Malema of inciting violence against whites, but the ANC said the song is symbolic of the anti-apartheid struggle.
Oh, and while we're at it, here is the President doing the same:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cb3MLHblnbQ

So yeah, f**k off back to Africa and take your racism with you.
Relax. It's quite a catchy song. You can't blame them for singing it.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Sards »

I was thinking that we should send some of his mates over to further their education.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Wilson's Toffee »

Sards wrote:I was thinking that we should send some of his mates over to further their education.
Preferably a whole 40 million of them, including the illegal Zimbabweans/others.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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.
Last edited by ox wagon on Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by NGD80 »

ox wagon wrote:
NGD80 wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
NGD80 wrote:Surely this is the one and only occasion that you can say "f**k off back to Africa" and not be called a racist?
A group of Oxford university students call for a statue at their university to be removed and you come up with that :thumbup:
[...]

So yeah, f**k off back to Africa and take your racism with you.
Anon is right, it was a shit thing to post. I've also already explained to you how Mpofu-Walsh has a British mother, and could probably get a British passport if he hasn't already got one.
Don't try and palm him off to us, you can have him back thanks.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Croft »

Wilson's Toffee wrote:
Sards wrote:I was thinking that we should send some of his mates over to further their education.
Preferably a whole 40 million of them, including the illegal Zimbabweans/others.
Only if you then take 40 million white English in a swap, chavs and all.

I wonder what would happen. The Brit economy is about 10 times as big as SA. I wonder how many decades it would take for that to then reverse.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Sards »

Croft wrote:
Wilson's Toffee wrote:
Sards wrote:I was thinking that we should send some of his mates over to further their education.
Preferably a whole 40 million of them, including the illegal Zimbabweans/others.
Only if you then take 40 million white English in a swap, chavs and all.

I wonder what would happen. The Brit economy is about 10 times as big as SA. I wonder how many decades it would take for that to then reverse.
It took 20 years to feck our countrys administration.....and cripple the economy. Not completely destroy it but minus growth.
Probably the same amount of time , but the fat cats would just get fatter.
Last edited by Sards on Wed Jul 15, 2015 1:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Sandstorm »

Anonymous. wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:It never ends.
Hopefully it will one day
Image
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Torquemada 1420 »

Sandstorm wrote:
Torquemada 1420 wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Zakar wrote:Calling anyone a psychopathic narcissist with no proof is atrocious behaviour.
Are you actually being serious? You do realise he doesn't read this forum right? I think he'll live.

It is so very strange the personal way supporters of Obama take criticism of him. It's bizarre.
You mean anon is NOT Obama? :shock:
No, he's Bishop Tutu
In a tutu surely?
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Croft »

Seneca of the Night wrote:
Sandstorm wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:It never ends.
Hopefully it will one day
Image
Ah SMOD. Sweet Meteor Of Death.

The answer to all our problems.
Still on that. :lol:
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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Wilson's Toffee wrote::lol:

http://www.iol.co.za/news/world/rhodes- ... aOzyLWvvqY
London - A group of students at Oriel College in London, a constituent of Oxford University in England, has called for the removal of a Cecil John Rhodes statue.

The statue is over 100 years old and sits on a historical building on the Oriel College campus.

The group, led by Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh, son of EFF national chairman Dali Mpofu, was inspired by the successful Rhodes Must Fall campaign which saw a Rhodes statue being removed from the University of Cape Town.

“We will demand greater representation for blacks at the university, removal of colonial iconography on any of its campuses, and a curriculum that is more representative,” Mpofu-Walsh said.

Mpofu-Walsh recently received his Master of Philosophy degree from Oxford University.

History student Annie Teriba, who is also a member of the Rhodes Must Fall movement, said that the Rhodes statue at Oriel College “represents institutional racism”.

“It’s something that students of colour take seriously. It’s a reminder, more than being a statue, that when this university was built it wasn’t built with us in mind, it was built off the back of exploiting labour and the colonial project. It’s something that still gets celebrated in the form of a statue,” she said.

Teriba added that it was problematic to have to walk past such a statue every day. “There’s violence to having to walk past the statue on the way to your lectures… there’s a violence to having to sit with paintings of former slave holders whilst writing your exams,” she said.

On its website, Oriel College responded: “When Cecil Rhodes died in 1902 he left 2 percent of his estate to Oriel College, where he had been a student. His legacy helped to fund the construction of a new building, opened in 1911, which is now grade-2 listed (a historical building). The building frontage included a statue commemorating his benefaction.

“Now, over a century after the building was constructed, Rhodes is thought of very differently. The college draws a clear line between acknowledging the historical fact of Rhodes’s donation and in any way condoning his political views.

“Oriel College is committed to being at the forefront of the drive to make Oxford University more diverse and inclusive of people from all backgrounds.”

ilanit.chernick@inl.co.za
e[afas[dfasdf
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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Bump.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Big Nipper »

Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by assfly »

Big Nipper wrote:Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
While I agree with you in principle, I don't believe the debate around him should be shut down. His impact on the history of southern Africa is too big to simply dismiss (the good, the bad and the ugly). And there is the issue of his fund putting many African students through higher education.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by kiwinoz »

Taliban lite
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by AND-y »

What does John Charity Spring think?
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by msp. »

assfly wrote:
Big Nipper wrote:Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
While I agree with you in principle, I don't believe the debate around him should be shut down. His impact on the history of southern Africa is too big to simply dismiss (the good, the bad and the ugly). And there is the issue of his fund putting many African students through higher education.
In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by assfly »

msp. wrote:In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.
Bloody hell. That's quite a read.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by sorCrer »

msp. wrote:
assfly wrote:
Big Nipper wrote:Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
While I agree with you in principle, I don't believe the debate around him should be shut down. His impact on the history of southern Africa is too big to simply dismiss (the good, the bad and the ugly). And there is the issue of his fund putting many African students through higher education.
In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.

Cheers, that is an excellent read! :thumbup:
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by shereblue »

sorCrer wrote:
msp. wrote:
assfly wrote:
Big Nipper wrote:Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
While I agree with you in principle, I don't believe the debate around him should be shut down. His impact on the history of southern Africa is too big to simply dismiss (the good, the bad and the ugly). And there is the issue of his fund putting many African students through higher education.
In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.

Cheers, that is an excellent read! :thumbup:
My takes:

Sacco, a PR professional: lived by the sword, died by the sword.
Biddle, a stalky plum.

Interesting on the one hand how "little jokes" can blow up in your face and, on the other, how a natural desire to "win" a debating point crosses a line when hatefully naming and shaming.

Also about tech and the latent public accountability of the private individual.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by msp. »

shereblue wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
msp. wrote:
assfly wrote:
Big Nipper wrote:Hopefully the statue is tossed into the nearest river. Rhodes was an absolute psychopathic plum of a man
While I agree with you in principle, I don't believe the debate around him should be shut down. His impact on the history of southern Africa is too big to simply dismiss (the good, the bad and the ugly). And there is the issue of his fund putting many African students through higher education.
In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.

Cheers, that is an excellent read! :thumbup:
My takes:

Sacco, a PR professional: lived by the sword, died by the sword.
Biddle, a stalky plum.

Interesting on the one hand how "little jokes" can blow up in your face and, on the other, how a natural desire to "win" a debating point crosses a line when hatefully naming and shaming.

Also about tech and the latent public accountability of the private individual.
But shows how quickly events can take over, an overheard comment/joke about "dongle size" (which was probabally not even funny) to a colleague suddenly can change two peoples lives. - It the feeding freenzy, from people uneffected demanding "justice" and as you say having to "win" a debate espcially if it can show how "virtuous" you are..
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by shereblue »

msp. wrote:
shereblue wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
msp. wrote:
In a society were many take pleasure from destroying of someone life for what really is slight offence (esp. when taken out of context) (https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/maga ... -life.html) it is not surprising that people what people what items removed that "offend" them.

Cheers, that is an excellent read! :thumbup:
My takes:

Sacco, a PR professional: lived by the sword, died by the sword.
Biddle, a stalky plum.

Interesting on the one hand how "little jokes" can blow up in your face and, on the other, how a natural desire to "win" a debating point crosses a line when hatefully naming and shaming.

Also about tech and the latent public accountability of the private individual.
But shows how quickly events can take over, an overheard comment/joke about "dongle size" (which was probabally not even funny) to a colleague suddenly can change two peoples lives. - It the feeding freenzy, from people uneffected demanding "justice" and as you say having to "win" a debate espcially if it can show how "virtuous" you are..
The "dongle size" joke was a shocker - or rather its consequences were.

I'd certainly counsel not going for a swim at the local baths with Backrow 'till this all blows over.

Tangentially, I'd noted that Glasgow had seen fit to take down a statue of one Jimmy Savile at one of its local baths.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by hermes-trismegistus »

madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
I suspect they'll hesitate before having a crack at Ghandi. He's a POC, and therefore - in the identity-driven rules of wokery - not subject to the standards applied to his white contemporaries. Even if it's pretty much indisputable that his opinions of black people were about as grim as it gets.

Thing is, if you dig deep enough, no one from the past gets a pass mark. How could they when even in the present most of us aren't up to scratch in the eyes of the anointed? Anyone can be cancelled purely by virtue of lacking the required package of identikit political attitudes.

Of course none of this is applied to woke figureheads. On social media at the moment, some impossibly bizarre arguments are being made for why the likes of Marx and Engels - and they're statues - are alright, in spite of transparently racist and eugenecist views in their correspondence. The moral standards in play here- in so far as they can be thought of as standards at all - are applied in an entirely arbitrary way.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Wendigo7 »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j1Ppi7CimA

Or people like this. Yes, he's genuinely real.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Anonymous 1 »

hermes-trismegistus wrote:
madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
I suspect they'll hesitate before having a crack at Ghandi. He's a POC, and therefore - in the identity-driven rules of wokery - not subject to the standards applied to his white contemporaries. Even if it's pretty much indisputable that his opinions of black people were about as grim as it gets.

Thing is, if you dig deep enough, no one from the past gets a pass mark. How could they when even in the present most of us aren't up to scratch in the eyes of the anointed? Anyone can be cancelled purely by virtue of lacking the required package of identikit political attitudes.

Of course none of this is applied to woke figureheads. On social media at the moment, some impossibly bizarre arguments are being made for why the likes of Marx and Engels - and they're statues - are alright, in spite of transparently racist and eugenecist views in their correspondence. The moral standards in play here- in so far as they can be thought of as standards at all - are applied in an entirely arbitrary way.
I don't know about identikit politics but it's anyone who was a blatant racist they don't seem to like
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by I like haggis »

madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
In Ghana they did actually remove a Ghandi status for that reason:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co ... a-46552614
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Anonymous 1 »

I like haggis wrote:
madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
In Ghana they did actually remove a Ghandi status for that reason:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co ... a-46552614
Yet in the UK despite knowing there was growing feeling about this we decided to stick a statue up to the man anyway. Just inviting future grief
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Leffe »

Wendigo7 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j1Ppi7CimA

Or people like this. Yes, he's genuinely real.
Well indeed. Churchill did in fact fight WWII for white people and not black. This is a reality.
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by hermes-trismegistus »

Anonymous. wrote:
hermes-trismegistus wrote:
madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
I suspect they'll hesitate before having a crack at Ghandi. He's a POC, and therefore - in the identity-driven rules of wokery - not subject to the standards applied to his white contemporaries. Even if it's pretty much indisputable that his opinions of black people were about as grim as it gets.

Thing is, if you dig deep enough, no one from the past gets a pass mark. How could they when even in the present most of us aren't up to scratch in the eyes of the anointed? Anyone can be cancelled purely by virtue of lacking the required package of identikit political attitudes.

Of course none of this is applied to woke figureheads. On social media at the moment, some impossibly bizarre arguments are being made for why the likes of Marx and Engels - and they're statues - are alright, in spite of transparently racist and eugenecist views in their correspondence. The moral standards in play here- in so far as they can be thought of as standards at all - are applied in an entirely arbitrary way.
I don't know about identikit politics but it's anyone who was a blatant racist they don't seem to like
Well, that's going to include pretty much everyone who lived and died pre 1960 then. More or less our entire shared past. It's also looking increasingly like their definition of blatant racism is anyone or anything that isn't fully on board with their views. There's nothing virtuous about that.
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hermes-trismegistus
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by hermes-trismegistus »

Wendigo7 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j1Ppi7CimA

Or people like this. Yes, he's genuinely real.
I genuinely feel sorry for the man. He's the living embodiment of the adage that if all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
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Anonymous 1
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Re: ‘Rhodes Must Fall’ rage now in UK

Post by Anonymous 1 »

hermes-trismegistus wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
hermes-trismegistus wrote:
madman wrote:So after Rhodes it is Gandhi,,

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-34265882
I suspect they'll hesitate before having a crack at Ghandi. He's a POC, and therefore - in the identity-driven rules of wokery - not subject to the standards applied to his white contemporaries. Even if it's pretty much indisputable that his opinions of black people were about as grim as it gets.

Thing is, if you dig deep enough, no one from the past gets a pass mark. How could they when even in the present most of us aren't up to scratch in the eyes of the anointed? Anyone can be cancelled purely by virtue of lacking the required package of identikit political attitudes.

Of course none of this is applied to woke figureheads. On social media at the moment, some impossibly bizarre arguments are being made for why the likes of Marx and Engels - and they're statues - are alright, in spite of transparently racist and eugenecist views in their correspondence. The moral standards in play here- in so far as they can be thought of as standards at all - are applied in an entirely arbitrary way.
I don't know about identikit politics but it's anyone who was a blatant racist they don't seem to like
Well, that's going to include pretty much everyone who lived and died pre 1960 then. More or less our entire shared past. It's also looking increasingly like their definition of blatant racism is anyone or anything that isn't fully on board with their views. There's nothing virtuous about that.
Bullshit
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